I feel like I'm drowning!

[miss snoopy]

Hi, I'm new here! I'd be grateful for some advice. I feel so desperate...

 

I was with bf from may. it was a very intense relationship, but we kept breaking up/almost breaking up on a monthly basis as he couldn't deal with my insecurity, paranoia and inibility to give him space. I admit I have control freak tendencies and things had to be done my way all the time. So I'm not the perfect girlfriend.

 

Now after I ended things in september (a case of jumping before I was pushed) we did the whole "friends" thing, but almost all the contact was initiated by me apart from the odd email and phone call he made to me, unprompted. Our contact included one incident of him staying over at mine and we kissed, but nothing more.

 

Just over 2 weeks ago he came round for another sleepover and told me he's finding this hard, that he wants us to either get back together or go NC. As I still loved him I chose for us to get back together which is what he wanted, and everything started again, full throttle, with us planning holidays as far as March! He told me he loved me and was very happy we were back together... he said "you don't know what you've got till it's gone"..

 

Things were going swimmingly well until last week when we had an argument late one night. He said he couldn't deal with my head and that it was a huge mistake us getting back together. That my behaviour makes him hate me (that same evening he'd told me he loved me and couldn't stop kissing me)

 

So he walked away, just like that. Admittedly, I behaved badly that night, not allowing him to leave my apartment and generally not giving him space all evening, so 4 days after he walked, I sent him a card. I apologised profusely for my behaviour and other stuff I did/didn't do in the relationship, and told him how much I loved him. But I didn't ask for us to get back together. I think at the time I hoped it'll give me some closure.

 

Anyway... it's been 3 days and he hasn't been in touch. When he left he said he wanted to get on with his life without me, he asked me to leave him alone when I tried to walk out of the apartment with him, he said the argument and my not giving him space just turned him off me completely, and he said he didn't know if he wanted to see me again.

 

In the background of all this is an ex who lives in another country. He is in approx weekly email contact with her and that's the source of my paranoia, as I saw one email where he told her what a cherished friend she was and that he loved her. This was during one of our break up periods. He has no plans to get back with her as far as I know, but I know he loved her to pieces - but ended the relationship. She is hanging on in there as she feels there is hope, this is very obvious from the tone of her messages.

 

There's so much more to say but I'll stop here. I know NC is my only option as he has ignored my card but can anyone shed some insight into how someone can love you and hate you the same evening, and how someone can just walk out of your life in this manner despite all the fantastic plans we made? And should I give up on this guy? I really love him and we're so great together...

[Guest]

i was dating someone until tonite....she is concerned that i might have feelings for my ex...i told her, like i did before, that my dealings with the ex only have to do with trying to find some way for her to give me back my life. she has stolen things, hijacked my house. i am in contact with her simply to remove this stuff and i have given her 3 weeks and she still hasn't.

 

the gf i was seeing is not a rebound, i like her alot and would be with her forever. i can't do that until the ex leaves me alone. i have told the ex that i don't want to go thru the trouble of anything legal that might effect her and her friends and others. when gf called and said that because of things dealing with ex we need to stop. i agreed. i need to get this solved. right now i am single and do not wish to be with anyone unless this is solved. i offered a solution to the ex. after tonite i tear down the comp and get the police fully involved.

 

i will never be with someone that have done this things to me. never.

 

is the clear enuff? so, lets do the right thing and move on.

 

i am taking friday off to get this done - one way or the other. i want my life back just like everyone else does - so do we have a deal?

 

yes or no?

[miss snoopy]

Would love someone's take on this... any words of wisdom or suggestion will be gratefully received...

[Davis]

Snoopy: Huh?? Am I not getting it? The second post was from your recent ex?

[miss snoopy]

Snoopy: Huh?? Am I not getting it? The second post was from your recent ex?

 

Hi Davis, well that was what I thought when I read the first couple of lines but no, it definitely isn't him, I'm not sure why "guest" posted that on here!

[Ssheena]

Miss Snoopy, I think you already know what you do that bothers him.

"he couldn't deal with my insecurity, paranoia and inibility to give him space. I admit I have control freak tendencies and things had to be done my way all the time" and " behaved badly that night, not allowing him to leave my apartment and generally not giving him space all evening,".

I don't know what the argument was about or what was said, but from what you have written, he feels a lot for you but the dislike he has for your behavior is winning out over how he feels for you. It might be helpful for him to learn how to tell you when something you do bothers him - sort of catch you in the act - and then for you to really "get" what he is saying. I hate it when someone is "clingy" and doesn't give me my space and is paranoid on top of it all. Have you had other boyfriends who have told you that about yourself? If so, I would suggest you take a good look at yourself and see why you are that way. I would start now and give him space.

[Davis]

Hey Snoopy. That was a strange post from "guest" but you said it wasn't your ex. Anyway. You have to do NC. That means NC! Have you thought about some counseling? If you can't afford it, you might be able to get it through school, the local college, the county or somewhere. You may not be able to make it work with him or any guy until you understand and change your behavior. NC would be good for him to calm down a bit and good for you so you can really work on changing.

 

I'm sure he loves you, but your behavior just drives him away. You shouldn't have jumped right back into the situation with him "full throttle". That just put you guys right back into the same problem as before, only faster. That's why you have to change and go SLOW.

 

Don't even worry about some other girl or any other girl. That's not the issue. The issue is your behavior. Why ARE you so jealous? They say that jealousy is really insecurity about yourself. Maybe you need to work on your self esteem too. If you can work on your behavior and REALLY change some over the next 4-8 weeks and then show him, you might have a shot. If you can't control your emotions or change, then forget it. But you really need to work on you. Even if this doesn't work out with him, when you meet the next great guy (and you will) you don't want to fck that up with the same old behavior do you?

 

So: NC for at least 4 weeks, work on yourself, go out with your friends, workout and do not have any sleep overs anymore !! Sex comes way later IF you guys start seeing each other and work through your issues. Sex just really complicates emotions for everyone.

[miss snoopy]

Thanks Ssheena, it really helps to get neutral perspectives on this. My family and friends trry being neutral but thy lobe me and want to make me feel better so they don't always hit hard enough.

 

You are absoultely right about my behaviour, something must be pulling him in and pushing him away and in the past I blamed him, saying he was a commitment-phobe as he lfet his ex despite the relationship going so well, and he keeps in touch with her to keep her hanging in there. But I thin if things had gone great between us his ex won't matter that much - even now his email to her are a lot briefer than hers to him (that's another thing, I snoop at his emails hence my username, he doesn't know about this)

 

The argument was about the ex, I accused him of keeping her sweet so she's there aiting, single, for him and that deep down he plans to marry her. I also told him I cannot get over my paranoia about her as he hasn't given me enough reason to do this.He felt very hurt by my words and it just escalated... then he wanted some time on his own but I kept going at him, trying to talk about the matter, and eventually he packed his things and said he was going home, then I barricaded him in my apartment and confiscated the things he hadn't packed - resulting in a tussle with some name calling. I have never seen him so angry - ever.

 

My exes have said the same, when they want space to do bloke things e.g. watch sport or a blokey movie alone, I can't stand it - I drape myself over them, purring like a cat, talking "at" them. I thought guys liked this but clearly not...

[miss snoopy]

I hope it doesn't seem like multiposting but I couldn't edit the previous post to correct my typos, so I'll post the previous post again, and I prefer to separate the 2 responses to make them more legible. Mods - can you please delete the post above this one?

 

Thanks Davis - I agree NC is the only way forward and your point about why NC is good for him is well taken. I am in fact in counselling but I feel I'm wasting the therapist's time as I've been stuck on patching up this relationship without exporing the "whys" - so I just bring day to day happenings to the sessions. I need to use it well to justify the cost! I know I have no hope of a fulfilling realtionship if I don't get help, and interestingly my sister has the same problem with men - we have the same issues from childhood and adolescence.

 

I'm using this NC period to understand how others see me - I have just ordered a book from amazon called "emotional blackmail" - this was one of bfs parting phrases. Reading the blurb I know I'm guilty of this.

 

We should have gone slower, and I should have done more to show I'd changed. An example is the holiday planning - it was all places I wanted to go, and I'm sure he said yes just to make me happy. Every event was my suggestion and I'm sure depsite his smiles, these things build up.

 

Finally, after all this I realise the other girl is no threat. He left her and was with me. She wants to come here and resume their relationship but he has never even gave her an opening or encouragement re this. If he planned to go back and marry her, well he is going about it in a very strange way! Why couldn't I see all this when we were together? He never cheated on me so there was no reason for my paranoia. I wanted a committment from him hence the insecurity but I guess 5 months is too soon, and I need to show I'm worth committing to.

 

I'm sure people think I'm putting myself down when I say all this, but I'm an attractive, intelligent, very financially secure person with a lot going for me. I'm in my mid 30s and all I've ever had are short-lived relationships, with the men walking. Surely they can't all be jerks? Most of them are happily married now!

 

I agree I need to work on my self-esteem to stop being so insecure but how???

[miss snoopy]

Thanks Ssheena, it really helps to get neutral perspectives on this. My family and friends try being neutral but they love me and want to make me feel better so they don't always hit hard enough.

 

You are absoultely right about my behaviour, something must be pulling him in and then pushing him away and in the past I blamed him, saying he was a commitment-phobe as he left his ex despite the relationship going so well, and he keeps in touch with her to keep her hanging in there. But I think if things had gone great between us his ex won't matter that much to him - even now his emails to her are a lot briefer than hers to him (that's another thing, I snoop at his emails hence my username, he doesn't know about this)

 

The argument was about the ex, I accused him of keeping her sweet so she's there waiting, single, for him and that deep down he plans to marry her. I also told him I cannot get over my paranoia about her as he hasn't given me enough reason to do this. He felt very hurt by my words and it just escalated... then he wanted some time on his own to just watch TV, think and stop being so mad - but I kept going at him, trying to talk about the matter, and eventually he packed his things and said he was going home, then I barricaded him in my apartment and confiscated the things he hadn't packed - resulting in a tussle with some name calling. I have never seen him so angry - ever. I begged and pleaded and cried, all to no avail. He said his mind was firmly made up. He couldn't even bear me touching him, this is someone who normally cannot keep his hands off me.

 

My exes all said the same, when they wanted space to do bloke things e.g. watch sport or a blokey movie alone, I couldn't stand it - I draped myself over them, purring like a cat, talking "at" them. I thought guys liked this but clearly not...

 

He's still not been in touch

[Ssheena]

Hi Ms. Snoopy! I think you are on the right track. Maybe at your therapist you can change your perspective now from "the relationship" to how can I change or become more aware of my behavior and how it affecting my relationships. That is interesting that your sister has the same patterns as well. Probably a lot that you can look at in your life, this is all something you should be able to explore in therapy. How your parents were to each other and to you really shapes the way we turn out. Maybe since Davis and I are both from Colorado and the air is so much thinner here, our brains just function the same. Plus, where I'm from there is, I think, the largest portion of therapists to people around.

I will say this though, the guys that I have met REALLY appreciate it that I let them have their own space, time, friends, interests etc because they have met women who don't give them that.

Good first steps!

[Walk]

Hey Snoop.

 

I think Ssheena actually covered it really well. Had a lot of good points in her posts.

 

I had one thing I wanted to say though... I think you're being pretty hard on yourself for all this. You have insecurities, we all do, but the fact that your bf would still talk to his ex and express terms of affection (love) toward her would play on any girls insecurities. I don't know how your bf talked about her normally before you read the emails, but if you aren't normally driven to read other peoples personal stuff, then it would seem to me like maybe he was the catalyst. You still need to work on your insecurities, but honest, I think you're beating yourself up a lot over this. He helped contribute to the problem. You weren't the only one causing all the problems. He had his own ball of issues that really didn't mesh well with yours.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is he can be as lovey dovey, kissy, affectionate as he wants, but if he slips one word in about an ex lover who he still cares about, it's going to wipe out all those little acts of love he was giving to you. Which would leave you left feeling a bit decieved by it all. Like you're on shaky ground with him. Because if he loves her, why is he with you? And if he doesn't really love her, why is he throwing that word around for others? I don't know.. just saying that I can understand how your insecurities could really be pushed into action by having an ex still in the picture (even if she doesn't live close by).

 

I get pretty insecure at times too, but I've really reigned it in the past several years. I used to get really clingy/needy, but it seemed the more I clung, the more insecure I'd feel. And the worse I would feel. It never helped. Talking seemed to make it grow bigger. More affection was never enough... I could never fill that void by trying to get more. So I pulled back. Now when I feel that way I take a time out. I go do stuff by myself, pamper myself a bit and do stuff without my bf. Or if he's around, I'll "suggest" that he play his video games or do something he'd like while I play on the computer or something. I've found if I can get myself focused on something else for a while, that the needy feelings aren't so strong. Still there, but not as bad. The crazy part... since I'm usually creating a bit of space between my bf and me, he ends up more affectionate, compassionate, and loving toward me. Go figure. But seriously, the times I've tried to use my bf to fill that insecure hole, we fight like cats and dogs, and I end up feeling worse, and he's off to who knows where without me. It's not his job to fill it. And frankly, he can't. For me to ask that of him is selfish. So I had to find ways to resolve it. Even if that means I have to flat out tell my bf I can't see him tonight, even though I'm desperately dying to attach myself like a barnacle to his hip. hahahah

 

But seriously, I fake it if I don't feel it. He wants to hang out with the boys all day, I smile and tell him to have a wonderful time. I don't feel that way at the time.... but 9 times outta 10 if I give the impression that I'm really happy for him, then he'll call and ask me along. He just wants the feeling of being able to go off on his own... but he still wants me around.

[miss snoopy]

Thanks again Ssheena and thanks Walk.

 

Walk, I agree I'm being a bit too hard on myself. in fact I must say this board has been really great, replies to my posts and other threads, in helping me move on and do NC so easily.

 

I know my ex has a lot of feelings for his ex, maybe it's something he's not really proud of as he never mentions her to his mates, he talks about me to his parents, friends, siblings etc so if I had no access to his emails I'd never even know she existed. He told me very early on in our relationship that he ended things with someone he loved who was the most beautiful person he had ever met... and he kept referring to her as his gf and not his ex when he talked about stuff they did (e.g. this time last year I was in Brussels with my gf) and it was all this stuff that made me snoop. Also on her birthday he went out alone to get her a card (OK it was late and she had emailed him a reminder) and one earlier email thanked him for flowers (but no reference to it in his previous email or obvious occasion - still haven't got to the bottom of that one)

 

I wonder if he still loves her but wishes he didn't so he can fully move on? Or if he's selfishly keeping her hanging in there "just in case"?

 

I think I'm slowly getting over him as I now no longer fantastize about us getting back together. Mainly as he's one of these irritating people who can never be wrong, it's always someone else wrong as he's such a "kind, thoughtful, generous person" (his owrlds in one email) Maybe he has some insight but in my case very litle of it. Or maybe we're just completely incompatible...

 

Thanks everyone for your advice and thoughts, it really does help!

[miss snoopy]

Oops double post!

[miss snoopy]

Well.. from e-snooping I have found out exactly why he left. He told a friend that I was mentally unbalanced and he couldn't cope any more, and told another that I switched from being the loveliest, coolest, greatest person to being a psycho and that's why he fled.

 

Wonder what people think - most break ups here are brought on by someone needing space, another woman/man etc but I don't recall seeing any examples of this - breaking up because one partner percieves the other as prone to insanity. Of course I can justify everything I've done or said but so can everyone who does something wrong, justifying it is no good if others see you in a negative way.

 

I wonder if there's any hope for us? If he thinks this of me he'll reckon there's no hope, right? No-one wants to walk on eggshells in a relationship, scared of unleashing the madness with just one comment...