What's the deal with "If she's interested, she'll contact you?!"

[CaliGuy]

And sometimes doesn't take "no" as an answer if he knows already that the lady is interested.

 

If she says no, that isn't reciprocal and thus in my mind, I check out and move on to the next. I've no time for games like that.

 

To continue after she says no is the same a pursuing, being needy, etc. Not traits of a self-confident man.

 

Back to the night when my husband called me all night after he got cold feet... he finally got me on the phone by begging my mom to wake me up (I wasn't sleeping, of course ) and told me right away: "Tell me that you don't want to hear from me and I promise to NEVER EVER call you again." (He ALWAYS keeps his promises!!!) I was falling apart inside, but I knew what I had to do so I said: "I never want to hear from you again." He said: "OK, good-bye then" and we hung up.

 

Why the games?

 

The phone rang one minute later and the rest is history.

 

I'm sure there's more to it than that. Sounds a bit over-simplified.

 

When I say he chased me, I mean he did all the calls, visits, and suggestions. After his first phone call, I hadn't heard from him in a few days so I took his profile off my hot list. He emailed me to ask me why and if he should assume that I no longer want to communicate with him. He called me on the phone and we started from there.

 

He said "I love you" first. Of course I showed him how much I was interested - that was never an issue with us. I never played the hot-cold game (I played other games at times though!). I was always online for him, I even showed jealousy and clinginess.

 

He acted like a real man and LET ME act like a real woman, because he's the dominant type of male. When I played games, whether on purpose or unintentionally, they worked! He bit all the baits I threw to him.

But everything I did, I did out of love and eventually it brought us together.

 

Doesn't work on every man and most certainly not very confident men.

 

In marriage he's the head of the family, the boss. But it's funny to see him act like that cuz he does it so naturally and instinctively; it's not a family mentality or culture injection. He has this urge to lead and organize (which he also does at work). I love it when he tells me "Leave it to me, honey, I'll handle it, you don't worry about it!" I am like "Whew! Finally a male to lead me through life! " (by the way, he's very loving, caring, respectful and smart so don't try to imagine some low-class, quasi-macho beer drinker that burbs and farts while watching football!)

 

I'm a leader as well and I exemplify it through running my own business and I do lead in the relationship. I just won't let a woman get away with games if she wants to be in a relationship with me.

 

So I hope now you understand what I mean by chasing and which type of men can afford to chase women without being their puppies, but rather the alpha males. By chasing I actually mean courting, approaching, moving things forward...

 

Alpha males don't chase

 

CaliGuy, this thread was not about you as I don't see this problem with you.

 

I didn't think it was about me but some of the concepts you were throwing out there tend to lean towards soft, clingy males. I just wanted to clarify some of it.

 

I was inspired by one of my favorite members whose opinions I value a lot - our Alphamale. His attitudes, all except this one, are totally manly.. well that's just from my perspective as a woman.

 

I don't know much about Alpha so I can't speak for him. I was speaking for men in general.

 

So you admit that my story is successful because he chased me!

 

My personal opinion is he was a bit needy and clingy for my taste. To be honest had you said to me what you said to him I would have deemed you not worthy of my time and moved on And don't take it personal as it not meant to be that way. I just have a certain level of confidence that says if you insist that I do all the chasing, all the work to build this relationship then hey, have fun doing that with someone else. Relationships are built on both people putting in 100%.

 

The truth is: I didn't have to LET HIM chase me, he did it himself. HE was the one who asked me to visit me, I didn't invite him. HE was calling me every time I was away for a whole day. HE told me he missed me when I told him I didn't want to be in a non-exclusive relationship as I've never heard of that thing before in my life and broke up with him... I was just the one who rewarded him with love for all the effort.

 

Again, this sounds clingy/needy to me. I did this with my last g/f and none of that worked. She didn't want to be chased, she wanted to know I was confident enough in myself to let her be involved as well, which I didn't do.

 

Not sure how it works where you are from but here if you pursue like that you are showing a lack of self-confidence, neediness, clinginess, etc.

 

I wanted a prince, I didn't want to settle for a jerk who would pull my leg on and on. I didn't have time for that anymore...

 

Hmm, most women dream of a Prince and spend their lives chasing that dream. When they find one, he isn't going to be doing all the chasing, I assure you of that

[Outcast]

My personal opinion is he was a bit needy and clingy for my taste. To be honest had you said to me what you said to him I would have deemed you not worthy of my time and moved on

 

Exactly. That poor bugger's whipped. You, OTOH, understand about equal partnership.

[alphamale]

So I hope now you understand what I mean by chasing and which type of men can afford to chase women without being their puppies, but rather the alpha males. By chasing I actually mean courting, approaching, moving things forward...

THe man should be the leader and initiate things but you must remember that it is the woman who has the final say on whether or not he can move forward. Had you not been interested in him then no amount of courting, approaching or moving things fwd would have worked to seduce you. I agree it is a two way street but the female has final veto power. When the female finds a man she likes then she will make it easy for him to do the above things....do you understnad this RP?

 

In addition, you two were in a LTR and on different sides of the world so the rules are a little bit diffrent than a traditional relationship.

[MadDog]

When the female finds a man she likes then she will make it easy for him to do the above things....do you understnad this RP?

 

Perfect example: I called up a girl I recently kicked it with & told her we should hang out somtime & get some dinner, maybe watch a movie. She said she didn't know when the next night she'd have off was but would find out. 30 minutes later, I get a text from her saying she has X evening free this week & she wants to hang out.

 

It's obvious she made the effort to find out when she could get the night off so we could go out. That's what a girl who's interested will do. If she weren't interested, she would just not get back to me at which point I'd move on.

[alphamale]

It's obvious she made the effort to find out when she could get the night off so we could go out. That's what a girl who's interested will do. If she weren't interested, she would just not get back to me at which point I'd move on.

exact-a-mundo MADDAWG.....that was my point. That the female always has the final say on this stuff. Ergo, we have our new rule-of-the-day:

 

When a woman sees a man she wants she will go out of her way to make it quite easy for him to do what he needs to do to get her. Period.

[MadDog]

When a woman sees a man she wants she will go out of her way to make it quite easy for him to do what he needs to do to get her. Period.

 

Solid. I think the place where guys get tripped up is they don't understand this principle along with the principle, "A girl is either iinterested in you or she isn't. There's little you can do to make her interested but there's a lot you can do to make her lose interest."

[CaliGuy]

exact-a-mundo MADDAWG.....that was my point. That the female always has the final say on this stuff. Ergo, we have our new rule-of-the-day:

 

When a woman sees a man she wants she will go out of her way to make it quite easy for him to do what he needs to do to get her. Period.

 

You couldn't be more correct, Alpha.

 

It's men who don't get that whom end up chasing, chasing, chasing and eventually beating their heads up against a wall pursuing a woman who might have given a couple of positive buy signals but in the end decided not to spend the cash

[aleatoryd]

I think he meant that we should know when to stop chasing and move on.

[Guest]

CaliGuy - are you saying that men shouldn't chase....AT ALL???

 

Yes, to a degree.

 

Show interest in a confident, secure manner.

 

Be smart enough to know when she isn't interested.

 

Don't be clingy or desperate.

 

There's nothing attractive about that at all.

 

Eg:

 

Today I went to an Easter service. When I go, I'll usually go to the singles group. No less than three women hit on me. One sat next to me and would not shut up the entire service babbling about how she's new here, single, etc. I basically had to ignore her after a while. The other two were lobbing compliments at me left and right.

 

Too desperate/needy!!

 

Maybe it's the new me exuding confidence, I don't know. I'm just not ready to date yet I don't think. Maybe women can sense that? haha.

[CaliGuy]

CaliGuy - are you saying that men shouldn't chase....AT ALL???

 

Yes, to a degree.

 

Show interest in a confident, secure manner.

 

Be smart enough to know when she isn't interested.

 

Don't be clingy or desperate.

 

There's nothing attractive about that at all.

 

Eg:

 

Today I went to an Easter service. When I go, I'll usually go to the singles group. No less than three women hit on me. One sat next to me and would not shut up the entire service babbling about how she's new here, single, etc. I basically had to ignore her after a while. The other two were lobbing compliments at me left and right.

 

Too desperate/needy!!

 

Maybe it's the new me exuding confidence, I don't know. I'm just not ready to date yet I don't think. Maybe women can sense that? haha.

[amerikajin]

I think the degree to which a man is willing to chase simply determines the kind of woman he's going to get. It's not a matter of whether to chase or whether not to chase, because there are times you chase and times you don't; it's a matter of when to chase, and for how long you should continue said chase.

 

The chase (or whatever you want to call it)...yeah, I think men should be the 'aggressor' in the budding stages of a romance. I get rather bored when I don't have to chase. I know that's a s***ty attitude, but it's true. If I don't work for something, I take it for granted - because I know it's always something I can come back to if whatever I really want doesn't pan out. Women and men are really the same in this regard, we just see it from mirrored perspectives, and it sucks when we don't get what we want.

 

I believe men were born to be the aggressor. Most men actually want to have a little bit of control in a relationship, or at least feel like they're setting the pace and tone of the relationship (although women are really the ones making the final decisions here). Women in turn want a guy to come after them, for precisely the reasons RP stated. For eons, men were the natural born hunters of the pack - it is their job to pursue and to bring back the bacon to the camp site. It is this same trait that also describes a man's other natural tendency - to go out and seek out a mate. And a woman will instinctively assume that if a man don't got the nads to seek her out, then he ain't got the strength to do the rest of the chores around the camp. That isn't what she's thinking consciously, but biologically, that's what her instincts and hormones are sayin.

 

Likewise, men don't like it when woman get all macho and self-liberated to the point where they start taking charge and initiating things. Sure, the insecure guys do, but most really don't, and I guarantee you - the moment those shy guys start to feel comfortable around their mate, they, too, will start to think that things might have been a bit too easy and start to seek out someone more feminine.

 

Now, having said all that, there does come a point in time when I no longer want to chase, and I want to know whether the woman I am chasing wants to stop and let me catch her. If she keeps running, a man should stop running. It's as simple as that.

 

rant over

[RecordProducer]

Amerikajin... kuddos to you for this post!

 

CaliGuy, you're claiming that after my hubby (BF at the time) got cold feet twice and broke up with me (that was the first time he broke up with me) and left for the US earlier, he should've stopped at my first "no"? Why?

 

Just to show me how proud he is? He doesn't care about pretending, he does things as he feels them. He realized that he screwed up and he wanted another chance. He also knew that I was (still am) crazy about him and he was crazy about me so he wanted to repair the damage. Only seven days later we were married and neither of us ever regretted it so far.

 

According to you, after running away from me and leaving me one day prior to our scheduled wedding day, he should've let go of me just because I told him to leave me alone. Well I have my pride too. For how long should I have taken his cold feet? Do you think he wants a woman who has so little respect for herself to take just any crap?

 

And yes, it was as simple as that. A minute after we hung up, he called again and said that one beautiful year of love shouldn't be thrown away, that he wanted me, etc. We argued and talked for hours and finally got back together and he came and married me.

 

You talk about this confident and secure man all the time, but I get the feeling that your ex-GF is the only experience you've had (I bet you didn't have that many women in your life to acquire the necessary experience).

 

A self-confident man knows when to stop, when to push, and when to pull. My husband is the type of man that, if I told him I was leaving him, he'd open the door for me and remind me to pour gas on my way...

 

But if I really leave, he'd chase me to come back.

[CaliGuy]

CaliGuy, you're claiming that after my hubby (BF at the time) got cold feet twice and broke up with me (that was the first time he broke up with me) and left for the US earlier, he should've stopped at my first "no"? Why?

 

Just to show me how proud he is? He doesn't care about pretending, he does things as he feels them. He realized that he screwed up and he wanted another chance. He also knew that I was (still am) crazy about him and he was crazy about me so he wanted to repair the damage. Only seven days later we were married and neither of us ever regretted it so far.

 

According to you, after running away from me and leaving me one day prior to our scheduled wedding day, he should've let go of me just because I told him to leave me alone. Well I have my pride too. For how long should I have taken his cold feet? Do you think he wants a woman who has so little respect for herself to take just any crap?

 

As long as you are happy and everything worked out in the end, I can't say with 100% accuracy what would or would not have happened.

 

You both made some mistakes.

 

And yes, it was as simple as that. A minute after we hung up, he called again and said that one beautiful year of love shouldn't be thrown away, that he wanted me, etc. We argued and talked for hours and finally got back together and he came and married me.

 

You talk about this confident and secure man all the time, but I get the feeling that your ex-GF is the only experience you've had (I bet you didn't have that many women in your life to acquire the necessary experience).

 

Well without knowing me you're only surmising. I've dated a lot of women, but have only truly loved two my whole life. What I found with me at least is when I fell in love, I forgot who I was. I stopped becoming the man they loved and turned into a wuss.

 

I didn't learn anything the first time this happened but damn sure did the second time. I don't want this to happen again.

 

I can say that had I maintained who I was I would either be married or would have walked away from her when my gut told me to.

 

A self-confident man knows when to stop, when to push, and when to pull. My husband is the type of man that, if I told him I was leaving him, he'd open the door for me and remind me to pour gas on my way...

 

But if I really leave, he'd chase me to come back.

 

A confident man is balanced and doesn't chase if a woman plays games like that. He also wouldn't let it get to that point.

 

But if it was me and you said you were walking, I'd carry your bags to your car and wish you good luck.

 

If you can walk away from me easily, you never truly loved me.

[alphamale]

But if I really leave, he'd chase me to come back.

and what if he did not? if he has all these great qualitites then you know he could get another woman in a week or two....

 

personally, my whole life women have been chasing me (along with both my brothers). I just pick the ones I like and blow the rest off.

 

the famous blues musician BB King said "...if a woman likes a man, there ain't nothing gonna get in her way..."

[Lights]

What happened to "If HE is interested, HE will contact you?"

 

The words "It takes two" float through my twisted mind...

 

I consider myself a real, traditional, and feminine woman that wants the man to be a man and not a pussy.

 

Some of us are stuck in the second millennium. Others of us aren't.

 

And, oh no, don't imagine these strong-charactered women as tall and sexy professional ladies - they don't have time to be intrigued by your games or the patience to wait for you to make up your minds.

 

Right, right, and tall, sexy, professional gentlemen of strong character are supposed to put up with other people's games and have the patience to wait for everyone else to make up their minds?

 

I think you'll find that indecision and game-playing are not gender-specific.

 

Finding people of character depends on who the person is, not whether or not they contact whomever else or vice versa.

[RecordProducer]

As long as you are happy and everything worked out in the end, I can't say with 100% accuracy what would or would not have happened.

 

You both made some mistakes.

Well in LDRs it's easy to make mistakes so you gotta be flexible.

 

What I found with me at least is when I fell in love, I forgot who I was. I stopped becoming the man they loved and turned into a wuss.

I think you're still a bit shaken from your last relationship. I understand that, I was all screwed up after my first failed marriage, I thought all men were ass holes and didn't want to get attached ever again. But time wipes up the sour taste and brings new hope.

 

I didn't learn anything the first time this happened but damn sure did the second time. I don't want this to happen again.

I think you dated the wrong women. I had two awful long-term relationships within 10 years; then I met a good guy who was simply not for me and didn't accept my kids so the 4th time I decided that it's going to be the right guy. Once I decided that I knew what to look for. Don't just look inside yourself, CG, look around you and find the right girl this time.

 

A confident man is balanced and doesn't chase if a woman plays games like that. He also wouldn't let it get to that point.

An ideal man never makes mistakes, a smart man corrects them! Are you ideal or smart, CG?

 

But if it was me and you said you were walking, I'd carry your bags to your car and wish you good luck.

 

If you can walk away from me easily, you never truly loved me.

... and if you can let go of me that easily, you never loved me in the first place.

 

and what if he did not? if he has all these great qualitites then you know he could get another woman in a week or two....

Because he loves me? You don't chase someone because you can't find anyone better, but because you're in love.

Plus there's no one better than me!

 

Lights, I can tell that you were born in the 3rd millenium!

[RecordProducer]

the famous blues musician BB King said "...if a woman likes a man, there ain't nothing gonna get in her way..."

This is true - I played ole da games to get to mah mayn!

[CaliGuy]

... and if you can let go of me that easily, you never loved me in the first place.

 

Ah but see you would be the one walking away, not me.

 

I know I can't control others. I just give them choices and let them be free to make the choice they feel is best for them.

 

And yes, I consider myself a very intelligent guy. I don't pick bad people, I just have yet to understand love completely and be comfortable with myself when I am in love.

 

This has happened to me twice. It's not the women and I can't blame them. After reviewing all that's happened I don't blame them. I accept my faults and have vowed to change them because honestly, that's the only thing I have control over.

[amerikajin]

What I found with me at least is when I fell in love, I forgot who I was. I stopped becoming the man they loved and turned into a wuss.

 

It's weird...I have been feeling for the past few weeks that I am the cusp of something really big in my life, as things are beginning to take off in my current relationship (well, I'm cautiously optimistic anyway). But yet, I feel exactly what you're describing above. It's like, once she broke into the "I love you" territory, I started losing my grip and I have had to catch myself here a bit lately. I am not going to make this easy for her, because she's not going to make this easy for me.

 

I think the conclusion I'm coming to, Cali Guy, is that you have to appreciate the time you have with someone and leave it at that. I think that's the attitude I'm trying to adopt anyway, and it's been working so far in my latest trip down lovers lane. I don't know how far we're going down the same path, but I'm going to try to enjoy the time we're together. If we part ways, we part ways and I'll wish her the best of luck, and I hope she'd do the same. I think the problem for people like me, who have insecurities in relationships, is that we try to put too much stock in whether the relationship succeeds or fails. We start thinking in terms of winning and losing, and start trying to control aspects of the relationship. We start behaving mechanically, and we come across as devoid of the heart and soul that a woman really needs to keep a love burning. It's scaring me because this tendency of mine has already been identified in our relationship...I'm just hoping I can stop myself before I wreck this opportunity.

[CaliGuy]

It's weird...I have been feeling for the past few weeks that I am the cusp of something really big in my life, as things are beginning to take off in my current relationship (well, I'm cautiously optimistic anyway). But yet, I feel exactly what you're describing above. It's like, once she broke into the "I love you" territory, I started losing my grip and I have had to catch myself here a bit lately. I am not going to make this easy for her, because she's not going to make this easy for me.

 

Good of you to catch that. Be very careful that you don't slip into being a clingy, insecure guy just because you love her. The reasons she loved you were because you were genuine and who you really are. Never change that. Be vigilant to stick to who you are.

 

I think the conclusion I'm coming to, Cali Guy, is that you have to appreciate the time you have with someone and leave it at that. I think that's the attitude I'm trying to adopt anyway, and it's been working so far in my latest trip down lovers lane. I don't know how far we're going down the same path, but I'm going to try to enjoy the time we're together. If we part ways, we part ways and I'll wish her the best of luck, and I hope she'd do the same. I think the problem for people like me, who have insecurities in relationships, is that we try to put too much stock in whether the relationship succeeds or fails. We start thinking in terms of winning and losing, and start trying to control aspects of the relationship. We start behaving mechanically, and we come across as devoid of the heart and soul that a woman really needs to keep a love burning. It's scaring me because this tendency of mine has already been identified in our relationship...I'm just hoping I can stop myself before I wreck this opportunity.

 

I think you'll be fine, my friend. I wrecked my last relationship because I became that clingy, insecure, wussy guy that drives women away. I was always the one asking where we were and pushing, driving for us to be a steady couple when her feelings were always in doubt.

 

Had I just stayed the course she would have either come around (which I think she would have simply because I know she loved me too) or I would have been able to let her walk away confident that I was true to myself and didn't change who I was for her.

 

Keep a journal if you can and document anything you feel is necessary to help you stay on course. I know I am going to do that the next time I get serious with someone. Sounds a bit feminine but in order to make sure everything I have learned is not lost, I need some gauge of progress.

[RecordProducer]

Keep a journal if you can and document anything you feel is necessary to help you stay on course. I know I am going to do that the next time I get serious with someone. Sounds a bit feminine but in order to make sure everything I have learned is not lost, I need some gauge of progress.

Sounds feminine too much for my taste!

[SuperMonk]

This is true, girls that I have so/so interest or if I think it will be a struggle to get with her with will get secondary priority of me trying to contact her. Girls that I have a good chance with, I will be like a super sexual gigolo to her.

 

If there are girls that are somewhat intuitive with my own intuitive personality from which we both are quite compatible in terms of personality - I will use my super suavy skills. Trust me, the girl will always call with me just using my super skills. Usually I will be the one that is calling but only if the personality is super good between each other. If it's not or she has opinions vastly different than mines, I treat her like a friend and if that kinda girl wants to hook up, she'll have stronger signals. And WHAT IF she has a bunch of guys chasing her, who cares, like I want to be with a girl that is chased by a bunch of guys.

[MadDog]

And WHAT IF she has a bunch of guys chasing her, who cares, like I want to be with a girl that is chased by a bunch of guys.

 

I would. The girls who have a lot going for them normally have the most guys chasing after them. What kind of guy only wants a girl who no guy wants to go for?

[RecordProducer]

I would.

Good dog, MadDog!

[amerikajin]

It's a double-edged sword having a girl who gets lots of male attention. In my life, counting the one I'm dating now, I've dated two girls who made heads spin - and this one is in a category all of her own. It's been both exciting and nerve-racking at the same time.

 

It's not that I have major issues with self-esteem, because I generally like who I am. I know I have faults and I'm trying to correct them, but I'm generally honest about them. But knowing that everytime my girl walks into a bar that she's going to get hit on by damn near everyone there is something I'm not used to, and it's really tested my nerves. I think I've generally passed the jealousy and clingy tests so far, though. I've handled that part of it better than I thought I would.

 

The test I haven't passed so well is my own ability to address the things that irritate me about her. She's always late. And we're not talking like five minutes late, I mean she's sometimes ridiculously late. Always apologetic, but it's very irritating to deal with that. I once got a bit testy with her about it - not screaming loon testy, but I raised my voice and uttered an obscenity. And then most recently, while I did much better at not getting testy, I was a bit clumsy with my phrasing of things. I still think too much at times, and I need to learn to just let things go. I'm trying but it's not easy. Whenever I used to get rattled, I would often push harder and get super clingy and ask 'what's up'? in the relationship. Now I do the opposite, I just pull back and hide a little. That doesn't cure my tendency to over-think but it at least prevents me from annoying the s*** out of her.

 

This past weekend she basically told me she loves me, and she started pressing me, to which I finally admitted to having the same feelings. Honestly, I've been wondering whether or not all of this is moving too fast. I feel weird. I recognize that we are different people, and while I am attracted to her, I wonder how these differences are going to play out over time.