I can't believe I'm here

[dgiirl]

Hearts, sounds like your husband is spewing off the same lines my ex told me too. The day he left the house, he sat me on the sofa to lay out all this absolute bull**** just to hurt me. One thing he told me is not to have anyone over in the house sleeping in our bed. It would just mess me up emotionally and it would be weird for him. I've NEVER slept with any man except my husband. I was in no way going to start that night sleeping with just any guy. I've never been nor ever will be a slut and him saying those words to me hurt like a slap in the face. I find out a few days later it is HIM who's been cheating! So like Ms Pixie, i have a strong suspicion your ex might be cheating on you.

 

But irregardless of what HE'S doing, you sound very strong and stubborn to get through this. There really is life after divorce and it really can be the best thing to happen to you. You have an opportunity to take a good look at your life and change everything you are not happy with and make the best life you've always wanted. Just take it one day at a time.

 

 

Guest, i'm shocked that not only do you find the need to attack ms pixie for her opinions but you also do it under anonymity. If you really wanted to help the OP, then do so by telling her your story, but there's absolutely NO need to attack ms pixie at the same time. Shame on you.

[anna13]

so sorry to hear that you are going through all this . The fact that he would take his pillows with him ,and make a comment like that , what a jerk for real . I would be so heartbroken as well . sometimes I just have to wonder how no matter how stressed a spouse is , how can they just be so cold just all of a sudden . but like i have read on these threads, people are different and once someones makes a dicision there is nothing really the other person can do about it. yes you went through all that illness and survived. so you are a very strong person .you can get through this. just hang in there .

[Heartsonfire]

Well believe it or not, I woke up very clear headed and I've decided that, hell, whatever happens is going to happen and I'm going to have to be OK either way.

 

If he is cheating then I'm better off w/o him.

 

I won't be pulling anymore Drinking Spells over him again.

 

Yeah it hurts. But I thought back to the day after he left and how bad I was hurting. Well, I'm not hurting as bad today. That tells me that this pain will lessen, it's just going to take time.

[Touche]

I'm so glad you're finding your strength. It will serve you well no matter what the outcome of this situation. Stay strong, ok?

[dgiirl]

Yeah it hurts. But I thought back to the day after he left and how bad I was hurting. Well, I'm not hurting as bad today. That tells me that this pain will lessen, it's just going to take time.

 

It's a rollercoaster of emotions, but it helped me keep faith during the dark times that if I could smile a few days ago, then i could smile again tomorrow and to hold on. But yes, in time, the pain will lessen and lessen. Try to keep yourself active. Try and do thing's you've never done before. For me, I never knew how to cook, so i bought a cook book and would pick one dish a week to learn to cook. I also got my digital camera and roamed the city taking pics like a tourist. I would check out my local community center and see what activities were on and just show up, usually with my camera. I would take lots of walks around the park and would go to the library often to read up on self-help/relationships or anything else. It's just about keeping yourself busy.

 

In the beginning, I kept a daily journal and in it, i'd ask myself two questions. 1) Did I accomplish something today? 2) Did I have fun today? You need to answer yes to both of these questions. The first one insures you are being responsible and taking care of things. The second insures you balance that responsibility with some pleasure. No matter how trivial you might think it is, you need to answer yes to both. And fun doesnt necessarily mean you went out and partied. It could be as simple as having a nice conversation with a friend, or having a nice walk outside looking at the stars.

[Mz. Pixie]

I absolutely disagree. Starting to snoop around and looking for stuff that MAY or MAY NOT be there is pointless and harmful for you, for him and for your marriage. Ms.Pixie - I think its terrible you have taken it upon yourself to forecast such behaviour - when you DO NOT know. It is pure speculation on your behalf

 

It is speculation on my behalf based on being on these boards, other boards, and reading numerous marriage books on the subject.

 

You think you are helping her? You are merely throwing another log onto her fire. Just because your partner cheated on you it doesnt mean that anyone who shows similar behaviour is also doing the same thing

 

Yes, as a matter of fact I am helping her. And, let's get this straight- my partner didn't cheat on me. I was the one who did the cheating, so I am intimately aware of what cheaters say and do. And I did all of those things.

 

It's textbook pretty much that cheaters do the same things. Of course at that time they don't feel like they are- they feel like their situation is special and unique. Simply go to marriagebuilders and check out the information there or google "Signs of an affair" and you'll see.

 

 

Maybe he IS and maybe he isn't. In my case, he wasn't. I was advised that maybe my husband was cheating because he was "showing all the signs". He swore to me black and blue there was no-one else. What did I do? I didnt TRUST him and i started snooping around - and eventually hired an investigator. What was he doing? Going to the pub by himself, or occasionally meeting his best mate and going back to his place. I feel disgusted with myself and wonder why I never thought to listen to HIM rather than some stranger who is merely analyzing my words from thousands of miles away

 

Whatever. Where there is smoke there is usually fire.

 

You cannot stereotype people as being a cheat just because they are showing signs of pulling away through simple unhappiness. Obviously Ms Pixie, you are still so hurt that you are seeing and LOOKING for parallels with your own situation. This is not you being insightful - its you looking for strength in numbers.

 

Strength in numbers???? Exactly who else on this thread told her the same thing that I did??? Because I saw no one but me forming that opinion.

 

And, I'm certainly not hurt one bit. As a matter of fact, I have a husband who treats me like a queen- and who doesn't feel the need to hang out "at bars or his mates apartment".

 

I don't come here to blow smoke up people's asses. I come here to give advise based on the information given. I'm going to be honest about what I think is going on, even if you don't like it.

 

A person who pulls away because of simple unhappiness is not going to be the one who just up and decides they want out of their marriage. If you check statistics you'll find out that rarely do people leave their spouses just to "find themselves" or out of bs like that. I've known only one person who ever left their spouse, moved into a place on their own, and went to marriage counseling to mend their marriage. During that time neither of those people dated anyone else. In every other case, out of tons of couples, there has been another partner or a person that the other one wanted to try out a relationship with.

 

This is a guy who went from nursing his wife to treating her like crap. You don't just "pull away" for no reason- especially when you have kids, a mortgage, and your wife has been on the brink of death. That takes something pretty powerful.

 

She doesn't have to take my advise, and you didn't either. You don't even have enough sack to post your real user name so I'm not going to sit here and stew about what you think about my posts. I didn't post them for you. If you have issue with something that I do, then use your little ignore button and you won't have to see my posts.

[Touche]

Don't worry about Guest, Pix. I think it's PERFECTLY legitimate for you to bring that possibility up for the OP to consider. It crossed my mind too when I first read her posts.

 

Guest is acting like it's competely out of the realm of possibility. Come ON! How naive! Ok, great in your case it wasn't the case. Does that mean it's NOT the case here? Maybe and maybe not.

 

Sorry but if Pix hadn't brought it up, at some point I would have. I think it's a GOOD thing to lay out all possibilities for the OP to consider. Many times people can't think straight in these situations.

 

And if it's NOT the case that he's cheating, fine. Where was the harm in bringing it up as a possibility for her to look into? Tell me where the harm was? I don't think the OP had a problem with it. Apparently only GUEST did.

[dgiirl]

I think it's very important to question if he's cheating or not. Not only because if he's cheating, then he's a slime bag... but ALSO for her own health. If he's sleeping around, she needs to get tested, or atleast be aware that she should be tested.

 

Depending on where she lives, she might be able to sue for alienation of affection. Or atleast she might be entitled to more during the divorce than if he just left. She needs to talk with a lawyer and see what the laws are where she lives.

 

Also, if she knows the FULL story, she wont beat herself up for his failures. Having your husband leave you is hard enough, and you tend to beat yourself up over all the things you've done wrong. But if you know that on top of it, he's cheating, you tend to be a little more compassionate to yourself. You realize that not EVERYthing is your fault. And it's hard to believe that when you put your husband on a pedestal.

[Touche]

DG, good points all the way around but especially about the health issue. I hadn't even thought of that. I think we as LSers trying to help this OP would have dropped the ball had one of us NOT brought up the possibility of infidelity.

 

Guest is out of line in my opinion. She's letting her own situation cloud what's right here.

[Guest]

Just thought I would chime in on possible affair.

 

It very well may be one. Long story short, I was finding myself unhappy with long term marriage. I guess there seemed to be things I needed (I have heard them called Emotional Needs) in the marriage that seemed would never change. I slowly withdrew emotionally. I did have a brief affair. I havent had any affair in last two years.

 

I guess point I am making is this. Yes he could be having an affair. But it is also possible that he is just withdrawn from marriage. I find that now my wife is trying hard. But I just dont feel it much anymore. Although with her trying, it has me feeling confused. I am still contemplating separation to put an end to my internal emotional termoil on what I should do. Figured this would wake me up one way or another becuase I am driving myself crazy with the indecision.

 

And even with wife trying hard (I would give her an A for her effort), it is very hard coming out of the withdrawal stage. I guess it boils down to that I need a woman I really love and have a hard time thinking of going along without it..........

[Heartsonfire]

Everyone is intitled to their own opinion. That's way I sought out a forum like this. To get all the advice that I could get. I wanted to hear from real people that has been or is going through a similar heartbreaking time like I am.

 

I don't want any sugar coated advice. I want it straight up and truthful. And if I take that advice it will be on me, not the person giving it.

 

Thank you, everyone, that has taken the time out of your very hectic and busy day to come here and try to help not only me but countless others.

 

I will keep you all posted on what is going on.

[Scott S]

I'm sorry to hear how this turned out. I was sincerely hoping for a lot better.

[Mz. Pixie]

How are you today? Any updates?

[Heartsonfire]

First off, I would very much like to give everyone that offered their advice a huge Thank You. I know I said that I would keep you posted on things but I had to do some soul searching and stayed offline.

 

I read Divorce Busters in one night. And without that book, I wouldn't have seen the light. She was so on the money that it wasn't even funny especially about the last resort part. About not hounding them or calling them and pleading with them. Boy, it was like she wrote that part just for me. lol

 

My husband came home to me Saturday. He said that we needed to move forward and stop dwelling on the past. We talked for over 5 hours Saturday night and just let everything out that we were too afraid to tell one another before. It was hard to hear what he had to say just as I'm sure it was hard for him to hear what I said. But the main thing is we both listened and understood.

 

We're taking baby steps. It's almost like we're meeting each other for the first time and getting to know each other all over again. And I find that very exciting.

 

 

If I can offer any advice that I've learned through all of this it would be: WORDS. Watch what you say to your loved one. You can say you're sorry all you want to, but once you say something hurtful, it's out there and can never be taken back. I've learned that words are like daggers, they hurt so bad. And the scars are there, and the hurt is there. So, the next time you want to hurl some hurtful, nasty words to your husband or wife, think about after the arguement is over. Even after the "I'm sorry" and the great make-up sex, those words are still out there and will some day come back to bite you in the a**. Trust me, I know.

[Due South]

Hey! {{{{{{{{{Congratulations!}}}}}}}}}}

 

Divorce Busters seems to be pretty great - I've read bits and bobs (and the bulletin board is grrrreat).

 

Great to hear your H is up for giving it another go. I wish you guys all the best and go easy on yourselves.

 

xx

[Yikes]

I have been loosely following this thread for a while now. I don't poke my head in these forums or post as often these days... I find that it often makes me feel bad.

 

He does exhibit some of the classic signs of cheating. For what it's worth, where I come from, cops are the WORST offenders for being unfaithful. To make matters worse, they all cover for each other... brothers in blue.

 

Personally, I liked the idea about looking extra-hot when he showed up, but then not letting him know what you were doing. Your not lying, your just not saying anything because it's not his business. I know a lot of women that get all gusied up just to meet a girlfriend for coffee. They do it simply because it makes them feel good about themselves when they are feeling down. It doesn't necessarily mean that they are going out clubbing trolling for guys. I'm sorry that it didn't work out better for you.

 

Focus on the positive, look after yourself and your kids and don't worry about the things that you can't control.

 

Hopefully things go better from this point on for you all and I hope that he appreciates what he has.

 

Yikes

[Mz. Pixie]

I have been loosely following this thread for a while now. I don't poke my head in these forums or post as often these days... I find that it often makes me feel bad.

 

 

Hey sweet cheeks! Miss ya!

[Lor]

Hi hearts....just read thru your thread. Okay, my view on things...my OP so no one start cussin'

 

You went thru hell with being sick, the chemo, the whole nine yards. I love how you said you have 4 kids ~ cudos for not differentiating between his and yours.

 

Something I'm sure you already know or have realized ~ you were just as much to blame for what happened with the breakdown of your relationship as he was. Whereas you were angry, emotional, depressed, on the heavy meds, you were using him as a punching bag for everything, taking for granted that he would be your shoulder thru all of it, to take care of you and the kids. Who did he have to rely on, who's shoulder did he have to help alieviate some of the burden he was carrying around? Worrying about if his wife was going to live, worrying about trying to work full-time, taking care of the kids?

 

I don't believe he cheated ~ doesn't sound right, signs or not. Otherwise, why is wanting the kids every weekend? That tends to put a cramp in the swingin' man's style.

 

Now, that being said, he's pulled away and built up an emotional wall, its come to the head where enough was enough. You getting gussied up to go to a friend's house? Big Red Flag and a big no no to let him think you were going out on the town. Here was was, taking care of you, consoling you, puting up with everything you were dishing out to him, loving you, loving the kids and as soon as he walks out the door you're looking hot and ready for action. Now, I know that wasn't your intent and wouldn't have acted on it but in his eyes, I'm betting that's what he saw. Sure, get dressed up, look good but Scott was totally in the right on this ~ you were giving off the wrong signals. It sounded like you didn't have time to get all dolled up but the suitcase on the bed was like a beacon shining out at him ~ Hey, the hubby is gone! Time to p.a.r.t.y.!! See what I mean? No wonder he came for the pillows ~ he was jealous and hurt. This is no time for games ~ intentional or not. When he came over, all you'd had to say was I'll be at so-n-so's if you need to get ahold of me. No need for the I miss you's, I can't be here alone's. That alone is enough info.

 

I'm glad to hear you are hopefully working things out. Don't change who you are but think before you speak and stop before you act. it only takes one second to screw things up worse and a lifetime to try and fix them, whereas that minute or two you took to stop and think will save you hours of time and heartache in the future.

 

You feel like you're starting over? Great, but you're not. You are still you, he is still who he is. Communication is the key, realizing what you both did wrong, working towards never doing it again, or changing the way you view things. And never never never take him for granted again. Sounds like you have a heck of a guy there ~ don't fall into the same patterns. And he needs to not bottle everything up but to tell you when he's getting overwhelmed.

 

My 2 cents.

[blueberry]

Something I'm sure you already know or have realized ~ you were just as much to blame for what happened with the breakdown of your relationship as he was. Whereas you were angry, emotional, depressed, on the heavy meds, you were using him as a punching bag for everything, taking for granted that he would be your shoulder thru all of it, to take care of you and the kids. Who did he have to rely on, who's shoulder did he have to help alieviate some of the burden he was carrying around? Worrying about if his wife was going to live, worrying about trying to work full-time, taking care of the kids?

 

<snip>

Sure, get dressed up, look good but Scott was totally in the right on this ~ you were giving off the wrong signals. It sounded like you didn't have time to get all dolled up but the suitcase on the bed was like a beacon shining out at him ~ Hey, the hubby is gone! Time to p.a.r.t.y.!! See what I mean? No wonder he came for the pillows ~ he was jealous and hurt.

 

And never never never take him for granted again. Sounds like you have a heck of a guy there ~ don't fall into the same patterns. And he needs to not bottle everything up but to tell you when he's getting overwhelmed.

 

My 2 cents.

 

 

Can I get an "AMEN!" I totally agree

 

Perhaps he also saw this strong beautiful woman regain her health and felt that he was somehow not needed now (or felt disregarded). He may have started to build a wall and feel resentful.

 

Show him you need him girlfriend, now and forever but also show you can look after him and be HIS rock for a while. Men are kinda like big babies when it comes right down to it.

[Heartsonfire]

Can I get an "AMEN!" I totally agree

 

Perhaps he also saw this strong beautiful woman regain her health and felt that he was somehow not needed now (or felt disregarded). He may have started to build a wall and feel resentful.

 

Show him you need him girlfriend, now and forever but also show you can look after him and be HIS rock for a while. Men are kinda like big babies when it comes right down to it.

 

LoL. I agree.

[Scott S]

[sNIP] My husband came home to me Saturday. He said that we needed to move forward and stop dwelling on the past. We talked for over 5 hours Saturday night and just let everything out that we were too afraid to tell one another before. It was hard to hear what he had to say just as I'm sure it was hard for him to hear what I said. But the main thing is we both listened and understood.

 

We're taking baby steps. It's almost like we're meeting each other for the first time and getting to know each other all over again. And I find that very exciting.

 

That is exciting news. I'm very happy to read this.

[Heartsonfire]

Thanks Scott. I appreciate that.

 

The going is still tough though. I think the biggest issue right now is trusting one another.

[mental_traveller]

We talk and he finally say's that he will try to let me try. And I do try. But when he would come home from work, I would go and hug him and try to kiss him on the lips, he would turn his head away. This just sent daggers in my heart. But I said to myself that I deserved this and let it go on for a week. Every day my heart broke more and more. Finally, I had enough and I guess you can say that I gave him an ultimatum.

 

I told him that he could either stay here and get our marriage back on track or he could leave. He kept saying how unhappy he was and that the WHOLE 8 years of marriage was miserable. I get so upset that I go into the house, pull out some luggage and start putting his clothes in them. He comes into the room and asks what am I doing??? I tell him that I love him and I want him to be happy and the only way I know for him to be happy is for him to leave and the least I can do for him is to pack his clothes. He starts putting his clothes back. I truely feel that if I didn't insist on his leaving, that he wouldn't have.

 

But how was I suppose to continue and to show him that I've changed when all I get from him is rejection? How am I suppose to compete with this huge brick wall that he has put up against me? I just couldn't do it anymore.

 

I'm so depressed. I miss him so freaking much and so do the kids. I don't know what to do or to say. I don't know if I've shared too much or not enough info for anyone to give me advice. I just know that I love him with every fiber of my being and I want so desperatly to show him that I'm not the same person and that things could and will be better.

 

Well if I try to look at this dispassionately, I see you being not yourself, having big mood swings because of your illness and medication, and this having a big effect on your husband. Even though it was not your fault, but brought on by a medical condition, the fact is that this is how he saw you for several years. This is how you treated him. In his mind, this is how you *were*.

 

Now, follow up to when you got back to your normal self, what happens? He was there for you for years during your toughest time. You put up with *his* flaws (again, not of his own making) for a grand total of one week. You then literally throw him out of his own home, this the same guy who stuck by you while you were suffering a potentially life-threatening illness.

 

I'm sorry, but I feel you have treated him very unfairly here. Your mistreatement of him during your illness can be excused, but I'm afraid you are going to have to take full responsibility for how you acted once you recovered. You refused to show even an ounce of the patience he showed with you, and you threw him out. How you can say you love him when you forcibly ejected him from your home, removed him from contact with his kids, I don't quite understand. That is not the action of someone who is in love with their husband.

 

I also think you made a really big mistake by giving him an ultimatum. If I was in his shoes, I'd be thinking how dare she demand instant change from me, after the way she acted? I mean how do you think he feels? He probably feels like he did everything he could, only to have you act mean & nasty to him. Of course his feelings are going to be hurt, and hurt deeply. It will take time, effort, and *proof* that you have changed, before he comes to believe it and the walls come down.

 

So, what to do to win him back? Well, perhaps you could start by making a vow not to throw him out of the house again? That would be a start That's assuming he even considers reconciling - I know I wouldn't if someone ever did that to me. I think all you can do is promise a huge change, and say you'll do whatever it takes, whatever he asks, to show and *prove* by your actions that you can change. So far, your actions have been pretty much the opposite. You are going to have to do a big, lasting 180 degree shift if you want to have any hope of a lasting reconciliation.

 

That's what I would suggest - be sincere and open, tell him what you've told us, then put yourself at his mercy and basically say you will do whatever it takes. Then stick to that promise, don't do even a single thing that could compromise it. If you don't have the staying power or will to stick it out, then don't even bother trying. If you think a week is long, then you might as well give up now. You should be prepared for it to take 1, 2, 3 years before he feels he can fully open up again. If you can't put in that kind of committment, then it's much less likely to work IMO.

[mental_traveller]

Oh, and one more bad move on my part. This past Saturday, he came over and we had sex. And you know what he said???? He said that he had us figured out. That it's LUST not LOVE we have for each other. WTF? I wanted to sling his a** through a window but I played it cool and didn't say anything. How could he say such a thing?

 

I don't know if this is true or not - but in the last few years, including when you were somewhat unstable because of the treatment, has he seen more signs of love from you than bad signs? I mean did you do 10 nice things for him for every time you did something bad? If he perceives it as being more bad than good, then perhaps he just doesn't see it as love right now. You seem to have dismissed the bad period as an aberattion - you know it wasn't the "real you". But how is he to know that? For him it was the "real you", and obviously he doesn't see that person as being particularly loving.

 

The fact that you are getting so angry at him for this, shows that you really haven't succeeded at all in understanding his perspective. Maybe you should try to get a bit of progress on that, before you start passing judgement and getting so angry about his behaviour.

[mental_traveller]

I have to disagree with Ms Pixie here. This is one of the few cases involving hostile and estranged behaviour, where I would *not* think an affair is a strong possibility.

 

The reason is that this has not been a normal relationship. If he behaved like this, and you had just had a normal last few years like most couples, then yes I would very much think an affair is possible. But instead, you have had this huge stressful experience. That is the obvious culprit for the current tensions. Not that he got bored, or met some bimbo with big boobs. He even says he is in lust but not love with you - the exact OPPOSITE complain of most people who have affairs. People have affairs when they "love" their partner, but aren't in lust with them. Men rarely have affairs when they want to f*ck their wife/gf more than they want to live with or have a love relationship with her.

 

The fact is that he got badly treated by his wife for several years. That is the most likely cause of his estrangement. It is more than enough to explain the change in his attitude. There is no reason to suspect an affair *just* because of his current behaviour. You need extra evidence before asking questions about that - such as changed appearance, behaviour patterns, suspicious phone calls etc. The original poster even dug into all that stuff, acting suspicious on her (seemingly) devoted and loyal husband, and found what? Absolutely nothing. Diddly squat. To me it seems like the guy is a straight arrow. Anyone having an affair will leave enough signs that an already suspicious wife will find something to set the alarm bells ringing. Yet by her own admission, there is not a single sign he has cheated.