Author Pink Amulet Posted August 31, 2006 Author Posted August 31, 2006 Um. Nobody ever stole my man. Nor did anyone 'pretty' make me feel anything at all. And I don't make those assumptions. Nor was I addressing you specifically. If the shoe fits... Again, you'll do well if you refrain from assuming that all of these posts are directed specifically at you. I only assume they are directed at me because people say "take pink for example"- not to mention the fact this whole debate was sparked by the fact that "I only posted this for attention and affirmation".
Touche Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 I don't see a thing wrong with asking/getting a little affirmation how and when we can. What's the big deal? Who ISN'T a little insecure about some aspect of themselves? Is that a crime? I can think of a host of things worse than that. Some of you are really being ridiculous. And although there have been "studies" claiming how good-looking people have it easier, I don't buy it in many cases. Where are the studies that show how so called good-looking people suffer a certain kind of rejection BECAUSE of their looks?
Noos Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Thanks Johan - but I don't have hatred on my face and I don't hate pretty women. What I hate is guys who cannot even have the common courtesy to acknowledge my present or include me in a social conversation, or turn their backs to me while they chat up prettier acquaintances. That tends to wear down a girl's self esteem after a while. And I never said Pink used her looks to get ahead. She has no control over other people's response to them and that isn't her fault. But don't try to say that they don't matter - that's just disingenuous. However, I admit that 5% of me is wondering if you would have been as vociferous in your defence if you didn't know what Pink looked like 'cos I have seen you flirt with her online.
Guest Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 I think your bitterness reveals your own tendency toward "lookism". If you find those guys reject you in favor of women like Pink, and you think that reveals a character issue, do you still consider those shallow men desirable? I think that this is a very good point indeed. By the way, I'm the same "guest" who posted earlier in the thread, but since tempers seem to be running rather high I'd rather be anonymous in this discussion. Anyway Johan's right I think: a guy who chooses to line up for a vapid-but-beautiful woman is showing that he is just as shallow as the object of his affection supposedly is. Now why wouldn't any guy try for someone who was smart AND kind AND beautiful? These things are in no way mutually exclusive. I don't see the problem there. What I was commenting on earlier was in response to the very valid point that on a discussion board in cyberspace, presenting yourself as "beautiful" and/or "sexy" is kind of beside the point, in fact I cannot figure out what the point of doing so is. I mean, if a beautiful woman is given preferential treatment in real life like doors held for her, all kinds of perks and attention from men, well, that's life. She's not necessarily doing anything to receive those benefits, she cannot help the way she looks. And if she is beautiful and can get away with it why shouldn't she approach a man (provided of course that he's single)? But here, everyone chooses how to present themselves. If your "true self" is what is inside and you don't value your external appearance, why make sure that everyone knows what you look like? I think it's interesting because it indicates that despite lots of claims to be above caring about how their beauty affects others, people do what they can to impress upon others that they are beautiful. I never saw that movie with Gwyneth Paltrow and ... was it Ben Stiller?... where she was in fact very heavy but he only saw her beautiful personality. I thought the movie looked kind of preachy and dull. But I did see an interview with Gwyneth Paltrow in which she described what it was like to walk around town in the fat suit she wore in the film and she said it was quite a shocking eye-opener to see that the positive reception from strangers that she'd received her entire life was really connected to her physical appearance. Anyway I guess I'm just agreeing with others that of course people respond more positively to beautiful men and women. It's natural and there are probably evolutionary reasons for it because I've read that beauty is a good indicator of physical health. It's undeniable that a beautiful woman will get more positive attention and positive responses from strangers than a less beautiful woman will. Once a stranger is no longer a stranger, beauty will count for less than personality and character (at least if the stranger is worth knowing!) . But in order to get to that point of no longer being a stranger, one must attract attention somehow ... and who would deny that beautiful people have an easier time of that? I'm not saying that extremely beautiful people have no problems or that they should apologize for looking as they do. But at the same time I think it's a fallacy to assert that someone who takes care to make sure that everyone knows how handsome or sexy or beautiful they are, even when that info is unverifiable and largely irrelevant like it is on Love Shack, isn't trading on their beauty.
Noos Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 not all "pretty" women rely on the way they look... and not all women will take advantage of it (if you saw how I dressed at work-not to mention my demeanour- you would undestand) and so far, not one has acknowledged it. Again, but you could if you wanted to because people will give you the opportunity to get ahead based on your looks in the first place. What I'm saying is that I have no choice in the matter.
Touche Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Again, but you could if you wanted to because people will give you the opportunity to get ahead based on your looks in the first place. What I'm saying is that I have no choice in the matter. You think maybe the bitter attitude that I'm picking up on from your posts might come across in person as well and just MAY have something to do with the fact that you think you have "no choice in the matter?" Something to ponder, anyway....
johan Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Oh puleeze. I hardly think anyone can be bothered to 'hate' because of that. Let's not turn the plight of the beautiful into a complete melodrama. Actually I think "hate" is an accurate term. It's not "dislike" or "disapproval" is it? It's certainly a result of fear and prejudice, and I equate that to the hatred of bigots. If you want to argue degree, fine. But I am usually semantically correct, and I only exaggerate when I want to be sarcastic.
Risky Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Looks like the typical don't hate me because I'm beautiful. Sorry but women are caddy sometimes, if they feel a girl is hotter than them they can be real *itches. Sometimes you see someone that makes you feel inferior and the green eye monster comes out. I don't think pretty people have it any easier because who is to say who is pretty. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It's our own insecurites that make the hatred come out and you don't have to be considered ugly to be insecure. Think of how many hot girls or guys you have met that think they are unattractive. Or maybe they just want attention (being sarcastic)
burning 4 revenge Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Helloooo Risky :love::love:. Love the avatar :love:
Ripples Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 The thing that causes a problem for me with some beautiful people is their sense of entitlement to adoration and their need to be the centre of attention. Also, I've noticed a tendancy to try to undermine anyone who is more attractive than them. Maybe though these particular people are actually quite insecure and feel that they have little else but their looks to appeal to people as that's what they are most praised for... Disclaimer: I don't for one moment think this applies to all beautiful people.
lindya Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 The thing that causes a problem for me with some beautiful people is their sense of entitlement to adoration and their need to be the centre of attention. Also, I've noticed a tendancy to try to undermine anyone who is more attractive than them. Maybe though these particular people are actually quite insecure and feel that they have little else but their looks to appeal to people as that's what they are most praised for... Disclaimer: I don't for one moment think this applies to all beautiful people. I must concur with that a bit. I can pick out friend A and B and find that aesthetically there's little to choose between them....they're both as naturally pretty as eachother. But friend A is more into her looks, and more in need of male attention (I am thinking of two real life friends here). So she's constantly giving off messages that she needs to be validated for her looks....then when people focus on her looks, she gets confused and upset. "Just because I'm pretty, people treat me like a bimbo despite my academic and professional credentials". Yet friend B is just as pretty...and she doesn't seem to be suffering from the bimbo tag. A is confused and upset...but so are other people. They see that she's always carefully made up, spends a fortune in hair and nail salons and generally wears clothes that show off a lot of cleavage. So doesn't that mean that she is, actually, quite keen for other people to sexualise her? Why does she get angry when they do? Is it maybe just that she wants to have the power to dictate when other people can sexualise her, and when they should be focusing on her less visible attributes? I think it's understandable for any woman to want that power, but in reality people will perceive according to a) the signals they're getting, and b) however it is they choose to perceive things. Trying to control how others perceive you by saying "You should take me seriously. You shouldn't dismiss me as a bimbo simply on account of the way I look" is a waste of energy. Only a fool will be persuaded by other people's demands (based on their wants and needs - sometimes quite narcissistic) of how others should perceive them. It's hard not to sexualise someone who is presenting themselves in a very sexualised manner. If I see a naked woman on a billboard, I see a naked woman who's got a good enough body to be used for advertising purposes. There's no reason for me to spend extra time contemplating whether she's also a kind, caring and intelligent woman. Unless I'm going to spend an equal amount of time in such contemplation about the tired, middle aged woman walking underneath the billboard.
Ripples Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Right. You've summed it up totally. Why do they do that thing of presenting themselves as one thing and saying they want to be treated differently? Is it because its not socially acceptable to act as if your main asset is your looks? Is it a disingenuous tactic to appear acceptable? Maybe to elicit sympathy, praise etc.? This is great! I feel a little less irritated by them now.
Guest Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Sorry but women are caddy sometimes, I think you mean "catty" right? I do make the occasional barbed remark but I don't like golf and will never lug anyone's clubs around! Lindya I agree with you completely. There's no need to resent beautiful women, regardless of how lovely or unlovely you feel about yourself. And worrying about whether beautiful people get more attention, and whether or not that's fair, will also be pointless to worry about. It's the mixed messages sent by someone who does whatever they can to emphasize their hotness while protesting that people shouldn't assume they're all about their looks that is irritating.
lonelybird Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Pink, I see you are a compassionate girl from some of your posts. how about hide your appearance and pick another skreename, just to test which side make you more shiny? maybe you are curious about this too?
Walk Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Or pick an avatar like a4a has? Big ugly woman. Do a study on the responses of people, and then report your findings in a new thread.
a4a Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Or pick an avatar like a4a has? Big ugly woman. Do a study on the responses of people, and then report your findings in a new thread. OMG don't hate me because I am beautiful!!! :lmao: Hey now in RL I am not too hard on the eyes..... my ass has not yet slunk down to the back of my knees... and I cannot jog and hold a whole loaf of bread under my boobs without it budging. But good looks don't count for crap unless you can back them up with offering something else to the people you are interacting with. I will say though I have run across people that take the approach of competition with me based soley on my looks.... and shyte that sucks. Trust me I don't run around looking like a barbie far from it. But some women tend to look and think " oh I bet she thinks she is hot, well she is just a whore, I hate her!"........ and the whole time I am thinking "what do I need from the grocery store, I wonder if it is going to rain tonight?" Fine example is the head to toe glances and twisted face I get from the Kitchen Chicken and her clucking hen friends. :rolleyes: their problem not mine. So sorry I am thin.... I am so friggin sorry! sheesh!!!
a4a Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Here is a good question...... how many times has someone asked you if you think they are good looking, either directly or indirectly.... like posting their pic to an avie and you just don't have the heart to tell them the truth of how you see them? :lmao: I admit I have just said..... oh you are very attractive, yet I am really thinking ..... ahhhh.... don't quit your day job or you kinda look slutty and cheap...... IMHO....... You asked so I guess I should start telling the truth??? :lmao: Kinda like BOs bad singer friend...... what the hell are you supposed to do? Tell him he sucks? Or like baby pictures when the kids looks like a baby red rat with a cone head..... yeah how beautiful that baby is :lmao: :rolleyes:
Walk Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 I just wanted to say.. When I was growing up, I spent every summer with my grandparents and my cousin. My cousin has been in modeling since the time she was 6, and now models for some top magazines. She's a very photogenic, beautiful woman. And was the most gorgeous child. My grandparents treated her as special. To the point of ostricizing me. (Which upset my parents greatly, yet they continued to ship me off to see these shallow people.) They would take us to go swimming and afterward offer to buy my cousin ice cream and gifts, and specifically told me I was too fat to have ice cream. (I wasn't fat.. I just wasn't anorexic looking like my cousin.) They would introduce her to their friends as their granddaughter, and either ignore me.. or they would throw in my name as though I were just the neighbors child or something. A friend of their granddaughters... It really hurt me growing up. To the point that for years I felt ugly, fat, atrocious. Ingrained soo deeply, that any one who said anything nice about my looks was immediately met with a barrage of "You liar" and many hateful words. But I learned something really important about people from this. Although my grandparents were somewhat shallow people, what initially began as feeling of pride for them in having a beautiful granddaughter.. resulted in my withdrawing from them because I felt like less in comparison. It was a combination of their initial response to my cousins appearance, and my withdrawing from them, which caused them to favor my cousin more and more over the years. They grew closer, while "we" grew further apart. I was only able to see this (at the time) as a result of them rejecting me based on my appearance.. not my behavior toward them. What I'm trying to say is.. it's not ONLY appearance which gives people special status. It's our behavior that causes others to either see us, or not see us in comparison to another person. If you feel others are going to treat you as a nobody when a hot girl stands next to you, then that is how you will be treated. If you truly believe you are just as deserving, or more deserving, to be noticed in comparision.. than that is how you will be treated. Our deamenor, our non-verbal, and verbal language dictate how others treat us. So although someone like Pink or Risky might have a small jump from the starting gate.. It is our behavior which dictates how others will treat us. And I mean from the very moment a person see's you, you can change their perception of you. If you appear confident, believe in yourself, then no "hot" girl will ever "one up you". Not even from the get-go. I get as much, or more, attention and respect then "hot" girls who hang around me get. And I feel it's because I am comfortable in being me. Not hot, not ugly, not outside appearance related... I'm just me.. and I like me.
Outcast Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 If you feel others are going to treat you as a nobody when a hot girl stands next to you, then that is how you will be treated. You couldn't be more correct. I am not being scouted by Models Inc. nor will I ever be but I've not had problems attracting people. Seems that being a cheeful sort of person is some sort of magnet. Truth to tell, it surprises the heck out of me but trust me on this - it definitely does the job. To the point where I have to actively work on toning it down so that guys won't go for me. Yes, poor me - it's soooo hard being friendly. We friendly people are misunderstood :lmao:
midori Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Hi folks, This thread has started to wander off-topic, and while some of the things that various posters have touched on tangentially might be relevant to the discussion in the context of the original post, a lot of the discussion about beautfiul women is not really relevant and as such doesn't belong here. I'm afraid that I don't have time to weed through the thread right now and move off-topic posts to a new discussion thread, but if the off-topic posting continues this thread will have to be closed. If you're unclear about what the topic of this thread is please refer to the original post -- anything you care to add should address this topic in some way. Otherwise please start a new thread. Your cooperation is appreciated. Best wishes, midori
Touche Posted August 31, 2006 Posted August 31, 2006 Yes, I think I've read some studies that show that friendly people have an unfair advantage in life. They have it SO much easier than unfriendly people. I mean unfriendly people are constantly being shunned. It's really not right. They can't help that they were born that way! Oh and what about friendly and attractive people? That's just too unfair an advantage. I can't imagine how unnatractive unfriendly people even go through life? Care to tell us Smooch? HA! Sorry, couldn't resist! It's a joke, really. ( I think...)
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