First Post: God am I glad I found L.S....I need some insight!!!

June 28, 2006

Okay, so I have been browsing through fourms here for awhile, but just now set up an account. I have read through many posts that are similar to my own delimma, but I would like to post my own, since every situation is different (or is it?).

Right, so I am posting this under the OW fourm, even though I am not "technically" an OW as of yet. However, I don't know where this situation is headed, and I needed some insight from people who have been in similar situations. SO, I would like advice from OW, OM, MW, and MM (or people who are considering becoming one of the mentioned) ONLY. I have read some "advice" that is clearly hurtful, and certainly not HELPFUL lately, so if you are not in, or haven't been in a similar situation, don't bother (I don't mean to cut any openminded people out of the discussion, but I don't want people on a community fourm that is supposed to be helpful to just insult me, etc.

Okay, so here is the situation: there is a married man (with two nearly grown children) whom I work with, and whom I have befriended. He is quite a bit older than me, and is always saying he could be my father (which, in all honesty, he could be, but that doesn't matter to me). We have been friends for a while. I don't work directly with him, but he comes in occasionally. Here recently we have become closer. I eat lunch with him, we talk about our days, he calls me, I occasionally call him, etc. Here recently he has brought it to my attention that he would like for me to kiss him. So today we nearly did, but neither of us could bring ourselves to do it. Anyway, so I have heard stories about him and the other office girls (speaking of which, they don't really care for me at the moment because he comes over to talk to me, and not them anymore); one girl quit because (supposedly) she wanted to sleep with him, and he refused. Also, he is still really good friends with someone else who use to work there (whom I have never met). Thus far, he has (to my knowledge) been really honest with me. If I tell him he is doing something I don't like (leaving for business when we are supposed to have lunch), he says, "Well, I don't see what say you have in the matter," or something to that degree (of course, I'll call him out on being a jackass, and he will admit it, but bring up the "I'm older than you, so I have more say" card). So, he certainly doesn't try to "sugar-coat" things. Anyway, I have asked him about this girl whom he use to work with, and whom he is friends with, and he has been honest about everything (to my knowledge). However, I haven't asked him if he ever had a relationship with her...honestly, I don't think I want to know.

So, I guess I just don't know what to do. I can see where this relationship is going, which is why I am posting in the OW fourm. However, I don't want to have an affair with a married man! Especially one who has been married for so long, with children (much older, but still). I mean, he seems so genuine, but so do all conartists, right? I really trust him, and love him as a friend; I think he would die for his friends. But I don't trust him as a significant other. I am pretty sure he has cheated on his wife before (I am not so nieve that I believe I am the first pretty girl that he has seduced in 20-some years of marriage). However, I can't help but like him. We are friends...and honestly, though rationally speaking I don't want to have a relationship with him, on an emotional, more animalistic level, I do. I really really really do. He loves women so much; it is funny. He is always going on about pretty girls (actors, real women, etc.). So, I KNOW where I stand with him on THAT level. Anyway, I do like him as a friend, and wouldn't mind benifits maybe...I don't know. This is the part where I need some advice: What the hell do I do? Kiss him (we know where that will lead)? Just talk to him? Cut him off? Where do these relationships usually end up? HELP!

June 28, 2006

on an emotional, more animalistic level, I do. I really really really do.

Understand that biological 'animalistic' bit of you will be every bit as happy with some other guy who's not married. That's the part of you that only wants you to procreate. So move on, find another guy who gets you going who's not married, and indulge yourself all you want - happily and without a nasty outcome looming over you.

June 28, 2006

The reason everything feels right, is because he is working hard to make everything feel right. This isn't two innocents meeting and falling in love, this is an experience older man running a very sophistocated game on you.

Unless he is Bill Gates, the next time he starts giving you the "I want to kiss" game, give him the cold shoulder. When he asks you how you you could be so mean, tell him you are pretending that you are his wife. And no, you aren't going to like the mad/sad look he gives you then, but do it anyway.

He is just like a cute little puppy that you just have to pet and take home with you. After keeping him around for a days, you'll realize he had rabies when you wake up one morning and he is growling at you with saliva running down his chin.

June 28, 2006

And if he is Bill Gates, don't give him jack until he gets you a house, a car, something.

June 28, 2006

Hello Sadistic Life.

I'm an exOW. I'll tell you what I think.

Firstly, getting involved in an A is always difficult... no matter on what level you try to see it, try to rationalise it, try to prevent yourself getting hurt... even if the MM concerned is the nicest, kindest, most understanding man in the world, whose M is in tatters and is about to leave, even if he loves you with all his being and hates what this is doing to you... you WILL STILL go through the most gut-wrenching, horrible, traumatic, soul-destroying period of your life, and walk away battered. EVEN if you're the strongest woman that ever walked the planet, I do believe that EVEN if he leaves, and it all works out, there will be scars for both of you.

Secondly, this MM you're describing... you've already listed a dozen red flags, several dislikeable thigs about him (I don't need to point out which ones!) and you already know that he's not worth a second look. Not really. Not when you get past all the flirty, fun things... all those smouldering looks, and his being patient and taking things slowly and not quite kissing you. He's got a reputation. He already has messed around with other women... that's obvious. He knows how to work it... he 'loves women'... yeah, spends a lot of time studying their reactions so he knows the 'right thing to say'. Just thinking about him is making my flesh crawl, and I'm not exaggerating.

Thirdly, you work with him. Take a look at the stories of some of the OW on here who had an affair at work. Try to imagine going NC with him when it's all over. READ about how hard that is. And it will end. And his attitude will be disgusting... he won't respect you, just as he already doesn't respect you. You're right, he IS a jackass. And when the affair ends he will behave like a jackass.

And you will wish you'd never set eyes on him.

Do yourself a favour and tell him you're not interested.

June 28, 2006

However, I don't want to have an affair with a married man! Especially one who has been married for so long, with children (much older, but still).

What the hell do I do? Kiss him (we know where that will lead)? Just talk to him? Cut him off? Where do these relationships usually end up? HELP!

SL,

I, an exOW, agree with Sami above and only have this to add;

If you don't want to have an A with a MM, then DON'T!

What do you do? RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!!!!

June 28, 2006

The reason everything feels right, is because he is working hard to make everything feel right. This isn't two innocents meeting and falling in love, this is an experience older man running a very sophistocated game on you

You hit the nail on the head. Magister is Soooo right, its a game. Game of seduction he has mastered. Like you said, this is not the first time he has seduced a young women. And from the sounds of it, your going to be another notch on his list at the office. Do you want to be one of those bitter girls that are hateing on you when the next young, cute conquest starts working there and your watch from the sidelines? You are feeling everything he wants you to feel, this is planned and he is watching you fall into his trap. Recongnize the game, becareful, and good luck.

June 28, 2006

SO, I would like advice from OW, OM, MW, and MM (or people who are considering becoming one of the mentioned) ONLY. I have read some "advice" that is clearly hurtful, and certainly not HELPFUL lately, so if you are not in, or haven't been in a similar situation, don't bother (I don't mean to cut any openminded people out of the discussion, but I don't want people on a community fourm that is supposed to be helpful to just insult me, etc.

you can't request specific posters to be the only posters. that being said, it sounds like this guy is a manipulative creep and you know it. the only one who can stop it is you. i hope you have some real life support to get through this ordeal, because though it won't be easy, it has to be done for your own self-respect and sanity. good luck and welcome to loveshack!

June 28, 2006

This man is manipulative and arrogant. He doesn't "need" you. He wants you to be his plaything for his own ego.

He makes my skin crawl as well. For all of the above reason and the ones to follow, just don't "allow" him to do this to you.

June 28, 2006

You hit the nail on the head. Magister is Soooo right, its a game. Game of seduction he has mastered. Like you said, this is not the first time he has seduced a young women. And from the sounds of it, your going to be another notch on his list at the office. Do you want to be one of those bitter girls that are hateing on you when the next young, cute conquest starts working there and your watch from the sidelines? You are feeling everything he wants you to feel, this is planned and he is watching you fall into his trap. Recongnize the game, becareful, and good luck.

This is absolutely correct!!! Nothing would ever come from this except the joy this man would get from conquering yet another young office worker. He will after that, drop you for the next new woman who comes along and you will feel used. I know you think you want "benefits" from this guy but trust me (from the way you already sound) you will fall in love with him and he will and would never leave his wife and family. Meanwhile, you'll be sitting at work watching him run the same old tired game on another new woman. Leave him alone now to avoid having a reputation at work, maybe losing your job or having to find another one, and most certainly heartbreak and embarassment in the end. Yes you are naive, but we all are at some point. Lucky you found LS to set you straight. Good Luck!

June 29, 2006

This is a no good situation. As much as I hate admitting this...I am STILL an OW. I tried to end it.....6 months without seeing him...now 3 times in just over a week. I wonder how much more I can take....I already feel like I am going insane. Literally losing my mind.

Stop now while you have a chance. My A started out as just sex....I am a Flight Attendant, he's a Pilot..we were on a layover. It was just the alcohol paired with the free hotel room and a little chemistry. It was soooo incredible we decided we'd do it again..and again...and again. Until oneday we didn't have sex. We just hung out then went to bed. We slept together. Then one day he poured his heart out to me. And I did it in return. So you cannot say that it will be just for the sex. At least I couldn't.

Please just save yourself. Continue the good working relationship. And leave it there.

June 29, 2006

He is just like a cute little puppy that you just have to pet and take home with you. After keeping him around for a days, you'll realize he had rabies when you wake up one morning and he is growling at you with saliva running down his chin.

Hahahaha, that is funny. I have the best visuals...

June 29, 2006

Thank you all for your replies. I asked him today whether or not he has had an affair, and his response was, "Not yet." He told me he has nearly had an affair three times (in twenty-five years), but couldn't go through with it because he kept thinking of his children, and he was affraid of getting caught. So, he has been honest thus far, why shouldn't I believe him now, right?

I don't know. I am not thinking clearly. I don't know what I want, so until I do, I am going to just stay friends with him.

June 29, 2006

Thank you all for your replies. I asked him today whether or not he has had an affair, and his response was, "Not yet." He told me he has nearly had an affair three times (in twenty-five years), but couldn't go through with it because he kept thinking of his children, and he was affraid of getting caught. So, he has been honest thus far, why shouldn't I believe him now, right?

I don't know. I am not thinking clearly. I don't know what I want, so until I do, I am going to just stay friends with him.

Ok, first...don't think. Second, really, don't think. Thirdly...did I mention, don't think?

Nearly my Arse! And he's probably been caught.

IMHO, you really don't want this. It's the worst tortment you can ever put yourself thought. Don't act sadistically...it's really not worth it.

June 29, 2006

Thank you all for your replies. I asked him today whether or not he has had an affair, and his response was, "Not yet." He told me he has nearly had an affair three times (in twenty-five years), but couldn't go through with it because he kept thinking of his children, and he was affraid of getting caught. So, he has been honest thus far, why shouldn't I believe him now, right?

I don't know. I am not thinking clearly. I don't know what I want, so until I do, I am going to just stay friends with him.

You're dan straight you aren't thinking clearly.

This is not a 15 year old schoolgirl's husband your messing around with here. This is a mature woman. She has raised two children. She knows what it is like to feel that drug called Power pumping through her veins. She is not going to turn into some whiney; Oprah, let me tell you my story; lifetime-movie emotional basket case. Oh, she may at first, but it is going to wear off real fast.

I can see it as if it is happening right in front of my eyes. She is going to be sitting there in her rocking chair with the tears streaming down her face and then that 23rd psalm is going to jump into her mind. "Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over." As the psalm comes to its conclusion, she is going to dry her eyes, get up, and...

And, well I don't know what she is going to do then, but for your sake, I hope she don't include you in it. You don't know this woman. You don't know what her breaking point is. Me personally, I wouldn't want to find out.

I'm just saying. There is a price to be paid for tasting the forbidden fruit. And, while you are concentrating on the payoff, it might be better instead to consider the payback. Because it could be a b***h. You never know.

June 29, 2006

You're dan straight you aren't thinking clearly.

This is not a 15 year old schoolgirl's husband your messing around with here. This is a mature woman. She has raised two children. She knows what it is like to feel that drug called Power pumping through her veins. She is not going to turn into some whiney; Oprah, let me tell you my story; lifetime-movie emotional basket case. Oh, she may at first, but it is going to wear off real fast.

I can see it as if it is happening right in front of my eyes. She is going to be sitting there in her rocking chair with the tears streaming down her face and then that 23rd psalm is going to jump into her mind. "Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over." As the psalm comes to its conclusion, she is going to dry her eyes, get up, and...

And, well I don't know what she is going to do then, but for your sake, I hope she don't include you in it. You don't know this woman. You don't know what her breaking point is. Me personally, I wouldn't want to find out.

I'm just saying. There is a price to be paid for tasting the forbidden fruit. And, while you are concentrating on the payoff, it might be better instead to consider the payback. Because it could be a b***h. You never know.

Ahhhhhrrrrrggggggghhhhhh!

The W! Oh that is a major turn off!

Think what she'll put him through (and how he'll 'take' it for the sake of the marriage) Now isn't that attractive?

Tell the creep off.

Sami noted the large number of 'red flags'. They're there, and they warn you that there's trouble ahead.

June 29, 2006

You're dan straight you aren't thinking clearly.

This is not a 15 year old schoolgirl's husband your messing around with here. This is a mature woman. She has raised two children. She knows what it is like to feel that drug called Power pumping through her veins. She is not going to turn into some whiney; Oprah, let me tell you my story; lifetime-movie emotional basket case. Oh, she may at first, but it is going to wear off real fast.

I can see it as if it is happening right in front of my eyes. She is going to be sitting there in her rocking chair with the tears streaming down her face and then that 23rd psalm is going to jump into her mind. "Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over." As the psalm comes to its conclusion, she is going to dry her eyes, get up, and...

And, well I don't know what she is going to do then, but for your sake, I hope she don't include you in it. You don't know this woman. You don't know what her breaking point is. Me personally, I wouldn't want to find out.

I'm just saying. There is a price to be paid for tasting the forbidden fruit. And, while you are concentrating on the payoff, it might be better instead to consider the payback. Because it could be a b***h. You never know.

Hahaha, yeah. The two friends (neither of whom have met him, and live out of state) whom I have told the situation to have both warned about the wife. I know that if I were a wife and really loved my husband (which presumably I would), I would go psycho.

Yes, I know about the "price to be paid" for our actions, but it is so hard to say "NO." I swear, it is like I am back in high school with my friends who all tried to get my to smoke with them, though it was easier to say "no" to that, due to my dad being a smoker and seeing what it did to him. I don't personally know anyone who has been in this situation (or, if I do, they never spoke to me about it).

It's just so hard to not trust him, because we both have told eachother things that are so personal; we are really good friends. He is one of the only friends that I have here--I just moved to this area a few months ago, and because I work all the time (over 60 hours a week--he too works around 60 hours a week), I only really know the people who I work with. I have three people there who I consider "friends" here, and he is one of them. There are no single guys who work there, and very few girls, and the girls who do work there don't really care for me; I have always gotten along better with guys than girls anyway. However, with the other two guys, it is truly plutonic. Hahaha, though, I thought my friendship with this guy was "plutonic" as well, and I am not sure how it progressed into this:p.

June 29, 2006

Hey, have you read my thread? I am in the exact same situation; though you have gotten quite a few more helpful replies than I did. I dropped the guy I was considering, because I found out he was a lying ass . However, yours might not be (though I am of the opinion that most people in general are lying cheats). So, I say do what you want to do, because guess what? You only live once, and you may regret not kissing him for the rest of your life. I mean, kiss him, see what happens, and take it from there. You always have the power to stop when you want to. So, good luck, and I hope you have a fun time together .

June 29, 2006

Hey' date=' have you read my thread? I am in the exact same situation; though you have gotten quite a few more helpful replies than I did. I dropped the guy I was considering, because I found out he was a lying ass . However, yours might not be (though I am of the opinion that most people in general are lying cheats). So, I say do what you want to do, because guess what? You only live once, and you may regret not kissing him for the rest of your life. I mean, kiss him, see what happens, and take it from there. You always have the power to stop when you want to. So, good luck, and I hope you have a fun time together .[/quote']

Hey S'n'R! Actually, it was your post that inspired me to post mine; I am sorry to hear that things didn't go how you expected with your MM, but it is probably for the best if he is a lying cheat. I just don't know. I mean, I am not so irrational as to believe that my situation is any different from the hundreds of other MM/OW situations. I swear, sometimes I feel so young and inexperienced. I read that you are 21, well I am only 22, and I too have been very sheltered, up until I moved here (a new state) on my own this year, which has been scary, but an experience, never-the-less.

How is it working with your MM now that you know who he is? How did you find out he is a lier? You didn't post this info on your thread.

June 29, 2006

SL, having been involved with my xMM with whom I work closely with, I can say honestly, just run for it.

First off, the rumours... if he's given an impression that he's a player, then he probably is.

Secondly, if he's almost had 3 affairs, then what makes you think that he wouldn't do the same to you if you have a relationsip with him. Tell him that if he's almost had 3 affairs then he should be evaluating his marriage and why he remains married.

Thirdly, his response to you about 'you have no say in the matter' if you are lunching together and he gets called off on business is in no way appropriate to treat even an acquaintance, so why would you even tolerate this from someone who says is trying to gain intimacy with you.

I only have one thing to say... tell him to back off. If he doesn't, then take him to HR for harassment.

June 29, 2006

You only live once' date=' and you may regret not kissing him for the rest of your life. I mean, kiss him, see what happens, and take it from there. You always have the power to stop when you want to. So, good luck, and I hope you have a fun time together .[/quote']
SL, the only thing I agree with the above poster, is yes, you only live once and you can't undo what is done. If you kiss him and it leads to a road of pain, then you will definitely regret kissing him. But if you don't, then no big deal find someone else who is free to love you. Maybe you do live a sheltered life at 22, having heard all the rumours and being treated poorly you would still consider this man as worthy of your time? Spend some time growing up.

I've made my share of mistakes and in the last year, I've grown up a lot myself. I'm only 33.

June 29, 2006

Your description of him sounds slimey. I'm sure he comes across as the 'nice guy' and is fun to talk to and have lunch with. But you just mentioned how you are only 22 and moved to a new city where you have no friends. He is taking advantage of you big time and the fact that the other girls know it and you don't see it is so sad.

You are too naive and the others know what he is all about and the more time you spend with him, the more pathetic you are going to look to everyone else in the office, as the sucker who fell for his advances. I have a feeling he's made a move on every girl in that office and you are the only one responding and he is putting all his moves on you seeing that you are eating it all up, knowing how hungry you are for attention and affection.

I think that if he were to take a lie detector test and was asked if he has had an affair before and answered no, it would show that he was lying. And if he hasn't it is only because all his victims were strong enough to say no. Don't be the first to be the homewrecker. He's tried at least 3 times before and nobody bit his bait. But I understand how badly you want to be with him so just keep your eyes open and I hope you don't get hurt.

June 29, 2006

Your description of him sounds slimey. I'm sure he comes across as the 'nice guy' and is fun to talk to and have lunch with. But you just mentioned how you are only 22 and moved to a new city where you have no friends. He is taking advantage of you big time and the fact that the other girls know it and you don't see it is so sad.

You are too naive and the others know what he is all about and the more time you spend with him, the more pathetic you are going to look to everyone else in the office, as the sucker who fell for his advances. I have a feeling he's made a move on every girl in that office and you are the only one responding and he is putting all his moves on you seeing that you are eating it all up, knowing how hungry you are for attention and affection.

I think that if he were to take a lie detector test and was asked if he has had an affair before and answered no, it would show that he was lying. And if he hasn't it is only because all his victims were strong enough to say no. Don't be the first to be the homewrecker. He's tried at least 3 times before and nobody bit his bait. But I understand how badly you want to be with him so just keep your eyes open and I hope you don't get hurt.

Though I don't know about the affairs, I do know that the women don't feel sorry for me; they hate me because he use to go talk to them, now he spends his free time talking with me. I have over heard them talking about it, "(we'll call him Bob) use to come visit us. Now he is always with 'blondie (that's their grand little nickname for me; one of many);' she is so fake, he'll see who she is, and then he'll come running back to us." Blah, blah, blah. They all hate me because they think I took him away from them; I have over-heard all of the girls talking about him. Once in the office the girls did a "poll" of which man in the company they would sleep with if they had to, and he came in #1 (out of 75). So, I really don't think they feel sorry for me about how he is supposedly playing me; I think they are pissed at me because he is not "playing" them. Oh, another time he asked me to go to lunch with him, and another girl in the office was like, "What the hell Bob? You never would go to luch with me when I asked. And here you'll go with her?" I was right there when she did it; women can be such bitches, I swear.

Again, regarding the supposed affair(s), he could be lying. I really don't know, but so far he hasn't given me a reason not to trust him (he has always been blatenly honest about what he wants, etc.), except that I know he is not honest with his wife (which is of course shadey). However, I wouldn't be surprised if he has had an affair, or many. Frankly, I don't care; there are things I have done that he has asked me about that I haven't told him the complete truth about, so if he has lied to me about it, oh well. The only things I care about are losing a friend and becoming a home-wrecker, both of which I am affraid will happen if this "friendship" goes any further beyond plutonic (who am I kidding, I am sure this is an EA...so I might as well admit that by being the OW who he tells his secrets to, etc. I am helping to wreck his marriage by taking away that intimacy from his wife).

June 29, 2006

Well it looks like you made your mind up.

I can't say I blame you... why listen to a bunch of naysayers on a website, who are essentially just a group of bitter "been-there-done-that" women who simply can't see how wonderful he makes you feel, how honest he's being, how jealous those other women in the office are at the catch I made! Yay me!

This happens all the time on the OW forum... someone comes in asking for 'advice' or 'insight' about the affair they're absolutely sure they don't want to have and yet ohhh he's so dreamy... a number of pages later and she's decided she cannot resist, or she just stops posting...

I don't really think I can remember one case of a putative (is that the word I want) OW who was turned back by anything said here. Maybe someone will correct me on that

I'm not poking a finger at you Sadistic-Life... just pointing out that you're doing just exactly the same as everyone else... It takes a strong person to WALK in the OPPOSITE direction. Which is what you should do, if you want to save yourself a lot of trouble.

Try reading this thread in particular:

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t92242/

It was started by ahotmess, who came here late last year in a similar position to you. It's a great example of what I was trying to get across to you in my first response on this thread. That no matter how 'honest' and upfront a man might be about wanting an affair, and how it's going 'nowhere', etc... YOU will still suffer, eventually. Read it, and ask yourself if you want to be adding to a thread like that in six months.

But then reading your last response I think... perhaps Fate put this MM in your path right now to teach you a few lessons about people, and about yourself. Sometimes it takes a really heavy blow to our psyche to wake us up to life.

Whatever you do, I wish you all the best, and strength to deal with whatever gets thrown your way.

June 29, 2006

SL, SpankinReality made a really accurate point. You may forever regret not kissing this man. I regret giving in to my MM's pressure. The regret of not giving in could never be as terrible as what I feel right now. Some times it is okay to wonder "what if".

If only I could have been strong enough to resist all of the "What ifs" or just been okay with being alone that night in my hotel room.

Hindsight is truly 20/20. If I had never met MM, I would not be able to say that I have truly been in love with someone who in return loves me. And that is the most incredible feeling I have EVER felt. Never have I felt more accepted.

But despite the wonderful time we have together. The laughs, the jokes. We are so pittifully comfortable with eachother. We are truly in love. But I am still not good enough for him to leave.

So yes....I have found true love....but I am simply not good enough for it.

Try letting that one sink in for a while.

And I am not a bitter been there done that kind of girl. I am just completely heartbroken. The me I know is gone.

Just really think about what you may do to yourself. I wish this agony on no one.

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