Yea or Nay??

[Torn Up]

I come here today, not for advice on my now exMM (Thank God!), nor any issues I have in relation to my past affair, but rather about the man I have been seeing since my breakup with MM. I know this board is designed for OW/OM, but because I've come to know (and trust) the advice of many here, this is the place I've decided to turn to.

 

Last week I mentioned my breakup with the man I've been seeing since my breakup with MM. He has an ugly past with alcohol (damaged a portion of his heart and got violent), but has been sober for the past 3 years. Until last week when he decided to drink with his sister and then got beligerent with me...which is NOT like him. He had promised me that he wouldn't drink...EVER. So, when he broke his promise, I promptly through him out and haven't spoken to him since.

 

Okay, so I get the call from him this morning. He told me he misses me horribly, that he knows he "f*cked up," (his words) and hates his life without me. He said he can live without me if he has to, but said he doesn't want to. He told me he has done a lot of thinking this past week and feels that we have something special together and doesn't want to let it go without at least trying to work through it. He said that he loves me and can't get me off of his mind.

 

Thing is, other than this recent incident with drinking, this man has been wonderful to me. Whatever I want, he gives me. He knows about my affair with MM and has been extremely understanding and compassionate with me. He also knows that I have serious trust issues now and has bent over backwards to gain my trust...to prove that not all men are lying dogs. So, when he drank that night, the trust I fought to gain for him crumbled and I was furious. I threw him out without listening to what he had to say.

 

I realize now that my exMM did some serious damage with his lies and deceit. I don't know that I will EVER be the same again, nor learn to fully trust again. I am beginning to wonder if I will always be "damaged goods."

 

So, here's my dilemma. This man wants to try again, wants to work on "us"...to give it another chance.

 

My problem with this?

 

Well, for starters...I don't know that I can trust him to keep his promises in the future. I mean, he broke his promise to me last week. What's to stop him from breaking it again, and the longer we're together, the bigger the heartbreak. And I do NOT need to have my heart broken again....especially after the hell I went through after my split with MM. I honestly can't take it....I can't!!!

 

If I decide to give this another chance, I risk getting my heart broken once again. If I don't, then I'll always wonder if I had over-reacted, if maybe this guy was my idea mate...could've made me happy but I was quick to walk away because of ONE mistake he made.

 

Tell you what....this is a crappy place to be.

 

Should I or shouldn't I???

 

You know, I should've been a nun. Then I wouldn't have to deal with men!!!

 

Help!!!

 

~Torn~

[Curmudgeon]

Well, it's never too late to enter the convent.

 

In this case I'd tread cautiously. Maybe it was only one slip but it was a big one. You're right to be wary. Perhaps if you ease back into it with occasional meetings (sans sex) over a period of time you can better guage whether he's both sincere about and capable of keeping that promise once again. There will always be a risk and I think you know that but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

[Torn Up]

There will always be a risk and I think you know that but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

 

So very true...and so very SCARY!

 

I think you're right....perhaps I should test the waters slowly here. No need to plunge in, especially given the fact that I now know those waters can turn rapid in a hell of a hurry!

 

He'll be calling again tonight and no doubt will be pushing me for an answer. And at this point, I honestly don't have one. Confusement only produces rambling, which, at this point, will be all I have to offer because I'm at a loss as to what I really want in this relationship.

 

Thank you, Curm, for once again offering me sound advice.

 

~Torn~

[whichwayisup]

Here's a deal breaker - He MUST go to AA meetings on a regular basis. After 3 years of being sober and he slipped is a BIG thing. He has to want to stop drinking for himself, not just stop so he can keep you around.

 

I think being friends with him right now is good, but hold off on the 'relationship' part until things settle down.

[blind_otter]

Google "Dry Drunk". There is a difference between abstaining from alcohol and recovering from alcoholism.

[lovernotafighter]

So very true...and so very SCARY!

 

I think you're right....perhaps I should test the waters slowly here. No need to plunge in, especially given the fact that I now know those waters can turn rapid in a hell of a hurry!

 

He'll be calling again tonight and no doubt will be pushing me for an answer. And at this point, I honestly don't have one. Confusement only produces rambling, which, at this point, will be all I have to offer because I'm at a loss as to what I really want in this relationship.

 

Thank you, Curm, for once again offering me sound advice.

 

~Torn~

I think I'd tell him just what you have posted...that you don't have a answer right now and need to think about it...that is a very fair answer and he should give you that.

 

the biggest problem is that he is a violent and beligerent when drinking and knows it...he breaks his promise again what will he do since you took him back..perhaps he'll be worse..and he did break a promise.

 

with that it would be difficult for me to take him back...but that being said when I met my husband he just got out of the service and was alcoholic..he showed up at home one night to pick a fight with me and I dumped him on the spot.

 

a few weeks later he promised he'd never do it again and begged me back..he kept that promise till our marrage but he was drinking with me we had no problems with it..it was occasional drink..so maybe theres a chance he'll do what he says.

[lovernotafighter]

Google "Dry Drunk". There is a difference between abstaining from alcohol and recovering from alcoholism.

hmm very interesting...and your avatar scares the hell out of me

[Ladyjane14]

If I felt like I had to monitor his behavior for the rest of his natural life....I don't think I'd want him.

 

You had some misgivings before anyway. Wasn't he moving things along a bit too fast or something like that?

 

Anyway, I don't think you're over-reacting. If he won't back off and give you some breathing space, you probably ought to consider releasing him back into the pond.

[Curmudgeon]

Always a pleasure to help a neighbor!

[Curmudgeon]

I think that's a bit harsh. My wife is bipolar and occasionally relapses and self-medicates with alcohol. It's a common factor of the disorder and something I will have to monitor the rest of my life or hers, whichever ends first. The disorder does not define her, any more than cancer would. It simply exists so we both make allowances.

 

It certainly doesn't make her a pond-dweller or lower form of life, nor does it diminish my love for her.

[blind_otter]

Someone who is in a disease process like alcoholism needs to take the steps to move towards recovery. The danger with dry drunks is that they are still dealing with life like an alcoholic would.

 

Alcoholics are addictive even in the wway they relate to other people, especially in intimate relationships. Whether or not you want to take on this burden is ultimately up to you, but in all honesty it takes a lot of tolerace, and sometimes that's just not worth it. And that's OK too. But it's a lot to ask of another you supposedly love, to carry those burdens that are pretty heavy just for the alcoholic. And the guilt that goes with that.

[Torn Up]

Here's a deal breaker - He MUST go to AA meetings on a regular basis. After 3 years of being sober and he slipped is a BIG thing. He has to want to stop drinking for himself, not just stop so he can keep you around./QUOTE]

 

Wanna hear the kicker to this? When he called this morning, he told me he's gone to 7 AA meetings since our breakup last week. He said that after all this time with no drinking, and thought he had it under control, his "slip" was a wakeup call that he isn't quite as strong as he thought, and that once again, his drinking caused him grief once again (losing me).

 

But, yes, I agree. He MUST stay away from alcohol for HIM, for the betterment of his life...NOT for me, or to keep me around. He MUST step up to the plate and grab the bull by the horns because nobody can do it for him...certainly no I.

 

Thank you, Which, I think this is a good idea. Gives he and I something to talk about when he calls tonight.

 

See why I come here for advice???

 

~Torn~

[Curmudgeon]

I certainly never said it was easy, nor is it pleasant at times. However, I still object to the inference that someone is automatically in throw-away status because of it and inferior. They're a person with a problem and yes, it does take a great deal of tolerance and sometimes it IS worth it.

[Torn Up]

the biggest problem is that he is a violent and beligerent when drinking and knows it...he breaks his promise again what will he do since you took him back..perhaps he'll be worse..and he did break a promise.

 

Bingo!

 

THAT is EXACTLY my biggest fear...that he'll do it again, and this time, it will be worse. He has never been anything but gentle with me, both emotionally and physically, BUT - he DOES have a violent history. For starters, he beat his father so badly he put him in the hospital for a month. Now, granted, the father was extremely abusive to his kids (when he bothered to stick around to raise them, that is), and I know how painful that experience can be. But to beat him to the point of hospitalization??? No, that's where I draw the line. And yes, I know he was drunk when he did it, but all the more reason for him to stay away from alcohol. You'd think after beating his father almost to death, and then doing jail time over it would be enough for him to swear off the stuff for the rest of his life. Not to mention the physical damage he now suffers (his heart) because of his drunkn' days.

 

His recent "slip" concerns me greatly because I fear him becoming violent towards me. He said he never would, has never hit a woman in his life, nor would he, but he's as strong as a bull. Has HUGE arms with the almost friekish strength.

 

And I certainly don't want that strength turned on me during a drunkn' brawl. Especially given the fact that I'm a small woman!

 

~Torn~

[Torn Up]

If I felt like I had to monitor his behavior for the rest of his natural life....I don't think I'd want him.

 

You had some misgivings before anyway. Wasn't he moving things along a bit too fast or something like that?

 

My biggest fear is that, should I decide to take him back, give this relationship a go, I'd have a hard time enjoying it because I'd be in a constant state of worry that he'll "slip" again. I wouldn't relax long enough to exhale...bracing myself for another "drunkn" episode. NOT a pleasant way to live!

 

And yes, he was moving FAR too fast for my comfort. This is something that would have to be dealt with as well.

 

Jeeze....I just came out of a relationship with a MM only 5 months ago and am STILL licking my (deep) wounds from that experience. And then along came this guy. He's very gentle, thoughtful and kind (when he's not drinking!), and has many qualities I'm looking for in a mate...but his "one" issue is a biggie - and one I have to look at seriously.

 

My God...are there ANY normal, sane men out there anymore???

 

~Torn~

[luvtoto]

It's clearly your decision. However, you will *always* have your guard up around this man. If he did it once, he can do it again. You'll never really allow yourself to trust him. Do you really want to live that way?

 

I was once in an abusive relationship for nine years, and he would make me promises, too. Oh...the promises. *sigh* But, he never changed. The funny thing is that *he* thought he changed. He didn't have a clue what normal relationship was like.

[Guest]

Alcoholics are addictive even in the wway they relate to other people, especially in intimate relationships. Whether or not you want to take on this burden is ultimately up to you, but in all honesty it takes a lot of tolerace, and sometimes that's just not worth it.

 

Otter,

 

I do understand what you're saying...that the alcoholic has an addictive persoanlity in general, and it rings true. They do.

 

But on a personal level, I know it is entirely possible for the alcoholic to turn his/her life completely around and do well. On the other hand, many don't...just depends upon how badly the alcoholic wants to succeed, their reason(s) for wanting to stop, and the personality of the alcoholic.

 

How do I know?

 

I'm a psych nurse and have dealt with many of them. I've seen both success and failure while dealing with alcoholics. And to get involved with one is a gamble, no doubt. A gamble I'm not so sure I want (OR CAN) take on at this point in my life.

 

But I don't believe in throwing the baby out with the bath water, per se. I've seen FAR too many success stories in all walks of life to do that.

 

Funny, isn't it, that I've worked in the psych field for over 20 years and here I am...a freakn' wreck!!

 

First I get involved with a married man...then an alcoholic.

 

So much for psych credentials, hmmmmm????

 

You seem to know the dynamics of an alcoholic. If you don't mind my asking, did you learn this from personal experience (yourself or a loved one?), or did you research it?

 

Just curious...

 

~Torn~

[Torn Up]

Alcoholics are addictive even in the wway they relate to other people, especially in intimate relationships. Whether or not you want to take on this burden is ultimately up to you, but in all honesty it takes a lot of tolerace, and sometimes that's just not worth it.

 

Otter....I do understand what you're saying here, that alcoholics have an addictive personality in general. They tend to do things in excess....like spending money, jumping into relationships without caution, etc. Basically, the have poor impulse control.

 

BUT - they can also turn their lives around completely. Many don't, but some do. How do I know? Because I'm a psych nurse and have dealt with many of them in the 20 years I've worked in this field.

 

The success of an alcoholic depends upon his reasons for quitting, how long he/she has been drinking, the reason(s) why they drink, and the personality of the alcoholic. And yes, to get involved with one in a relationship is quite risky, no doubt. A risk I don't think I want (OR CAN) take at this point in my life.

 

Funny, isn't it, that I'm a psych nurse yet my life right now is a freakn' mess!!! I get involved with a married man and then an alcoholic.

 

Ah well, so much for psych credentials, hmmmm???

 

Out of curiosity, you seem to know the dynamics of an alcoholic well. Did you learn this from personal experience (yourself or a loved one?), or from research?

 

~Torn~

[scarletletter]

If you think he is really sincere about his apology and knowing that he screwed up, it is up to you whether you give him a second chance. I personally think that most everyone deserves a second chance, after that....if it happened again, that will tell you if it is going to be a pattern. Maybe you could suggest to him to go to AA meetings to ensure that he doesn't fall off the wagon again?

[Torn Up]

Always a pleasure to help a neighbor!

 

Neighbor?

 

As in "Northern California neighbor," or "global neighbor?"

 

Inquiring minds, ya know!

 

~Torn~

[Torn Up]

It certainly doesn't make her a pond-dweller or lower form of life, nor does it diminish my love for her.

 

Does your wife know how fortunate she is to have a loving husband like you?? Good for you for sticking by her side despite the difficult obsticles you two face.

 

And Bipolar Disorder IS a difficult thing to deal with...for both parties!!!

 

~Torn~

[Torn Up]

I was once in an abusive relationship for nine years, and he would make me promises, too. Oh...the promises. *sigh* But, he never changed. The funny thing is that *he* thought he changed. He didn't have a clue what normal relationship was like.

 

 

...and there lies my biggest fear. That I'll give him "another" chance, only to regret my decision later when he once again breaks his promise...and breaks MY heart in the process.

 

What makes this SO difficult is that, when sober, he's a wonderful man...he truly is. Very tender, giving, considerate and loving.

 

A bitter-sweet deal, this is. And a HARD decision to make.

 

~Torn~

[Torn Up]

Alrighty then...he called as promised and we talked on the phone for over 2 hours. He asked me to come over to his house (for privacy, my son lives with me), of which I initially declined. But he kept asking me to come over, saying over and over again that he misses me and he can't "take it" anymore. Said we need to have a long face to face talk and make a final decision as to what we want to do (give it another try or call it quits).

 

I made it clear to him that I do NOT want to get intimate with him tonight, that I am coming over ONLY to talk, to have a heart to heart...to speak our minds and make some decisions, which he has agreed to.

 

And so...I'm off.

 

Wish me luck!!!

 

~Torn~

[luvtoto]

Torn, it's only been one week since his drunk episode. He couldn't have changed much in that matter of time, imo. He is running the show here.

[whichwayisup]

He's showing desparation and 'begging' you to come over, telling you he can't "take it anymore" is very manipulative of him. Having a 'serious' conversation so late at night isn't a good idea, those conversations should take place during the day or early evening.