More from an OM

[MoonGirl]

BKRPM,

I don't know if you're still reading this thread, but I thought maybe I could give you some insight into the other side (a MW with an OM).

 

Of course I can't tell you what exactly your MW is thinking, but I may be able to offer some insight. I have been with my H for 6 years. He is extremely verbally abusive (as is your MW's H) and occasionally physically abusive. During much of our relationship I have had reoccuring dreams of one of my ex boyfriends. This BF was/is a very nice guy, we dated for 2 years, and only separated because we lived in different places. Plus, I was young and didn't really appreciate what the ex-BF could offer me at the time (I was a party girl!). Anyhow, to make a very long story short, once I woke up to the fact that my H was abusive (this happened when the physical abuse started), I emailed my ex-BF (bad idea, I know!). I should have ended things with H first, but after so much abuse, I felt weak, unwanted, and very lonely. I felt that leaving H would crush me.

 

Ex-BF (now OM) and I began to hang out as friends and I fell for him hard. Fortunately for both of us, OM refused/refuses to have any physical contact with me while I am still married. Yet, we are deeply emotionally connected and each know how the other feels. His presence in any form allows me to see that I am lovable and wanted. Even though he is very guarded, I can see that he wants to be with me (the way he looks at me) and he sometimes talks about the future. Like your MW, the attention my OM pays to me makes my marriage seem bearable, especially since I spend less time with my husband these days. Sometimes I feel terribly guilty because I don't want to hurt my BF or my H (even though I mostly think he is an abusive jerk).

 

Despite H being abusive, like many abusers, I don't think he is aware of how damaging the abuse is or how it pushes me away from him. The abuse and then subsequent guilt trips he lays on me are torturous and make it nearly impossible to walk away from him. The abusive statements include (and may sound funny to you, but affect me in a very real way), "You are destroying our family", "If you wouldn't f-up, then I wouldn't punish you", "I am the only one who thinks about your feelings", "Your friends don't like you; they only invite you out when it is convenient for them", "you're an idiot", "you're stupid", "your uneducated", "I hope the children don't turn out like you", "I can't believe I married someone as dumb as you", "You don't do anything for me", "Only I think of your needs, but you never think of mine", "Your parents don't love you", etc...the list goes on and on and on. Then, after he has destroyed me verbally, he builds me up to try to make me feel special, loved, and wanted. He buys me expensive gifts and takes me out on "romantic" dates. It's a vicious cycle of ups and downs with the ups feeling so nice and the downs feeling so horrible. To someone who is not in an abusive relationship, the solution seems easy: LEAVE! But the amount of guilt placed on the person being abused is massive. The abuser can make you feel like his happiness is solely dependant on you, blames you for everything that goes wrong (and can often make you believe that everything is really your fault), and tries to convince you that no one else on earth would want you or even put up with you.

 

Despite your "promises" to stay with your MW after her D, she may doubt you and be really afraid of being discarded and lonely. She also has some SERIOUS issues to work out (I know she's going to therapy). And, like other posters have said, if you (the OM) are available to meet your MW's needs while she is married, then leaving her marriage is not too likely (even if she's being abused). I'm sure that I would be less likely to leave my H if my OM and I were also physically intimate or if OM contacted me every day (which would show how hooked he is on me). This is not because I don't love my OM, but because it shows that he is content (at least to some degree) with how things are.

 

I am in the process of separating from my H (am now packing and looking for a place). I have been careful not to promise my OM anything special, but I have definitely lead him to believe that I will move out and I will divorce H. I feel terrible about telling him this because even though I truly desire to move out, I don't intend to mislead him in the event I don't move out. I am so so scared that OM really won't want me in the end and I will be left alone and lonely. This makes me, at times, hesitant to leave H even though I know that's what I should do (even if I end up alone). For someone who has been abused, being abused can seem like a better choice than the prospect loneliness. I can't explain why, but it likely has something to do with lack of self-esteem. You also get used to the abuse and begin to think "it's not that bad" or "I'm just weak". Fear of the unknown is probably also a factor.

 

Does your MW's family know that her H is abusive? If not, maybe she should tell them. I think that having your feelings/situation validated by those who are closest to you can help you see that things are wrong and that change is needed. Until I told my family about my abusive H, I don't think leaving him was even an option for me. Once I told them, his abuse became a reality and something that I had to deal with.

 

I know some people have stated in the past, "maybe MW's home life isn't THAT bad" and that's why she's not leaving. This MAY be the case, but, trust me, home life can be pretty bad and a woman may still not leave. I'm proof of that! I'm not trying to complicate your situation, just tell you how your MW might be feeling.

 

I agree with everyone else here that NC is best for YOU and for HER. I even think that NC would be best for me and my OM until after I move out. My OM has not made any promises that he'll be waiting for me, which is very mature of him. I like this situation because it means that I have to decide to leave my H based on the fact that my H is not good for me and not on the fact that OM is waiting for me. It has taken me some time to come to terms with the possibility of being alone, and now I am okay with it. But some women, even if they want to leave an abusive H, they stay for years and years due to various reasons (children, guilt, control, possible loneliness, etc).

 

I recommend reading Patricia Evan's book "Verbal Abuse Survivors Speak Out". It's hard to imagine how verbal abuse can affect you and control you unless you've lived it. I think even the book can't possibly describe what it is like, but it does give some insight at least. Even if your MW leaves her H, she has been through a lot (based on what she has told you anyway) and may exhibit a lot of strange behaviors that you will have to deal with.

 

For me, the biggest deciding factor to move out was my H's behavior. On days when he was nice, it made me feel really guilty to think about leaving. The second factor was that my OM told me that he would never consider me his girlfriend or touch me until several months after I moved out and filed for divorce. He keeps his distance (not as much as he should) enough to make me wonder what he is up to. He also never discusses his feelings for me, but has slipped a couple of times and alluded to a future together. We spend WAY too much time together (2 dates per week) and he makes my life to seem bearable (which is a big mistake on his part). But I know that I cannot have both my H and my OM long-term. To many people, the solution seems simple, but it is not (as you know). I can say that I want a divorce and that I want my OM to be my only man, but until I move out and file for divorce, anything I say is irrelevant. Like your MW, I truly love my OM and want to be with him. It is fear of the unknown that keeps me from taking action each day. Even though I know my H is abusive, I fear that leaving him will be the biggest mistake I've ever made. I just think, "I'll do something about it tomorrow."

 

I wish you the best and hope that your situation has improved. Reading about the "other side" has really helped me see the pain that you (the OM) experience. I will never put my OM through this torture after reading your threads. In fact, I'm thinking of NC with the exception of email until after I move out. I think this will help me get my butt in gear for sure. It makes me think about why I keep putting up with an abusive H when being alone or, better yet, eventually being with a loving stable partner is a real possibility.

 

Keep us updated on your situation if you can!

[pureinheart]

I think she was playing mind games....I know it sounds promising her leaving H....I would beware of the mind games and keep dating....

[pureinheart]

In thinking about this....she only did this D thing with her H because she knew you were serious about dating....she is leaving him for all of the wrong reasons....now if she would have left him before the dating thing, then it might be different....she is reacting emotionally....you can't trust that...

 

It would be the same thing if ex-MM ended up on my doorstep (like he said he would "someday")....too little...too late

[frannie]

I wish you the best and hope that your situation has improved. Reading about the "other side" has really helped me see the pain that you (the OM) experience. I will never put my OM through this torture after reading your threads. In fact, I'm thinking of NC with the exception of email until after I move out. I think this will help me get my butt in gear for sure. It makes me think about why I keep putting up with an abusive H when being alone or, better yet, eventually being with a loving stable partner is a real possibility.

 

Thanks for posting your story, because I think it will help quite a few people here, not just BKRPM.

[oyster]

Thanks for posting your story, because I think it will help quite a few people here, not just BKRPM.

 

ditto that, as the ex-OM too, it helped me understand what went thru the mind of the ex-MW.

 

geez, I think I am turning the page, I am using "ex-":p

[movinon05]

oyster, this is the poster i was talking about in your other thread. it gives you a whole different perspective when you see what can happen and what you will go through, doesn't it?

[BKRPM]

Thanks very much, MoonGirl, for your perspective. It has been very helpful. It truly is 'torture' sometimes. I think, "Why in the heck do I take this from MW?"

 

An update, and please - keep the comments coming. It makes me stronger, especially like right now when I feel kind of despondent.

 

MW saw her attorney in mid-December, and attorney told her to wait 90 days....MW's H has tried to pull out all of the stops to save her marriage. He invited their local pastor over to discuss things, he showered MW with Christmas gifts. He goes to church with her, and he never did before. MW tells me that she is totally baffled by it, and still is wary. But, it is obvious, by looking at her and talking to her, that MW likes the attention from H. Every week or so, MW sends me an e-mail that says things like, "H can do what he wants, and we discuss issues, but I still don't know if I ever could be happy with H, and I know that I could be much happier with you." MW says that she has a problem now that H seems to be taking his anger out on her daughter.

 

Mood-wise, lately MW has been 'off' 3x as much as 'on' with me. I still work with MW as 'line of business' partners, but I was moved this week to the opposite end of my territory to be more of a support to a weak manager. MW has been crabby and mean. When I ask her why, she can't give me a straight answer. MW does mention that MW needs to stay strong, but feels very sad that we won't work directly as much.

 

I know a few things right now: 1) I really do love MW. Spending time with MW is the most enjoyable thing that I have ever had in my life; 2) We never should have taken the physical as far as we have. As enjoyable and special as THAT was, it has created more heartache for me that I need; 3) I am very tired of her recent crabby moods, and have gotten too comfortable with my 'sorries' and apologies, probably when I have no reason to be!

 

It hit home, MoonGirl, when you said "(from going through all of this), she might exhibit some strange behaviors." I keep telling myself that these behaviors are due to her emotional baggage. Otherwise, I sit and preoccupy myself thinking, "Why is she saying this? Why is she doing this?"

 

Any assistance very much appreciated.

[oyster]

BKRPM > Thread carefully dude, her hubby is fighing to keep her for whatever reason. He will break her down with guilt and shower her with attention. If she is weak, she will never leave. She will go back to her confortable misery as it is less headache for her.

 

I would initiate NC and wait on the side, start dating other.

 

My ex-MW, similar pattern, her hubby fought, brainwashed her, she took 1 month to think about it, I am still maintaining NC, I think she will go back to her marriage and the whole cycle will happen again, this time without me.

 

you got to wait till the dust settle. She has to sign divorce paper and move out. Speed is of the essence.

 

The longer it drags out, the more headeache she will have and more likely to stay in the miserable marriage.

 

Walk away so she can see clearly. If she comes back to you, great, if not, go out and meet people.

[pureinheart]

A female " cake eater??????? "

 

I hate that phrase by the way.

 

emotional leech is closer to correct

 

 

GEL you are so right on the money!

 

Cakewoman????

[MoonGirl]

All,

I'm glad that I can be of some help to understanding the abused MW and the reasons why she may not leave her H.

 

 

BKRPM,

 

BKRPM > Thread carefully dude, her hubby is fighing to keep her for whatever reason. He will break her down with guilt and shower her with attention. If she is weak, she will never leave. She will go back to her confortable misery as it is less headache for her.

 

 

I certainly agree with oyster here. Even though I want to leave H (you can certainly read my other posts about that), I find it terribly hard to do so. Abuse is usually cyclic, with the abuse occurring and then the abuser trying to make ammends by giving gifts, being extra lovey-dovey, etc. The abuse messes with your mind SO much that you think that everything bad in your relationship is your fault (even if logically you know it's not). The abuser makes sure to imply that leaving will be one of the stupidest, most irrational, most painful, and most SELFISH things you could ever do. The amount of pain and guilt involved in THINKING about leaving is overwhelming (I haven't left yet, so I can't tell you how the actual leaving experience feels). For those who have not been abused, this likely sounds crazy. I was once a person who had never been abused and if I had heard my very own story I would have thought "what the hell is she thinking? why does she stay?"

 

I have already managed to separate myself emotionally to some degree from my H. I KNOW I don't love him, I don't respect him, I don't want to be with him. I feel like I am just wasting my time with my H. Yet I stay. I stay for the reasons I mentioned in my previous post and even other reasons unknown to me.

 

Like everyone else has already told you, NC is best for both you and her. It gives her time to be alone with H and then the decision to leave will not likely be a choice between H and you.

 

On Friday I imposed NC with my OM, and it is terribly painful for me. I need, like your MW, to be able to stand on my own and leave H because our relationship is terrible, not because OM is waiting for me. I didn't say to OM "If you love me, you'll wait" or anything like that. I just told him that I DO have feelings for him, but I have a lot to accomplish in my life before I will be available for a real relationship. Of course, I hope that he will be available when (if) I find myself on the other side, but I think it is unfair to string him along when I am not in a position to make him my only man.

 

Do not wait for this woman (I hope my OM is not reading this!) It could be months, years, or NEVER before she leaves her H. I know this is hard for you to hear because you love her. I guarantee you that there are many other more stable women who will make you their ONLY man and love you back in the way you deserve. Concentrate on yourself, your hobbies, dating, etc.

 

By the way, your MW's moodiness toward you is not acceptable, even for someone who has a lot to deal with (IMHO). It is likely her strange way of distancing herself from you. When I referred to strange behaviors, I mostly meant sensitivity toward abuse-like behavior, difficulty with commitment, and all of the emotions that accompany loss (loss of her previous life and of her H).

 

I'm so sorry to hear that you are still having a hard time letting go of your MW. For your sanity, please try to move on.

[BKRPM]

Update--It has been painful, but I have gone NC for over three weeks now with MW. I feel maybe 2% better, but that is not saying much. MW still in that 'trial period' of trying to make M work. She saw the attorney in mid-December, and decided to wait 90 days, especially after H was bending over backwards to be nice for the first time in 12 years. MW still says that H will regress. She's waiting for the other proverbial boot to drop.

 

Regardless, I have kept it strictly business at work, and moved locations (I have four to choose from in my district) to be away from MW. We're still line of business partners, so I still see her 2-3x week. After a business call last week, MW told me that I should date others during her decision period, but then said that she really didn't want me to, because it would break her heart. Uggghh. MW begged me to please keep her apprised if I DO date, so that maybe it will be easier for her to accept, as opposed to hearing my stories from other mutual friends. I thought about that and decided, "Hell no, why in the heck should I make everything as pleasant and give her control over everything...If I want to date many women why does she deserve to know?"

 

With my NC going on, I think I have gone from despondency more to anger. I truly do love MW, but I am not going to be treated like a doormat.

[MoonGirl]

BKRPM,

 

Your MW is treating you like a doormat (as you already know).

Anger is good for you right now I think. It sounds like you're starting to move on.

 

You're doing great with the NC. Soon you'll be feeling better!

 

DO NOT keep her apprised of your dating situation. It is none of her business and she is MARRIED. She has no right to inflict more pain on you. The only reason she wants to know if you're dating is so she can try to talk you out of it. It sounds like she wants both her H and you in her life, but that's not fair to you.

 

If she really wanted to be with you, she would end her marriage. I can't say whether or not she loves you, but she certainly doesn't love you enough to do what is best for you. YOU need to do what's best for you, which is what you're doing right now with the NC. Great job!

 

I'll be thinking of you and hoping that you're staying strong and continuing to work on what's best for you.

[frannie]

MW told me that I should date others during her decision period, but then said that she really didn't want me to, because it would break her heart. Uggghh. MW begged me to please keep her apprised if I DO date, so that maybe it will be easier for her to accept, as opposed to hearing my stories from other mutual friends. I thought about that and decided, "Hell no...

 

 

Good For YOU!!!!

[BKRPM]

I had lunch with MW yesterday. We were between business calls on clients. I hadn't seen her in over a week. I'm still staying strong (and keeping it all business), although it is not easy. Twenty minutes into the lunch she admits that she realizes that she has put me through hell the last two years. MW stated, "How could I be so selfish to put myself out there and fall in love with you when I was still married, and to be open to you falling in love with me?" My (polite) anger came out a bit. I told her (with a hint of sarcasm), "Why are you fretting at all? Your H is being great to you. You seem doubtful, but are loving the attention from H. Why do I matter at all?" MW then told me that, despite things being good at home, MW still thinks about me all of the time. Arggghhh. I dropped a couple possible date scenarios that I have. Yes, I do love her very much, but I can't sit and wait....

[MoonGirl]

BKRPM,

 

You're doing a great job. I think getting together with MW though is probably going to make your healing process longer.

 

If she hasn't left H yet and says things are currently good at home, I doubt she'll ever leave H...at least not anytime in the immediate future.

 

It sounds like she has finally realized (or admitted to) what she was doing too. Apparently, her marriage wasn't THAT bad and she wasn't planning on ending it. There are many people who engage in exit affairs (as you know), but this doesn't seem to be the case for her.

 

I'm sorry you're dealing with such a painful situation. Feel free to PM me if you need to talk.

[Guest]

I so don't understand the push-pull thing. She gets close to you, then distant. She needs you, loves you, but won't actually do anything to be with you. If the marriage is truly dead, it's a no-brainer, she'd leave.

 

But the marriage isn't dead, it's alive enough for her to choose to continue to participate in it. Her husband is mean to her and doesn't meet all her needs (just as she doesn't meet all his)--so she gets back at him, and soothes her wounded self-esteem with an affair. She loves what you do for her when her feelings are hurt, but she loves the good parts of her marriage even more.

 

This is so unfair for you. I am very sorry for the pain you must feel. Have you considered a NC? If you are going to date others, NC is the best way to go. I think dating others is a good move.