NEED S REGARDING FIRST BIG FIGHT - is it my fault totally?

[Kate]

Here is the deal. I meet this guy a year ago. He immediately likes me but has a gf. So no dice. Then, a year later, we meet again...he has no gf, and I let him know I am interested. We develop an AMAZING courtship...full of mushy gushy feelings, spending a LOT of time together. In a nutshell, neither of us has had so many emotions, so fast.

 

My background: I am 27, lots of life experience, several relationships.

His background: 24, little life experience, only one serious girlfriend. They broke up a year ago.

 

So, we have been overwhelmed with happiness...I am his ideal girl and he lets me know it. I have never wanted to spend so much time with someone.

 

Then my problem sets in -- I can't seem to communicate with him the way I want.

 

Example 1) He invites me to a party one day. Right before I get there, he sends me a text, "Beware, this is my ex-gfs party, we need to behave." I declined going. I thought it was rediculous. I didn't discuss this matter though, didn't want to stir things up.

 

Example 2) He doesn't know how to act around me AND his old friends from highschool (age thing, he isn't as comfortable with himself yet). We go to the beach, his friends show up, his female friends barely acknoledge me, and he says nothing...so we leave and he is visibly uncomfortable. This made me mad. I again didn't discuss it...but I tried...I told him how I felt and he said nothing in return. It was like he was scared.

 

Example 3) I talk about major issues in my life that are important to me - my past, my family, my friends, etc. And he can't relate to hardly anything. This frustrates me so I write him a long letter about how it is important to me to communicate on a deeper level. He says he wants to do anything to make me happy.

 

Example 4) I still don't feel a deep enough level of communication, so I start getting frustrated. I take it out on him by being bitchy about the fact that he didn't immediately discuss the email I sent. This was MY BAD. He didn't deserve that.

 

Example 5) I find out that the girls at the beach are his best friends...and that one of them was his first sex, and that they have slept together repeatedly since highschool. This bothers me, why wouldn't he have just told me the situation beforehand?

 

Example 6) I find out he helped his first sex move out of her apartment. I have NO problem with this...other than the fact that I had to find out the nature of their relationship from a 3rd party. I fear that maybe she is a fallback for him and I don't trust him as much.

 

Example 7) I ask him about this girl and the nature of their relationship, and he confirms that they used to sleep together on and off. i was surprised, because he made himself appear like this "virginal" guy. I shouldn't have gotten upset, but I did.

 

Example 8) I further find out that he also slept with another one of his girlfriends a few months ago...without a condom. THIS IS MY FAULT -- i get mad because I had a full test and exam before being with him. I stupidly assumed he would have done the same. Again, I KNOW this is my problem. But I tell him that when I brought up my feelings about sex, he had NO comment...as usual for things.

 

Example 9) We start discussing examples 5-9 after dinner...and I get really upset. He sits there while I basically tell him how annoyed I feel because I didn't become aware of the situation by him. I am confused because I thought he was different in some respects.

 

Example 10) My anger starts to overwhelm me as he really isn't explaining himself, he is just sitting there while I express my anger. He has nothing to say. This reminds me of a guy who cheated on me once. I get scared.

 

Example 11) In the middle of me telling him I am disappointed, and him feeling guilty, he tells me more details by trying to be more honest...and of course it only infuriates me. MY BAD -- I leave the situation and just leave him standing outside my apartment.

 

Example 12) My mind is racing and I send him a horrible text message telling him he deserves to be with his "dirty whore friend" and that he is "just like all the rest".

 

So, he did NOT deserve that. But I had all of these confused thoughts racing through my mind. I know I hurt him so badly. Last night he said he was sick all night, all day, that he had fallen in love with me and now he doesn't know if he can ever be with me again. That I broke him, etc.

 

Now, I know how horrible I made him feel...but were my actions so unspeakable that the average person would never talk to me again?

 

I was so upset that I bawled my eyes out in front of him. I never meant to hurt him. I just got so hurt, frustrated, confused and jealous...and confused by lack of communicating. What killed everything though were my words..and how he felt because of me. I expressed anger instead of tried to understand him. He said it made him feel better to see me so upset and angry.

 

At this point, he is telling me that he is too scared to go forwrad because he has never had his heart broken like this in his whole life. He said he will always expect me to overreact now. And, he has a point ... I overreacted a few times last week about communication frustrations, and my lack of understanding and "knowing him". Because he doesn't share many thoughts and emotions with me.

 

I am confused. I am going to see a therapist this week to see what I can do to further work on myself. I don't want to regress as a person and be in denial, and I think that there was a much better way for me to deal with my anger.

 

This guy is the sweetest thing on the planet and I have mutilated his emotions and heart. At this point he said he just needs a lot of time to decide what he wants with me.

 

I understand his hurt and pain and fear.

 

What are your opinions? Please.....

[lostinyouth]

I have a couple of thoughts for you. If he is not willing to communicate with you leave him. If the communication isn't there it isn't worth investing time in... On the other hand, if you really want this to work with him, you need to work on your communication skills. IE find a better way to 'overreact'. He might seem like a very nice guy to you, how much do you really know about him? I seemed like the perfect man to my wife, until I told her the truth about everything I had done that wasn't what you could call admirable. Now I'm going through a divorce because I acted like your b/f is now. Submissive and secretive, I thought I was being the strong and silent type... To answer your question, it doesn't seem to me that it is all your fault. You wanted him to tell you everything and got upset when he didn't. But you also got upset when he did, so what are your expectations of him really?

[whichwayisup]

Well, these are my thoughts...

 

He's too young for you maturity wise. He needs to grow up abit before being with you. He's into FUN FUN and more FUN...Not a grownup relationship. If you like him and think he's worth waiting around for, stick with him.

 

People have pasts, so you have to deal with his. You assumed alot about him (being virginal) and now you find out stuff you didn't know about him.

 

He's a guy so he needs help and some experience when it comes to communication. He probably isn't used to it. As for the uncomfortableness around his friends, that's HIS issue. His own comfort with himself. He cares TOO much what others think...

 

You DO have right to be pissed at him for the ex's party. That was sneaky of him NOT to tell you upfront. Ya don't just let someone know moments before going to a party that it's the ex's place. That was s***ty of him...And what should it matter if you two behaved or not? It's an EX and they broke up a year ago...........Makes me think he still likes her or is intouch with her.

 

I could be wrong here, but I think you're better off with a guy who's abit more mature than this guy.

[Kate]

I have been feeling like I shot the president (wouldn't be such a bad thing). I feel like I ran over his dog and liked it or something.

 

Yes, he is too young. That is the feeling I have gotten from the beginning. He is VERY sweet...we have a WONDERFUL connection, etc. I am VERY attracted to him. But, the intellect and communication isn't there. Hence, he is too young.

 

I said horrible things to him..but I was imagining him not being who I thought he was. I felt like he was a different person to me. He doesn't understand, still, why I was acting that way.

 

I am going to get help regardless for my anger issues -- because I don't like not being able to separate reality from scary thoughts.

 

I can't believe he doesn't see/won't admit that inviting me to the ex's party was s***ty. I know he did it to make her jealous. He said that he didn't think it was a big deal and that he was "respecting me" by telling me whose party it was. No-no...but he doesn't see eye to eye with me on that. That seemed VERY immature to me.

 

The way I see it, he is living in some kind of a la-la land right now. He doesn't know the full scope of living as a mature adult.

 

I have fallen for him big-time though, that is the problem.

 

How do I get him to see my side of it? I have told him numerous times I don't feel there is any communication...he doesn't get it at all.

 

How do I get him to see I am NOT the villan? Also, I was pretty wrong to send a text "u are like all the rest, you deserve to be with your dirty whore friend". no one deserves that, right?

 

The thing that boggles me, though, is that he just stood there while I was confronting him. He didn't know how to respond, or react, or communicate. so, I assumed he was very wrong and sent a bad text to him after closing the door in his face.

 

He has acted like I have ruined his whole world, his thoughts, his dreams, etc. I wrote him a long apologetic and sensitive email expressing my care for him.

 

I suppose that when we talk again ( he said he needs a week alone) that I will have to tell him again that he needs to better communicate...or perhaps at that point I will realize it's time to move on?

 

i would appreciate any more comments or advice....

[Walk]

You're reactions were over the top some, and the only flaw I can find in this is the fact that you weren't willing to begin the conversations when things first started bothering you. You seemed to shove all those feelings down until your assumptions and fear exploded. I've done the same exact thing, and I think most people would admit they've done it in some degree too.

 

Also, I think a great deal of trust was broken by him. Any time we have to find out important information about our partner through a third party, its bound to cause some trust issues. Especially when he's had the opportunity to talk to you prior to that about his sexual past. The only area I could even possibly see where you may have contributed (not saying you did) is if you had unintentionally made him feel he couldn't talk to you about these things.

 

I wanted to say that I think it's really admirable that you're getting some help with what you're going through.

 

Last thought... I don't think there's much that will cause him to understand how you are feeling and thinking right now, except for time and experience on his part. He just doesnt' have the experience to be able to place himself in your shoes. I know when I was younger, even though I tried to understand how someone might feel in a certain situation, I couldn't. I just didn't have the emotional/mental experience to draw off for that.

 

Don't bash yourself too hard for the problems in your relationship. Both of you made errors and wrong decisions. Work on the problems you can, and forgive yourself for the rest. You may have said some harsh words and hurt him, but he can't expect to go through life pretending to be someone he's not. He suffered the consequences of his decisions. If he's in pain, he's half responsible for it. Same way that you already accept responsibility for your actions. But don't beat yourself up for his mistakes simply because he can't take responsibility for them himself.

[Fun2BMe]

I agree with lostinyouth that it isn't all your fault, that he needs to communicate more, and I agree with whichwayisup that you could help him with this. On the other hand, you too need help with your communication skills and like Walk I am glad to hear you are going to get some therapy this week. Whereas he is silent and unresponsive, you repeatedly explode in an angry fit, ending up saying nasty things you later regret that hurt him.

 

I also think that he is starting to have a change of heart towards you. I think he wanted to go to his ex-gf's party AND to go without you. He couldn't ask to go alone, so he invited you, then the last minute drops the bomb knowing you wouldn't want to go if you knew, especially so suddenly where you wouldn't have time to get used to the idea and decide to go.

 

Also, the degree that he is silent and unresponsive, remember you said it reminded you of your ex-bf when he was cheating on you? I think that is a sign. I have experienced that type of behavior too, where they are not as involved with what you are telling them. You feel like they are not as 'there' as before. It is because he doesn't care as much and possibly is having sex with the ex-sex girl he is now suddenly seeing. She pops up at the beach, then he is helping her move, and goes to her party without you, all the while you find out from a 3rd party that they 'used to' have on and off sex and she was his first. Hmmm, small detail for him to not have told you about! And now He's the one mad at YOU? How convenient for him to turn the tables on you. He is a sneaky one.

 

It is as though he is doing the silent sneaky thing. Just like how you thought he was 'virginal" (I'll take that to mean an innocent, good natured, upfront person) only later to find out his past was sketchier than how he presented himself, he could be putting on an act of being all innocent, acting the part of being dumb and silent, all the while KNOWING that it is pushing your buttons and causing YOU to be the bad one, getting all mad and now he has a convenient reason to be the poor guy whose gf is treating him bad and out of the blue lashing out at him. Honey, I'd probably be throwing vases at him on top of yelling. He will get sympahty from the ex he is hanging out with. He will have a reason to feel hurt and not be able to predict when you will lash out as he so conveniently is now telling you. Well guess what, it IS predictable. He has you figured out. He acts dumb and quiet and unresponsive, boom you explode.

 

Use your intuition to FEEL if he does in fact still feel deeply for you, or are you fooling yourself to believe he still does or do you just not know from him acting one way which is deceptive and unloving, yet TELLING you he has never felt so into a girl before blah blah blah. Remember that actions speak louder than words.

[nicki]

I react emotionally like you do: Shoot first. Ask questions later!

 

I also had a boyfriend like yours. Quiet and unresponsive. It drove me to act more like a lunatic so he would show me a response....He sounds passive aggressive, while you sound independent and not afraid of conflict.

 

I agree with everyone else who said he is sneaky. His actions are not trustworthy. Remember, our anger is a signal of something. Whether you put the brakes on an emotional outburst or not, your anger means something....what?

 

Maybe you are getting the message he is too much like your old lying cheating ex. I'm sure you don't want to go through that crap again. Anytime anyone does something that reminds us of past hurt, we are going to have an emotional defense system immediately pop up. Again, a signal.

 

If you choose to stay with this guy, you are going to have to draw some boundaries on behavior. Starting with truthfulness. And you do have a right to get mad if he tells you something that threatens your value system. He has to learn to handle your emotions, as well as his own, I suspect.

 

Long story short, he may be a creep. Watch what he does. I don't like the whole ex girlfriend/friend/sex partner thing. She's gotta be relegated to the background. You are right to be upset about that whole thing.

 

If you both can't talk to each other, you will feel unheard and unloved and will probably leave him anyway.

 

For whatever it's worth, I found a boyfriend who is an excellent communicator, and it I hardly ever blow up anymore because I feel he is responsive....so, as much work as I needed to do on myself, it helped to have someone who can express himself and talk WITH me.

[Kate]

i have BEEN with a creep, so I know the signs. he's the opposite from how this guy dated me. he is just a passive silent one. his last gf is 21 and they met when she was 18. that's much much younger than me.

 

before i started freaking out, he was sending me messages all day in a non-overbearing way. he was calling. everything was perfect. but i just got fed up at lack of communication.

 

the first time i freaked out it was after a few drinks on the phone. i had sent him an email earlier that day about how i need more communication. it was the 3rd itme i brought it up. it was like midnight and i called him and he didn't bring it up right away and i was like...ok why don't you want to talk about this...he seemed put off. but he told me to go over. i went over and he had the email right on his computer screen. that was very mature, in my opinion.

 

the next time i "freaked" (i have never yelled or cussed) we woke up together at his place. we were just laying in bed for an hour and i had things to do. he was half asleep but just so passive...i was sick of the passiveness. we have sex at least 5-7 times a week and it is great. we are both completely monogamous. i live 5 blocks from him. aynway, i stormed out of his apartmetn and told him that i need a little more than laying in bed for hours. i felt stupid. but an older guy would have done things differently.

 

as far as the ex, she already has another bf. they live an hour apart from eachother. it is O-VER. i think he just wanted to make her jealous at the party. but it seemed fishy.

 

as far as the girl he lost his virginity to, she lives an hour away too. she is also not very attractive (shallow i know) i think it was a friendship/fallback thing.

 

i think he was too scared to tell me. but i think the problem is he is too scared to tell me a LOT of things.

 

i question myself the most because 1) i am very afraid to fall in love and trust 2) i don't know that this could be very long-term. 3) i have a history of over-reacting and blowing up. 4) before my freakouts, i never questioned trusting him...seriously, we felt "in love". he couldn't say enough about me to his friends, family, etc.

 

more advice? i have missed 2 days of work over this. that is why i am going for help. i feel desperate.

[Walk]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean when you say "passive". Can you explain/describe what you mean?

(Just trying to get a better understanding of what you are saying.)

[Kate]

when i say how i feel about something..anything...he doesn't state a really strong opinion. he kind of does anything he can to make me happy, but it comes from a place where he is scared of losing me instead of just being himself and SAYING it.

 

i think a lot of his mistake with me has been because he is afraid of saying the wrong thing. i have gotten the impression he is VERY afraid of losing me

 

he also suffers from anxiety and is on meds for that. he sees a therapist.

 

he is the most genuine, sensitive guy i have met in years. i don't think he would ever hurt me. he has always been a little nervous, a little shy with the world.

 

thanks for your help, i am trying to get motivated to go to work so i'm not fired.

 

i wish i had a phone # to call to calm me down -- (THIS IS WHY I NEED THE THERAPY I THINK!!)

[Kate]

so he sent me an email last night saying he needs time, he knows that i don't have bad intentions, that he needs to feel like he can open himself to heartache...bla bla.

 

i responded by telling him politely and diplomatically that we are ALL subject to heartache...and I don't want to be crucified for delivering my message in a hasty and mean way.

 

i then spoke with him today...it was very good, our talks are always very good...i told him he needs to learn that my feelings aren't all about making HIM feel bad. i told him I also need to work on being more sensitive with words/anger. i said i am willing to do anything to work on that.

 

he said he is afraid of losing me because he needs a week to be alone. i told him i fully respect that and won't get in the way of it. i have never not given a guy space when asked. it's simply not fair.

 

i think it's mature of him to say what he needs. he is REALLY thinking about this carefully. i told him we need to learn to communicate better, and he agreed. we see pretty much eye to eye on everything.

 

he said he misses me and that he wants to be able to feel the way we did before this happened. he was extremely sincere. i told him i don't want to feel like the devil for a mistake in the way i was dealing with stuff. i told him he needs to stop taking things sooooooooo personally.

 

also, as far as him being sketchy is concerned -- close to impossible. he is best friends with my sister's fiancee...and my sister has known him for years. he has a very good reputation as a sensitive and true guy. he is just very concerned with making the situation right and he takes things way to personally.

 

i think this is the worst situation i have ever felt in my life becasue i for some reason feel so much for him. i am seeing a therapist to figure out why i waffle from one extreme to the next so much, and why i get angry and don't express it well. i'm definitely not off the wall or anything, but when you want things to work.....you make them work. better than those of us who end up in marriage therapy in 10 years after never working on themselves. i'd like to do the hard stuff now.

 

i'll keep you posted...i was really worried about his age as i said...but it seems to me he's being pretty mature now. if he can learn/change from this and so can i, i will say that it's more than many 35 year olds i know or have dated!

 

what matters most to me is that one is WILLING to look inside themselves. some people as we get older refuse to do so. he said he wants to be a better person and understand things. so do i.

 

thanks and please any more comments are really welcomed....

[scrybe74]

Listen - You had valid reasons for being angry. I've been in a similar relationship....but I was the guy. Again...you had valid reasons for being angry...but a few things to chew on:

 

He IS young.

Like you said...he has few life experiences compared to you so....you have to accept that and be patient. Let him experience life with our without you but he probably feels intimidated. Like he has nothing to bring to the table. It would be much easier for you to date an older man or one with more life experiences but if you really like this guy you need to see him in that context.

 

Don't be the Volcano

Getting frustrated, storing it up, expecting him to know how to deflate the situation. Bad Idea. All you're going to do is build up and explode on him on a regular basis. You're expecting more than he can deliver to you right now. Something to think about.

 

You're just mean.

 

It doesn't sound like he called you names, cussed you out or disrespected you. He had poor (very poor) judgement and was dishonest with you. Not by lying but from witholding important (critical) information. That was just juvenile and (dare I say) stupid! But....BUT....that doesn't give you the right to be downright mean and evil towards him. You ripped his heart out...yanked it through his balls and and shoved it up his @$$. (excuse my french). I and a vast majority of men would agree that any average 24 y/o guy in that situation would turn and run.

 

I personally would simply walk away. Life is too short to be in misery. Life is too short to live in fear of your girlfriend's wrath. Life is too short to put up with that when you can find a girl your own age or younger who demands far less of you.

 

I hope you figure things out and I hope you find happiness - with him or someone else....but happiness.

[scrybe74]

I suppose that when we talk again ( he said he needs a week alone) that I will have to tell him again that he needs to better communicate...or perhaps at that point I will realize it's time to move on?

 

i would appreciate any more comments or advice....

 

In addition....I'd like to point out something else. You seem just a tad bit controlling. Not a whole lot....but more than you need to be. You're going to TELL him that he needs to communicate better? Maybe that's the best he can do. Maybe you need to realize that YOU need more communication from someone. Trying to change his behavior to match your expectation won't work. At best he'll change for you in the short term but he'll resent you and begin to hide things and lie. Why? Because he's doing things for you and not for himself. It's hard to accept but you may need to deal with the fact that his true colors are showing and you can't 'fix' him. You need someone at your level. Unless you are willing to go without - let him go. If he wants a real woman then he'll grow up real fast and come looking for you. In the meantime...keep working on your anger. You seem smart and aware enough to realize what you need to do around it.

[Guest]

It's basically your fault.

[nordanvind]

I think that the problem here is that you're giving your bf double messages. First he's not sharing important information with you and you get upset at him for that. Then when he is trying to open up you get upset at him for being open. He just doesn't feel safe enough to open up to you. Perhaps this could have been a part of why he didn't mention anything about his sexual past in the first place? He figured that you'd overreact, and you proved him correct.

 

I've been in the exact same situation your boyfriend has. I've always had a difficult time opening up, but when I did my girlfriend would get absolutely furious of what I was telling her. It made me think that the most idiotic thing that I did was to open up because all it gave me was more and more screaming. I don't know how you react when you get angry, but when my gf got angry all I could do was also to just sit silent and not say anything while she was screaming her lungs out. The reason for this was that anything that I said would be misinterpreted, used against me and be distorted. If you reacted anything similarly to this I can absolutely understand that your boyfriend feels that he's not sure whether he can be with you anymore or not.

 

I really do hope that he'll go back to you though. I think that in order for things to work then is to obviously demand for openness from his side, but what you have to do then is to be creating a safe environment for him to open up in. This means listen and try to control your emotions if you hear something that you don't like. Then ask about the things you don't like in a calm manner and trust what he says. I can assure you that he'll definitely open up more if he feels that he can say what's on his mind without getting punished for it. Hope it works out for you two and best luck.

[Kate]

yes. i am interested in becoming a better person, period -- with out without him. i realize that my behavior was cruel, and i truly hurt his heart. i reitereated many times in 2 emails after the event how i felt...and i am a decent writer when i need to express my regret.

 

yesterday we both came to terms about what we need from eachother and what we need to do to get it.

 

i need to focus less on what he needs to do and more on what i need to do -- first. even if he is slower to catch up...at least he is trying.

 

yesterday i went to a therapist who specializes in anger junk. it was VERY helpful and i'm going once a week from now on. it is not healthy for me to be like this. i don't want to be like this. my mom was/is like this and she is alone forever as a result. i'm far from her, but i still have some of the same qualities.

 

i hope despeartely i can get to the root of what is really bothering me..insecurity, fear, etc. he would never have treated me the way i treated him the other night.

 

i need to also be careful about how i act for the next couple of months..he is going to be less open now as a result and i need to be patient with that.

 

knowing what i need to do and doing them are 2 different things...i hope i have the strength to sloooowwww down and ask questions. i need to make him feel safe again.

 

yesterday he sent me 2 text messages saying he misses me but still needs his time...and another saying that he was reaching over for me in the middle of the night and couldn't go back to sleep. i'm giving him all the space he needs. if he doesn't want to be with me, well, then i deserve to learn a lesson and he deserves to feel free of my wrath. but he said he's going to give it another chance.

 

i have older guy frineds in their 30's who seems to put up with waaaaaaaay worse...but still that's no excuse...but i think my guy is just really young so things will affect him more. he has only had 1 serious girlfriend, ever.

 

thank you for all of your comments...i will probably need to write here from time to time when i get irrational thoughts about how to deal with something.

 

also, i had 2 glasses of wine when i exploded (I DID NOT YELL AT ALL) with cutting words. i should avoid alcohol for a while perhaps or if i have something on my mind avoid it altogether perhaps. just something to think about.

 

thanks...more comments are please welcome as i am still asessing the situation.

[nicki]

I learned to say how mad, confused, hurt I was instead of calling the other person names or blaming them for how I felt.....(Hey, I'm a feisty girl so I'm not always good at following that, but at least I catch myself better now.)

 

I also learned to ask for clarification. Instead of reacting to something that he says, try calmly asking him a follow-up question to make sure you understand what he said. You can paraphrase whatever he just said, and say, "Now, did I hear you right? Is that what you meant?"

 

Then, after hearing him, you can share how you feel. It's a two way street. Keep your list short. Tell him when you are upset about a few things so you don't have long fights about 100 things.

 

It sounds like he is trying. That's a good sign. Keep being honest with him and you will build something real.

[Kate]

things have gone extremely well...all uphill.

 

he is an amazing person. despite life experience, i don't believe this guy is lacking in character whatsoever.

 

i was honest with him about my feelings/faults and i have learned that i need to accept the situation for how it is, not how i would like it to be. this guy has treated me better than anyone just yet...and i have amazing feelings for him. i get butterflies EVERY TIME i see him. this is a first.

 

i need to learn to become a better person and that is separate from any relationship. i am seeing a therapist to see about anger management, etc. i am a big fan of self-improvement so when i see my ugly self in a mirror like i did last week i'll do anything to fix it or work hard on fixing it.

 

i am thankful he gave me another chance and opened his heart.

 

no matter what comes out of this, i am fully confident he is doing his best...and i know i am, too.

 

thanks for the help/comments.