mental_traveller Posted September 22, 2006 Posted September 22, 2006 Ok, time and again we see the same topics pop up on this board. Someone's darling hasn't called them for 3 months and they don't know what signal he is trying to send. A guy isn't sure whether to take back his pleading gf after she had a naked pool party with the high school basketball team. Your best friend went on holiday to Thailand, met this wonderful woman but now she is asking him to wire $3000 to pay for a new water buffalo. You know the stuff. So, I thought I'd start a thread where I throw out a few opinions on common relationship topics. Since I'm a guy, obviously I'll be a bit biased - maybe some of the loveshack ladies can start their own threads and balance things a little I'll start by just listing some common problems, and the most effective solution to them. I won't explain my reasoning at first, but if you want to know, just ask. Pretty much all these answers are based on experience, either my own or other people I have seen in this situation. They are simple, effective, and they work. Problem: your woman cheated on you Solution: dump her, and never communicate with her ever again. If you are married, get a good divorce lawyer and proof of her indiscretion, to help you in the settlement. Never, ever, stay with an unfaithful woman under any circumstances. Get an STD test asap. Problem: you are in a serious relationship, and your woman wants to live together/get married/or have kids, whilst you don't. Solution: sit her down and honestly tell her that you don't want this, and are unlikely to want it in the future. Either she accepts you as you are, or decides that your needs are different and you should amicably break off to find a partner with similar goals in life. Never, ever drift into a serious commitment that you are unhappy with - it's unfair to both of you. Do not cave in to ultimatums, pleading, threats etc. If she acts up, it's time to call and end to the relationship. Remember there is always a woman just as hot if not hotter, who doesn't want kids, is happy not to get married etc. Finally, if you are not using condoms, start using them. Many women are not averse to having an "accidental" pregnancy despite telling you they are on birth control. Problem: you really like a woman, but are too shy to make a move Solution: have a few drinks to build up dutch courage, this will lower your inhibitions and allow you to talk to her more naturally. Problem: your partner has some undesireable trait, habit, or behaviour, that you are unhappy with - for example gaining weight, smoking, taking up drugs, alcohol abuse. However, when you raise the issue, they for whatever reason don't end up changing it. Solution: begin by being patient, constructive, and supportive in your discussion about the issue, but make it clear you need this to change. Set an internal deadline for efforts to start, and if she hasn't made genuine attempts by then, then become firmer. If she still doesn't respond, then give her a firm ultimatum that she chooses between the behaviour or the relationship. If she still doesn't change within a reasonable period of time, dump her and move on. It is important to set clear deadlines, and *not* listen to whining, excuses, pleading for 2nd and 3rd chances etc. Actions speak louder than words. Also, after being dumped, she may seriously try to change, and ask to be taken back. You can go back, but only once - if she fails again, then it's over for good. Problem: some aspect of your sexual desires is unfulfilled in your current relationship. Your gf/wife won't do oral/anal, doesn't wear sexy underwear, won't have sex etc. Solution: if this has always been the case from day #1, then chances are you are sexually incompatible. Immediately end the relationship, and only start another serious relationship with someone you know is into the same sexual stuff as you. If this is a change, then you need to sensitively but clearly explain the problem, say that this is a dealbreaker for you and that if she wishes to continue the relationship, she has to go back to how she was before. Set clear deadlines in your own mind, if she doesn't show signs of change, then you have to call it a day. Problem: your girlfriend is hot, good in bed, and you have great personal chemistry. However, she is volatile/jealous/crazy and you often argue a lot. Solution: make her your mistress, not your girlfriend. Immediately end all prospects of a serious future together, and just keep her as a good **** buddy until you meet someone who is good in bed *and* emotionally stable. You must make it clear that you will not be monogamous or emotionally involved with her, and that your interaction is confined to the bedroom or your local drinking/clubbing/gambling den. Surprisingly to many men, this kind of arrangement is often perfectly fine by this type of woman. Just be discrete about any other ladies you have on the go at the same time - this sort of woman at least wants the *illusion* that you are mostly into her. Problem: your girlfriend is nice, great fun, good-looking, but you lack a bit of sexual spark and the sex life isn't quite what you would want Solution: you are probably not really compatible, and things will be much worse once you are past the initial attraction phase. Move on and find someone were the sex is passionate and mind-blowing early on. Problem: you and your girlfriend are in love, but her friends/family disapprove, and/or her religion/culture is strongly opposed to you and/or your background & views. Solution: under no circumstances compromise, hide, downplay, or lie about any of your convictions or beliefs. If you are destined to be together, she'll choose you regardless. You can then reach an acceptable compromise on your differences, and live fairly harmoniously together at least. If she insists that you change yourself to accommodate the friends/family/background, or prevaricates, then move on. There are plenty more fish in the sea. In future, do not get involved with women where these issues are obvious from the beginning (e.g. if you are an atheist/agnostic, never allow hardcore religious types to be more than **** buddies). Do NOT get married or impregnate her until this issue is clarified and the situation is stable for at least 2 years. Problem: I bust my nuts working my ass off in the office, while my wife/gf lazes about all day getting manicures or workouts from her personal trainer. She hardly cooks or cleans, and just takes me for granted. I resent the fact that she's not pulling her weight. Solution: she's a gold-digger or a spoiled princess, taking you for a ride. If you are married, then hope you signed a prenup, then go see a good divorce lawyer. If you're not married, make sure you don't propose or get her pregnant. In both cases, use condoms and don't trust her birth control until you stop having sex with her for good. Problem: my girlfriend/wife has changed her behaviour, and is acting secretive about her cellphone/email/whereabouts/trips etc. I love her and know she wouldn't cheat, but my gut tells me something is wrong. Besides, there's this new guy at the office who seems to be into her. Solution: your SO is quite likely to be having an affair, and has probably had sex with another man at least once already. Your instinct is very sensitive and often a good early warning radar for infidelity - trust it. Immediately get an STD test and start wearing condoms. Hire a private investigator, install key-logging and snooping devices on all the computers she uses, tap the phone if possible & legal, basically monitor her intensively until you find the truth. Then, if it's confirmed, dump her, tell all friends/family (both yours and hers) what happened, and never speak to her again. Problem: me and my gf are deeply in love and I recently asked her to marry me. She said yes! I'm so happy that I've finally met the woman of my dreams. Solution: you are a naive fool who is about to be taken for a ride by the absurd legal and political marriage & divorce system operating in your country. You are trying to fight millions of years of evolution by committing to one woman for life, and exposing yourself to huge financial and possibly emotional loss, for extremely tenuous reasons. Go to http://www.nomarriage.com, read the divorce and infidelity forums on loveshack, and most importantly, speak to 3 or 4 good divorce lawyers, as well as friends/relatives who have been married/divorced. The *only* reasons to get married are i) you are going to have children ii) you are with a foreign citizen and need to marry for her to be able to emigrate to be with you. All other issues can work just as well in a non-marital relationship. If after reading all the horror stories, and seeing the dismal statistics, you still for some reason want to marry, then get the best lawyer you can find and draft an ironclad prenup. Marry in a country with the most lenient divorce laws you can find. Touch wood, because you will need all the luck you can get. Ok, that's the first few musings for now. Let me know what you think!
Adunaphel Posted September 22, 2006 Posted September 22, 2006 Mental_Traveller, I don't always agree with your posts on LS but I found this post very, very interesting. I actually thought that most of it is *very* good advice - that is, very good advice for someone who would not try to (or is incapable to , or has already unsuccessfully tried to, or should not) reconsider his own expectation/point of view before starting to reconsider the relationship, and won't try to, or can't find an acceptable compromise. I am genuinely curious, though, about whether you'd be actually able to follow your own advice if you found yourself in a situation like the ones you described. Breaking up straight away with someone after you have found out you are not compatible is one of the best pieces of advice you could give someone, but how many people are strong enough to do it without esitation? Would you dump a cheater under *any* circumstances? Do you firmly believe in the non-existance of exceptions to rules? (this is a more general question that sprung from the one above) Are you really so strong and determined? If so, I really admire you for it. I certainly am not like that! I would also like to ask you, do you believe in trying to work a problem out together with your partner? Or your approach is more of a "my issues/point of views/needs are what they are, if you wish to be with me you must do all the changing" kind? (I'm not thinking or assuming that you have this kind of attitude, I'm just asking) I guess my problem is that I'm unable to see *anything* in black and white. Which explains, among other things, why I am a lousy chess player.
Author mental_traveller Posted September 22, 2006 Author Posted September 22, 2006 Well, I'm sure someone wiser than me has said that advice is much easier to give than to follow. So yes I totally agree it's more difficult to do than to say. In fact one of the reasons I made this post was to clarify to myself how I should act too - if it's down in black and white, it's easier to recognise what I should do. Yeah, one or two apply to me or have in the past! But overall, I think it's good to clarify what should be done - that helps you build up the conviction and willpower necessary to make those tough decisions. As for compromise, in some of them I've said you should try a compromise first. I'm not advocating an immediate breakup for everything. My experience with some (e.g. sexual incompatibility, or insufficient attraction) is that it's either there or it isn't, you can improve it but not to as good a level as when it's just there naturally - I admit maybe that's different for other people. But I can only write for me and people like me, which I think is a fair number of guys. My personal experience, and that of my friends, has been that you can never break up too fast when there's a problem. I've literally *never* seen someone break up over a serious problem, and then 3 years later I've thought "boy, they acted too fast and made a mistake there". In every case where I thought they should break up and they didn't, I've later thought the breakup would be the right thing. IMO people harm themselves and their life prospects by their inertia and fear of "rocking the boat" or being single. It keeps them in sad, broken, dishonest relationships that just mess both people around. Regarding cheating, the only case I can imagine being ok with it is if it was a bisexual affair with a hot or sexy woman that I also liked, and they were up for making it a threeway Predictable I know, but honest! I really can't imagine overlooking something with another guy. Also I'm talking about sexual activity here, just to clarify. An "emotional" affair I'm not really sure, because I'm rather sceptical they exist without some physical side too. Can you think of a cheating incident that ought to be forgiven? I do believe in working out problems with a partner. However, it's two people there. If *they* don't believe in working it out, then I believe in working it out solo - by leaving. If they do believe in working it out, then generally the problem would never arise in the first place, or would get resolved shortly after you mention it. An example is my current gf - she smoked irregularly (avg 2-4 a day) and I said I wasn't into smokers, she said it's ok I can stop. I've heard that before so I kept an eye on it, and she didn't change at first despite asking. So basically next time we kissed I made it obvious I found the taste & smell disgusting. It bothered her and she started trying to quit. Like most people she weakened a few times - so I would be encouraging generally, and hardass on those occasions she felt tempted. Eventually she stopped. She then put on a bit of weight, and the same thing happened. The things is, both times she knew it was a problem. It was similar with me with drinking, while I was single I drank a lot more and I knew she was a bit uncomfortable with hardcore levels of drink & drunkenness. So I was cool with toning it down. The point is, if she had said no, said she would continue to smoke, or had got defensive and emotional about me pointing out the weight thing, like many women on this board, then I would have ended it. In fact, she volunteered the idea of changing both before I even had to mention it, because she is aware it's a problem and she believes that as a person in a relationship you should act & look a certain way, and have standards for yourself & your partner. That's the difference between someone who takes pride in their conduct and appearance, and understands the wishes of their significant other. I see too many people on here who's partners ignore their wishes, men and women who are slovenly and have little or no concern for how they appear or act. When I hear that some wife has not only ballooned up to 250lbs, but also screams at her husband for being shallow for even mentioning it, I find it ridiculous that she is not turfed out on the street that same day. When a man is cheated on by his wife, despite making his best efforts as a husband, I find it absurd that he even considers keeping her, and even more absurd that women here encourage him on working on "saving" his "marriage". The same is true the other way round - it's amazing to see the crap that women put up with from men sometimes, total *******s who sleep around, put them down and abuse them. But in this case, I find that most posters are condemnatory like me, and give the correct advice to leave. So really it's the guys that I think need to get a bit more backbone. Nothing is more pathetic than seeing a guy blinded by what he thinks is "love". If only they just went out and met a few more women, they'd realise what they were missing. It's nice to see a story like that of Caliguy, who finally wised up and dumped his cheating tart gf, then went off for a rip-roaring time on the dating scene with a load of west coast hotties, and even gave us a dating guide of sorts I think if one or two guys read my remarks (or other people on similar lines, like Cecilius, Westernxer, Alpha, tanbark etc), and decide to get tough with gfs/wives who go way out of line, they too can undergo a similar transformation. Finally, I have deliberately been a bit "over the top" with my tone, and the last one on marriage is a bit tongue in cheek But I always prefer to give the brutal truth than to sugarcoat things!
serial muse Posted September 22, 2006 Posted September 22, 2006 hiya, mental. help the ladies out, too! can we switch the pronouns and the same rules apply? what about that last marriage thing?
Adunaphel Posted September 22, 2006 Posted September 22, 2006 Thank you for posting again - it was very interesting to get your whole perspective. Well, I'm sure someone wiser than me has said that advice is much easier to give than to follow. So yes I totally agree it's more difficult to do than to say. In fact one of the reasons I made this post was to clarify to myself how I should act too - if it's down in black and white, it's easier to recognise what I should do. Yeah, one or two apply to me or have in the past! But overall, I think it's good to clarify what should be done - that helps you build up the conviction and willpower necessary to make those tough decisions. I couldn't agree more about how knowing what should be ideally done can help you quite a lot to make the right decision (expecially if it's a tough or painful one). As for compromise, in some of them I've said you should try a compromise first. True. I'm not advocating an immediate breakup for everything. My experience with some (e.g. sexual incompatibility, or insufficient attraction) is that it's either there or it isn't, you can improve it but not to as good a level as when it's just there naturally - I admit maybe that's different for other people. But I can only write for me and people like me, which I think is a fair number of guys. It makes perfect sense - do you guys just know, and can tell, when you can work on sexual incompatibility or insufficient attraction or when it's just useless? (I'm referring to cases where there was attraction at the beginning of a relationship). Just an exemple....you used to be very attracted to you gf.... you are no longer because she gained a lot of weight, because you are turned off by something about her looks or personality that did not bother you before, because you just lost sexual interest in her and do not know why... can you just tell whether the situation*could* potentially improve and get back to normal, or not? If this makes any sense to you. My personal experience, and that of my friends, has been that you can never break up too fast when there's a problem. I used to think exactly the opposite - you should be careful not to break up too fast - but hey, I ended up breaking up with an ex some two years later than I should have. So I don't really know. I've literally *never* seen someone break up over a serious problem, and then 3 years later I've thought "boy, they acted too fast and made a mistake there". In every case where I thought they should break up and they didn't, I've later thought the breakup would be the right thing. IMO people harm themselves and their life prospects by their inertia and fear of "rocking the boat" or being single. It keeps them in sad, broken, dishonest relationships that just mess both people around. Food for thought, I guess. Regarding cheating, the only case I can imagine being ok with it is if it was a bisexual affair with a hot or sexy woman that I also liked, and they were up for making it a threeway Predictable I know, but honest! What if they ended up deciding not to have a threesome with you after having sex (or any other interaction that would be considered cheating) with each other? Also - would your opinion and level of respect of your partner remain the same if such a thing happened? (either a threesome or she interacting with a very hot woman) I really can't imagine overlooking something with another guy. Also I'm talking about sexual activity here, just to clarify. An "emotional" affair I'm not really sure, because I'm rather sceptical they exist without some physical side too. They exist - but perhaps you meant that you wouldn't consider them as bad as a physical affair? Can you think of a cheating incident that ought to be forgiven? A year ago or so there was a post on LS about a lady who cheated on her H while volunteering as a doctor in a country that had just been hit by a tragic natural catastrophe - she was basically surrounded by a nightmarish scenario, witnessing pain and suffering, and she was very away from home. She clearly loved her H (and came clean with him right away), she cheated in a moment where she was very, very vulnerable. I quoted this as a quite extreme exemple. A less extreme exemple would be a partner cheating once while he was in a moment where he did not really know what he was doing, coming clean right after the fact and feeling very, very bad about it. If this happened to me I'd very probably give my partner a second chance, at least if he had never cheated before on anyone and looked like the kind of guy who'd not cheat on me again. I do believe in working out problems with a partner. However, it's two people there. If *they* don't believe in working it out, then I believe in working it out solo - by leaving. If they do believe in working it out, then generally the problem would never arise in the first place, or would get resolved shortly after you mention it. I think you are very right here. An example is my current gf - She quitted smoking, you toned down drinking - it sounds like a great exemple of meeting each other's needs. When a man is cheated on by his wife, despite making his best efforts as a husband, I find it absurd that he even considers keeping her, and even more absurd that women here encourage him on working on "saving" his "marriage". I think that women (and some men) will encourage the man to work on his marriage only in some particular circumstances - but I guess we are back to the problem of whether cheating can sometimes be condoned. The same is true the other way round - it's amazing to see the crap that women put up with from men sometimes, total *******s who sleep around, put them down and abuse them. But in this case, I find that most posters are condemnatory like me, and give the correct advice to leave. I got the idea that a guy and a woman who are in the same situations exactly would receive basically the same kind of advice. A scumbag is just a scumbag - and is genderless. So really it's the guys that I think need to get a bit more backbone. Some women should too (myself included). Well, I'll wait until some lady posts a thread that is similar to yours - I'd be very curious to read it and jump into the discussion. I think if one or two guys read my remarks (or other people on similar lines, like Cecilius, Westernxer, Alpha, tanbark etc), The posters you named are all guys that *do* have brains. I still think that Alpha is not for real though (or kind of). and decide to get tough with gfs/wives who go way out of line, they too can undergo a similar transformation. Some people should not attempt it though, IMO (men or women). Some insecure people should not attempt to 'play tough' before they have worked on their self-confidence enough, or it will backfire on them if they can't keep up with the transformation. I don't mean that some men or women are hopeless (I'd be doomed otherwise ) but that such a trasformation should be gradual - if you undergo it a step at a time, it's going to last. Or perhaps I'm just a temporizer. Finally, I have deliberately been a bit "over the top" with my tone, and the last one on marriage is a bit tongue in cheek But I always prefer to give the brutal truth than to sugarcoat things! I admit that I took it more as a joke than a piece of honest advice.
Author mental_traveller Posted September 22, 2006 Author Posted September 22, 2006 hiya, mental. help the ladies out, too! can we switch the pronouns and the same rules apply? what about that last marriage thing? The marriage one was only half-serious, but it does sort of reflect my views As for application for ladies - it's coming from a male perspective, and women are of course different, so I'm not sure exactly how it would "flip" for the fairer sex. But I think the general principle of deciding your dealbreakers, sticking to them, and not kowtowing to unsuitable partners is a good one. Women I guess might have different priorities - maybe instead of sexual compatibility, it might be that romantic compatibility is higher priority. Things like men being really messy, never returning calls, picking their nose in public and burping in front of your friends at dinner parties etc might be more common complaints I'm sure the many women posters here can come up with their own versions!
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