Pink Amulet Posted June 23, 2006 Posted June 23, 2006 *shivers at the thought* I wonder if a "plumbers crack" holds resonance in the northen hemisphere...
fatty Posted June 24, 2006 Posted June 24, 2006 Hey RealBroken, I feel exactly what you have gone through. Alot of my freinds tell me that I have really female type emotions, as in i am sensitive, emotions etc.. in my relationship with my ex, I was a complete doormat and did everything she asked me to jsut so she could be happy. I realize now, that this was due to my lack of self confidence and my insecurities. But you are right about one thing, sometimes a man needs someone to lean on for extra support and not just get a cold hug. I thought women were the caring and nurturing type?? I am now intune with my feelings and getting closer to the "gentlemen type". I am finally growing a backbone. I wish this threa was here last year. I have soo much insight now on why I was a doormat and why she treated me the way she did. But here is the thing, When i did start to stand up for myself she became even more of a bitch and alll she ever said to me was "If you love me then you would it" the word "it" meaning anything that is in context. thats one thing I still dont understand, why was she even more bitchy to me when I stood up for myself? This thread has saved me. hehe thnx Pinkamulet your post is inspiring. I am printing that one paragraph out. great insight.
Pink Amulet Posted June 24, 2006 Posted June 24, 2006 Great to know I can be of some help. Good luck to you.
Author RealBroken Posted June 24, 2006 Author Posted June 24, 2006 Yeah you have been some help Pink amulet.and thanks for that. Im just so gutted this is the way women think. Maybe i'l become gay.
Teacher's Pet Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 Hey... I'm a guy who was just dumped 6 days ago. Yes, I'm one of the "nice guys". All my friends (especially the female ones) tell me she dumped me because I wasn't a challenge to her anymore.... I just don't get it... I treated her like a PRINCESS..... I was always there when she needed me.....supported her through some tough times...always listened.....just always wanted to be there for her..... Then in one brief moment...POOF.... She's seeing someone else. I feel like utter garbage. EVERYONE is telling me she's not the one for me....... and I guess deep down I know it's true... But I LOVE her, I can't help it. I love her, and I want her back, and the thought of her with another man is KILLING me inside. I haven't slept all week, I haven't been able to function at work, I'm sick to my stomach over this, and it's just not going away....... I am so sick of being The Nice Guy, all we do is get stepped on! :(
riobikini Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 re: gtfo: "There's a third kind of guy that no one is talking about: the "gentleman." He's not a jerk, but he's not a "nice guy" either. He gives his gf respect, romance and affection, but he tells her "no" from time to time and doesn't take crap from her or anyone else. The problem with a "nice guy" is that he NEVER puts his foot down or says "no" under any circumstances. The "nice guy" is too happy to be with his girlfriend, so he'll take any crap she throws at him. Thus, she has no respect for him, and he gets dumped. Gentlemen finish first. Jerks come in second. Nice guys finish dead last." (Smile) Salute! to all the *gentlemen*! I was married to one of these -my second husband. There are far too few of them left in the world. -Rio
Outcast Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 Why oh why do people assume that when someone leaves, it's the person left who is at fault and needs to change? Maybe the dumper has issues. Maybe there's commitment problems. Maybe they have terrible taste. If you treat people with consideration, kindness, and respect (without letting your entire personality be taken over by them), and don't get that in return, then you have suffered no loss and absolutely do not need to change. All you need to do is learn to find better people.
alphamale Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 If you treat people with consideration, kindness, and respect (without letting your entire personality be taken over by them), and don't get that in return, then you have suffered no loss and absolutely do not need to change. All you need to do is learn to find better people. ahh...but what if someone has very low self-esteem and sub-conciously does not think they deserve someone better? whats your answer to that OUTCAST? and don't give me some lame answer like therapy.
Outcast Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 ahh...but what if someone has very low self-esteem and sub-conciously does not think they deserve someone better? whats your answer to that OUTCAST? and don't give me some lame answer like therapy. What, Alpha, is 'lame' about therapy? If someone with low self-esteem has been unable to help himself, then it's time to enlist the aid of a professional. If your brakes are shot and you've run out of options, you don't keep driving with faulty brakes - you go to a specialist. Same with your psyche - you can't possibly know all the things which may have caused the poor self-esteem or the best remedies for it so enlist the aid of someone who can point the way. Or limp through life on faulty brakes but that is such a pointless waste of a good human...
jerbear Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 Nice guys, jerks, gentlemen, all change to adapt to the market. Some nice guys figure it out, jerks figure it out and even gentle figure it out. It depends on the purpose and reasons. Some people are out get a conquest. I remember doing that to get a ONS, a woman's number at a bar. The point was I got it done. There are just some women who I could be a jerk to and there are some where I could not control myself and be a nice guy. Sometimes I even forget my own name let alone control myself. The wife materials I tend to be a nice guy while others I am indifferent; which is bad. So my point is that a guy has to adapt to the market and even be a jerk sometimes, say no and not put up with s***. Last few weeks I ended so called friendships because I wised up on respect or lack of it. Gave enough to get my attention but not enough of a balance.
Pink Amulet Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 you can't possibly know all the things which may have caused the poor self-esteem or the best remedies for it so enlist the aid of someone who can point the way. How can someone who knows us for five minutes know better than us? I don't hear from anyone what I don't already know. I have seen professionals. They were good, I suppose, I just don't like having someone tell me things I already know. However, this is just my opinion of therapy.
jerbear Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 Why oh why do people assume that when someone leaves, it's the person left who is at fault and needs to change? Maybe the dumper has issues. Maybe there's commitment problems. Maybe they have terrible taste. If you treat people with consideration, kindness, and respect (without letting your entire personality be taken over by them), and don't get that in return, then you have suffered no loss and absolutely do not need to change. All you need to do is learn to find better people. Maybe they have terrible taste. Sometimes smell not taste... like tuna? Sometimes it takes time before the changes to take hold. I noticed myself and very close friends notice kept on saying I have changed since graduating. I'm nice to certain people and got vicious to some. Sometimes it takes a few hurts before they notice something is "wrong". Hopefully before turning into a woman hating male at 80, action has to be taken. If something is not working then that person will have to do something to correct it. A person will have to be who they are and change comes from within. Learning a new ideal or idea will change someone. Sometimes they wise up to something in their life and notice a few things. In regards to finding better people, some don't want friends but want that one or one for the moment. I don't treat "the one" and friends the same.
reservoirdog1 Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 Hey Real... I'm a classic nice guy who got s*** on massively by XW during my marriage. I spent most of the two and a half years since we split being anything but a nice guy towards her. Frankly, I was cold, emotionless, and often an a**h***. She didn't like that but I didn't care. However, I still think it was the right thing to do in the circumstances. I went far to the other side in regards to her because being so much the "nice guy" got me so comprehensively screwed. From my POV, she needed to be shown the other side of me, the "see what happens when you f*** with me" side. Things have levelled out a lot in the last few months, mostly because I've reached the point of largely being indifferent towards her. That's made it easier, and things now seem to be on a more even keel. All of this has taught me something important. I don't think you want to be a PURE nice guy. Try to be a "nice guy with an edge." Treat your future partner well, absolutely... but don't fawn all over her. Make her a very important component of your life, but not the ONLY important component. Don't give up your friends, your interests, or your hobbies. Try new things, with or without her. Stay as the confident and dynamic guy you were before you met her. Your goal is to ensure that you will have a full and rewarding life, whether she's in it or not. I got married at 24, and I subsumed myself into that marriage. I let it define me. I was young and stupid. And when it ended, my life seemed fairly empty for awhile. Never let your life be defined by a marriage or by one other person. Let it be defined by pursuits you can enjoy whether you're single or not. A partner should compliment your life and fit into it -- not become the sole focus of it.
Outcast Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 How can someone who knows us for five minutes know better than us? They haven't our baggage and our blinders. They can see through the defenses and the denial. They understand the many causes of problems and can pose potential causes to you to explore that you could never think of. They can also pose solutions you never thought to think of. A lot of people are bad at realistic self-appraisal. They're heavily into cognitive dissonance, projection, etc. A good therapist will eventually see through all these things and point them out to the patient. A good therapist can also explain how past experiences affect present actions and reactions - again something that lots of people can't figure out for themselves.
Geoffrey Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 ....that we are usually the LAST ones to realize something is not right within ourselves....I know that is true with me.
Woggle Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 You can still be a nice guy but ket your woman know from the jump you are no doormat and you won't put up with her crap. Kindness is not the same as weakness and more people need to realize that.
Outcast Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 It's sad to assume that women are bound to give one 'krap'. And of course men never give women 'krap', I suppose. Sighhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Woggle Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 It's sad to assume that women are bound to give one 'krap'. And of course men never give women 'krap', I suppose. Sighhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Both genders give crap but men are the ones that need a lesson in growing a backbone. All women don't give crap but a man needs to lay the ground rules at the start of a relationship. I did and she was fine with it. There is an escape clause in my prenup in case she gives me too much crap.
AriaIncognito Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 I am so sick of being The Nice Guy, all we do is get stepped on! :( Here's the thing, Teacher's Pet, the nice guy won't get stepped on, when he finds the right girl. There are so many of us nice girls out there looking for nice guys. Trust me. It sucks, we are in love, we want our exes back, but well, we need to figure out how to move on, because if they wanted us, they wouldn't have left us. (I think i've read too much of 'It's called a breakup because it's broken' today - because I want more than anything to be with my ex too..but i'm also trying to get myself to a realistic place where he's not coming back). Keep posting your feelings. Some of us on LS are nice people and want nothing more than to share our experiences and help others move on, just as we are trying to move on. Jennifer
AriaIncognito Posted June 25, 2006 Posted June 25, 2006 Make her a very important component of your life, but not the ONLY important component. Don't give up your friends, your interests, or your hobbies. Try new things, with or without her. Stay as the confident and dynamic guy you were before you met her. Reservoirdog1 - Why would you view it as not being a nice guy to not give up your friends, interests, etc. I wouldn't think anyone, nice guy or bad guy, should give up other aspects of his life to be with me. In my opinion people need time together and time apart in relationships. Having separate friends/hobbies/etc doesn't make either person less of a nice person. It just makes the relationship more balanced. Jennifer
reservoirdog1 Posted June 26, 2006 Posted June 26, 2006 Reservoirdog1 - Why would you view it as not being a nice guy to not give up your friends, interests, etc. I wouldn't think anyone, nice guy or bad guy, should give up other aspects of his life to be with me. In my opinion people need time together and time apart in relationships. Having separate friends/hobbies/etc doesn't make either person less of a nice person. It just makes the relationship more balanced. I agree with all of that. What seems to happen all to often, however, is that a lot of "nice guys" figure that time with their own pursuits is time taken away from their GF/wife, and they worry that they'll be resented for that. Which isn't the GF/wife's fault -- it's the result of the nice guy's misperceptions. Besides, it's that diverse collection of interests and acquaintances that helped make the nice guy attractive in the first place. This sort of thing seems to go hand in hand with what couples often experience: one (or both) of them decides (not through conscious decision, it just sort of "happens") that they've found their partner, so they don't bother to keep themself looking good, staying fit, etc. They figure the relationship will survive anything. And it doesn't work that way -- attraction can disappear over time. The key, it seems, is to STAY (as much as possible, within the natural effects of aging) the attractive, interesting people we were when we met our significant others, and not let natural erosion take over.
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