Ladyjane14 Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 Are you wondering why you're here yet, WBAsmethwick? Just a guess... but I'd say it's probably because your girlfriend is tired of waiting around. She knows if you post here, the most likely advice you'll receive, is "either sh*t of get off the pot". What she's failed to realize though is that once you set foot out of the OM/OW forum.... we're all free to give you our REAL opinions. Mine is this: Everybody has their own agenda, darlin'. Your girlfriend's agenda is to end up with YOU. Understandable enough, when you look at it from her POV. But... she's going to tell you whatever you need to hear in order to keep you in the relationship. You need to know it. She'll tell you to take your time. She'll tell you she understands. She'll promise you whatever it takes to keep you from withdrawing... even if that means telling you it's okay if you do. She certainly does feature herself to be in love with you. And I think she truly believes that she has your best interests at heart, and doesn't see her own "agenda" in it. Believing it doesn't make it so though. By playing ANY part in the destruction of your marriage, she's damaging you... even though neither of you realize it. Extramarital affairs keep us from dealing with REALITY. And there's a good bit of "reality" that you're going to have to deal with anyway. And some aspects of it are less tangible than others. Realistically, Frannie doesn't know how you really feel about your wife. She understands the anger and frustration, but she doesn't have the TOOLS to understand the intangibles. She wasn't there when you looked into your bride's eyes and promised her forever. She has no way to really appreciate what that feeling meant to YOU. She can only identify with what it meant to her in another relationship scenario and through a woman's "filter". And women don't feel everything that MEN feel. I'm a woman myself... so I can't feel it either. But I have observed it. Most usually, I observe it in elderly men who sometimes follow their wives to the grave within a year of becoming a widower. These ones don't seem to have the will to go on once the bond is broken. I observe it often here at LS too, in men who have lost their wives due to marital problems, and then recognize the deficits they, themselves, brought to the table too late. These men are often inconsolable as they deal with the grief and guilt. I also see it in men who would probably be better served to move on from women who won't put enough effort into their relationships; women who deny intimacy to them. But these men continue to search for ways and means to repair that broken relationship rather than end it, because even though they're SOOOO fed up, they can't imagine going on without her. A man seems to develop an intangible bond to his wife. Maybe it stems from some kind of leftover biological instinct to guard and protect his mate... I don't know. But I've seen it in my own father too, divorced from my mother for more than thirty years. These are two people who held each other in great contempt and resentment afterwards. And yet, to this day, my father might call her a "bitch" in one breath, but in the next will tell you he'd 'straight up KILL any a*hole who seriously hurt her'. And I honestly believe he would too. He still remembers what she looked like in 1959, a teenage girl with her lipstick on a little too bright. He still remembers how scared she looked on their wedding day, and her sense of wonder when she held his first child. He still feels responsible somehow for making sure she doesn't starve or go without. Some little corner of his heart still refers to her as "Wife". The "bond" has never been fully broken. Frannie doesn't really understand what she's asking of you. There's no way she could. And by telling you she does, even if she believes it herself... she's leading you down the garden path to her OWN agenda. Because if she REALLY knew what you'll be going through... you wouldn't be here at LS today so that we could all tell you to "sh*t or get off the pot". You'd be home with your wife... making it or breaking it, without interference or safety nets. I have no doubt she believes her own rhetoric. I don't doubt that she honestly believes she's helping you to 'move forward and be happy'. But she doesn't know how your heart is going to bleed. Does she?
frannie Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 So, gunny... how did you go about that..? What decided you on leaving your marriage as a course of action? Did you have an OW, or did you want to leave because of the bad relationship you had with your wife..? How did you broach it to your children..? How did they react..? Was there no other way..? Did you not think of being with them in the marriage rather than out of it..? What decided you on divorce as the best course..?
frannie Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 Frannie doesn't really understand what she's asking of you. I have no doubt she believes her own rhetoric. I don't doubt that she honestly believes she's helping you to 'move forward and be happy'. But she doesn't know how your heart is going to bleed. Does she? Maybe I don't, but I do know that I'm here to find answers, rather than push solutions on other people. We're both here because we have no idea how to proceed... in OUR lives... why is that such a difficult thing to comprehend..? I'm lost, and so is he. Not such a complicated thing at all, when you come down to it, really.
Ladyjane14 Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 ... I do know that I'm here to find answers, rather than push solutions on other people. We're both here because we have no idea how to proceed... How does a potential solution NOT qualify as an "answer" ???
frannie Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 How does a potential solution NOT qualify as an "answer" ??? OK, we're here to seek answers to OUR (or mine, and his) questions rather than push answers onto other people's. And no, I'm not avoiding answers, solutions or input. Seems odd to me that you'd think I'd believe he was only going to get ONE side of anything posting on here, in whatever forum. Posting here is a great way of getting input from all angles... neither of us is afraid of that... We're looking for input. Hence the posts..?
Gunny376 Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 So, gunny... how did you go about that..? What decided you on leaving your marriage as a course of action? Did you have an OW, or did you want to leave because of the bad relationship you had with your wife..? How did you broach it to your children..? How did they react..? Was there no other way..? Did you not think of being with them in the marriage rather than out of it..? What decided you on divorce as the best course..? This all went down seventeen years ago, before the internet. I wasn't the cheating spouse ~ she was. Even still I tried my best to hold it together for the sake of the children, but as anyone who's been through this ~ its damn near impossible. Basically when it was all said and done ~ she couldn't handle Marine Corps Life. It got so bad ~ I had to send her and the children, because if I didn't there was going to be a "killin' and all that would have been left to do would to get a mop, a bucket, and a preacher to say a few final words! (The OM not the wife ~ I would never harm a woman especially the mother of my children) The children were relieved, and are quite happy, well adjusted and content, (they're grown now), in part because I knew that being carrer military, and just coming out of the first Gulf War that I would have a hard time getting custody. And, the children were young, and at that age they need their Mother. I also knew, that when you go to court, be it civil, divorce, or criminal that someone is going to lose something. So, I "manned up" with the idea of doing all I could that was righteous by my STBXW and in meeting the needs of my children. I gave the XW virtually everything from the 12 years marriage, took all the bills to include her car payment. I walked away with the clothes on my back and my personal belongings that you could pack in the back of of a Firebird. Its taken me years to recover and get back on my feet, and I do mean years. But, I accomplished what I set out to do and that was to provide the best possible childhood and life I could for my two children. BTW ~ when I got with my last LTR GF, she was still married, but separated pending divorce. I made her drive me to his house, knocked on his door, stood in front of him and looked him in the eye, and asked him basically if he was sure that it was over, and if there was any chance of their reconcilation, even the slightest or dimmest of chances,.................... because if there was I would be exiting stage left, and told him that as well. Which until WBAsmethwick and his wife have had full disclosure about this mess, is the righteous and honorable thing that YOU should be doing. Even if they do end divorcing ~ the two of you shouldn't be kicking it together until one solid year after the ink is dried on the papers. IMHO!
frannie Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 Right, gunny. So, forgive me, you've had no real experience of this situation at all?
Ladyjane14 Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 Seems odd to me that you'd think I'd believe he was only going to get ONE side of anything posting on here, in whatever forum. Well, you got me on that one... I suppose I'm assuming that the most natural response from most folks to a guy who's splitting his life between two women would be... "make a frikkin' decision already, guy". Now that you mention it, I reckon there probably are some folks who would tell him to keep the status quo. Afterall, what could be better than having it all? A wife at home for continuity of history and stability for the children... and a mistress on the side. If that's not "having it all"... I don't know what is! (Except for maybe personal integrity.) Posting here is a great way of getting input from all angles... neither of us is afraid of that... We're looking for input. Hence the posts..? Mine is just an opinion too. And in my very honest one... this man should go on home to his wife, lay his head in her lap, and confess every feeling he ever had. All his hurt, all his anguish.. and everything he's done on account of them. And he should NEVER see or speak to YOU again, regardless of the outcome of his confessions. In that way, he can rest assured that he's put his 100% into his family dynamic. He might lose them, but he's losing them anyway as things stand. And if it all goes to pot, he'll be okay as long as he still respects himself. He can find another woman later on, who's just as good as you were... but who doesn't make his heart bleed when he looks at her.
Author WBAsmethwick Posted February 4, 2007 Author Posted February 4, 2007 Are you wondering why you're here yet, WBAsmethwick? I have no doubt she believes her own rhetoric. I don't doubt that she honestly believes she's helping you to 'move forward and be happy'. But she doesn't know how your heart is going to bleed. Does she? To be honest I hope you stop posting in this thread.
Author WBAsmethwick Posted February 4, 2007 Author Posted February 4, 2007 Thank you all for your posts. Those of you men who have either been in my situation or one similar your perspective and views are appreciated. There are many common threads to your and my story. Those of you who have avoided inflammatory comments and implied criticism thank you. Those who have shown understanding and some genuine insite thank you. You have given me food for thought.
Ladyjane14 Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 To be honest I hope you stop posting in this thread. You have an "Ignore" feature. Feel free to utilize it. No skin off my nose. That said, my opinion still won't change. Using your kids to justify your adultery with another woman is NOT in their best interest... in my honest opinion. If you feel that your best interest is paramount, then of course... continuation of the current status quo is a better solution. If you're trying to do what's best for your children though... Living an exemplary life of truth and honor would provide them with better tools for their adult lives.
Author WBAsmethwick Posted February 4, 2007 Author Posted February 4, 2007 You won't get slammed or abused. You are not the first one. How do you know that this woman is your ideal partner? Have you gotten to know her on an intimate...not sexual, but personal...basis? Is she married...does she feel the same about you? Have you had sex with her? Why do you no longer love your wife? What happened? Intimacy is central to our relationship. We corresponded and talked for a long time before we became sexually intimate. We are intellectual, emotionally and artistically in tune. she is single, yes we have had sex. I don't love my wife because we are not intimate in any way. Decisions are made without my input and discussion is none existent, arguments aren't. What happened is we drifted apart and a wall was built, by both of us.
dilly Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 WBAsmethwick, As crass as Ladyjanes assessment of your situation, I'd welcome it as just another POV. Its nice to see Fannie, your OW contributing here as well. Now, it seems you just want validity to leave your marriage. Thats whats so great about this forum. Its like using a lifeline - polling the audience, what should he do folks? stay, or leave? If thats the case, its looking like you'll get half of us saying go for it , and the other half saying you have to stay. Not much help is it? You do have to listen to both voices, and don't discount it because it puts you in a bad light. The whole situation is pretty F$%^ed up as it is! Your situation is different than mine. If I was in your situation, and the OW loves you as much as she says, than honestly. Just do it. Its a huge step to take though. I have been following ilmw, post about his divorce (wow, what a read!), its the flip side of the coin with his wife leaving him but it puts it all into perspective. The heartaches and the emotional turmoil that divorce does. No surprise. While I feel like i can't be with my wife, I still love her and I know it would be extremely tough on her if I left. It just makes me re-evaluate what I'm going through. That said, if my XOW would have reciprocated my love, I would follow her to the ends of the earth. Your looking for a black and white validation, unfortunately life is shades of grey. You've got your kids lives that you don't want to mess up. quick tangent- The other night, i sat down and watched That Rosie O Donnell love boat cruise documentary on HBO where they had a cruise ship with gay and lesbian couples. They interviewed a gay couple, 2 men who had adopted 3 kids from foster homes. Now, I am totally heterosexual and my first inclination was that was preposterous! These kids are raised in a completely alternative lifestyle family. What is that going to do to their relationships when they grow up. Are the going to be gay too? Watching the interview, i could see that the kids are very well taken care of and the couple seemed to be very involved with their kids and the kids seemed to be very well adjusted. A really happy family! In my mind, as long as the kids have enough emotional support and have some semblence of love in their lives. They'll be fine. i believe that once you get your love life in order, you may find that your love for your kids won't be taken for granted either. They'll be doubly happy having two sets of households that love them! Seriously though, from what I've seen, your kids will be fine. Hell, look at all the messed up kids from perfectly fine households, and look at all the perfect kids from less than ideal households. If I were you, I'd leave your marriage, you have a loving woman in Frannie. That way, your wife can go on with her life as well and possible find her true love. You only live once so make it the best you possibly can right? (unless your buddhist and you believe in reincarnation). You can't find love, love finds you. As for me. I've decided that I'm going to go one more round in this marriage thing and see if it doesn't work out. If Its doesn't, I owe it to my self and invariably, my family (kids are like sponges, they know if your not happy, and in turn they are not happy) to find that happiness. Its so damn scary to face the world without somebody already there to take the steps with you. thats why i haven't left.
frannie Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 Well, you got me on that one... I suppose I'm assuming that the most natural response from most folks to a guy who's splitting his life between two women would be... "make a frikkin' decision already, guy". Now that you mention it, I reckon there probably are some folks who would tell him to keep the status quo. Afterall, what could be better than having it all? A wife at home for continuity of history and stability for the children... and a mistress on the side. If that's not "having it all"... I don't know what is! (Except for maybe personal integrity.) Well then you're making assumptions about me, and about him. I have no real idea what people will say, beyond the obvious... and actually what you've said is just echoing my comments to him over these few years I've known him. Maybe not in such terms, but those are the questions. Don't think you're saying anything new, because I've read all the forums, here, there and everywhere. I've listened to the words and they've gone right down into my soul. And I've asked myself and him the hard questions over and over. I have nothing to fear, and everything to gain from hearing whatever the questions here are, and whatever his answers are. I don't want to live in cloud cuckoo land. So ask away. But we're just people. And yes, we want to do the best we can. So why the big stick..? It might look fine but it's really redundant. We're just people here to ask questions, and this is OUR lives. Not just a side show for your commentary. If you have something to help us, comment... otherwise.. why type at all..?
frannie Posted February 4, 2007 Posted February 4, 2007 I just wanted to say thanks for posting dilly, and I don't feel I can comment on what you said, because this isn't exactly my thread, but thanks.
Gunny376 Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 Right, gunny. So, forgive me, you've had no real experience of this situation at all? Well golly, gezz, whittaker's 'Mrs Wilson' (Think Densis The Mensis) I guess when you get right down to it, no I've never have? (In that I never cheated on my wife or SO, GF) You know you can take your Crayola watercolors and paint this anyway you want to but when it all comes down to it, and all is said and done ~ there's more being said here than done. I mean this isn't trying to do Chinesse calculus. Its not that complicated?! Lady Jane was just being more sutle about the situation. The facts of the matter is that WBA is married to another woman (also another real person) with children (also real people), who's mentally, physcially, and emotionally enstranged from his wife. He's found out that though while married, that he doesn't have to be by himself to be alone! And, because he has needs just like the rest of us ~ both mental, emotional, physical, and intimate-wise, he goes out and lures another single woman into this mess ~ instead of "manning-up" and doing the hard work at hand, and making the hard choices. Bad enough that he's gotten himself into the mess he's in, he's drug you (also another real person with real wants, needs, desires, dreams, hopes and un-answered prayers) into it?! To be honest with you? I think you deserve better than him. But, that's just my own personal opinion ~ and that plus $1.50 will get you a cup of coffee down at the Waffle House. But, we could sit around all night drinking whiskey and spitting such into the fire. That's not constructive, and its not solving your problem ~ eh? WBA ~ I'm not disrespecting you ~ you've got caught up in a mess. I'm sure that going into the marriage this isn't what you had in mind when it comes to marriage. And, to be honest you, me, Frannie, Lady Jane, all of us, probally had 1/10th of the knowledge, education, and experience that was required to pull it off and make it work. Its like John Wayne once said in one his movies ~ "There's a Hell of a lot of things that they didn't tell me when I signed up for this outfit!" And, then's the simple fact ~ that when most of us get married, we're actually are marrying three different people. The one that we think we're marrying, the one that we're actually are marrying, and the one that comes about as a result of having married us?! (There's possiblly for some a fourth ~ the one that you meet in divorce court as in, "I can't believe that's the same person I've been married to all these years!") WBA, even if you were to kick Frannie to the curb ~ in an effort to make your marriage work ~ there's the wife. Its sounds like to me that there's too much water over the damn and under the bridge to go back. It sounds as though there's a lot of resentment, anger, bitterness, hurt in your marriage in order to pull it back together. Half of all first time marriages end in divorce ~ mainly because as I said most have 1/10th of the knowledge and experience to make it work. Sixty two percent of second marriages end in divorce, (Mainly because they're transitionary and re-bound relationships and people jump back into the fire too quickly without learning and educating themselves as to what it takes to make a relationship work) But your going to have to "man-up" and make some hard choices and hard decisions here. Either kick the wife to the curb, or kick Frannie to curb. If you love Frannie as much as you say you do ~ you're doing her wrong in keeping her hanging on. You're hurting her, and its a testement to her characther that she standing by you through this BS! Its time to "man-up"! Its time to "Lead, follow, or shut the Hell up!" Its time to choose! Its time to get a "pair" The children? The young, they're adaptable! They're flexable, and they're more resialant than you know! They would rather see Mama and Daddy apart and Happy ~ than miserable together! If Frannie is all that you say she is to you ~ your so-called "Soulmate" then its time to put the big boy britches on ~ its time to make and set things right! Its time to make her and honest woman! And the woman in and of your life ~ or do the right thing ~ and let her go! Personally? From what you've described ~ all I ever see you accomplishing with the wife is living in a martial comma ~ hating life and most people in it. Going through the motions, talking about what needs to be done, what chores are to be done, what bills to be paid. You might call that a marriage ~ I don't! I'd call it quits! "IF" the wife was on board with going to IC and or MC and was 100% involved with saving the marriage ~ I'd say stay with the wife, but from what you described she's not on board with that. There's a lot of things you can do by yourself ~ being in a marriage by yourself isn't one of them! By the way! Cutting off LJ from this thread? You just PO'd and screwed a SIGNFICANT WEALTH amount of wisdom and knowledge! You both need to open up your minds, your not searching for the answers to the questions, nor the solutions to your problems, your searching for the answers and solutions that YOU want to hear to your questions and problems!
norajane Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 WBA, from what I recall of what frannie wrote, you see your kids primarily only on the weekends anyway since you are a business traveler and stay with frannie much of the week. So, really, what difference would it make to either your kids' lives or yours if you divorced? You'd still see them on the weekends, and you'd still have the option of going to their sporting or school events. Do you see them much more than that now? When? Holidays? You can split those in a joint custody arrangement. If your marriage is dead, then you are using frannie as a crutch so you can "endure" your marriage. If your marriage isn't as dead as you make it sound, then you are using frannie as an excuse not to give 100% to making your marriage work. Either way, the kids are not relevant to your fundamental problem because you're not home full time with them anyway - your problem is you aren't ready to divorce, and you aren't willing to give up your OW. Tell your wife you're having an affair. Give her the opportunity to make an informed decision about her life and her marriage. Maybe your wife will step up and want to work on the marriage, or maybe she'll want a divorce. Either way, she'll make the decision for you, which should work out fine since you can't make the decision for yourself.
Gunny376 Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 Well then you're making assumptions about me, and about him. No she's not, but in part what she is saying is that there's a bio-chemical element involved with all of this ~that she has studied, and that she understands ~ but you don't. Its not you, its not him, its not me, its not us. Neither of you are crazy, neither is she, nor am I.
Gunny376 Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 WBA, from what I recall of what frannie wrote, you see your kids primarily only on the weekends anyway since you are a business traveler and stay with frannie much of the week. So, really, what difference would it make to either your kids' lives or yours if you divorced? You'd still see them on the weekends, and you'd still have the option of going to their sporting or school events. Do you see them much more than that now? When? Holidays? You can split those in a joint custody arrangement. If your marriage is dead, then you are using frannie as a crutch so you can "endure" your marriage. If your marriage isn't as dead as you make it sound, then you are using frannie as an excuse not to give 100% to making your marriage work. Either way, the kids are not relevant to your fundamental problem because you're not home full time with them anyway - your problem is you aren't ready to divorce, and you aren't willing to give up your OW. Tell your wife you're having an affair. Give her the opportunity to make an informed decision about her life and her marriage. Maybe your wife will step up and want to work on the marriage, or maybe she'll want a divorce. Either way, she'll make the decision for you, which should work out fine since you can't make the decision for yourself. Hammer + Nail! You just hit it right on the head with that post! :bunny:
OldEurope Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 It is certain that these men need to rethink what their goal is. Do you want to save your marriage and keep your family or do you want your freedom and pursue your personal goals. Why why why is it always the mens'/the husbands' fault on these boards? Oh there is a nod or two on occasion on these boards that "both sides" are at fault, but the bulk of the womens' responses here are somehow viscerally programmed to thing the H is almost exclusively to blame. You know, perhaps it is the wife who not a participant in the marriage. Perhaps it is she who is lacking--and unwilling to repair the breakdown of--emotional intimacy. Perhaps she wants the convenience and comfiness of the legal umbrella of a marriage and is in no way lifting a finger to concern herself with him. I know or know of men who are constantly doing backflips trying to please their wives--emotionally, materially, etc--and its just not ever good enough. Men have to bust their ----s to make wads of money, be the pragmatic, dutiful, responsible backbone to a marriage, see to it their kids are secure and support a wife who simply may be flakey, non-committed, whimsical, moody, who knows what--all kinds of things. Then he finds emotional support and intimacy with another woman because he is human and is not a robot out to just feed mouths and buy the latest purse for a spouse. Horrible, right! God Forbid, that a breakdown of a marriage should ever have to do in great measure with the wife.... As for the quote above, I love the "either/or" approach to this view of life. How sad. In the right marriage, you have your marriage and family AND you can pursue your own personal goals. A couple is made up of two individuals. Since when are you supposed to give your identity up? Is that not, at the end of the day, the single biggest cause of frustration and breakdown in marriages: people losing a sense of themselves to be constantly taking care of another person who cannot and will not get it together? I cannot totally blame these men for vacillating. They want or have wanted things to work and most likely have a hard time facing the fact that their marriage, no matter how glaring the problems, has not been the one they too dreamt for and most likely tried to give their best. I agree that at a certain point one has to be decisive; it is much worse when there are kids. But to slam these men--all four or five or how many--because they aren't out there still pushing that rock up the mountain like poor old Sisyphus (look it up, good metaphor), is simply unfair. What are the wives doing in these cases? How are they knocking themselves out for their Hs? (BTW "personal goals" is here not meant to imply here the pursuit of As, as in a great marriage these will not happen). We wait for the day Western Civilization gets this right!
noforgiveness Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 To be honest I hope you stop posting in this thread. Wow that sure doesn't sound like it came from a married man who wanted advice at all. ladyjane has offered you some very wise advice and things to think about. Can you not even face reading someones advice let alone face the mess you have made of your life, your childrens lives, your wifes and frannies?
LucreziaBorgia Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 I just read this whole thread, and its pretty much the same old same old. Regardless of how much the MM "loves" the OW, he chooses to remain married. Do the reasons really matter in the grand scheme of things? Does knowing a reason why really make it any better or bearable for the OW? So, he's staying married. Frannie, that gives you only a couple of options: remain the OW to a man who chooses a loveless marriage over a life with you, or walk away from him. As for the MM, seriously... you aren't doing your children any favors by staying. You can be a better father to them when your own life is happier and more stable. I know you don't want to demote yourself down to a "part time dad", but the fact is - you can be a great "part time" dad within a context of a full and happy life, or you can be a miserable "full time" dad who cheats on his wife and maintains a miserable personal existance in a loveless marriage. What do you want for your kids, MM? Your actions in all of this are giving your children a blueprint for their own futures in terms of relationships. You can hide and deny all you want, but children learn the greatest lessons from their parents not from their words, but from their actions. Kids know when mom and dad aren't happy together. You can fake it all you want for the "children's sake" but take it from the child of philanderers - they know. And yes, dad - you will fall from grace in their eyes. It would be far better to go ahead and divorce, and move out and form your own happiness and bring your kids into that happiness than it would be to stay married and raise your children up in a dysfunctional marriage. I see no reason whatsoever to stay married, given your emotional standing with Frannie. If you stay, everyone loses. Your W is trapped and doomed to a life lived out with a cheater who doesn't love her, your children will eventually see how obligational they are to you in terms of sacrificing your happiness, Frannie will be doomed to a half life "dating" someone else's husband, and you will be miserable. If you leave, then W gets to start over and find someone who will love her, your children will no longer be reared in a dysfunctional environment, Frannie will be happier, and you will be happier. It will be like a bomb going off at first, but when things settle you'll all be better off for it.
norajane Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 Hammer + Nail! You just hit it right on the head with that post! :bunny: Something tells me one nail isn't enough to finish the job... WBA has all the tools he needs to figure this out - successful businessmen aren't generally without powers of reason, logic, and analytical thought. They know that tackling a big problem requires breaking it down into smaller pieces. He's had 2 or 3 years to do it - surely, he's had enough time to consider all his options. Maybe he doesn't want to deal with the financial repercussions of a divorce...that's the only thing I can think of that would keep him standing with a foot in both camps for so long.
mum2three Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 about Frannie and your decision will be made. Has it crossed your mind that your wife might have OM if she doesn't need you for sexual intimacy? You mentioned that you are not home alot. Would it be easier to walk away then? You guys are adults and you have been wrapped up in this extra-marital relationship for over a year. It is time to tell your wife so she knows exactly where she stands. If she wants you, she'll tell you. If you feel anything left for her, you will try and work on it. But it is not getting the 3 of you anywhere right now. It will come to a full blown explosion if this keeps going on.
movinon05 Posted February 5, 2007 Posted February 5, 2007 As for the MM, seriously... you aren't doing your children any favors by staying. You can be a better father to them when your own life is happier and more stable. I know you don't want to demote yourself down to a "part time dad", but the fact is - you can be a great "part time" dad within a context of a full and happy life, or you can be a miserable "full time" dad who cheats on his wife and maintains a miserable personal existance in a loveless marriage. What do you want for your kids, MM? Your actions in all of this are giving your children a blueprint for their own futures in terms of relationships. You can hide and deny all you want, but children learn the greatest lessons from their parents not from their words, but from their actions. Kids know when mom and dad aren't happy together. You can fake it all you want for the "children's sake" but take it from the child of philanderers - they know. And yes, dad - you will fall from grace in their eyes. It would be far better to go ahead and divorce, and move out and form your own happiness and bring your kids into that happiness than it would be to stay married and raise your children up in a dysfunctional marriage. If you stay, everyone loses. Your W is trapped and doomed to a life lived out with a cheater who doesn't love her, your children will eventually see how obligational they are to you in terms of sacrificing your happiness, Frannie will be doomed to a half life "dating" someone else's husband, and you will be miserable. If you leave, then W gets to start over and find someone who will love her, your children will no longer be reared in a dysfunctional environment, Frannie will be happier, and you will be happier. It will be like a bomb going off at first, but when things settle you'll all be better off for it. I would like to address these particular points. I am a firm believer that, unless there are extenuating circumstances, you do not stay married for the sake of the children when you know, in your heart, the marriage is over. I sense that is the way it is with you. I was a child of divorce, and honestly, I couldn't wait for my parents to divorce. While there was no infidelity involved, I prayed it would happen because it was too unbearable living like that. And I too, had an A. I knew my M was over. My experience was probably far more "horrendous" (for lack of a better word) than you would probably deal with and I did hurt my children. I did "fall from grace" in their eyes. But when all was said and done, they came to me because I did everything I could to put them first during and after the divorce. As a result, I have never been closer to my children and I have earned their trust. I even heard recently from one of my son's friends, that my son was going on about what a great mom he has. My ex thought his world was ending, but he found someone new in about 8 months, and he's moved away with her and is having a good old time. In my heart, I knew I didn't love him and knew that he also deserved a chance to be with someone who loved him the way he wanted. I think you owe that to your wife as well. I'm just trying to point out that life does not end for you, for your wife, or for your kids. And btw, I am not with the MM. But honestly, I'm glad it turned out this way anyway. Quite frankly, this big secret of yours is what is keeping you on the fence.
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