My deal (thanks for reading)

[cityboy]

I've been following this site for weeks since my breakup, and I truly appreciate all the insight and support here. Good stuff, people.

 

I think it's time for me to share my own experience, both to get support and to possibly help someone else.

 

I met her when she was 23 and I was 29. It started as a fun, casual sort of thing, hot city summer nights, lots of making out and sex, and we really loved being together. We fell in love and moved in together after about a year. Not that it's terribly important, but she was the clear aggressor in locking down our cohabitation. I was reticent due to a previous long-term relationship.

 

Things were, for the most part, wonderful. Friends called us an "institution" (their words, not mine). We got engaged about a year ago, had an engagement party, and slowly started planning our marriage.

 

A couple days after my birthday in December, she up and left me. The event that she said triggered it was a brunch with my mom who was in town for my birthday. My mom wanted to take me to dinner for my birthday the night before, but my fiancee, at least it seemed, insisted on paying. At that moment my mom insisted on taking us to brunch the next morning. Good enough. Well, we went to a place that was cash only which I had forgotten, and I announced as much when we sat down. I then said it wasn't a big deal, that there was an ATM across the street. My fiancee then tightened up, and before we ordered, insisted on going across the street to get money despite my objection. After we ordered, I ran across the street (as did my mom) and grabbed cash. I paid.

 

Fiancee was pissed the whole way home and took off to work - this was a Saturday. That night she slept on the couch. The next day she took off to some friend's place and has been living elsewhere since in a sublet. She recently found another 6-month sublet.

 

She insisted she needs time, she's unsure of what she wants, has issues to deal with. That she needs to live on her own, be independent. That she has missed out on her 20s (not her words exactly, but my interpretation of how she describes what she wants to do now).

 

So here's the situation now. It's been at least 6 weeks at this point. We've talked a couple times but I have been desperately trying to maintain NC.

 

I've tried to be as strong and smart about the whole thing. I've realised and remembered many things along the way. Some of these include:

 

She has never had a strong sense of family or valued family much due to her upbringing. She has made intonations of not wanting kids occasionally mixed with discussions about wanting them. I have stated since day one that I want to ultimately have a family (I'm 36 now).

 

She has done things to undermine our trust over time. She fooled around with a couple people at a party once when drunk (she's an angry drunk), kissed a guy in front of me at a party, and has done things to set me off like stay out very late without calling me back and then getting angry with me for wondering what the hell was up, making me feel guilty for being jealous and possessive.

 

The past year or so, while extremely loving, wasn't terribly passionate. She lost herself in her job, working late and coming home and going straight to bed. I knew she was at work, by the way, as she would call me from there, I would call and she would pick up, I had a friend who works there as well, etc. So she wasn't "working late" if you know what I mean.

 

I realize in retrospect that she was declaring her independence much earlier than the actual breakup and I was blinded by love to even deal with it, hoping that it was some sort of phase. She turned me into a jealous, insecure idiot and I feel really embarrassed about it, especially because we have so many mutual friends.

 

About the mutual friends: When I met her she had her own group of friends. Over the seven years she successfully pushed pretty much all of her friends away and has befriended most of my good friends. They love her as well, as she is a fun person to be around.

 

So here's my situation now. I'm desperately trying to create space, maintain NC. With mutual friends, it's difficult, and to be honest I'm pretty resentful of her contacting people who were originally "my" friends, including people she normally didn't love hanging out with and I considered my own friends.

 

Additionally, she hasn't moved her stuff out of here. She has a lot of her clothing, but her major effects (computer, furniture, etc.) are all still here. I even still sleep on "my" side of the bed. Her new 6-month sublet is furnished. I clearly am being kept on the backburner here.

 

I'll leave it at that for now, because this could go on forever. As you can see, I have some perspective on how she treated me, but the pain is still immense at times, and talking to my friends is tough since she's talking to them as well, and I feel like they're protecting both of us. I'm also not asking them to "take sides" but it's gotta boil down eventually. I can't see myself, at least in the near term, hanging out together in friendly situations - it's too painful.

 

Again, thanks for reading, and I apologize for the random nature of this post. I just needed to begin chronicling my experience.

[quankanne]

not sure what to advise about your friends, but I will say that for your sake, I'm glad that they're trying to be fair to both of y'all, because it means they'll try hard not to denigrate one to the other. Maybe the key is to let them know that even though you're still trying to figure out what to do next, you are working at moving on and getting over her. That might make you feel at ease some, but I'm just guessing here.

 

other stuff you shared made me think that her relationship with you was about testing you. Especially when you said she never had a strong sense of family, and y'all as a couple can definitely be considered a family "unit." You feeling like you're being left on the back burner just adds to my theory.

 

maybe it's time to quit whole hog – tell her she has a certain amount of time to come get her belongings since you really have no use for them, then find an unbiased third party to be with you when she gets her stuff. Because the longer you hang onto it (even though you're being considerate by letting her keep her stuff there), the more cemented in her mind is the thought that you are her back-up.

 

it's been awhile since I've gone through a break-up, but I know how badly it can suck. Hugs to you, CB, you seem like you could use one.

[Green]

Yeah keep NC it will help you get over her, U may need to find a new group of friends or just make sure when you do stuff with them that you need to make sure shes not there. V days comming up a great day to ask some random single girl out

[cityboy]

other stuff you shared made me think that her relationship with you was about testing you. Especially when you said she never had a strong sense of family, and y'all as a couple can definitely be considered a family "unit." You feeling like you're being left on the back burner just adds to my theory.

Good point. She did seem to always get a rise out of making me jealous. Drove me nuts, and felt like I was being disrespected, then made me feel bad for not being secure in her feelings for me. Ugh. What a game.

 

I shouldn't have to deal with that. I'm a good looking, successful guy who deserves better. I'm just having a hard time understanding why our friends aren't as annoyed with her as I am. I know that's not fair, but I wish they were.

[dropdeadlegs]

Your post was well thought out and well written, thus making it so much easier to respond. Thank you.

 

Based on what you have stated, I am at a complete loss as to where she is coming from other than possibly fear of commitment long term. She hasn't sowed her oats so to speak. I don't understand what she was upset about following the brunch with your mother. It makes no sense.

 

I have learned that no matter if my parents visit me or I visit them that they will pay. I am 42 and I have stopped trying to pay, yet I offer. I learned this from watching my parents interact with my father's parents. We all apparently have issues with money is what I learned. I offer to pay, they pay. End of discussion. That's my life.

 

Her leaving when you paid makes this whole thing strange. The only thing I can come up with is that she wanted (expected) you to pay for the evening before. I don't know if you offered or if your mother offered, but it really makes no difference. You seem to be the kind of man that would not expect his fiancee' to pay regardless. And I got the vibe that your mother wanted to pay.

 

Weird.

 

So she left, didn't take all of her belongings. You are not her personal storage unit, right? She may have a furnished sublet, but that does not mean you have to look at her furnishings every day as a way to remind you of what has been lost. I don't know if you simply see these items as reminders or not, but it's not fair to you if you do. I would.

 

The friends are left in a bad situation. I have been through this aspect myself. It hurts that their loyalties are divided, doesn't it? It is unfair that she still claims them as part of her support group. I had some friends (mine first) that would refuse to take sides and preferred to just keep me and the ex apart as much as necessary. They spent time with both of us, but I honestly felt somewhat betrayed. I had some that completely chose to spend time with me alone and stood by me because they knew that I wasn't the cause of the breakup and I definitely feel more close to them now. Both were males that had golfed with my ex, but it was the couples that seemed more divided. The couples were more inclined to take the stance that they liked both of us and did not want to be involved in our problems. My separation was a far cry from yours, it involved damaging one of my children. So I learned who truly was the bigger person's of my "friends." I learned who really knew me. I could not believe that those who chose to continue a friendship with him would think I would embellish a situation or seek divorce on a petty idea that was not worthy of my actions. But based on their responses that is what I felt. Those same couples were very protective if I was a part of their events first. It was frustrating and confusing to me. That was the hardest part.

 

It is hard to have a strong sense of family if you grew up in a family that did not seem to have that. I can understand that. I wish I had the values behind that. I truly do.

 

As for NC I remain divided. I think it depends on the situation. I can say that I think her acts while intoxicated are not very encouraging and should be noted as red flags that she was not right for you.

 

People in general tend to become complacent and comfortable in relationships. The longer they last, the more we can't see ourselves with somebody else, or without the person we are with. We ignore things that are painfully obvious in retrospect. At least I do. I still try my best to work out minor bumps in the road, but I am not so willing to forgive things as I once was. I suppose my heart has hardened to an extent. It should have been hardened.

 

My 20's and 30's were definitely learning experiences, both about myself and others. All in all, I would rate those decades as fairly painful.

 

All of the above being said, I have no doubt that you will find the right person for you. Maybe she wasn't that person is the best that I can offer right now.

[cityboy]

Her leaving when you paid makes this whole thing strange. The only thing I can come up with is that she wanted (expected) you to pay for the evening before. I don't know if you offered or if your mother offered, but it really makes no difference. You seem to be the kind of man that would not expect his fiancee' to pay regardless. And I got the vibe that your mother wanted to pay.

 

Well, the dinner was my birthday. There was never any plan for me to pay. That said, she did mention that I should have "not allowed" her to pay and fought for that with my mom. I don't think I should have to be in that position, and if you don't want to pay, don't offer, and when the person insists, don't insist back if you don't mean it (which is what happened).

 

So she left, didn't take all of her belongings. You are not her personal storage unit, right? She may have a furnished sublet, but that does not mean you have to look at her furnishings every day as a way to remind you of what has been lost. I don't know if you simply see these items as reminders or not, but it's not fair to you if you do. I would.

 

Oh I do. Everything in the place reminds me of her and our situation. I would much rather completely redesign the place as an act of moving on, but her stuff is everywhere still. Giving her a date to get things out is probably what I need to do, but I can't get myself to do it. I'm an idiot with hope, and I need to get over that.

 

As for NC I remain divided. I think it depends on the situation. I can say that I think her acts while intoxicated are not very encouraging and should be noted as red flags that she was not right for you.

 

People in general tend to become complacent and comfortable in relationships. The longer they last, the more we can't see ourselves with somebody else, or without the person we are with. We ignore things that are painfully obvious in retrospect. At least I do. I still try my best to work out minor bumps in the road, but I am not so willing to forgive things as I once was. I suppose my heart has hardened to an extent. It should have been hardened.

 

Yes, agreed. The alcohol abuse on her part, while not clinically alcoholism by most accounts, really put me in some annoying situations. They weren't horrible, but uncomfortable for me, and she didn't seem to care at the time, shirking off my protests as not being fun or being too protective. I'm all for having fun, but if someone is uncomfortable as a result of your actions, and you supposedly love and respect this person, you need to reconsider. She never gave me that consideration, and never said sorry either.

 

Despite all this she comes off as the sweetest, most loving person, probably why my friends are all still attached to her (or she's hooking up with them in the bathroom and I just don't know it).

[cityboy]

So it's the 31st and she is supposedly moving in to this 6-month sublet tomorrow. I'm really growing tired of having the place exactly as she left it 6-7 weeks ago, but I don't want to initiate contact to talk about it.

 

Do I wait to see if she schedules a pick up or do I bug her about her crap? I want to be able to move on, but I'm not confident in my ability to be strong with such a call.

[dropdeadlegs]

Cityboy, if you are unsure of your mindset under the circumstances of contact, just sit tight.

 

I was reading a lengthy thread last night and the subject of their "stuff" being around came up. A wise person stated that you need to see it as just that, "stuff", not constant reminders of the past. This poster rearranged furniture and that seemed to help. Maybe any kind of change/difference can help.

 

Just an idea, not sure how it would work for me, but furniture doesn't have as much affect on me as clothing, cologne, photographs, personal writings, I think you get the drift...

[CaterpillarGirl]

Take her stuff and put it in storage somewhere. Let her know where it is and that you expect her to pick it up or take over the bill for the storage unit.

[dropdeadlegs]

If it were about simple effort I doubt the situation exist. Maybe he doesn't have the truck/trailer that would be necessary to move large furniture to another location. I don't. I can't even get rid of things for my own self. Like a burntout out BBQ pit, two Power Wheels that my kids have outgrown, a runover mailbox/post, a swingset, etc. The big stuff that I consider trash won't be hauled away by local garbage service. It requires a truck to be hauled to the dump. For a fee. (the dump charges)

[CaterpillarGirl]

In that case, I would say you would need to weigh the physical and financial cost of moving her stuff with the emotional cost of keeping it around. Obviously, only you know which is greater, city boy.

[cityboy]

Well that's just the thing. It's only been 6 weeks at this point, and she just moves into the new place today. In addition, I live in New York city, so trucks and hauling type things aren't much of an option, let alone something I would own.

 

Given the timing, I think it's too soon to dump her stuff to the curb, but getting too long for her to expect me to remain a storage solution.

 

There's also a big part of me that likes having the stuff still there, as if one day she'll just show up back home and things will be back to normal. I know, not healthy, but it's comforting in an uncomfortable sort of way.

[cityboy]

So a quick update...

 

I called her last Saturday asking her to begin getting her stuff out of here. She came by on Sunday and got a bunch of personal effects out, but still has a lot of things here (computer, printer, a closet full of clothing and boxes still). I clearly need to be patient with this, and she seems to be trying, but it's still difficult.

 

When she was here we talked a bit, she laid into me again about "being selfish" with "our friends." I got a bit angry and told her I do not tell my friends what to do, and that's between her and the friends. She also said she found it strange that I'm all of the sudden going out all the time, being social -- when we were together I enjoyed staying home with her sometimes. Nothing wrong with that, I think, and I told her I didn't think I need to apologize for trying to stay occupied and hang out with my friends. She reiterated that she wants to be friends. I didn't really reply with an answer of much. I mean, I really do love this person, and I know everyone here will say to cut all contact, no friendly hangs.

 

She IMd me a couple days later (yesterday) just to check in. I kept it light, and re-deleted her after I ended the convo, saying I had to go do something (which I did).

 

Today started out great, I felt amazing, was getting tons done at work. I went to dinner with a girl this evening, it was nice, but I was still clearly not ready for dating, not able to put the charm on all that much. I feel bad because I think she was into me.

 

Then when I get home, our old home, I break out in tears. I don't know why. I was doing so well.

 

I have some serious esteem issues right now. Gah.

[dropdeadlegs]

Oh cityboy! {{{HUGS}}}

 

I'm sorry you are still hurting. I know you want to turn off your feelings and just heal. Healing is so hard.

 

I don't know if this will make sense to you, but I think women often heal faster after break ups. I think it's because many of us deal with emotions so often that we can deal with them better in really bad times. As far as feelings for him, I got over my husband in about three months. We had been married 7 years and had two kids together. My BF, on the other hand, needed 7 months to get over his ex GF and they never even lived together.

 

Give yourself whatever time you need. It sounds like a good idea to date, but maybe you should just stick with friends related activities for the time being.

 

I think you doing quite well as far as contact goes. The remaining belongings are a different matter and I wish they would go away. Is there any way you could move them out of sight for the moment? Is there an extra room or area that you don't inhabit much? Just trying to help.

 

Keep your chin up and use our little online journal as needed. I'll be thinking about you.

[cityboy]

Thanks so much, DDL. You rock.

 

It's such a crazy up and down ride, as if I'm bipolar or something. For the most part I'm doing relatively well, but I just have these deep, dark moments when I just want to be hugged, cuddle, say the goofy names I used to call her. I work out, I take care of myself (although I started smoking again like an idiot, but it's a crutch I feel I need right now), I go out with friends - a lot - and I have some of the most amazing friends in the world (in my opinion, of course).

 

I remember the lovely Saturday mornings we would have when we would go to the farmer's market, pick up some fresh fish and produce, come home and cook in the afternoon with a bottle of white wine. Life was really charmed, and I'm so overwhelmed with the thought of ever finding that again. I know in my head that I'm better off given how she treated me (see above), but I truly, madly loved her.

 

This girl I met tonight was adorable, smart, grounded, respectful, shared my values, and yet I felt nothing. Meanwhile I flirt with girls who I know are so wrong. I just like flirting, I guess. It feels good, like an ego workout. I'm such a tard.

[dropdeadlegs]

It's such a crazy up and down ride, as if I'm bipolar or something.

You're not bipolar, you're completely normal! Everyone has bad days in the beginning. Then you have good moments and bad days. Then you have good moments and bad moments. Then you have good days and bad moments. Finally you just have good days. It's a process called grieving that is in ways harder than an actual death.

I started smoking again like an idiot, but it's a crutch I feel I need right now

I'm going to agree that you need a crutch right now. You've quit before, you can quit again.

I go out with friends - a lot - and I have some of the most amazing friends in the world (in my opinion, of course).

Lean on them and lean hard!

I remember the lovely Saturday mornings we would have when we would go to the farmer's market, pick up some fresh fish and produce, come home and cook in the afternoon with a bottle of white wine. Life was really charmed, and I'm so overwhelmed with the thought of ever finding that again. I know in my head that I'm better off given how she treated me (see above), but I truly, madly loved her.

You will have all of that again, along with different, new, and special moments with another lucky lady. One who won't leave over your birthday dinner tab.

This girl I met tonight was adorable, smart, grounded, respectful, shared my values, and yet I felt nothing.

She wasn't HER and you are not ready for anything else right now. Again, completely normal.

Meanwhile I flirt with girls who I know are so wrong. I just like flirting, I guess. It feels good, like an ego workout. I'm such a tard.

Boost that ego when you can, you especially need that right now. Try to keep it to innocent flirting. And you are a warm, feeling, hurting young man, not a tard!

 

Hope tomorrow is a better day.

[Shadowdog36]

My opinion...for what it's worth...

 

The drinking, regardless of the quantity or frequency, and her reaction to it are bad signs. My father was an alcoholic, and drank himself to death in 2001. Mom came home from work and found him dead on the floor. I'm not saying this will happen with you, but given the choice of quitting drinking or you, which would she choose. Maybe I'm hypersensitive to this issue (since I have so many of my own issues with it) but be cautious around 'angry drunks'. Most people I know that act that way use the booze as an excuse to get away with things. Just cause they're drunk does not excuse their behavior, ever!

 

Smoking? Really? Is that really the ego boost you're looking for? I'm actually taking the opposite approach. Since I've felt so beat down over the past few months, I'm using that anger for something positive, or at least I'm going to try. I officially quit smoking next week. Valentines Day to be exact. I figure I'm gonna love myself this year, and give myself the best gift I ever could. She doesn't want me, F**K her. I'll be a better person on the other side of this.

 

Was sitting in the office this Monday, and at 3:30 a wave came over me. Don't know what it was, but it sucked. Staying strong all the time can wear you out. It's ok to let your guard down for a little while, and it's ok to be sad about your loss.

 

Here's something else that might help...

I got a call from my uncle, who was upset that I didn't respond to his email. Apparently my company email, that changed last year, was forwarding to my new address. As of Jan 1 of this year, our old address expired, and I forgot to update my personal address book. Sent a blanket message to my address book, updating my personal contacts. I have the read receipts turned on for my outgoing mail. Guess who I sent a message to by mistake! When I got the read receipt, and it had her name on it, I, at first, didn't realize that it wasn't a message from her. Talk about gut-wrenching. Needless to say, I was a basketcase for the next couple of hours. We used to email all day long, and that brought back some pretty strong emotions. The point? Anything can set you off, and you may not even see it coming, but if you can laugh at yourself for getting caught off guard, each time will get better. BTW-I used the opportunity to tell her that I didn't intend that to go to her and, don't worry...I'll delete you from my address book! Hah!

[cityboy]

Smoking? Really? Is that really the ego boost you're looking for? I'm actually taking the opposite approach. Since I've felt so beat down over the past few months, I'm using that anger for something positive, or at least I'm going to try. I officially quit smoking next week. Valentines Day to be exact. I figure I'm gonna love myself this year, and give myself the best gift I ever could. She doesn't want me, F**K her. I'll be a better person on the other side of this.

 

Yeah, I know. It's only been a few weeks and I'm not a very good smoker (I forget them, only smoke at night, etc.) so I too plan on getting out of it as soon as possible. It's a solace thing, I don't know.

 

Regarding what you said about angry drunks, you're absolutely right. She'd be pretty out of control at times. It was incredibly unattractive, and I really don't know why I put up with it. I'm too healthy a person as far as that stuff goes to deal with that in my life. Nothing wrong with going out and having a few drinks, but to turn it into an excuse, as you say eloquently, is just unacceptable, especially when it hurts those you say you love.

 

Thanks for the note. It's replies like that that get me back on the "I'm better off" train.

[cityboy]

So an update (for those who care):

 

I was doing great, concentrating on the new job, exercising, hanging out with new people, even went on a couple dates - even got laid. The ego and focusing on myself and NC were working.

 

Anyway, she continues to insist on keeping in contact with my friends (well, according to her, "her" friends as well). She even works with one of my best friends.

 

So in the middle of this otherwise great week, a friend tells me she was IM'ing him asking about me, about a party we went to on Saturday, who was there, even asked about a particular girl by name. I know, sounds very high school, right? We're in our 30s. My friend said he played dumb, but I started getting very annoyed that she seems to be using friends to check up on me.

 

She also IM'd a friend yesterday to ask if I'm going through my "angry phase." Well, she certainly triggered that.

 

At first it was an ego boost, knowing she's trying to find out, and what-not. Then there's this weekend. There was a get together last night I was invited to. She somehow got invited by my friend's girlfriend that she's hung out with.

 

Then, tonight, there's another friend's birthday gathering. She doesn't even like this guy. And she's going to that as well since she's hanging out with my friend she works with beforehand.

 

Keep in mind she wasn't explicitly invited to either of these events. So last night of course I had to see her.

 

It was okay, I was being nice and all that. She was being nice as well. We talked a bit, I kept it friendly.

 

Apparently, though, it was too soon for me to see her and I'm not doing so well today. I'm dreading having to see her again tonight, but I don't feel I should have to stay home so she can hang out with my friends.

 

So annoying.