I'm a secret

[Waap]

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum but need some advice. I've posted below the body text from an email | sent to a friend. She replied at length and also suggested I post here.

 

All replies welcome.

 

BACKGROUND

 

I love her to bits. Always will. When things are good they are really great. The last week has been terrific. But she has a fearsome temper. Sometimes irrational and unavoidable and I've wondered sometimes if there is a medical problem because it can be so sudden and very very fierce. To the point of abuse on occasions. And yet I love her.

 

We've been together getting on for 5 years. 4 years ago I asked her to marry me and she said yes but wanted to keep quiet about it. Racism/rejection from her [indian] family and complications at work (we met there, I was the boss) justified that.

 

ISSUE 1

 

Four years later... I'm four years away from her work but still know some of the people but don't have contact much with any of them. Her family now accept me (pretty much). Her dad, via the brother in law now wants to know my intentions, do I intend to marry her etc. They clearly would be happier if we married (more to avoid shame than to accept me probably). N still pretends to her friends at work that she is single. Last month I bought a new engagement ring and proposed again. I took off the old ring, joked about how it hadn't worked, and gave her the new one. I said that now we should tell people and she agreed.

 

But... a couple of weeks later I suggested talking to her family and provoked rage. I feel like I'm back where I was before. I'm taking the view that I'm not engaged if its a secret. And I'm finding it hard being a secret after so long. I'm seeing her brother in law this Thurs and I'm inclined to just tell the truth.

 

Any perspectives or challenges on this would be really welcome.

 

ISSUE 2

 

Her boss has invited her out.

 

I've not met him but he's apparently a bit camp. He is currently separating from his wife. He's a huge Madonna fan and has invited N (also a fan) to go to an aftershow fan club party with him. She told me this and said she told him she'd let him know.

 

As I see it: He's splitting from his wife. He thinks she's single. Its two of them, not a work outing.

 

I genuinely don't think she's planning an affair or anything. But I'm really opposed to this evening out. It might not come to anything anyway, she might just say no. If I raise it I know this will cause a massive fight - how dare you suspect me, don't restrict me etc. But I think it is wrong.

 

I admit to being motivated by jealousy here - I don't want her out with someone else like this.

 

I'm minded to raise it with her and just weather the storm - there will be one. And if she intends to go I'll probably call him and tell him who I am and maybe menace him a bit.

 

Tell me if I'm going over the top, because I can you know.

 

Thanks

Waap

[amaysngrace]

Don't contact this man. It's a sure way to get her mad at you with him being her boss and all. I think you should get the ring back from her and try with someone else. She doesn't seem to take you as seriously as you take her. And where is the respect she should have for you as her fiance? I just don't see it.

 

It's your life but if I were you, I wouldn't bother with someone who seems so unworthy.

[Chinook]

Hi Guys

 

I asked Waap to post here because I want him to get some unbiased advice. I'm going to decline from giving my view because I already emailed it to him. Just to say a quick 'hello' and welcome to him.

 

C

x

[Craig]

Waap, if you're a secret, if the 'engagement' is a secret then there is no relationship here. Sorry.

 

Given her anger problems you should start to think about breaking things off with her anyway.

 

Nothing good is going to come of this 'relationship.'

[Waap]

And a bit more context... we live with her 8yr old son and my daughters 6 & 8 stay with us two weekends out of three.

 

So we have both 'normal family' and 'secret'.

[Buttaflyy]

Hey Waap! Welcome. Chinook, I hope you gave him good advice already and told him that this woman doesn't (sound) as if she's worthy. She doesn't respect you enough to admit to her family that you are planning to marry? I think you also mentioned that you guys live together?? Please explain again her reasoning for keeping your engagement a secret? It would seem that if you already "live" together, there went the traditional household for most cultures. And she has a child from a previous relationship? I think she's full of it Waap. Sorry. I hope you come to terms with the fact that maybe she isn't the best for you. I'd ask for the ring back. I'm not even touching the surface here from what you've mentioned (her violent streaks).

 

BTW, don't dare call her boss. It will just make you look bad. She should handle that situation herself.

[norajane]

Definitely stay away from the boss. He is not your problem; your so-called fiancee is the problem.

 

All I can say is if my SO proposed without even any ring at all, the first people who would hear about it is my sister and my parents, and they'd hear about it as soon as I got to a phone. She is not happy about being engaged to you, and probably has no intention of marrying you.

 

The uncontrolled anger probably isn't a good thing for your children to be around, either. Even if you think you can deal with it, they certainly cannot, and should not. Protect them.

[riobikini]

Waap,

 

This girl is telling you she's not ready to settle down.

 

It doesn't matter about the four years you've known each other; it doesn't matter that you have all these emotions and hopes to marry her;she seems to be searching for something she hasn't found in her relationship with you.

 

I think her keeping you a 'secret' has little to do with work, race, or anything except this strange blindness she has in seeing the gem she has in you.

 

She wants to keep looking; you love her and want to say "I do".

 

Forget about why she's so volatile, -it's likely to have more to do with her than you.

 

Also, you are having very natural feelings concerning the informal 'date' with her boss, to see the concert together.

 

Anyone with even a pea-sized brain would be concerned with that, -especially in light of the boss's marriage problems.

 

But it appears that dear girlfriend is unconcerned -and willing to engage herself in a potentially compromising position with her work, her romantic life, and whatever else that could come of it.

 

Which brings me to seriously question *why* (if she didn't want her relationship with *you* to interfere with her job) she is allowing such a situation to even begin with her boss that could mean much more than *interference*with it?

 

I advise you to refrain from contacting her boss; cool the relationship off a great deal (even though she may dive into another relationship), and muster as much effort and courage as you can to prepare for whatever unfolds over the next weeks and months.

 

During this cooling-off period, spend alot of looking for answers as to why *you* are still hanging onto to such a relationship after four years.

 

And feel free to keep in touch with this board if you feel the need to.

 

Take care.

 

-Rio

[bendit]

Waap, I am going to be direct with you so don't take it the wrong way. Its for your own good.

 

There are a lot of problems I see here. The first is your love seems to be unconditional for this woman. You said "I always will". That's fine for HUMANITY, but not your significant other. What I mean by that is your partner has to earn your love. She has to act in a way that is 100% deserving of a great guy like you. From what you write, she is not acting that way.

 

This woman has all the power. You have given up your power as a man to her. She doesn't respect your power. Your boundaries are weak. You let her do what she wants. She calls the shots. The relationship is terribly unbalanced in her favor.

 

A committed woman does not act this way. She is not committed to you. You are settling for table scraps and you deserve more than what she is offering you. You have "ONEITIS." This is the belief that there is only one person in this world that can do "it" for you. That's not true.

 

There are many many many women who could make you happy. But you don't realize this because you have an unhealthy attachment to this particular woman. You love her no matter how she treats you. You have told her, by your actions, that she can treat you any way she wants, including abuse you, and you will still love her. She has no incentive to change and treat you better.

 

Now, imo, this person is a commitment phobe with a number of other serious issues, such as anger problems. This is key: she does not want to be married, but does not want to lose your "supply", the emotional support you give her when she is in need. You give her something, and she does value it. But she can't really return your true love. Its quite possible she has a mental condition. And you should never be accepting anyone raging at you, or emotionally abusing you in any way. If you are, you have to examine why you accept someone doing this to you.

 

The last issue you raise is an example of emotional abuse. Now, this is the woman you gave a ring to. This is the woman you want to marry and spend all your years with. This is the woman you wish you could have kids with. Yet she does not deserve to be your mate. She is doing one of the most abusive things any person can do. She is flaunting the attention of another, and waving it in your face as if to say, you don't matter.

 

Your instincts are 100% correct about this date, and you should feel profoundly upset that she is doing this to you, even if she chooses not to go. If it were my SO doing this, I would kick her ass out onto the street and say don't ever darken my door again.

 

She treats you with disdain, as if you DO NOT matter. And you are satisfied with the few moments of intermittent happiness that she gives you. It is not normal for your SO to act as if she is single at work and elsewhere. Majore Red Flag!! This devalues you and your relationship with her. She is manipulative. When you bring these issues up, she rages at you. This is her way of saying her actions are NOT subject to negotiation. This is unfair. It is immature. It is unacceptable.

 

She could easily have an affair with him or another man. Why? Because she has not COMMITTED to you. Has she? Yet, she knows that you will accept her behaving any way she wants. You accept her awful behavior. So it continues and it gets worse.

 

From her perspective, it is fun to be desired. Its fun to be desired by more than one. And its fun to see how your SO reacts when you tell him that you are going to date the boss. Your reaction of jealousy means you "desire" her. She is jealousy making, and that is LOUSY. She is an abuser. She doesn't deserve you. You should immediately cut off her "supply", the emotional support you give her. Don't contact the boss. Take care of business by getting out of this travesty of a relationship.

 

Next, you have to deal with your unhealthy attachment to her. You have to start looking at YOU and the reasons you don't believe you deserve someone who TRULY loves you. Why do you settle for this Crap? Why do you accept this? Why do you let your woman do this to you, the woman you want as your wife. Why do you let her devalue you as a man?

 

You should break free of her and start to rebuild your self esteem brick by brick. It won't be easy. You will have to do it with NC. But she has systematically beaten you down, and has you thinking you can't do any better.

 

Let me tell you there are HUNDREDS of women out there who would love a great guy like you. Maybe thousands. But to see them and meet them, you have to emerge from the dark fog you are in.

 

You have to begin to disengage and realize that this isn't going to be the woman of your dreams. She is the woman of your nightmares. Please read and re-read what I have said.

 

You can do better than this woman, a person who will never be able to commit to you, and who extracts your love and support, and offers you nothing but emotional abuse and an occasional good time.

 

You can do better than this. I wish you all the best and I really hope you make the changes that will make your life all it can be.

 

regards

[KittenMoon]

Hi Waap-

 

I got two sets of questions for you:

 

1) Have you sat her down and had a talk with her about why she doesn't want to settle down and marry you? Does she even know? How did her last relationship end?

 

2) Does she really act single (as in she's up for grabs?) or single as in unmarried? Does she talk about you or refer to you as he bf/partner/etc in social situations?

 

 

I ask the first questions because I will admit to being commitment shy. I got ditched by my love of over 6 years. I didn't want to marry. Well, I did, but I kept waiting for the feeling to be right. But every time I asked myself if I wanted to marry him, the answer I got from inside was "no". I don't know why- I loved him to death. I still do- I think. If he came back today, I would marry him- i think.

 

I guess I just want to point out it's not as easy as it sounds for some of us, even when we're madly in love with someone.

 

Second set, I ask because if she's really "hiding" you.... red flag! Even if you love her.... this is really disconcerting. I've never known anyone to hide someone they were deeply in love, or even just infatuated, with.

 

 

And another question: Why are you so set on being married to her (other than the family thing)?

 

If she's dedicated to you (providing she truly is) isn't it enough she's your partner? Would it be so bad to go on like you are? I used to try to tell myself marriage is just a piece of paper... it didn't mean anything. Well, now I ask myself, if it was just a piece or paper, why was I so scared? I say that so maybe you can try to see it from her perspective, if she is afraid of marriage on some level.

 

Sit her down. TALK to her. Tell her exactly what you want, but don't accuse her of anything. As in saying "I want to marry you" not "Why won't you marry me?" I can guarantee putting her on edge with your words won't do anything good. Be very concious of your words. Keep them passive and calm, but say exactly what you want, ask her what she wants. Be prepared for "I don't know". Ask her, what's the first feeling or reaction that pops into her mind when she thinks of marrying you. Be prepared that it might be a resounding sense of fear, or "NO!" (That's how I felt....)

 

 

And I can understand being motivated by jealousy. Ignore the jealousy- there are two paths now. One, she wants to marry you. Two, she doesn't, at which point the jealous will be moot because if you are really looking to be married and she's not, you may have to walk away and try your luck elsewhere.

 

I hope things work out- I hope for your sake she's just scared inside and she really want to be with you.

 

Good luck.

[In Sync]

Waap,

You have received some top notch advice. Unfortunately because you're in it, you may not be able to see or think clearly, but somehow what you conveyed in thise few paragraphs obviously provoked the unanimous replies that say "GET OUT OF THIS RELATIONSHIP"

 

You say you love her and who am I to question that but the description you've laid out here is of a person so dependent and in denial that I believe you are in love but I'm thinking it's co-dependent. The five alarm fire is the rage thing. When a person is receiving verbal abuse they will do anything to please the abuser in hopes not to have another episode. They will bend over backwards and ignore anything that would spark a fit of rage. (I know from personal experience) What's sad it that you are in such deep denial that you are willing to expose your daughters to this woman. Sorry dude, but that's madness on our part. And now you are furthering sliding down the humiliation pole by contacting her boss out of jealousy.

I'm sorry that you bought a ring and she is no more excited about the idea of being your wife and willing to share that news..ususally you're looking for a woman who is proud to make that announcement to her family and friends. But stop this insanity with your life and this woman before it gets worse. Move into your own place and regain your dignity. Is this woman a

role model for your daughters? Hardly. Wake up and take a good look at this woman what qualities has she that would make you want her to be your wife?

[EnigmaXOXO]

If you're living together and are engaged … she is not "single" and therefore shouldn't be accepting dates with other men. Period.

 

Her total lack of respect for you and her family seem like the immature antics of a rebellious teenager rather than a grown woman.

 

God bless your patience and I hope this girl grows up soon (for your sake). Also hope you're not left behind to babysit her son while she's off trying to prove to the world how irresponsible, care free and independent she is.

[riobikini]

P.S. Look at her *pattern*: you were her *boss* once-upon-a-time.....see anything resembling social/job-climbing in action, here?

 

Retreive your (second) engagement ring, -take your kids on a trip with the money from it.

 

-Rio

[Chinook]

Okay guys, I just want to say thankyou for offering the wisdom of your words to my friend. Some of it has been very hard for him to see today and to deal with how he's feeling too. We are currently working out what applies to him and what doesn't and putting it into context of what fits his actual reality. Of course throughout all of this, only he can decide what is best for him and his relationship. Thanks again guys.