DesperatelyUnsure Posted July 18, 2006 Posted July 18, 2006 Here is my situation, I'm seriously envolved with a man who has a young daughter (10 yrs of age) who he is estranged from. The mother and he were never married and went seperate ways when they broke up and did not get along at all (mainly from her from what i'm told from other family members) after they parted ways. They have both moved on and married other people. There last contact envolved the childs mother getting physical with my S/O ex wife wich was two years ago. So my understanding is she's very physical, verbal and intollerable. He talks of his daughter often and is always making reference to his her. I have three children to whom he's become very fond of and he of them. However there is this part of me who doesn't understand not seeing or having any contact with his daughter. He pays his child support weekly but has not spoken to his daughter in two years. When I try to discuss this with him he's very sensitive to the issue. We have been talking of getting married and when I bring up his daughter I raise the issue of his lack of contact. What are you going to do one day when she show's up at your door and wants to know "How you could be a father figure to three other kids that weren't his but not have any contact with his own". His response is you have no idea what turmoil she's caused our entire family his parents, brothers and sisters ect.. Now I understand difficult relationships with ex's and children. I am divorced twice. I know how exhausting and draining emotionally it can be to have to deal with the other parent just to get to talk, visit, spend time with your own child/children. However I also know the importance and significance of having a relationship with your child and no matter what the other parent does it would never keep me from my child but i'm a mother so I don't know if that makes a difference. Now my question is this.. Am I out of line by pushing a reconciliation for he and his daughter. I know how important children need there parents both mothers and fathers and I can only imagine what kind of issues his daughter may already have due to his absence. Not to mention I love this man and want to know and accept everything in his life that includes his daughter. Should I even bring it up, am I out of line for trying to persue this?? Is this not my place?? could someone please give me some insight. Sorry..trying to make short. Appreciate any response.
amaysngrace Posted July 19, 2006 Posted July 19, 2006 You're in a tough situation, no doubt. I have to wonder why he doesn't call her or try to see her. Is it because of the mom? Is she really so frightening? If she is so bad, why hasn't he tried to remove her from her mother? Have you ever asked him that? If him having to deal with her is the problem, then he needs to put his feelings second to his daughters. He should worry more that she is okay than if he isn't. It's just the right thing to do as a parent. Put your children first. This new guy, his daughter's step-dad, is he a good man? Is he involved in her life and being a positive father-figure to her? Geez, so many questions, I know. It's just my natural reaction when I hear a child is being neglected, I guess. Sorry for answering your question with more questions!
Trimmer Posted July 19, 2006 Posted July 19, 2006 ...no matter what the other parent does it would never keep me from my child but i'm a mother so I don't know if that makes a difference. Just for the record, as a father, nothing, nothing, nothing would EVER keep me from wanting to have a relationship with my children, and short of some kind of court order, I can't imagine ever relinquishing that privilege - I can't bear to even think of that as a possibility, so it's not exclusive to your being a mother. You call the father and daughter "estranged"; that implies to me some bad blood between the two of them. Is that really the case, is their relationship a difficult one, or is the relationship between the daughter's mother and father so poisonous that this is what causes the strain that separates them? On one hand, it's hard to imagine giving up contact with a daughter like that, but is it possible that he believes he's doing the right thing by minimizing the drama and toxicity that the bad blood between him and her mother brings? Maybe they had some agreement early on that he was to stay out of their lives or something? I don't know... Hard to say how much you should push. Are you doing it for the daughter's benefit, because you think she may question how he could have left her alone? Or for his benefit, because you think he should step up to the plate and be a father to her? Or are you concerned about his commitment and suitability as a parent? It may just be a part of him as a package deal, but it does make it hard that you want to understand this part of his life, but he isn't able to openly share it with you... _________________________________________________ -------------------------------------------------------- Ahhh, in reading back over your initial post, I see something that strikes me: We have been talking of getting married and when I bring up his daughter I raise the issue of his lack of contact. What are you going to do one day when she show's up at your door... Speaking from a guy's perspective here, you may be putting him on the defensive right from the start. You know that this is a sensitive subject, but it sounds like right from the outset you are calling him on something he may well believe is a personal failure ("his lack of contact") and pressing him to answer for it ("What are you going to do...") Realize that whatever it looks like from the outside, this is probably not a situation that he feels ambivalent about. For whatever reason it happened this way, he may actually be holding a great deal of pain, sorrow, anguish, or whatever over this situation. (I'm sure we would all rather that he feel something deeply about it than to believe that he just doesn't care.) If you introduce the subject within a negative context, his defenses will almost certainly go up right away, and you get exactly what you described: "...he's very sensitive to the issue" Now come at it from another perspective... You said "He talks of his daughter often and is always making reference to her." This makes me think that he does still hold her in his heart, irrespective of whatever gulf has opened up between them. Ironically you're doing the characteristically "guy" thing - you're trying to FIX the situation right away. But you might want to start out just listening... If you want to learn about her and his relationship with her, don't take him to task for the current state of affairs; don't call on him to explain his failures. Here's the key: Start out by letting him share the memories that he is fond of. Some time when he mentions her in passing, become interested, and gently ask him something more about her, something to very delicately encourage him to continue sharing his experiences in a positive context. Something as simple as "tell me your favorite thing you remember about her", or "what did she look like when she was a baby" (if he had contact with her then).... And then be a good listener. Let him get comfortable talking about her with you - starting with the good stuff - and over time he may trust you enough to share the scary, painful stuff. But you'll have to resist the temptation to try to jumpstart the process and go straight to "why don't you...", "How could you...", "Why haven't you..." or anything like that; once he starts to let you in he may feel that as a betrayal. It may take a while, but you may find that this approach will let him relax a little around the subject - he may welcome the opportunity to talk about it in a safe context. And if and when he is ready, he may share the more difficult stuff with you, but realize he may resist if you try to pry it out of him. And until you know for sure the whole landscape of the situation, you can't really judge for sure whether he believes he has done the "right" thing, or what the deal is. And I'll reiterate that I'm only suggesting walking on eggs because I believe that deep down, this may actually be a very painful subject for him, and he may have a great deal of defense built up around it. I mean, can you imagine? Good luck - I'm interested to hear how it turns out, but get settled in for a gradual, gentle process and let it unfold...
Author DesperatelyUnsure Posted July 19, 2006 Author Posted July 19, 2006 I appreicate your responses!! You both bring very valid points to the table. I have listened and tried to talk to him in regards to his daughter. I try to bring it up in a sensitive way trying not to sould judgemental however it may appear difficult at times and I tend to get less tollerant Because like you Trimmer there is nothing or anyone person/persons who would keep me from my children no matter what! There relationship before the final blow up with the mother, he saw his daughter on a regular basis but it was a constant battle at every exchange of the daughter between the mother. Apparently she was always starting something. Then he made decision to stop visitation after the last episode with the mother getting physical with his at the time wife due to the fact that he didn't feel his daughter needed to be envolved and witness that type of behavior nor was it fair to himself or the wife to continue the constant turmoil. When I ask questions about the daughter, what there relationship was like and the situation it's clear to me that he's still very emotionally attached to his daughter and there is guilt, anguish and a deep hurt there from their lack of relationship. My inital response to that is " Your children are only young once, and rather then allowing this woman to reuin your chances of a relationship with your daughter and miss her growing up, he is the only one who can change the situation". Now I realize this approach is brutal but i'm also the type of person who can't stand to hear people wine about issues and do nothing. Do something about it if you can and if your willing to sit back and do nothing then you have no one to blame but yourself is my approach. From my end of the spectrum. I love this man and am contimplating a furture with him. He has a child out there who is a part of him and I want to know her, love her and accept her. I also feel that with the information i've been foretold about her mother I fear that this child very well isn't being taken care of the best possible way. I also see how this man is with my children and see what a wonderful father figure he is and I feel she is missing out of all that he has to offer. I have asked him how the mother is with the daughter and he said she would never hurt her directly. The mother seems to be so consumed with making his life miserable that's where her drive is. I also find her behavior odd since she was the one who ended there relationship. She cheated and moved out. So i'm confused as to why she has all this animosity. If the tables had been turned I could understand where all her anger stems from. the bottom line is this with both of them...It's not about the both of them its about there daughter and whats best for her. I told him as parents they both need to realize that. I'm trying to put thoughts down and it's difficult to write everything without writing a novel...
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