ridingthebulls Posted June 2, 2006 Posted June 2, 2006 Isn't funny how it is supposed "human" nature when we (men and/or women) want multiple partners, YET WE (the same men and women who don't want monogomy for THEMSELF) CANNOT TAKE IT when we find out our long-term partner is having relationships on the side with multiple people. Therefore, usually it will NEVER work out to be anything other than monogomous. A man is NOT capable of wanting to share HIS territory/long-term woman with other men... even though he wants to be with other women. So if BOTH PARTIES had equal rights in the matter.. it just would never work. And don't think for a second that a woman who finds out about your whoring ways won't go out and cheat on you or walk out on you. One of the first things that comes to mind when a person is hurt so deeply is either pity for themself or revenge. If you don't want your loved one screwing around, then don't do it. If you can care less, it's probably time to leave the marriage anyways. Either way, your marriage is pretty much done for. You will NEVER be trusted again and I don't care whether it is 1 year or 10 years, eventually your lying and cheating will catch up to you. It's a waste of time anyways. Lust fades, just like it did in your marriage. If you aren't able to keep the romance alive after the "honeymoon stage" (considering a decent relationship already with no abusers and that THERE WAS ACTUAL LOVE + ROMANCE IN THE FIRST PLACE etc) or whatever.. or put in the effort to work on your marriage, chances are most of your relationships will end the same way. Did you marry for ALL the wrong reasons... did you settle for just money, looks etc and superficial characteristics that wouldn't keep you satisfied fully? I see people miserable every day and yes they were desperate and married for ALL the wrong reasons..
TheTallDarkStranger Posted June 2, 2006 Posted June 2, 2006 Oh man, I missed this! And please, don't tell me you would really get plastic breast implants because your MM wants to go back to his wife. *Kinda* superficial, girlfriend. I think you should seriously evaluate your behaviour :laugh: Ok, sorry. Back on topic. Uh, that was basically for you, 64. AND I toned that sh*t waaayyyy down. Don't sweat the obvious loonies - we support you!
Chump64 Posted June 3, 2006 Posted June 3, 2006 Thanks TallDark. Don't worry about me. I am used to internet fahreaks.
Blind Illusion Posted June 3, 2006 Posted June 3, 2006 . As common as infidelity is, you would think more people would be supportive of the BS's who choose to work in the relationship. I think you are incredibly brave and I applaud you for your courage. At the OW/OM Board, someone instituted a thread entitled "What Are you Doing to move on?" (or something to that effect, me being too lazy to check). I like it because it reminds me that I am the person solely responsible for my happiness and I shouldn't let others undermine it so easily. I know I did that with the MM but I do that with my husband as well Example: Surprise Party tonight for a mother at school. Two weeks ago, I tell my husband of this event & his response was, "What the hell did these people ever do for me that I should go to their party?" I wait a few days and tell him I am calling the man to RSVP because he needs a head count. This time Husband is in a mean mood and tells me "he wouldn't take me to a dog show" So I am planning on taking my son and going. Last night, my husband thinks that maybe he would like to come after all. I tell him call at this late point, I'm not. My husband changes his mind yet again and says he'll just stay home like a dog and goes into martyr mode. Poor poor him. This is not a thread about Blind Illusion's husband. But I babble on about it anyhow because in the past, this behavior would detract from the good time. I am trying so hard to learn not to let my good days depend entirely on another person. I am going tonight and will try a new type of food and meet new people and have a new experience. Someone posted about going for a new job and opening up a new chapter in their life recently here. What if you created a similar thread here as a support board about how you are moving on in a new chapter in your lives and in your marriage if that applies too. Maybe you can support and applaud one another as you do.
Chump64 Posted June 3, 2006 Posted June 3, 2006 I was thinking about this topic, re: how common infidelity is. I truly believe it is all around us. It's just not something people talk about. One day, a coworker caught me having a bad moment in my office. She confided to me that she had been in an affair a few years ago that almost ruined her marriage. She also told me about another person who works in our office who is the middle of an affair. I really think it's everywhere.
enoughisenough Posted June 3, 2006 Posted June 3, 2006 Thanks Chump, I'll check it out - - I've been wanting to say to you that I also notice a strange, harsh treatment on these boards for BS's who choose to try to work on the marriage. It's really, really weird. And I find it sad because I'm in love with a BS who has done nothing wrong. The idea that you should try to understand the specific OW who had sex with your H is ludicrous to me (as I read in the Revenge thread). I just don't know what gets in to people's heads. As common as infidelity is, you would think more people would be supportive of the BS's who choose to work in the relationship. I think you are incredibly brave and I applaud you for your courage. Of course you are upset over that type of thinking. Afterall, are you a WS? Don't want your ass kicked to the curb? Fortunately, some of us actually have standards for the amount of crap we allow back into our lives. Why shouldn't your loved one know all about the ow/om when you've been two timing her/him for who knows how long? Still can't be honest with her/him?
enoughisenough Posted June 3, 2006 Posted June 3, 2006 Unless there was just one really bowlegged woman in each town, women have been cheating just as much as men have been forever. What has changed in modern, western society is that more women are admitting to it. In the past and in current islamic socieeties like in pakistan, women get offiicial death sentences for cheating. I don't believe that human nature has changed much in the last 10,000 years. Men have cheated, women have cheated. both genders make excuses. The people who do not cheat have self control when presented with the temptations. I don't agree with that. Most women used to be full-time caregivers. How would they have time to meet anyone when they are taking care of the kids and home 24/7? Not to mention the strict christian beliefs instilled generations ago. A woman took her marriage seriously and didn't have much time to fool around. Men on the other hand were more out of the house and had many chances to meet different women and of course most have a greater sex drive/can't control themselves anyways.
Blind Illusion Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 I don't agree with that. Most women used to be full-time caregivers. How would they have time to meet anyone when they are taking care of the kids and home 24/7? Not to mention the strict christian beliefs instilled generations ago. A woman took her marriage seriously and didn't have much time to fool around. Men on the other hand were more out of the house and had many chances to meet different women and of course most have a greater sex drive/can't control themselves anyways. Who did these men have extracurricular sex with then, if all the women were home with their christian values, raising the kidlets?
michelangelo Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 I'm pretty sure that even in the old days the kids would go off to school for a bit. And the fuller brush man could really show her how to polish things. I don't but it for a minute that women are more faithful then men. DNA studies on the incidence of children born who don't match up to "daddy" bely that fantasy. The milk man and the baker dropping off baked goods or the shoe shine guy could all have had extra services.
Chump64 Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 I think that historically, women have been more faithful than men - mainly b/c they were not in the workplace day in and day out. (I'm not sure "faithful" is the right word -- many probably would have cheated but the opportunities are much more limited at home, you must admit.) I can't find them at the moment, but there are stats showing that the numbers of cheating women have grown considerably since more and more women have joined the workforce.
silktricks Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 Why are you so interested in my "situation" and so eager to fight with everyone? Actually Chump64 hasn't been "eager to fight" with anyone. What she has been is getting sh*t on all the time for choosing to stay in her marriage. That's enough to drive anyone into defense mode. Seeing what she's been taking lately is what got me posting again. She's interested in your "situation" as am I and others, because that's why we do on these boards. We chat about our "situations" and work on them. So, enoughisenough, I repeat Chump's question. What is your situation? Please share it with us.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 Who did these men have extracurricular sex with then, if all the women were home with their christian values, raising the kidlets? What makes you think 100% of women in the world were married? Explain yourself. Back in the day educated and working women were usually independent and unmarried.. that's the type a working man would meet at the workplace.
silktricks Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 I don't agree with that. Most women used to be full-time caregivers. How would they have time to meet anyone when they are taking care of the kids and home 24/7? Not to mention the strict christian beliefs instilled generations ago. A woman took her marriage seriously and didn't have much time to fool around. Men on the other hand were more out of the house and had many chances to meet different women and of course most have a greater sex drive/can't control themselves anyways. You can't really believe this can you? Humans used to live in an agrarian society. Women worked right along side the men, as did the children. In fact, it was the women who did most of the "work outside the home" if you call taking the goods to market work outside the home. And don't get me started on the "strict christian beliefs" of generations ago. Some society's followed that type of belief, some did not, but making laws have never stopped people from doing what they really want, which is why laws against adultery were such a waste of time. Men can't control themselves? Sweetie, it takes two, unless you happen to think that every affair includes rape.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 If you know anything about history from the past 100 years, the fact that birth control didn't exist and women had over 5-6 kids, had to do household work while the husband was out making the bacon, and to think she still had time to look for an affair is really ludicrous. The revolution of women taking over the workplace only started around 50 years ago. 95% of the women would be home doing their housework with 6 kids to worry about... please. If you also know anything about statistics, you'll see that just in the past decade how womens infidelity is rising close to the man's.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 "have never stopped people from doing what they really want" Are you kidding me? Why do you think the divorce rate used to be so low? It was taboo due to religious thought. It sure stopped people from breaking up their marriages and in today's day, for the few it still does.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 Well, you know how many posts I've read from men talking about how they couldn't control themselves if a beautiful woman came onto them? No, they obviously can't and they admit it every day. Especially since most of their affairs are only physical- no most can't control themselves. Women, on the other hand, look for an emotional affairs mostly because their needs aren't met and plan looking out of the marriage. With men, a lot of times it's unplanned- what does that tell you?
silktricks Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 "have never stopped people from doing what they really want" Are you kidding me? Why do you think the divorce rate used to be so low? It was taboo due to religious thought. It sure stopped people from breaking up their marriages and in today's day, for the few it still does. The OP is about infidelity, not divorce. One does not equal the other - never has, and probably never will.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 You claimed that religious beliefs never stopped people from doing what they wanted- that is clearly false.
target-d Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 If you know anything about history from the past 100 years, the fact that birth control didn't exist and women had over 5-6 kids, had to do household work while the husband was out making the bacon, and to think she still had time to look for an affair is really ludicrous. The revolution of women taking over the workplace only started around 50 years ago. 95% of the women would be home doing their housework with 6 kids to worry about... please. If you also know anything about statistics, you'll see that just in the past decade how womens infidelity is rising close to the man's. Maybe you should chill out a little, and while you're there, you may want to pick up some history books. What silk said was completely correct about the agrarian society. If you want to throw snippets of history around, why don't you nail down exactly which years/generations you'd like to discuss. And, I'd like to point out what so many others have. It takes two---two people---to have an affair. A man cannot have one all by his lonesome, so just WHO was it that they were having affairs with if not women? Or are you talking gay men, bisexual maybe?
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 Common sense people- Women had much less of an opportunity to look for or be approached by affairs when they were housewives/mothers taking care of 6-8 children. Common sense- use it. You will find much evidence to that effect as well. It takes two people, usually only one of which is actually committed. That's really apples to oranges.
silktricks Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 You claimed that religious beliefs never stopped people from doing what they wanted- that is clearly false. Actually, what I said was "making laws have never stopped people from doing what they really want" and I stand by that statement. If you want to extrapolate that to mean religious beliefs, that is your business, but it's not what I said, nor is it what I believe. I believe that religious beliefs do indeed influence human behavior. But I believe that the behavior is influenced by changing what people want, not by making laws saying that what they want is bad or wrong. All that happens then is that people go "underground" and still do whatever it is that they want to do -- if they want to do it badly enough.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 Anyways, I stick by my post and actually agree with chump on this one. I'm not into bickering matches- sorry. I've gtg. P.S> Statistics speak for themself!
Chump64 Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 I agree with “enough” on the theory that more women are cheating, overall. Part of that, though, is that it’s being admitted more readily / reported more frequently. In the past, researchers focused on men b/c of the notion that men cheat more than women. I don’t agree with “enough” on the religious theory. I call bull. If religion influenced sexual behavior, we wouldn’t see priests and bishops being hauled off to jail weekly for raping little boys. Furthermore, people in the US are more religious in recent years than they were in the 70s and 80s, and the divorce rate is still very high. There are some theories that strict religious people cheat partly b/c sex was always taboo in their upbringing. They didn’t talk about reproduction, body parts, etc. It was all seen as “nasty.” Grow up thinking something is nasty and forbidden, and you may be more likely to whip it out. BTW, cheating cuts across all races, religions, income levels, etc. Religion didn’t stop Jesse Jackson, Jim Bakker or Jimmy Swaggart. Why do you think the divorce rate used to be so low? It was taboo due to religious thought. No, it was low -- in large part -- because women were often trapped financially. Today when a couple divorces, if she is a homemaker, she gets half the equity in the house, half of his pension, court-ordered child support, etc. That wasn’t the case in the past. Things are more equitable now. Women have more power and better tools to get out of crappy situations. Furthermore, women are more educated and independent, and don’t have to put up with $hit like ongoing infidelity, domestic violence, etc. That’s just one theory. Another theory is that marriage is just viewed differently, as more disposable and less meaningful. It has little to do with religion. If it did, you would see lower divorce rates in the 90s-00s, as more and more people are turning to religion in recent years. Interesting stat: 50 percent of marriages end in divorce. 17 percent of divorces are due to infidelity.
Blind Illusion Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 I think that historically, women have been more faithful than men - mainly b/c they were not in the workplace day in and day out. (I'm not sure "faithful" is the right word -- many probably would have cheated but the opportunities are much more limited at home, you must admit.) I can't find them at the moment, but there are stats showing that the numbers of cheating women have grown considerably since more and more women have joined the workforce. Yes, I think it even said that in that book that lots of Lovershackers speak of..."Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass. I finally got my copy & started reading it. The internet, also spurred a lot of extracurricular activity as well. That's a fairly recent development. I'm not sure how typical my experience is or not, but basically, I was new and naive to the world of computer usage. We had just gotten one in 1999 and I used it to shop or correspond with relatives and pals I knew in real life. Then, in 2000, I decided to quit smoking and joined a forum somewhat like here. That was the first time I ever had contact with "strangers" online. In fact, I still maintain some of the women friendships I met at that site. Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on my mindset of the moment) I was pretty naive, looking back at how these things work with members of the opposite sex. Support for one thing soon became support for other, more personal things and chats became phone calls and meetings, etc. I'd like to think that I would see the flags better if such a thing ever happened in the future. At the time, all I saw was that I was (am) in a bad marriage where support is nil. In fact, he never could say a good word about my quit and even accused me of lying about it at one point. I did get off on a tangent though with my own little story and the Internet. I do agree that the workplace opened up opportunities as well.. I also think affairs happened throughout history more than we know and kept quiet more. We know all about the "Camilla"s and " Simone de Beauvoir's because of their public profiles. Surely, there were common contemporaries that were less in the spotlight. In some ways, I think that time period was worse because of the mentality that "men will be men" was more accepted. Later for that premise..lol.
enoughisenough Posted June 4, 2006 Posted June 4, 2006 "Another theory is that marriage is just viewed differently, as more disposable and less meaningful." It's a myriad of reasons as to why the devorce rate is higher, but religion definitely had and still has an implact. And the meaningless view I believe is due to religion decline. I don't see the trend of people going "more and more to religion" (at least christianity for that matter). I see the opposite. Maybe I am just in another part of the country. And I think the divorce rate being up is actually a good thing. Too many people used to be stuck in meaningless, abusive and destructive marriages. And it was a real taboo to be a woman from divorce. You were referred to as a "divorcee" and people shunned you out of their groups. It was a very real negative social circumstance few women wanted to be a part of. There are many examples, one of which was depicted in the movie "walk the line". Especially in conservative areas of the country. Silk, you sound really bitter in your first post I just read. My situation, for the time being, is none of anyone's business. When I am comfortable, I will share. Who are you to try and make me? You sound like you are on attack-mode as well and I'm not going to fuel your negative attitude with my problems- because you surely don't seem like someone who would help anyways.
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