silentcharon Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 I have a friend whose bf broke up with her nearly a year ago. Actually, about the same time as my break up occured, about nine months ago. Thing is that, she tried to stay friends with the ex, did things for him and yes, slept with him often. She told me that he just wanted to be alone, etc, etc, seemingly similiar issues like I had with my ex. She was suspecting that there was something going on in between her ex and a good friend of hers (it had been going on for a couple of months)- she confronted them both two weeks ago and asked straight up if there was something going on. All she wanted was honesty- because then, she would back off and go into NC with the ex. They both denied it, and her friend told her that she would never do such a thing- especially when she knows that he still loves my friend. Her friend said it so passionately that my friend believed her and let it go. Recently, on thursday night- she went out with a bunch of friends, her ex and her friend included. Her ex led my friend to a table and told her that he slept with her friend. My friend flipped out, and left the bar- only to have the ex follow her home. Her ex told her that he wanted to wait a few days before letting her know the situation. He didn't know what he wanted, or what to do- as he DID want to marry her, but how was he supposed to know if she was the one? Did he want to marry her because he was in love with her or if it was all he has ever known? He told her that he told her friend that he couldn't commit to either my friend or her- as he still loved my friend. She told him that she didn't want to speak to him again, or the friend either- after finding out the first time they did it, they both were drunk, and it just happened. She asked him how many times they did it, his answer was twice, three times in the last week. She said, bull, accidents don't happen twice or three times- if you REALLY love me, you wouldn't have done such a thing. He asked her to forgive her, and said that he couldn't promise that it would stop between him and her friend. He asked her if she was willing to stay friends with him, she said that she didn't know, because after all, they have been broken up for a while. Plus, she felt more hurt and betrayed that they lied to her face two weeks earlier than the fact they were sleeping together. So she doesn't know. The ex asked her if she would be willing to go for coffee on saturday to talk more, and she agreed. Saturday hits, they go out for coffee and the ex's been kind of clingy- like, putting his arm around her or on her waist. She told me that it made her extremely uncomfortable but she couldn't say no. He said things like she looked great, and inquired about the perfume she was wearing, to say "no wonder why you smell so good.." Later on, went over to his house, he bought chicken from a grocery store and made dinner for both of them. He asked her for some info on therapy, the costs of seeing a counselling and possibly meds. She told him all that, and asked why (she has been trying to convince him to see one, as he has been depressed before the break up and still is now) he told her that he really didn't know what to do and that he felt really mixed up. 6 30 hits, and she told him that she had to go out. Prior to leaving, he hugs her in a really loving way, as if he wanted her now. This lasted for a couple of minutes, and as she pulls away, he kisses her forehead. She did nothing and just left. She's so lost on what to do. She's mad at everyone for lying to her when she asked straight up, and that she feels that her ex wants her now that she has made her unavailable. The problem is that she knows that her ex is now (and still is) sleeping with her friend (they're NOT dating...?) The weird part is that, prior to all of this, after the break up, she really tried to get him to come back periodically (like asking him every couple of months or so), she felt that he geninuely didn't know, and she couldn't feel the spark there. Yes, the love was still there, but not so much the spark. And now that the tables have turned, the ex got what he wanted (her friend) and she is now unavailable, the spark is back there? She feels the chemistry between her and her ex coming back, the way the ex acts towards her NOW as opposed to prior to hooking up with her friend. She has NO doubts he still LOVES her, but can't understand why he is doing this. She told him that what he was doing to her and her friend wasn't really fair, how he doesn't want to commit to either one of them but is now sleeping with the friend anyway. It's screwed up kind of- he's sleeping with the friend and told her he won't commit because he still loves my friend, and won't commit to my friend again because he's not ready. His answer was..... I don't know. I can't promise it won't stop. She thinks now is the best time to go into NC as (weird as it may sound), it will likely end in having the ex coming back at some point. The push/pull thing, I guess. I told her that she was crazy, and that the ex was just using them both. She's not sure what to do, she is willing to let the ex go, but should she stick around (she won't sleep with him anymore or anything like that) and act as if everything was normal, and just be there, be funny, be charming, etc, etc, no pushing on the ex. She told me that her friend is a bf hopper, she can't STAND being alone- my ex doesn't like insecure people, so she KNOWS 100% that her friend will get jealous and insecure whenever she hangs out with the ex, if they do end up dating. She has been jealous with her boyfriends, so her ex won't be any different and it will be 100x worse because he told her that he still loves my friend. He probably will end up being forced to choose between my friend or her friend, any way it goes down. The ex told my friend he wants her in his life no matter what- as lovers or friends, so she is pretty sure that he will pick her. She just wants to know how to play this tricky situation right- as she really feels like now is the time to play hard ball, now that she knows the spark is back. She feels it, and the ex mentioned it too, how he felt like there was something going on in between them NOW. I told her that she should have gone NC from the start- like I should have, and ended up doing so a few months later, because then she wouldn't have to deal with this bs. "I know, I know, but the situation now - I am so convinced that he will come back sooner or later, I just want to play this right. Is NC the answer to this? To allow him to miss me, or stick around, be a great lady, on strictly friends only basis, and let him compare" her friend to my friend, because her friend will be jealous whenever he goes out with my friend. She knows this will happen because of how her friend treated her past boyfriends, and because now the tables have turned- her friend will now be the one wondering whether the ex is messing around with my friend still (even if they really aren't.) I told her to go online here, to ask for advice, but she didn't have the net, so she asked me to post her story here and tell her what people thought. They have dated for ummm, 5 or 6 years (they are 25 and 26.)... He asked her to marry her a couple of years ago, and broke up with her because he didn't know what he really wanted. Because she was his first gf, he told her he wanted to make sure if she really was the one before marrying her. She knew that he wanted to date, and she was somewhat fine with it, she just didn't expect it to be her friend and that the situation would be like this. The chemistry is still definitely there, she's positive that her ex will eventually come back to her, she feels this is the right time to take action. By NC or god knows what, she gave the ex all the space he needed prior, and he wouldn't tell her anything during the break up, not even a I love you or nothing, he refused to discuss anything. Until the night she found out he slept with her friend, he told her he still loved her and was scared *****!e$$ of what was going to happen. He said that he stood to lose everything now, any way it goes down. He said that he knows that: If he dates her friend, he knows that my friend will leave, and he wants her in his life no matter what, as friends or otherwise. If he doesn't commit to her friend, he will have lost a friend (he was supposedly best friends with her friend), and probably my friend because of what happened. If he doesn't stop sleeping with her friend, he will eventually lose my friend or her friend because of drama and jealousy issues or god knows what else. So you can see why he is scared ****less. She wants him to figure something out... soon and fast. She wants to figure out what to do, without this turning into a **** storm. Not that it's already a **** storm- she told everyone (friends in the group, it's a small one- 5 or 6 people) that she didn't want to have anything to do with anyone, and a couple of the people are upset with the ex for what he did to her and that it made his friends suffer the loss of her friendship with them too. She grew up with these people, and so did the ex, you could say that they were high school sweethearts, so the history of this group runs deep in between everyone. Everyone is deeply affected by this now. I personally have seen this- I definitely see the chemistry between the ex and my friend. Yet there are also chemistry between her friend and the ex, but it's more intense between my friend and the ex. At first, when she told me all this, I thought she was NUTS. But I saw them earlier today, the chemistry is crazy now, than it was prior to the situation (AFTER the break up). It's almost as if they were in love again. I truly, now, do believe what she says here is true. I honestly want to help her, but I'm not very experienced in this sort of area/thing, so if anyone could give my friend helpful advice, and please, no bashing. I'm so sorry if this is so long, but I really had to explain EVERYTHING, so you guys could take everything into account. Thank you for taking the time to read this... now give her advice, please!
Guest Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 Ok...i Will Make This Very Simple For You... If I Was Dating A Woman [who By The Way Was The Most Amazing Thing In The World And Simply Because Depression, Illness, Regular Life, Kids, Work, Etc.] Felt That She Didn't Feel The 'spark' Even Though I Had Covered Her Ass A Zillion Times, Did Rawk Her World Sexually Until She Simply Took Everything Thing For Granted, Left And Started Screwing Around With Someone I Knew [by The Way, I Don't Have A Best Friend - Never Have], And This Woman Was Wondering What Decision I Would Make - For Her? Lol. I Would Tell Her - Hey, I Told You Ages Ago That Because I Simply Cannot Cheat On Someone I Would Expect The Same In Return And That If A Gf/wife/fwb Cheated On Me - That's It! Over! End Of Story. When Someone Makes That Decision - After Someone Has Done And Provided For Them In Every way - And In The Face Of All That Still Went Thru The Mud...that Woman Should Know Very Clearly - That The Moment She Walked Out His Door [like He Told Her] That Was It [everything Else Is A Side-bar] [see The Leaving Happened Way Back Then] So, I Would Tell Her - Hey, Look I Have Shown U I Can Do Stuff Like "this" As A Friend But That's As Far As It Goes...i Hope Enjoy Your Choice Of Life Partners - And I Hope U Find What U Are Looking For. That's It!
Author silentcharon Posted October 22, 2006 Author Posted October 22, 2006 She did, it's just such a utterly complicated situation. The ex WANTS her, she wants to reinforce that, now that the "spark" has been rekindled. Should she make him suffer the consequences or wait and see how it pans out, by remaining friends with him (without the benefits) anyway. She knows nothing will work out if she stays friends with him, if he does end up going out with her friend. The only saisfication she gets out of this whole thing is that he TOLD her friend that he still loves my friend- her friend will always have that at the back of her head even if they start dating. I'll tell her the advice you gave her.
KittenMoon Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 Whoa- my first impression is this guy is an utter jerk. My second is this, some important points: 1) He slept with her FRIEND. 2) Her FRIEND slept with her ex. 3) THEY BOTH LIED. Accidents are one thing... lying is another... and together they're pretty horrible. I can sympathize with the wanting to be with someone, especialy after such a long time, but I think this is too much.
norajane Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 If they were together for 5 or 6 years, he KNOWS who she is and how funny, charming she is, etc. She does not need to stick around to be compared to her friend in order for him to know that. He's not likely to just forget. If he needs to sleep with other people in order to figure out if he really wants to be with your friend or not - and your friend is ok with that - fine. But why should she give him her friendship and support while he f*cks around? By sticking around, she's enabling his confusion, and enabling him to take as loooooong as he wants to figure anything out because he knows she'll be there...waiting....waiting...waiting...for him, for as long as he takes, for as long as he wants to sleep with others. How can he miss her if she's always there for him? How can he respect her if she sits and watches his exploits from the sidelines? They may have broken up, but he's been getting sex and friendship from her the whole time. So, he really hasn't "lost" her. He needs to know what that feels like or he's never going to feel any urgency to "have" her.
Author silentcharon Posted October 22, 2006 Author Posted October 22, 2006 Whoa- my first impression is this guy is an utter jerk. My second is this, some important points: 1) He slept with her FRIEND. 2) Her FRIEND slept with her ex. 3) THEY BOTH LIED. Accidents are one thing... lying is another... and together they're pretty horrible. I can sympathize with the wanting to be with someone, especialy after such a long time, but I think this is too much. I agree- I told her she should leave the jerk, and allow him to truly feel the loss of her friendship. It's a better plan anyway- she leaves, and the group gets angry at the ex. Make him suffer the consequences!! As of right now, three of his friends refuse to talk to him now. But then, if she sticks around, she KNOWS that they won't last long- as her friend is a very insecure person, and can't STAND being alone. She told her ex how were they supposed to be friends if they end up dating, since she will always get jealous whenever they go out alone, because he told her that he still loves my friend. So either way, she wants to be there when they break up or any way it goes down, she wants to be there. She truly believes that the spark is back, and she has no doubts the guy still loves her, and is willing to let him go to date others. I think she's afraid that if she leaves, he'll forget about her or something like that. This really sucks for her.
Author silentcharon Posted October 22, 2006 Author Posted October 22, 2006 If they were together for 5 or 6 years, he KNOWS who she is and how funny, charming she is, etc. She does not need to stick around to be compared to her friend in order for him to know that. He's not likely to just forget. If he needs to sleep with other people in order to figure out if he really wants to be with your friend or not - and your friend is ok with that - fine. But why should she give him her friendship and support while he f*cks around? By sticking around, she's enabling his confusion, and enabling him to take as loooooong as he wants to figure anything out because he knows she'll be there...waiting....waiting...waiting...for him, for as long as he takes, for as long as he wants to sleep with others. How can he miss her if she's always there for him? How can he respect her if she sits and watches his exploits from the sidelines? They may have broken up, but he's been getting sex and friendship from her the whole time. So, he really hasn't "lost" her. He needs to know what that feels like or he's never going to feel any urgency to "have" her. That's true, you have a point. She's just afraid that if she leaves, the opposite reaction will happen as opposed to what she hopes to have happen, the ex ending up staying with her friend anyway. He is still there for my friend, she recently found out that her grandma didn't have much longer left to live, she told him that and he came over right away. He's always there for her too. I'll definitely tell her what you said. She's just, I guess, confused right now as to what to do. Leave, leave, leave! Gosh, I am just so worried about her..... So, he really hasn't "lost" her. He needs to know what that feels like or he's never going to feel any urgency to "have" her. That's the odd part- and I can see it happening too. Ever since she told him she didn't know, and that she felt like she never wanted to speak to him again- the "urgency", or the spark, or courting is back now. Up to this situation happening, she tried every so often to find out where they stood, he wouldn't give her an answer, everyone saw that they were... just there. Kind of hanging on. But NOW, the chemistry is there.... for some odd reason. That's why she's so convinced that she has to do something NOW. I told her if she left, the urgency probably will get worse for the ex, it'll be hard but he will find a way back to her sooner or later. I can see that they BOTH are in love now, not because I am a hopeless romantic, but it's there now, I can feel it in the air, it's so electricifying. Blah, this is just confusing. Even I don't understand it.
norajane Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 I don't think it's that confusing, actually. Love and in love doesn't necessarily mean you can get out of your own way to be with someone. Love is giving of yourself. At 25 or 26, giving doesn't come naturally. People are still primarily thinking of themselves, it's about the self. To actually BE with someone, to WANT to give of yourself, their best interests have to be part of what makes you happy. He isn't considering her best interests AT ALL yet. It's still all about him.
Author silentcharon Posted October 24, 2006 Author Posted October 24, 2006 I don't think it's that confusing, actually. Love and in love doesn't necessarily mean you can get out of your own way to be with someone. Love is giving of yourself. At 25 or 26, giving doesn't come naturally. People are still primarily thinking of themselves, it's about the self. To actually BE with someone, to WANT to give of yourself, their best interests have to be part of what makes you happy. He isn't considering her best interests AT ALL yet. It's still all about him. That's true. Well, the latest update is that she went out with some friends last night and her ex was there. He flirted with her (she wouldn't return anything) and well.. she ended up sleeping over his house as it wasn't far away. This morning, they slept together- (I told her that was a terrible idea.).... but the kicker is that before they did it (the peneration part) he asked her to promise him that she wouldn't tell anyone about it. She asked him why, and that she couldn't guarantee that she would keep it quiet as she would need to talk to someone about it. He told her that her friend would flip if she found out. She asked him why would she get mad, because they're not even dating and after all, he did tell her why he didn't want to commit to her. He said that it was because she wants more from him now, and he was afraid of losing her too. I told her to leave this JERK- and not to keep it a secret at ALL. I mean, it really does boggle my mind how this guy had the balls to ask her that. He's a jerk, and they both deserve each other, really. He told her that her friend knew that he went out with her and friends last night, and the fact that my friend slept in the same bed would be a deal breaker. She told him that she was pretty sure that her friend knows, and that she would be a fool not to have figured it out. I told her to go NC, this jerk is not worth it. This makes me want to call him up and yell at him. Leave, and make him suffer the consequences- the loss of her friendship. Give him a chance to miss her, though I'm not sure if it's too late in the game for that now. Geez, I don't know who's the biggest idiot in this love triangle....
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