ratingsguy Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 Well here's an update to my situation. My xMW (now separated at age 46) is now living away from home 3 nights a week. We've gone back and forth on e-mail... she's told me that she wants to start enjoying her freedom to do a lot of things - travel, spend time with family and friends, new hobbies, fix up a townhome she just bought and check out the dating scene (although she said she's not sure about dating just yet). She's been married for 22 years, and thinks that this will be her only opportunity to enjoy being single for a while... time to grow and explore new things and new people in life. She says that she is very emotionally connected to me, (and I believe that totally) but in order for her to enjoy her newfound freedom she needs to detach from me a little bit, even though she considers me the best man she's ever made part of her life. As suspect as that may sound, I think I can say that I understand where she's coming from. 22 years is a long time to be tied down to one person, especially if you've been out of love for 10 of those years. But this hurts. She's told me that she would still like to see me, but just less frequently (although since she's said that, it seems like we're seeing each other more). I don't know if that's a good idea, if I should wait in the wings while she gets this out of her system, or just never contact her again. Both choices I think will cause considerable pain and heartache for me. She had said that she wishes it were a year from now so she could have the single experience and then begin a relationship with me. She also doesn't shy from telling me that she misses me a lot, and just by the way she acts, I know she's completely honest about how she feels about me. We went out last night for dinner and talked things over a bit. It wasn't even one of her "free" nights, but her kids were out and she asked me if I wanted to get together. It was a great surprise! So when we got together, I was very honest with her. I told her exactly how I felt. No ultimadums, no "do this or else". I said that I want to give her the time she needs, so once we are officially in a relationship, she wouldn't regret at least not having some time being single. She said that there are no guarantees and she had me promise her that I would continue to search for a younger woman who could give me a family one day. I said I would, but I wouldn't look that hard. Her feeling is that she doesn't want to lose me, but wants to be fair to me at the same time. I told her that I want to be with her and I've never been more sure of anything in my life. I'm happy with the pieces if it means getting the whole pie! Her biggest fear is hurting me by not being able to control her emotions... which are all over the map right now. I know she needs time to herself and I have to respect that. But she tells me that I'm so hard to resist. I thought I would probably break down emotionally during our time together, which wouldn't have made anything better, but it didn't happen, thankfully. She told me that she was surprised that I didn't try to pull her back (meaning asking for more time together as opposed to granting her her wish to see less of each other). I basically told her that I didn't want to lose her by taking her freedom away. But she admitted that she couldn't picture herself with anyone else. So she's confused and needs time to work through this stuff I think. She said that she wants to rediscover life without losing me. A friend of mine told me that now is the time to step it up... send flowers, write more poems, stuff like that. Is that a good idea? The thought has occurred to me that she must think her and I will last forever if she wants time apart. What I mean is, if she thinks that, she may realize that she will never be single again, and that could be her motivation for wanting to see less of me. This is kind of sad, but I remain hopeful. My wastebasket had a lot of used tissues in it yesterday. But after seeing my xMW last night I feel better. Should I?
bonehead Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 I know I have really enjoyed the time I had between my divorce and her moving in. And I know her time between seperating from her husband and moving in has been a big help to her.
movinon05 Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 I think you feel better because you saw her. I don't think you feel better because of the situation. Obviously its not what you want. This is a very hard call and you are being a very generous person. Kudos to you. On the other hand, I can certainly relate to the allure she has of being single. Thing is, once you have your single time, go out and party and meet people, its a whole different ball game. For me, it got old and the dating got old because I truly did want to be in a committed relationship. For her, she has you to fall back on. That could be good and bad for you. She is also telling you to go date younger women so that you might have a family of your own one day, even though she might miss you. Only time is going to tell how this unfolds, but in fairness to yourself, I think you need to think hard about dating other people. You should not put your life on hold because she is obviously not going to put her life on hold either. I'm a firm believer in "if its meant to be, then it will be". You and she may not discover if it is until she has gone through her "single" experience. You're a very understanding guy. And you're obviously hurting. Since she is being honest and thinking about herself, I think you need to think about yourself now too.
whichwayisup Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 A friend of mine told me that now is the time to step it up... send flowers, write more poems, stuff like that. Is that a good idea? Flowers yes, poems no...But don't do it too often, she may look at that as pushing... BE a friend, yet try to detach yourself from her (if you can) abit emotionally until life settles down for her. Atleast she's being really honest with you, so don't doubt how she feels for ya...
GreenEyedLady Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 She said that there are no guarantees and she had me promise her that I would continue to search for a younger woman who could give me a family one day. This really stood out to me...hear what she is really saying...If she had said something else, I wouldn't be as concerned... I think that you should go out and date...but it's your call... Good Luck RG!
LucreziaBorgia Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 she's told me that she wants to start enjoying her freedom time to grow and explore new things and new people in life she needs to detach from me She's told me that she would still like to see me, but just less frequently she wishes ... she could have the single experience She said that there are no guarantees and she had me promise her that I would continue to search for a younger woman who could give me a family one day Her biggest fear is hurting me It sounds like your affair was a classic exit affair. Protect your heart, and protect it well. Please do not pin all your hopes onto this woman.
NoIDidn't Posted January 13, 2007 Posted January 13, 2007 LB, you took the words right out of my *post*. Definitely date other women. She got out and now she is on the run. Don't send her flowers right away. Your friend's advice is good for a *regular* woman, not a separated one. Anything you do to show her that you love and want to be with her, will be seen as trying to control her. Not a good sign for someone finally enjoying the freedom of not having a man to take care of. She is thinking long and hard about what M and seriously committed relationships can turn into when things go south and is trying to avoid that by any means necessary. Guard your heart. For sure.
pureinheart Posted January 14, 2007 Posted January 14, 2007 Hey Ratingsguy....if I'm not being rude, may I ask what the age difference is?
Author ratingsguy Posted January 14, 2007 Author Posted January 14, 2007 Not rude at all... she's 46 and I'm 31.
frannie Posted January 14, 2007 Posted January 14, 2007 ratingsguy, I think it's really good that she's being honest with you about what she needs to do now. The problem for you is, as you say... what do you do? You know it's her you want (at this point), you're even saying you'd accept very little at the moment just so it might work out in the long-term. But that isn't very good for you, is it..? I don't know what I'd do in your position. Because the time-lines are all messed up. By the time you've gone NC, 'forgotten' her and started to move on she might just be getting round to thinking hmmmm you know there's nothing much else out here and I really do like ratingsguy I'd be a fool to let him go... On the other hand, if you keep dating her occasionally you're going to find it so hard not to get frustrated and start pushing or feeling down because of what's happened, and wanting more In the absence of a 'perfect' solution to this I think I'd try to 'forget' the plans you had for a future with her, and start thinking day-to-day. Who knows what will happen next week or next month..? When you find yourself wondering what will happen or what she's doing or whatever... just forget it and get on with your day. Open yourself up to new possibilities and say 'yes' to things you might have been putting on hold because you were waiting for her decision/separation. Who knows... you may find that by the time she comes round things have moved on for you and life has started to take you in a new direction..?
Author ratingsguy Posted January 14, 2007 Author Posted January 14, 2007 Thanks everyone for your advice. You're all a great group of people. I think I'm just going to take this day to day. I see a lot of potential, but I also see some warning signs. This will have to play out a little bit more I think. The one thing that confuses me above everything else is her telling me to look for that younger woman who will give me a family. I can't understand why (if she truly has strong feelings for me, which I have perfect faith that she does) she would suggest this repeatedly, especially after how she also repeatedly states the fact that she doesn't want to lose me. It's a mixed signal that I can't quite figure out. Is she looking out for my best interest? Is it guilt? Is she trying to be fair while she's exploring being single? What is it? And for the record, having kids isn't much of an issue for me. It was since I love children (and she does know that), but not as much anymore.
frannie Posted January 14, 2007 Posted January 14, 2007 So do you never want children, ratingsguy..? (sorry, I don't even know if you have any!)
Author ratingsguy Posted January 14, 2007 Author Posted January 14, 2007 That's ok! No, I don't have children. Like I've said to my xMW, I would love to have kids someday, but sometimes in life you have to make sacrifices. As much as I love my neices and nephews, I don't think it would be a tragedy if I died without offspring.
frannie Posted January 14, 2007 Posted January 14, 2007 OK well my guess is that she genuinely believes it's a worry that one day you may want children and she won't be able to give you any. No one knows how they're going to feel about never having children til it comes down to the real questioning time. Of course that's not so clear-cut with a man as with a woman. Either that or she's using it as an excuse, but I don't really feel that's the case, as you say your gut is telling you that she genuinely cares for you and doesn't want to lose you. I think she's probably just thinking very clearly about things... and doing the sensible thing..? What do you think?
Author ratingsguy Posted January 14, 2007 Author Posted January 14, 2007 I think you're right frannie, but how do I go about convincing her that having kids isn't necessarily all that important to me?
whichwayisup Posted January 14, 2007 Posted January 14, 2007 she's 46 and I'm 31. She also could be concerned that the age difference at some point will become a factor as she ages...Not saying it will make a difference to you, but in her mind that could be a worry. The kids thing, well, you'll be stepdad to her kids, right? Guess she just thinks you'll be missing out on creating your own family... What can you do to convince her? I don't know, because your feelings could change in 5 years. At 31 some still aren't sure, male or female. I'm getting real close to 36 years old and I still don't know...I can't shut the door completely but I can't say when either.
frannie Posted January 14, 2007 Posted January 14, 2007 I think you're right frannie, but how do I go about convincing her that having kids isn't necessarily all that important to me? Hmm well I don't know if you can... because as I said, no one knows how they're going to feel down the line. At your age, it's probably not something you've given serious thought to..? (not making assumptions) but later on...? Besides, I doubt that is the only thing on her mind when she says she wants space, freedom, time, etc. It's probably just one aspect amongst many others. You know, ratingsguy... she may be right... what about that woman who might come along and all of a sudden... everything falls into place and you do want children with her..? I know it's hard to think about that, but... those opportunities are out there. Your MW is thinking about life opportunities now, and she's encouraging you to do the same... she's saying... don't close off your chances for living a full life. And she's right, in a way, eh..?
oyster Posted January 15, 2007 Posted January 15, 2007 Ratingsguy : you have a very similar situation as I had. 1- you are in a OW/YM relationship (older woman, yonger man). I am 32 and ex-MW is 39. Go do some reading on agelesslove dot com you will get more stories from people in similar relationship. Lots of advice on how to deal with your OW concerns. 2- you are dealing with an attached woman. This board is great for advice on this topic.
oyster Posted January 15, 2007 Posted January 15, 2007 Well here's an update to my situation. My xMW (now separated at age 46) is now living away from home 3 nights a week. We've gone back and forth on e-mail... she's told me that she wants to start enjoying her freedom to do a lot of things - travel, spend time with family and friends, new hobbies, fix up a townhome she just bought and check out the dating scene (although she said she's not sure about dating just yet). She's been married for 22 years, and thinks that this will be her only opportunity to enjoy being single for a while... time to grow and explore new things and new people in life. She says that she is very emotionally connected to me, (and I believe that totally) but in order for her to enjoy her newfound freedom she needs to detach from me a little bit, even though she considers me the best man she's ever made part of her life. Congratulation, your exMW made more progress, she is living away from home. Her request for freedom, to mingle with other people is similar song that my exMW said too. She wants to make sure you are the one as she has less time to waste then you. Also she is juggling the OW/YM topic in her head and weighting the risk of being lonely down the road should in 2, 5 years or later you decide to leave her. As suspect as that may sound, I think I can say that I understand where she's coming from. 22 years is a long time to be tied down to one person, especially if you've been out of love for 10 of those years. But this hurts. She's told me that she would still like to see me, but just less frequently (although since she's said that, it seems like we're seeing each other more). I don't know if that's a good idea, if I should wait in the wings while she gets this out of her system, or just never contact her again. Both choices I think will cause considerable pain and heartache for me. She had said that she wishes it were a year from now so she could have the single experience and then begin a relationship with me. She also doesn't shy from telling me that she misses me a lot, and just by the way she acts, I know she's completely honest about how she feels about me. She did asked me to see each other less frequently. I agreed. She kept coming back daily:) You have no choice then to give her space. She is probably looking for a pen pal or a close friend. My exMW complained that she was so controlled she had little friends. We went out last night for dinner and talked things over a bit. It wasn't even one of her "free" nights, but her kids were out and she asked me if I wanted to get together. It was a great surprise! So when we got together, I was very honest with her. I told her exactly how I felt. No ultimadums, no "do this or else". I said that I want to give her the time she needs, so once we are officially in a relationship, she wouldn't regret at least not having some time being single. Good stuff, she knows your deck of card and no hidden agenda. I agree ultimatum do not work. Plus good approach. She said that there are no guarantees and she had me promise her that I would continue to search for a younger woman who could give me a family one day. I said I would, but I wouldn't look that hard. Her feeling is that she doesn't want to lose me, but wants to be fair to me at the same time. She truely loves you enough to set you free. She is doing the opposite of what she experienced. Very mature and responsible. We had this discussion that I would find a younger woman to settle down and why I bothered with all the headeaches of an attached older woman. We discussed this so many times. Oh she might be testing you too by pushing you away. Testing your commitment and resolve to be with an older woman. I told her that I want to be with her and I've never been more sure of anything in my life. I'm happy with the pieces if it means getting the whole pie! Her biggest fear is hurting me by not being able to control her emotions... which are all over the map right now. I know she needs time to herself and I have to respect that. But she tells me that I'm so hard to resist. I thought I would probably break down emotionally during our time together, which wouldn't have made anything better, but it didn't happen, thankfully. The thought has occurred to me that she must think her and I will last forever if she wants time apart. What I mean is, if she thinks that, she may realize that she will never be single again, and that could be her motivation for wanting to see less of me. This is kind of sad, but I remain hopeful. My wastebasket had a lot of used tissues in it yesterday. But after seeing my xMW last night I feel better. Should I? don't stay home, go out to a coffee shop or something to stop crying. It is a possibility that she wants time apart to see if this is a fantasy or not.
Author ratingsguy Posted January 15, 2007 Author Posted January 15, 2007 Thanks for chiming in, oyster. There are so many thoughts running through my mind. On the one hand, I don't doubt that she needs time to herself to see other people, since 22 years in a M is a long time. If we got into a R tomorrow, she would regret not taking advantage of being single at this point in her life. I also don't doubt the strength of her feelings for me. People are telling me to date other people, but I don't want to grow apart if that's possible. I think we are truly meant to be together, but right now the timing is bad. So I'm doing my best to refocus my energies elsewhere in the meantime. I have to give her time to herself... going NC isn't really an option here. I can't push her because this is a really trying time for her and I need to be understanding. Oyster - PM when you get a chance. I'm interested how your situation is going, too.
oyster Posted January 15, 2007 Posted January 15, 2007 Thanks for chiming in, oyster. There are so many thoughts running through my mind. On the one hand, I don't doubt that she needs time to herself to see other people, since 22 years in a M is a long time. If we got into a R tomorrow, she would regret not taking advantage of being single at this point in her life. I also don't doubt the strength of her feelings for me. People are telling me to date other people, but I don't want to grow apart if that's possible. I think we are truly meant to be together, but right now the timing is bad. So I'm doing my best to refocus my energies elsewhere in the meantime. I have to give her time to herself... going NC isn't really an option here. I can't push her because this is a really trying time for her and I need to be understanding. Oyster - PM when you get a chance. I'm interested how your situation is going, too. PM sent. what ever you do, DO NOT push buttons or put more pressure on her. Any action that is perceived as trying to steer or control her will make her compare you to her controlling husband. I blocked 1 mean of communication with my ex-MW, she found a way to get in contact with me. So going NC is not that bad. If she wants you, she will find a way back to your heart. Our natural instinct is to talk to them logically but as Moongirl explained, she has been abused and we can't understand it. Time is what she needs to process information from "an ordinary life"
MoonGirl Posted January 18, 2007 Posted January 18, 2007 Hi everyone! Me again to try to help out the OM dating MW. Ratingsguy, As a MW who deeply loves her OM, I can tell you that SO MANY different thoughts run through my mind...everything from "I have to leave my husband this minute to be with OM" to "I don't deserve OM and I don't want to subject him to my life's insanity" to "I just want to be alone and deal with my problems". Most of the time, I want to be with my OM. Yet, because I really do love him, I also want what is best for him and I am convinced that what is best for him is not me. It is all very confusing. I worry about whether or not he loves me and wants to be with me. I wonder if he'll end up treating me like my husband did even though I know that's not likely. Your MW probably has many of the same thoughts, and your age difference is likely one of her main concerns (just like one of my main concerns is that I really don't want anymore children, but my OM has mentioned that he would like another child sometime in the future). I also don't know if I can give him the kind of commitment he deserves. Even though I love him, I am understandably wary of marriage and co-habitating with a man. Only time will be able to sort all of this out for us and for you and your MW. It does sound like your MW is being fair to you and like she really does care about you. Even so, the amount of change she is experiencing is overwhelming and you are just a part of the whole picture. I hope that doesn't sound harsh, but it is reality. I certainly don't want to feel trapped again and I have no plans on moving in with my OM for at least a few years. Being free to mourn the loss of my previous life with my husband (however awful it has been) and to stand on my own feet is necessary before I can fully give myself to my OM if he still wants me then. I hope this helps a bit.
Author ratingsguy Posted January 19, 2007 Author Posted January 19, 2007 Wow, I think that sums up exactly how my xMW is feeling right now. It's almost as if you sat down and interviewed her! We've talked this out a lot, and just about everything you say rings true. She wants to be with me, but then she doesn't. She needs time to herself, then out of the blue she asks me if I want to get together. She doesn't think she's good enough for me. And the list goes on. Like yourself, she is confused. I've basically just told her to go at her own pace. I can accept that things are kind of nutty in her life right now. The only thing I can do is support her and stand on the sidelines for the time being. She means the world to me and I don't want to be a distraction since she has a million other things to worry about right now. It hurts, but I know it's what's necessary now. Once things settle down in your life, I think you should give your OM a shot at a relationship (if that's what he wants). Go slow at first... go out on a few dates and then see what happens. I'm sure he cares deeply about you. You don't want to live with the regret of at least not giving it a try... after all, he did win your heart. It's the least you can do for the man who stood by you so patiently. Great post!
MoonGirl Posted January 20, 2007 Posted January 20, 2007 Hi ratingsguy, Yes, I would certainly give my OM a chance once I am out of my situation. I love him very much and have known him for a long long time. I often wonder if he loves me as much as I love him...and only time will tell. I hope you're doing well. If your MW calls to see you a lot, then it sounds like she enjoys spending time with you very much. In my opinion, actions speak louder than words. Chat with you soon!
norajane Posted January 20, 2007 Posted January 20, 2007 Ratingsguy, I think you're being far too accepting of her behavior. Yes, she has a lot to go through, but make sure you are watching out for yourself. If you were the crutch she needed to get out of her marriage, the last thing you want to be is her back-up while she goes out and dates other people. As long as she knows you're going to hang around waiting for her, she has no reason to make a decision about your relationship. The woman is going out on dates, and is on dating sites. Maybe you need to consider doing a little dating of your own and see what else might be out there for you. I know you don't want to, and you don't think you can. But, she needs to respect you and she needs to understand that you're not HERS and that she doesn't HAVE you. She needs to understand that she, indeed, could very well LOSE you and that she can't expect you to be there for her when she comes running back after having f*cked half the guys in town. You were in a relationship with her. What happened to all that LUUUUUV she professed for you? Don't just wait around for her. Live your life. She is.
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