So, what's the difference?

[OzGirl]

Been reading in the Infidelity forum, and as anyone else who reads there would know - the W of MM who find out they had an A seem to mainly want to "work on the marriage". Any ex-OW knows it's a tale all too familiar...

 

So, this is what I want to know - whether you're a betrayed spouse or and OW/OM, what's your take on this?

 

If a man hits a woman, everyone tells her to leave him. But, if he breaks her heart, they encourage her to work on her marriage.

 

Question #1: Why? What's that different in his intention and sense of risk to lose his marriage?

 

Secondly, OW seem to tolerate the MM being married because DESPITE this, he still manages to fulfil them.

 

Question #2: How is that different to the W taking him back after finding out he had an A? Are both women possibly the same "type" of person - that being someone who knows he "shares or shared" her with someone else, but she can't turn her back on him and say "not good enough. See ya".?

 

 

Your thoughts and theories???

[catgirl1927]

I think it's absolutely true that women are encouraged to forgive and blame themselves when men cheat. It's really unfair. Men don't tolerate that sort of behavior, but women are supposed to because men "can't help themselves." Whatever.

 

I also agree that takers always find givers. It goes for men and for women. It's no surprise that both the W and the OW are the same type.

[Sal Paradise]

I think it's absolutely true that women are encouraged to forgive and blame themselves when men cheat. It's really unfair. Men don't tolerate that sort of behavior, but women are supposed to because men "can't help themselves." Whatever.

 

I also agree that takers always find givers. It goes for men and for women. It's no surprise that both the W and the OW are the same type.

 

There are double standards all around though....

 

When a wife cheats on her husband, the general perception is that the husband wasn't fulfilling his wifes needs.

 

When a husband cheats on a wife, the general perception is that he is a pig.

 

I find people are more forgiving (or willing to excuse) a wife that cheats over a husband that cheats. Why? Because when a man cheats its seen as physical weakness. When a woman cheats its because the man wasn't meeting her emotional needs. Emotional needs are seen as more important than physical needs.

 

I think some of this goes back to Western Christian dogma that sexual need is something to be controlled or supressed (a weakness of the flesh). Where as Emotional need is seen as a noble thing.

 

Both are needs are equal in my eyes. And a cheater whether male or female is a cheater. Neither is more justified or less deplorable.

[catgirl1927]

There are double standards all around though....

 

When a wife cheats on her husband, the general perception is that the husband wasn't fulfilling his wifes needs.

 

When a husband cheats on a wife, the general perception is that he is a pig.

 

I find people are more forgiving (or willing to excuse) a wife that cheats over a husband that cheats. Why? Because when a man cheats its seen as physical weakness. When a woman cheats its because the man wasn't meeting her emotional needs. Emotional needs are seen as more important than physical needs.

 

I think some of this goes back to Western Christian dogma that sexual need is something to be controlled or supressed (a weakness of the flesh). Where as Emotional need is seen as a noble thing.

 

Both are equal in my eyes. And a cheater whether male or female is a cheater. Neither is more justified or less deplorable.

 

I disagree with this completely. I think that women who cheat are villified as whores, while men who cheat are just following their instincts. Men who are cheated on are victims of their wives inability to keep her legs together, while women who are cheated on are said to be frigid and cold, and the men were just looking for what she's not hot enough to provide them. Occasional cheating by men is totally accepted socially, women are to expect it and are not permitted to be angry about it without being labelled as jealous and selfish.

 

I agree, however, that all cheating is deplorable, wrong and completely inexcusable.

[a4a]

Boys will be boys!

 

They cannot help it.

 

Now women are supposed to be above it. Much worse if a woman cheats on a man.

 

Of course a man is giving up his life to become married..... a woman wants to get married to get a life.

[catgirl1927]

Boys will be boys!

 

They cannot help it.

 

Now women are supposed to be above it. Much worse if a woman cheats on a man.

 

Of course a man is giving up his life to become married..... a woman wants to get married to get a life.

 

Especially if it's almost time for that van to come and make her only care about Hallmark ornaments... :lmao:

[blind_otter]

I think some of this goes back to Western Christian dogma that sexual need is something to be controlled or supressed (a weakness of the flesh). Where as Emotional need is seen as a noble thing.

 

What western christian dogma glorifies the emotional needs of the individual? I am unfamiliar with this concept.

 

From what I've studied I was under the impression that putting any personal needs before the glorification of God were taboo, in the christian faith?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but please provide your citations.

[a4a]

Especially if it's almost time for that van to come and make her only care about Hallmark ornaments... :lmao:

 

If you see the white van......... RUN!!!!

[blind_otter]

Also, if I had a penis, I would f*** mud. I would run around sticking into things that were warm and moist. I for some reason would feel this was appropriate behavior, moreso than sticking things INTO My warm, moist area.

 

Does that make sense?

[catgirl1927]

If you see the white van......... RUN!!!!

 

Oh thank God, I was looking for a black one!!!

 

It's probably too late for me now anyway...

[a4a]

Also, if I had a penis, I would f*** mud. I would run around sticking into things that were warm and moist. I for some reason would feel this was appropriate behavior, moreso than sticking things INTO My warm, moist area.

 

Does that make sense?

 

 

Not sure if it makes sense, but would a warmed cantelope with a hole cut out be an appropriate birthday gift for a lonely single guy?

[blind_otter]

Not sure if it makes sense, but would a warmed cantelope with a hole cut out be an appropriate birthday gift for a lonely single guy?

 

I'm thinking yeah. Oh I hate to bring him up but maybe Admiral Thwan could experience intimacy with fruit.

 

If I had a penis for a day, nothing would be safe. If my BF took a nap I would wait until he was snoring and try to slide it into his mouth or something. I would point with it and examine things using the penis as a third appendage.

[Ladyjane14]

If a man hits a woman, everyone tells her to leave him. But, if he breaks her heart, they encourage her to work on her marriage.

 

Question #1: Why? What's that different in his intention and sense of risk to lose his marriage?

 

There's a big difference in the risk. Broken hearts don't usually KILL people. But physical violence tends to escalate until it's dealt with.

 

With treatment, it might still be possible to salvage the marriage, but because the offender is out-of-control, the only safe thing to do is to remove yourself from the situation. The offender has to choose to change his behavior. You can't make that choice for him.

 

As to 'encouraging betrayed women to work on the marriage'....underneath it all, I personally think we should DUMP ALL CHEATERS. But that's not usually what people want to hear when they post here. They want ideas for keeping the relationship going, so for my part, I try think of ways to help them get what they want.

 

I will tell you this though, if my husband had physically cheated on me....he would be divorced right now. These days, STD's have the potential to kill you and orphan your kids. And NOBODY is going to play 'Russion Roulette' with MY LIFE and then park their boots underneath my bed.

 

Secondly, OW seem to tolerate the MM being married because DESPITE this, he still manages to fulfil them.

 

Question #2: How is that different to the W taking him back after finding out he had an A? Are both women possibly the same "type" of person - that being someone who knows he "shares or shared" her with someone else, but she can't turn her back on him and say "not good enough.

 

I can't imagine that the OW is very often "fulfilled" by the affair relationship.

More often than not it seems to make them VERY miserable. To be perfectly honest, I can't begin to comprehend why and OW would put herself in that position. A cheating man is defective in character, IMO. He doesn't just cheat his wife...he cheats his children too. Because he has emotionally exited from the family dynamic in a way that's detrimental to it's survival.

 

Why would anyone want to begin a relationship with a guy who has a known history of deceit? It doesn't make sense to me.

 

And then the MM wants to cry to the OW that he can't leave his wife because of the kids??? What kind of horsesh*t is that? Essentially, he has ALREADY left his family, because his continued presence within it is no more than a BIG FAT LIE. What is he modeling for his children anyway? When the going gets tough....the tough withdraw?

 

Not much positive for a kid to learn in that, if you ask me.

 

But I do understand why wives have a tendancy to give the WH another chance. It IS possible for a marriage to recover, and for the family dynamic to become a healthy one again. That possibility keeps alot of BWs open to trying.

 

I think that most married people who have become unhappy with their partner....just want the one they intially married to come back. Most don't want someone new. They want the one they wanted back in the beginning. They want the one they fell in love with.

 

When your partner has become troubled and different, you still get these occasional little glimpses of the one you fell in love with. That's the person you STILL love, and you want them back.

 

So, there's something that's always sustaining there. These little glimpses that give you hope keep you in the game.

 

A BW will often go the distance because she knows her guy is still in there somewhere, lost in the fog. And if she keeps the light on maybe he'll find his way home and the family will be whole again.

[whichwayisup]

If I had a penis for a day, nothing would be safe.

 

I'd become a chronic masterbator and f*** my pillow!

[catgirl1927]

I'm thinking yeah. Oh I hate to bring him up but maybe Admiral Thwan could experience intimacy with fruit.

 

If I had a penis for a day, nothing would be safe. If my BF took a nap I would wait until he was snoring and try to slide it into his mouth or something. I would point with it and examine things using the penis as a third appendage.

 

If I had a penis for a day, I would ask for a raise...

[Guest]

Well, I have read many of the forums for years now. I have the conclusions and closure to my never ending questions. This area is an open book, therefore, your forum has given the much needed time to relate and connect. Not to base my r/s on my decision, as the forums have enlightened me and certainly allowed discovery throughout this chaos, and for these reasons, I thank you.

 

With all due respect, I reiterate, this place has been an outlet of sorts to help me define the questions that would have drove me mad! Friends, family claim I have reached that point, to me, no return! Alright, seriously, this has been a positive outlet although my replies have been minimal if not non-existent. But in essence you became a friend in deed in need!

 

My r/s has been rocky after our 1st yr together. And I question, now, why we continued? Love...we all understand if your r/s has endured a Lack of trust which is the foundation of longevity in any r/s the rest will either follow suit to its demise or will fade with only words to express what is left. The actions are just that.

 

Most importantly there are other factors to consider as to why we remain or cut the ties, gradually or definitely. The decision to render a final ending or fight to the death is where the fine lines start to set in. I realize having experiencing this, "love you, but not in love w/you scenerio" is for the dogs.

 

I am ready to throw in the towel. I am no longer willing or care to continue with his conviction, a one-way travelled affair of heart; justified given to my existance to blame. It is time for me to finalize the result of his actions, and he to accept my decision, it was over when he started his affair.

 

As I loved this man with all I could ever imagined in life, heart and soul, I just cannot continue listening to his 'airs' recall violent and lying on the floor begging for cries of help to love me, questions of 'why'? thrown to the air, while kicked and w/ a look of disgust turn and leave me. Well, yrs later, unlike him, I refuse to beat a dead horse.

 

I do not give up easily. I have the determination and conviction to fight with what I believe. But it is clear, he refused to love me then, and still does. I am ready to turn off the lights [in my heart], and close the door.

 

I wonder is this blame a last effort to keep me hanging? What the hell for?

 

I will give him my blessing and tax write this off to no deduction, accept my loss, AND IT WAS A BIG ONE for years, [but who's counting?] Is lying to yourself because it is a waste of time or the the risk to lose. Who cares now? The loss....?

[Blind Illusion]

 

Both are needs are equal in my eyes. And a cheater whether male or female is a cheater. Neither is more justified or less deplorable.

 

Not in mine. While both are important, if they are really equal, why is it that affairs with an emotional component (deep friendship, love, etc) are much difficult to relinguish than their physical only counterpart?

 

Besides, I can buy batteries for a variety of things to fulfill my physical needs if I did not want to go the one nighter/cheating sort of route. To my knowledge, no such toy exists for my emotional fulfillment and pleasure

[catgirl1927]

I don't think he's talking about the cheater's feelings. For me, it doesn't matter why you cheated. It matters that you cheated. That will be the question at hand.

[THX2000]

I disagree with this completely. I think that women who cheat are villified as whores, while men who cheat are just following their instincts. Men who are cheated on are victims of their wives inability to keep her legs together, while women who are cheated on are said to be frigid and cold, and the men were just looking for what she's not hot enough to provide them. Occasional cheating by men is totally accepted socially, women are to expect it and are not permitted to be angry about it without being labelled as jealous and selfish.

 

I agree, however, that all cheating is deplorable, wrong and completely inexcusable.

 

I must disagree completely here. I am male and my ex did in fact have an affair behind my back for the last 6 months or so we were "together". She has been characterized as a "whore" and I hate to agree but it's true. I also have a male friend that was found out to have been cheating on his long term gf and he was immediately "ex-communicated" from our entire circle of friends and labeled as a total A-HOLE (deservedly so). I don't know if it's where you are from or whatever but cheating is cheating whether by male or female around here and neither is looked upon with and kindness.

[OzGirl]

I'm guessing you mightn't be, but if you are interested, I posted this exact same thread in the OW/OM forum.

[silktricks]

I'm guessing you mightn't be, but if you are interested, I posted this exact same thread in the OW/OM forum.

 

Hi, and I responded to it there. I believe that LJ has definitely expressed things well, and that as she said, you do keep the "glimpse" of who the person was. Often that applies to both the BS and the MP.

 

I do however, believe that MOI on the OW forum said a mouthful. I will simply repeat something close to what I posted there:

 

Violence in relationships is not condoned in any society, however there are many societies where multiple partners (wives) is actively encouraged.

 

Therefore, multiple wives (mistresses) breaks societal standards, but not evolutionary ones. The repulsion is not as deeply rooted.

[sylviaguardian]

If a man hits a woman, everyone tells her to leave him. But, if he breaks her heart, they encourage her to work on her marriage.

 

Question #1: Why? What's that different in his intention and sense of risk to lose his marriage?

 

The difference is that if you hit someone, you intentionally hurt them. If you have an affair it is usually because of your own needs. You do not think "I know what will hurt my wife/husband the most - I will cheat on them" So intentionality is one 'difference'.

 

Secondly, people don't just generally tell others to 'work on their marriage'. I have been told many times by friends to dump him and people on LS have insinuated many times that 'if it happened to them, they would run for the hills'.

 

Easy advice to dole out when you are not in that position. The truth is, like all things in life, it's a process of weighing up pros and cons. If I had no children, I would be more likely to leave. I would not consider having children with someone had cheated on me. But I don't have the luxury of that choice now. I have to weigh up the pros and cons of staying, not just for me, but for others who have no choice. Similarly, if a couple has no children but have been together for 20 years say, there might be more impetus to stay than say, in a couple who've been together 2 years only. So there is no straighforward answer, despite what many people like to believe.

[cuckolded husband]

My question to you is which is worst Hitting or an A? If a man hits a woman he is branded a wife beater no matter what her actions are even if a man is trying to get out of a problem. That is between man and wife. Where an A brings in the 3rd person.

[sylviaguardian]

My question to you is which is worst Hitting or an A? If a man hits a woman he is branded a wife beater no matter what her actions are even if a man is trying to get out of a problem. That is between man and wife. Where an A brings in the 3rd person.

 

Again, I would say hitting is worse becauase it is done with the intention to hurt someone. Affairs are not usually conducted because the WS wants to hurt the BS. It's more to do with the personality of the WS.

 

And I don't think it matters what the wife's actions were, it still doesn't justify hitting someone. How can hitting someone be the answer to getting out of a problem??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[cuckolded husband]

Again, I would say hitting is worse becauase it is done with the intention to hurt someone. Affairs are not usually conducted because the WS wants to hurt the BS. It's more to do with the personality of the WS.

 

And I don't think it matters what the wife's actions were, it still doesn't justify hitting someone. How can hitting someone be the answer to getting out of a problem??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

If someone gets in your face and knows how to push all the right buttons to make you mad thats the same as a hit. Women (I don't mean this in disrepect of any kind) can fight with words that men don't know how to reply back to My wife could ask me two questions in the same question and get mad if I answered 2nd one first and mad the other way, no win.

Would know how to rip my heart right out in a second if she wanted to same with most couples. I don't think that a person don't think they react and when it happens regret it when its done. I not talking about those people that hit and hit and beat and beat. Is there a differance?

Where the A is thought about the whole time it starts (this is wrong, my

W/H will leave me, if I get caught I'll Lie,) Where the hit is a release of anger, uncontrolable. I never ever think that either one is OK both are wrong I wish that I could Have a DO OVER . You can point fingers all day long about whats wrong and find that what I did to me is not so bad and what you did is so bad to you. Its a way to "justify" or try to make it better.