just go NC, or say so first?

[blue skies]

Ok. I am sorry this is a little long, I needed to explain the background. Can someone bear with it and advise me?

 

We were talking about getting married after a relatively short dating period. We then had a communication problem one day when I was very hung over and emotional and he was very tired. He expressed big doubts about everything, asked for time to think, and contacted me after a few days. He jumped straight back into it, talking about marriage again and deciding where to live. I was still nervous that he had switched from being totally sure to having big doubts before and told him it would take time for me to feel confident again that he really wanted to be with me.

 

After a week I tried to talk about something. I had some fears playing on my mind due to bad past experiences of infidelity, and someone becoming abusive and lying to me. He is naturally quite secretive, and my fears were running wild, always wondering if he was hiding something. Have realised since that he wasn't, he is just not very open and I was scared.

 

Anyway, when I tried to talk to him about this he didn't understand and asked for specific examples of why I was worried. I gave specific examples of things that had happened that bothered me. I probably put it across as if it was facts rather than fears. Again he felt it was criticism of his actions as he thought he had been doing all the right and nice things all week. We argued. He expressed big doubts, said he had never felt so criticised, needed to know that I was stable because why was I focussing on the negative, and dropped all contact except email for a week, to think. I was climbing the walls. I apologised, worked out that I had just been afraid, said I loved him etc etc.

After a week we met. He said he had been very concerned (as had I) that we'd had 2 fairly big problems in such a short time. He felt pessimistic about our chances and needed more time to think. He was waiting for his feelings for me to bounce back up again, but it hadn't happened yet, and he was very down about things. He didn't know if he had the strength to go on and try and fix things.

I said that I thought we should date a bit longer to see if things would iron themselves out but agreed that it looked worrying. We agreed to think more and meet a week later. I said 'if you just want out, just say so' He insisted he really wanted to think and talk more.

 

The next day I saw his profile back up on the dating service where we had met! I called, he said he had no intention of contacting anyone but his friends had said he should do it as a psychological statement.

 

I said we were either still talking things through or he was out looking, not both. He reiterated what he said before and asked if I would still meet him the next week. I agreed to.

A day later it was still up there. I called, said I loved him, just wanted us to get back on with things and be happy and see where it went, but couldn't take the limbo any more and was upset about the website thing.

He said he wasn't ready to make a decision and I should do whatever I needed to be comfortable at my end. He said if I pushed him for answers, he wasn't ready to give them. I asked if he loved me, he said 'He cared a lot, but was very confused.' I asked if he missed me. He said he missed me but had no urge to come and see me'. He said he really didn't think things would work out, but that it was an important decision and he needed more time. I said I didn't see the point of meeting that week if he was so negative about things.

 

I was upset and we ended up arguing a little bit. I emailed the next day and said, 'look, what is over is over, if you cared about me you wouldn't have gone back on the site before we broke up, maybe in a couple of weeks we can meet for closure, and I will leave your stuff on your door handle when i am passing.'

 

Mid week I called about something that had happened when we were together that I needed to set my mind at rest about. He said he didn't want to get into discussions about the past and who had done what, but if I had a question he would answer it. We both ended up both getting frustrated and upset. He said, look, if you want to meet in a couple of weeks for closure lets do that and maybe we will both be calmer then'.

I emailed and apologised for the way the conversation had gone.

I emailed again a few hours later and said I thought the break had been necessary as the situation was going in circles, but that I didn't know if it was really closure I wanted to meet for, or to see if time would bring a new perspective on things when we met. And that I still loved him and maybe time would heal and bring a new perspective by the time we next met. That was 3 days ago and he hasn't replied.

 

Questions:

1)It was me who techincally made the break so I don't know if he really wants to meet for closure or is just saying that because of what I said.

2) Where is his head at??????????

3) Do people think I have given him mixed messages? In my last email I was trying to stay cool to try and get a reaction as all my apologies, trying to fix it, and emails etc during the week when he wouldn't talk to me obviously didn't help.

4) It is left that we are meeting in 2 weeks - for 'closure'. What I actually want though is to make a break from the problem we had before, and then meet, hang out together a few times, and have fun - to give him the chance to see me being as I was at the start again - confident, fun, not worried about things - and see if we can work it out from there. If not, we will part on good terms, if so then great.

4) Should I go NC for the next 2 weeks - with no announcement, or call first to happily wish him a good week and say that is what I am doing?

 

 

Please help!

Thanks

 

PS

One of the things that made me nervous was that he talked about getting married, told everyone that we were getting married, kept asking me if I still wanted to (yes) and said he would ask me properly 'next week'. Next week went on for 3 weeks, when i asked him about it he said 'oh, I forgot'.

[Chinook]

I'm thinking he seems a little flakey really. You have to decide do you want in or out of the relationship. If it's in and he is still playing ball - then you wait and talk on the terms that you've both set. If you're not sure or you think he's not sure (and it doesn't look like he is to be honest) then you maybe want out. If that is the case, drop off his stuff, cut contact and go through no contact hell. It is hell to start with - but things get easier over time. If you both need closure to know what happened - you both need to say what needs saying face-to-face. It's important. Without that you are likely to take bitterness and regret forward with you and you nor he would want that. Like you said, if it's over, it's over. But do it properly. Just walking away won't solve everything immediately because as soon as the initial anger has settled.. things become more lonely and emotional and, if I'm honest, a little lonesome. Then that XP takes on a magical almost ethereal like quality and you want him back... even though you know it ain't what is good for you.

[Alexandra]

I'm sorry if this will sound negative but overall I don't think you're missing on a marriage in the least, in fact coupling what you said before with the last statement about postponing it I'd dare say he was probably not going to go through with it regardless.

 

This question is key "Where is his head at??????????" and while I can only speculate I'd say he has serious emotional issues for one main reason. It sounds as if he proposed and made life long plans while being nothing but infatuated with you. A stable mature man who's ready for a lifetime committment generally gives it far more time, doesn't decide on it in the spur of the moment and then retracts it and goes from 10 to 0 on the feelings scale in the spam of a few weeks. Best guess is that he has an immature, adolescent even notion of love, one of those people "in love with being in love" whom are getting very emotional, very fast, propose or accept proposals because the idea of marriage is contained in their ideal version of love but have little to no interest in an actual relationship. I may be wrong but I doubt it.

 

To be very honest I think you are wasting your time if you give him many more chances his situation is not one you could "cure". Also I'm willing to bet in a couple of years from now (after you'll undoubtedly be in a happy fulfilling relationship) you can check the same dating site and his profile will still be there and I can bet the farm there will be some other women with whom he reacted the same way. This is not to say he's a "player" or an intentional gamer, I am sure he meant the proposal as well as the intentions. For then, for the moment. He is just not standing on his own two feet emotionally and rationally.

 

If you can manage it then yes NC (and to answer the thread title you could write a longer email before you start it if you feel it necessary) would probably benefit you, closure I don't know how you can attain, it's generally very hard to get joint closure from relationships with people who aren't entirely healthy emotions wise but if you can help it, please make sure you don't blame yourself for the episode you quote first as it probably made very little of a difference to the outcome.

 

Keep us posted and good luck.

[blue skies]

Yes, he is kind of flaky in many ways.

 

I don't know for sure what I want - because it depends on how it would be. I love him and feel very, very passionately about him, which is pretty rare for me - I am usually more cerebral. I am not usually so upset about things, I usually know I am making the right choice and am at peace with it. I miss him incredibly. I think we had something very special and so did he.

 

If he is going to continue going backwards and forwards not really being clear what he wants, and refusing to speak for a week every time we have an issue, I want out.

If he is prepared to work on that and be more level, I want in.

If it was just a situation that got out of control and we were both rushing into things and getting scared, and it can settle down and resolve with a slower approach to things, I also want in. A slower pace would suit me fine.

 

But I don't know which scenario applies, because he doesn't know. He hasn't got as far as deciding anything, so I cannot assess if he is willing to do the work needed on his side or not. I have sorted out my own fears and don't know what else I can do.

 

He is very emotional - I think a lot depends on how he feels at any given time.

 

He had a very abusive father which has probably affected him. I understand that and am willing to be patient if we are together, but unless he knows what he wants what can I do?

 

If there is a chance to work things out I want to take it but I am not going to stand around and torture myself waiting if he cannot even decide if he wants to commit to a few dates to see.

Confusing...

[blue skies]

Thanks. I am surprised people picked this flakiness up because there are more things that got me nervous about his behaviour that I didn't go into detail with.

There was often a big gap between what he said he would do and what he did. If I pulled him up on the gap (like, 'hey, why don't we go and see those friends you said we would go and see 2 weeks ago')? he would say he felt I was pressuring him.

 

The issue I tried to explain to him that concerned me was exactly that- that he was living in a world of what he wanted to happen and not what was actually happening.

 

In his defence I will say that we live in a religious culture where it is pretty normal for people to make a decision after 1-3 months. Neither of us came from that background originally, but there is that sense of external pressure there to only date in order to assess for marriage within a few short months and if not, then stay focussed and move on fast. So speaking about marriage so soon wasn't totally up the wall. I suggested slowing down as it was obviously too fast for us, no matter what the outside world thought, but he kept saying that we could just be wasting time. Of course, it could be months before we met anyone else in which case I don't see how a couple of weeks to see how things went would be the end of the world......

I guess I should just accept that if he loved me genuinely, he would be on the phone trying to make this work now, not drifting and 'thinking'.

Life is hard!

[Alexandra]

I guess I should just accept that if he loved me genuinely, he would be on the phone trying to make this work now, not drifting and 'thinking'.

Life is hard!

 

How do I put this clearly and yet not make it sound harsh to you?

 

I think you seem "all over the place" emotionally for now. In the midst of a "love me/love me not" carousel and that is perfectly understandable. You went in the spam of three posts from condemning his actions to excusing them, from saying you know it's healthier to be out of this to talking about second chances and patching things up. You do sound very confused and I am sure it's a very trying time for you.

 

I'm positive your head will gradually clear and your thoughts will eventually settle into more coherence. When that happens though, do me a favour and ask yourself if this is a man you should consider marriage with based on what you know of him so far. Why and why not will help too once you answer.

[blue skies]

You are not harsh, I appreciate the feedback.

 

He isn't someone I could consider marrying based on what I have seen so far. But I do have very strong feelings for him and because of that I want to give things a chance to work out.

 

If he got his act together, decided he did want this relationship and approached it in a more levelheaded and consistent way, taking it slowly, I would be in a very good position to feel comfortable with marrying him after a period of time.

 

However I haven't a clue what he really wants, although what he did say hardly sounded positive.

 

I just want him to stop blowing up one conversation into a whole crisis and give it a chance to see if this thing can actually work before we talk about marriage again. But he seems to want to deal with it as a 'deciding on marriage' issue before finding out if it can even work as a relationship.

 

Hence my confusion. My response is based on his and he isn't being terribly communicative.

 

As to condemning / condoning, The speed of his talking about marriage was understandable under the conditions, but even so it should still be a more thought out decision. Likwise to go from 100mph emotions, to 0, and back again over the space of 15 days is impossible to live with.

 

I have to make a decision based on the info I have, with no further update from him... and I am afraid to make the wrong one.

 

Thanks

[riobikini]

BlueSkies,

 

Your post is incredible!

 

To clarify, it simply has me dumbfounded that anyone would go to a dating site, find a man, date him for a *short period* (barely know him, for God's sake!), talk about getting married, and then wonder *why* you have problems in the relationship.

 

Is this the 'norm' for today's young (or even older) people?

 

I am shaking my head and hoping to God that this is just a random scenario of post-reality. Yet.....I know there must be others doing the very same thing.

 

Do you actually question why you have such problems as you have identified when you form and carry out new relationships such as this?

 

Solution (as you have generously invited response to your story):

 

*Get out of this silly relationship.*

 

Get yourself 'together' -find out why you are, who you are, and what you are supposed to be doing on this planet, (at least some of the reason) and give yourself time to mature into someone who can actually have a responsible, caring, intelligent relationship with someone similar.

 

And stop entertaining ridiculous *affairs* as being potentially long-lasting and truly caring, 'real' relationships.

 

I say all this in kindness, no matter how harsh it sounds.

 

 

 

-Rio

[Guest]

Rio

Thanks for the advice, I am already aware of that, but I do think it was unnecessarily harsh. As I said, it is the expected norm in our society, to select someone from a similar background, meet, keep your head screwed on, make an assessment, find out about their background from friends, colleagues, neighbours, and get married fast based on logical reasons such as shared values, a commitment to a joint purpose, and the seeds of love. I can't help that. This society also has a very low divorce rate.

If someone was Asian and in an arranged marriage that went wrong, would you flame them for marrying someone they didn't know?

What went wrong is because we are both not from this background originally, we both have different past ways of doing things and we mixed up our old 'emotional' way of doing things with the new fast way and that is the problem.

Yes, in future I am not going to do this. It takes as long as it takes and I don't care if everyone is standing round asking why I am not making my mind up yet and thinking I must be up to no good if I date someone for too long without marrying them.

 

But that doesn't help resolve the past.

[Guest]

She has already said she is tied within a cultural background where it is normal and even encouraged / pressured to make a fast choice on marriage by Western standards. She already said that they did not grow up in that background and found it hard to deal with and got emotionally involved rather than staying rational. What she needs is advice on how to deal with the current situation...

 

my 2 cents..

Jon

[blue skies]

I wrote and said did he want to go back to being just friends, get to know each other properly over time and see how it went and no more talking about marriage until we knew each other way better as we just didn't know each other well enough to decide and that the speed had ruined things. I gave him 24 hrs to respond and said that if he did not I would never initiate contact again. He responded after 2 hrs and said he didn't have the patience (obviously!) to work things out, apologised for all the pain he had caused and said we should just leave it and move on.

 

Yes, I was naive. But he had seemed very together, rational, clear and stable. I don't usually rush in, it genuinely seemed like one of those very, very rare cases where 2 people meet, click and after a short time feel they are really right for each other.

 

This was a professional educated person, we both are. I am usually very levelheaded. Everyone that knew him spoke equally highly of him. It was only after we started discussing marriage (at his pushing) that he started getting flaky and weird and acting bizarrely. I had asked to take things slowly but he didn't want to - because of the religious pressure we were under to formalise things. It was his flakiness as well as bad past experiences that got me scared, and when that happened he vanished.

 

Anyway, it is over and I am feeling at peace with it and looking forward, when I am feeling up to it, to meeting someone who wants to take the time to build a real relationship, however long it takes.

Thank you for your helpful comments.