CaliGuy Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 I've been reading through a book on boundaries and two things came up that really cleared things up for me. In my "Guide to Second Chances" I mentioned letting go was essential. I couldn't explain it in detail why but the book does. It explains letting go this way: Letting Go "When you forgive you someone you let them off the hook. You are not holding on expecting something in return such as money loaned you will never see again or a thank you that is never coming. When you are unable to forgive someone you can not truly let go. You are holding on to them because you want something from them, even if it's revenge. And as long as you want something from them you will be unable to break your ties to them." This explains it brilliantly. Whether we are angry, resentful, owed money, owed an apology or whatever, as long as we hold them accountable for it we'll never be able to truly let go. That includes anger such as thoughts of revenge. Forgive them so YOU are able to let go and move on. Forgiving them sets YOU free. React vs Respond This one is really simple. When someone crosses your boundary or makes you angry, if you react to them (such as getting angry) you have given control of your emotions over to them. This isn't exclusive to love, it happens in every relationship (work, home, friends, etc). When you respond without reacting you are demonstrating that you are in control and are not going to hand control of your emotions to someone else. I'm sure these subjects have been discussed before but the way the book lays them out (and I'm writing this from memory so it may not be 100% exact the way the book says) is just brilliant and makes a lot of sense. Both center on us taking back control of our feelings through forgiving (Letting go) and responding rather than reacting. Hope you got something from this. I sure did.
riobikini Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 CaliGuy, I do agree with the concept regarding not giving over 'control' so easily by "getting angry"....but I feel that, maybe more definition/clarification to the "getting angry" part is needed....for instance: it's natural for me to become angry in response to someone's specific actions, -but it's my choice whether or not to display my anger. That act of displayed anger can easily turn the tables against you in some cases, -but anger is still not an emotion that is useless to us. Sometimes, showing/displaying some anger (with reasonable bounds) can make a person realize that you simply aren't kidding around, and have 'had enough', i.e. anger is a useful tool in highlighting to others our own personal (perhaps, sacred) boundaries when they just don't "get it", or they just don't care and keep trampling or encroaching upon the edges. But I do get your point, Cali.... Good research with the book. (Smile) -Rio
SmoochieFace Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 Feh. Anger is an emotion that denotes weakness, IMO. When you are angry you are allowing another person to have power over you and it reflects badly on your character. I learned early on that anger is not an emotion that works well with me... both me being angry - as it is pointless... and anger in others - which I laugh off. As I love to tell people who are *angry* - "Take your so-called *anger* and shove it far up your ass. It's s*** and that's where s*** belongs." God... I love the reactions I get from the *angry* when I blow off their *anger* with that... absolutely a RIOT!
riobikini Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 P.S. Anger, in lesser forms (annoyance, for instance) also helps us to protect and preserve some things we value about ourselves: our well-being and self-respect. -Rio
In Sync Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 The whole issue of anger in a relationship is a dicey one for me. I mean it's a reaction that we have, a tool that is vital, but all too often in a relationship (and in my case I speak of only) it was used as a tool to stifle the other. For, example: My ex would become angry which was sometimes went to rage, but it was out of proportion to what was a trigger for him. On hindsight, his anger shut me down from expressing my views. On hindsight though I wonder had I gotten angry back, would he have behaved differently, because I wasn't used to using it and saying enough.
qnmc Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 Totally agree with CG on forgiveness. It allows us to take our power back. Again, totally agree with responding versus reacting. A good book that expands on this subject is called Emotional Intelligence, by Goleman. It talks about how we have two brains, an emotional brain and a rational brain. When they're balanced, they work beautifully. The only problem is that your emotional brain is much faster to react than your rational brain because it is hard-wired into your fight-or-flight response. This is why we say things in the heat of the moment we later regret, things that often times become relationship killers. The solution? When you start to feel yourself getting emotional, you have to train yourself that this is a cue, a cue to view yourself as an outside observer and consciously say to yourself "I am getting angry." I've used this technique and somehow it gives you a sense of control over it. The book goes on to say that the early we catch ourselves being flooded the better we can take control. The more things escalate, though, the harder it is to take control. Not an easy task to do, but can really help in life.
KittenMoon Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 My ex would become angry which was sometimes went to rage, but it was out of proportion to what was a trigger for him. On hindsight, his anger shut me down from expressing my views. On hindsight though I wonder had I gotten angry back, would he have behaved differently, because I wasn't used to using it and saying enough. Ditto this, In Sync. My ex used to get way angry at the smallest stuff and YELL at me for no reason other than frustration. So the rest of the fight would be me staying calm and trying to tell him he couldn't yell at me like that because it was immature. And thusly I don't feel like I managed to get my points across because it became about the anger. Not like he listened anyways...
Author CaliGuy Posted April 10, 2006 Author Posted April 10, 2006 qnmc, excellent analysis! Rio, I understand getting angry is a personal defense mechanism. However, it's what we do with that anger that matters. For instance, whatever our ex's did made us angry. However, instead of acting on my anger (writing letters, emails, calling, etc) to tell her how angry I was I decided that I would redirect my anger into something positive such as taking back control of my emotions from her. And in the process I took back control of my life. The fight or flight analogy is a good one and I'll try and remember when I am feeling emotional to take a step back and see myself from the outside.
riobikini Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 That's one of the anger emotion's most noted reputations, KC -it has the ability to instantly shut down all communication. And CaliGuy, you are right: we can accomplish alot of good things just from the energy boost we receive from feeling the emotion of anger....if we can teach ourselves to direct it in such a way that produces something positive. But there's the 'rub', yet, again: learning to harness those emotions. (Smile) -Rio
Author CaliGuy Posted April 10, 2006 Author Posted April 10, 2006 But there's the 'rub', yet, again: learning to harness those emotions. That's where responding comes in. It simply means "I recognize my emotions are overflowing and I need to get control of them. Instead of reacting (like firing off an email right away or screaming back at someone) we simply stay quiet and think or don't reply to that email for a day or so. I've found that when I don't react to someone that has made me angry and take a day or two to sit on it I am much more ratiionl and in control of myself. For me, harnessing that anger comes with not reacting, but cooling off first before I respond
qnmc Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 I think a problem when couples come into conflict is in making it okay to take a break. When things get heated, oftentimes it turns into a win/lose situation. Solution: Early on in a relationship, sit your partner down in a comfortable, non-threatening environment and tell them that you want to figure out how you're going to fight. Come from the position that, hey, we're going to fight, it's inevitable. It is never the content of an argument that breaks a relationship, most couples fight about virtually the same things, rather it is the method in which your feelings are conveyed. Make it okay to take a break. Come to an understanding that when you fight you are not looking to hurt one another, rather it is the passion you are bringing to an argument that shows you are passionate about the relationship - you honestly want to make things better. Make it a standing ground rule that when one of you calls a time out, that's it. It's time to take a minimum 20 minute break (it has been shown in studies that this is the minimum time one needs to cool off) and then come back and discuss the issue more coolly. As we've seen from posts like KM's, it can't just be one of you remaining the cool head all of the time. Sure, one of you needs to be cool first to diffuse the argument, but by making it okay to take breaks, you can both hopefully return to the argument and discuss rather than fight.
alphamale Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 React vs Respond This one is really simple. When someone crosses your boundary or makes you angry, if you react to them (such as getting angry) you have given control of your emotions over to them. This isn't exclusive to love, it happens in every relationship (work, home, friends, etc). When you respond without reacting you are demonstrating that you are in control and are not going to hand control of your emotions to someone else.. The above is all fine 'n dandy in theory CG....but in real life it does not hold water. People are motivated mostly by their emotions...you forget this fact. Human history would have been quite different if the above held true in practice
KittenMoon Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 The above is all fine 'n dandy in theory CG....but in real life it does not hold water. People are motivated mostly by their emotions...you forget this fact. Human history would have been quite different if the above held true in practice While there's truth to this, it shouldn't stop anyone from trying. If you don't strive for control and improvement, you guarantee you'll never get it.
alphamale Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 While there's truth to this, it shouldn't stop anyone from trying. If you don't strive for control and improvement, you guarantee you'll never get it. well KM....I don't believe I stated no one should try. You must always keep practicality and the real world situation in mind. Theory is very nice and comforting but reality is what we actually live in on a day-to-day basis. One must blend the two and come up with a happy medium. Below is an example of a "happy medium": ...When someone crosses your boundary or makes you angry over a small thing and you react to them (such as getting angry) you have given control of your emotions over to them for something small. This isn't exclusive to love, it happens in every relationship (work, home, friends, etc). Ergo, sometimes it is justified to get angry and react when boundaries you feel strongly about are crossed, for we are all human. It is important to choose your battles in these types of situations.
In Sync Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 We'd all like to not to react or overreact, but take it in and then respond. Again, in a relationship there is always a powerplay. Maybe not in the bloom when everything is sweet and harmonious and the birds are chirping. BUT that fine line between not wanting to rock the boat and biting your tongue to letting it rip exists. I think in the early stages no one wants to reveal their hot tempers. But as time goes by that's when you see the power play in the relationship at work. How much does one sit on it until that breaking point...and then how each gets angry, is there yelling shouting crying in hysterics. Is the voice loud and booming. I recall my ex would explode, and to him..this was just raising his voice. To me it was simply out of control and threatening. If we are not taught as kids how to react vs respond it rears its ugly head in relationships where the intensity of passion is involved.
Author CaliGuy Posted April 10, 2006 Author Posted April 10, 2006 The above is all fine 'n dandy in theory CG....but in real life it does not hold water. People are motivated mostly by their emotions...you forget this fact. Human history would have been quite different if the above held true in practice So what you're saying is don't even try, right? Those that understand and apply the "respond instead of react" will be at a distinct advantage. Ever see a guy that doesn't lose his cool during a debate? He's responding, not reacting. It's quite possible to learn the skill if you are disciplined to do so.
alphamale Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 So what you're saying is don't even try, right? No, please see post #14
Author CaliGuy Posted April 10, 2006 Author Posted April 10, 2006 No, please see post #14 ...When someone crosses your boundary or makes you angry over a small thing and you react to them (such as getting angry) you have given control of your emotions over to them for something small. This isn't exclusive to love, it happens in every relationship (work, home, friends, etc). Ergo, sometimes it is justified to get angry and react when boundaries you feel strongly about are crossed, for we are all human. It is important to choose your battles in these types of situations. The trick here is recognize you are angry but not let your anger cause you to lash out. It's being in control (responding) of your emotions and not letting letting your emotions control you (reacting). You can still have consquences for having a boundary crossed without throwing a fit.
Pyro Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 ...When someone crosses your boundary or makes you angry over a small thing and you react to them (such as getting angry) you have given control of your emotions over to them for something small. This isn't exclusive to love, it happens in every relationship (work, home, friends, etc). Ergo, sometimes it is justified to get angry and react when boundaries you feel strongly about are crossed, for we are all human. It is important to choose your battles in these types of situations. The trick here is recognize you are angry but not let your anger cause you to lash out. It's being in control (responding) of your emotions and not letting letting your emotions control you (reacting). You can still have consquences for having a boundary crossed without throwing a fit. Agreed completely.
justagirliegirl Posted April 10, 2006 Posted April 10, 2006 Most people do know how to control our anger. Most of us manage to in the workplace and other situations. Why not do that with our loved ones?
Author CaliGuy Posted April 10, 2006 Author Posted April 10, 2006 Most people do know how to control our anger. Most of us manage to in the workplace and other situations. Why not do that with our loved ones? There is no difference. It's a character trait that can be learned.
Pyro Posted April 11, 2006 Posted April 11, 2006 There is no difference. It's a character trait that can be learned. It can be learned. Those who disagree are too stubborn to try it out.
Author CaliGuy Posted April 11, 2006 Author Posted April 11, 2006 It can be learned. Those who disagree are too stubborn to try it out. Heh, good point. There's a lot of stubborn people out there. All it takes is opening your eyes a bit, a little self reflection and resolve and the next thing you know, their world is looking brighter every day.
In Sync Posted April 11, 2006 Posted April 11, 2006 I'm not a person who shows her anger...I do get angry and therein lies the problem when a person who tries to keep it in, bite her tongue and the confronting of the person, be it your boss, lover, spouse or friend that has no problem letting it go and has that lack of control. It's very difficult for the one who is holding it back to just walk n given circumstances. For example, the angry boss. I've seen it in office workplace. The boss becomes angry explodes...your paycheck keeps you silent. As for a lover or spouse, we don't walk away when we should at the angry partner..why? Because we want to diffuse the situation or think we are diffusing it..but in that diffusing...you are also stressing on the inside and bearing the physical brunt. So the person who does show that anger so freely does do w/o consequences because the ones in control stay calm on the outside. Is that a good thing in the end?
Author CaliGuy Posted April 11, 2006 Author Posted April 11, 2006 I'm not a person who shows her anger...I do get angry and therein lies the problem when a person who tries to keep it in, bite her tongue and the confronting of the person, be it your boss, lover, spouse or friend that has no problem letting it go and has that lack of control. It's very difficult for the one who is holding it back to just walk n given circumstances. For example, the angry boss. I've seen it in office workplace. The boss becomes angry explodes...your paycheck keeps you silent. As for a lover or spouse, we don't walk away when we should at the angry partner..why? Because we want to diffuse the situation or think we are diffusing it..but in that diffusing...you are also stressing on the inside and bearing the physical brunt. So the person who does show that anger so freely does do w/o consequences because the ones in control stay calm on the outside. Is that a good thing in the end? You should be angry. But you shouldn't let it dictate how you respond. I don't think the point is to be passive about the situation at all, it's just to remain in control of your thoughts and don't let your emotions control you. In other words you don't want to say something you will regret later but don't let your boundaries be run over either.
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