Long Distance Muslim Relationship...(long)

[Spooon69]

Hi,

 

First I just want to say this place is great, people seem really sincere and helpful. I've been lurking here for a while, but I guess I was hoping I'd never have to actually start a new thread, well, a "help me" thread, maybe something in the more cheerful section of this site, ha.

 

First, let me explain what kind of person I am and my beliefs, just so that you can understand what I'm going through, this isn't really the kind of relationship that you may usually see in the average American home.

 

I really hope all of you can understand where I'm coming from, since my values sometimes sway between the American and the Eastern values. From what I have read in these forums, while people do respect and try to understand and help, there really is no substitute for growing up in the environment to really understand. I hope that didn't come off as offensive, I just want to get this out and talking to my Muslim friends will give me a strict "Eastern" answer, while talking to my American friends will give me the opposite. I guess I'm just looking for a blended answer if thats possible, since that's the kind of person I am. Born in Pakistan, raised in the US, but values that exist in both worlds.

 

So I'm Muslim, pretty religious, not super devout, I guess I'd say sometimes I have more faith than religion in me, but sometimes it flips (blame it on growing up, I'm 27). My family and I moved to the US when I was 10, and I have Muslim friends, Christian friends, Atheist friends, etc. Nothing out of the ordinary, but at home the whole family is pretty Pakistani, which I like, it's like being back in Pakistan (family tries to visit every couple years, we still have relatives back there). It's like we have our own little Pakistan at home, my friends like it cause then they get to eat tons of Pakistani food all the time. Outside the home we're your usual American family.

 

The point is, I've had 2 girlfriends before, both of them non-Muslim and having a girlfriend is actually a big no-no because my parents are pretty devout (but lenient and loving) and they would never approve. One gf was in undergrad and one in grad school. We were good friends and after a few years it developed into a relationship (with both of them; I don't "pick up" girls, I just like hanging out with them and if things happen, great, if not, no loss, I don't really look for a relationship or even just hooking up). I ended it with both of them after ~10-12 months because I didn't love them and didn't see myself with them, I guess I was selfish for waiting so long to tell them that, I was just hoping it would develop into something. My last one is still one of my best friends and we talk all the time.

 

Back to the point. I guess I wanted a girl who could see both parts of me, the "American" and the "Pakistani", if that makes sense.

 

Well anyway. There's this girl...lets call her S.

 

Our families have known each for a long time, before her and I were even born. My sister and I played with her and her sisters/brothers all the time while we lived in Pakistan. All of us were pretty close, and my family still visited them and talked to them all the time whenever they visited (I didn't go back for a visit to Pakistan as frequently as them). So I went last Christmas break with my family to Pakistan, it had been a long time since I did go back, probably around 10 years. So then I saw her...

 

She was amazing, but I figured, whatever, an extremely pretty girl, I'll be here for 2 weeks and after that nothing, so why bother right? But she was perfect. Educated, beautiful, funny, and she understood both parts of me (American and Pakistani) since she's lived in Canada for a few years as well. So all of us hung out pretty much every night, there were usually about 8 of us just having a good time. We talked to each other a lot, it was nice, but like I said, long distances... So eventually I came back to the US and we started talking over email and IM, a lot. Then the phone calls started and we started getting closer. Her family is pretty strict and are into the whole arranged marriage thing, which is fine by me if others want to do it, but not me (not the true type of arranged anyway). The problem is, she has been hurt before, she's been engaged 4 times before and every time it has broken off (yes, 4). I believe the first one was her choice and the other three were arranged, so she's been burned 4 times.

 

Let me mention here that her family is really wealthy and I never actually bothered or cared much about the details about the previous engagements, but from what I hear one of them broke off because of financial reasons with the groom, whatever they might be, and another because the guy fell in love with another girl.

 

So after a couple months I find out that her parents want to get her arranged again. This girl trusts her parents and I guess doesn't want to make a wrong decision again so she'll get arranged. This whole time I've gotten close to her so I ask her to tell her parents to stop the arrangement, to give us a chance. So after a while it was "official", an arranged marriage*. Something her parents could be happy with and something she agreed with.

 

*Almost every marriage in Pakistan (in the East?) is arranged, not like you're thinking though. A true arranged marriage is something the parents initiate for their children. If 2 people fall in love and want to get married, they speak to their parents who then talk to each other to make it "arranged". It's rare to hear of a "Mom! Guess what? I'm engaged, check out the ring" scenario. But keep in mind, nobody is ever forced to get married, any person can refuse to marry the other. The media and hollywood kind of don't mention that.

 

Well I was supposed to visit her this past Summer, but literally a week before I was supposed to leave I had to cancel. I had gotten a good opportunity to work in Germany for the Summer and I had to accept it. She was pretty mad about it and eventually understood, but that's still a sore point for her. I did meet her father in Frankfurt though, he was in Europe for business.

 

So about 2 months ago (maybe 1.5 months ago), she just stopped talking to me. We used to sms and IM and email ALL the time, all the time, even with the annoying time zones, we didn't care (you should see my phone bill). At first I didn't notice, I was pretty busy with exams, but after a week...nothing. I figured she was doing another one of her silent treatment things (she did that after I told her Germany too), so I didn't think much of it. My mother, she talks to her and her mom regularly, well she called and found out that her and her family was on vacation for a week in Dubai.

 

Now this was big, she didn't even mention this (considering she used to tell me EVERYTHING, as in, how bad the traffic was for her on the way to work details). Her and her family were supposed to visit the US too, since I couldn't come to Pakistan over the Summer, but apparently these plans got canceled (3 times now), but looks like they had time to go to Dubai for a vacation. So obviously that irritated me since communication was all we had, it isn't like we saw each other everyday. So she got back from Dubai, she still didn't contact me, and I was pretty stubborn too, I didn't contact her either, even though we both saw each other online. Well after about 3 weeks of that I got a random text from her and I thought good, now we'll start talking again and she'll tell me what's actually going on in her head.

 

So I email her a couple times and IM her a couple times asking her what's wrong. I either get no response or an abrupt "I'm busy". Now it's been a while month since we talked and going from talking for at least an hour a day to nothing is big. I get stupid in the head thinking she doesn't like me anymore or she's found somebody else and call her up (after a couple days she actually picks up the phone and has time to talk). So I end up telling her that it's over, I'm sorry, I don't know what's wrong but I don't like the way she's treated me the past month. After it's over, she still doesn't understand why I did this, even though I specifically ask her why she didn't talk to me (to this day she hasn't told me, she just says she's been busy) and tell her that's the reason.

 

After I do this, I feel like total crap. I'm talking horrible, I felt like this bad for a couple days. I really missed her, a lot. And in one of those movie moments I realize what I had and that I should've talked things over with her rationally and I made a mistake and I love her, which is big, I don't think I've ever loved a girl before. So I call her again, apologize, beg her to forgive me. She says OK but wants to talk things over with her mother (who is in Canada for the week). That's OK with me, I've made a huge mistake, she deserves whatever she asks for.

 

So this whole time I'm pretty much trying super hard to make things right, I sms her, email her, IM her, call her non-stop. She still ignores me, which is fine I think, she's thinking things over. But after a few days of this I ask her how she feels, her only answer "I have to talk with my mother". Now she won't even tell me that she even likes me (she's a super shy and private individual, always has been) or even how she feels, she never has, she's only hinted at it and that's only in emails and text messages. It's as if she's waiting for her mother to tell her what to think, which is strange since she's usually a pretty independent girl and can take care of herself in any situation.

 

After hearing the only thing she can say over and over it started to feel like maybe I was her family's "backup plan". To keep me around if the marriage with the "other family" (hypothetically speaking) falls through. She said she'd tell me what she's thinking after talking to her. So her mom comes back from Canada, and nothing. It's been about 3 weeks, no contact between her and me. Things are still "OK", in the sense that they aren't over, but they're not well either. My mother has spoken with hers, she says "Let the kids handle it", which is strange since she has always (ALWAYS) said "this is something that the elders handle" whenever the topic of marriage or S's future comes up.

 

So now I've been hurting pretty bad. I haven't spoken to S in 3 weeks, and the times I did (after I made the mistake), she just wanted to argue and she hasn't contacted me after talking things over with her parents. I've got finals starting next week and I can barely study. I don't know what to do. She treats me like #2 and my brain tells me that she obviously doesn't love me and just wants me around so that she can get married off (pressure to get married is pretty big for girls, especially in the East, and especially since S's younger sister is getting married first week of '07). If I could go back I would have talked things over with her instead of ending things, but I still don't think that would've mattered, she's been ignoring me for a while now.

 

I can either contact her again and get ignored. Try and forget about her. Or just wait things out and hope things resolve themselves, most likely after S's sister's wedding since everything is so hectic at their house right now. I love her so much, but I will never marry a girl who doesn't love me, it just feels like she lied to me for the 10 months that we talked with each other. I just don't see how things can work out in a happy ending anymore, I mean, she's hiding things from me. I'm guilty of being stubborn too, but at least I've been honest about everything with her. I know I hurt her, especially since she's been hurt so many times before, but that doesn't mean she has the right to ignore me and treat me like an annoyance. I don't know, maybe I'm just reading too much into this. I just can't get her out of my head.

 

Thanks for reading, sorry for making it so long. I just hope somebody understands and if it's even possible, has gone through the same thing and has any advice. I've only spoken about all of this with 2 people, my mother and my ex (like I said, we still talk).

[alphamale]

aren't moslems and pakistanis in particular a bit ignorant and backwards?

[InsanityImpaired]

Very tough situation.

 

The hard part is of course, you are unaware why she is behaving as she does. You can come up with quite a few explanations, but you could make a fool out of yourself, if you assume that this or that assumption is true.

 

One thing strikes out: "Let the kids handle" ... Which seems to offer two interpretations. One is, that S. has to deal with you herself, in telling you some bad news. That is hard of course, and seems to be consistent with her behavior of the past weeks.

The other is, that you would have to win her over yourself. If the parents were to handle it, the course would have been "set." Either arrangements would be made to marry you, or someone else. But htat is not the case, so the statement implies nothing is definitive yet.

 

Both interpretations are not definitive. Now the question is, whether she has changed or really has been busy, and stressed for her sister's wedding. You are aware of the importance of marriage in a Pakistani family, so you can probably well imagine how busy and stressful (or not) marriage preparations can be.

 

I think it can go both ways, though. If you do contact her, try to steer away of arguments, and focus on what is important to you and her - and for now assume that she is telling the truth with the busy-ness.