How to avoid being a doormat? Signs of being one?

[blind_otter]

I'm assuming though that outside influences helped you realize you were an alcoholic. If your work was affected, your relationships, other people telling you over and over, your health, and finances... These were the outside interpretations I was talking about, not necessarily only from one person saying something. I assume if only one person had a problem with your drinking and nothing else was affected, then you would have no basis to believe you were an alcoholic. Maybe I'm wrong...

 

Yeah, this isn't actually the case. In order to go through AA you have to come to the realization yourself. No one told me to join, or even commented on my drinking, and my family was surprised when I told them. My old drinking friends were all surprised as well and thought I had a better handle on it. So no, this is a false assumption.

 

In your answers you said that boundaries had to be set for a reason. I was kind of under the impression that most people had reasons for everything.

 

In the example you gave, there was no reason offered, so you know -- not everyone is on the same page as you, and I couldn't have known that this was your basic assumption unless you presented it that way.

 

Or could justify nearly anything they do, even killing someone.

 

explain. Justifying an action is not the same as establishing boundaries, so I'm not sure why you brought this up?

 

I guess I'm wondering how to know if the boundaries you have set are fair and reasonable, and not overly exuberatant, or too little.

 

That's easy. How much are you like this . Hw muchare you like this . Do you feel people take advantage of you. Are you unhappy with the nature of your interactions with other? those determine wether you have good boundaries or not.

 

There are too many things in this world that cause us discomfort that still need to be done.

 

So you're telling me you don't differentiate between say, having to do your taxes, and being treated like less than a friend by a lover? I can almost always tell the difference between those two types of discomfort. That comes from cultivating self-awareness.

 

Doormats need to logic out the reasons for why they have set their standards and boundaries at specific limits, evaluate what is gained from them (more personal space, free time, energy, etc) and re-adjust any that are out of wack with their goals in life.

 

The dangerous game that people play when they break things down and over analyze and talk talk talk is that they can get lost in their words/thoughts and not follow through with action.

 

I say this because I have been prey to that way of thinking so much that it has seriously impacted my life in many ways. To become less entrenched in the thought process, and more involved in the actual act -- is a necessity. Doormats are stuck in their heads too much as it is. That isn't life, or living.

 

I know from experience.

 

 

She's fighting against the discomfort of offending her friends over the reward of personal time.

 

Why would this cause discomfort? If I don't have time, I don't have time. Why should it matter to have to explain it so much?

 

Fear, and negative outcomes.

 

To make extra consideration in order to live your life from a fear-based motivation? I think not. It's what I am learning about myself in AA -- to live your life because you are afraid is not living. It's an excuse. It's whiney. You need to get up and do, face your fear. Fear is no reason to do anything.

 

I wasn't asking because I don't have boundaries. I was asking to clarify the underlying thought process of setting boundaries. How you came to them, and how you set them.

 

I never said you didn't have boundaries.

 

But how can you have them if you don't really understand what they are?

 

In any event, try looking up the concept in wikipedia. They can give better answers than I. It's not like this is new research or anything. I believe it was popularized in the 1990s with the whole codependency fad.

[alphamale]

Yeah, this isn't actually the case. In order to go through AA you have to come to the realization yourself. No one told me to join, or even commented on my drinking, and my family was surprised when I told them. My old drinking friends were all surprised as well and thought I had a better handle on it. So no, this is a false assumption.

In the example you gave, there was no reason offered, so you know -- not everyone is on the same page as you, and I couldn't have known that this was your basic assumption unless you presented it that way.

explain. Justifying an action is not the same as establishing boundaries, so I'm not sure why you brought this up?

That's easy. How much are you like this . Hw muchare you like this . Do you feel people take advantage of you. Are you unhappy with the nature of your interactions with other? those determine wether you have good boundaries or not.

So you're telling me you don't differentiate between say, having to do your taxes, and being treated like less than a friend by a lover? I can almost always tell the difference between those two types of discomfort. That comes from cultivating self-awareness.

The dangerous game that people play when they break things down and over analyze and talk talk talk is that they can get lost in their words/thoughts and not follow through with action.

I say this because I have been prey to that way of thinking so much that it has seriously impacted my life in many ways. To become less entrenched in the thought process, and more involved in the actual act -- is a necessity. Doormats are stuck in their heads too much as it is. That isn't life, or living.

I know from experience.

Why would this cause discomfort? If I don't have time, I don't have time. Why should it matter to have to explain it so much?

To make extra consideration in order to live your life from a fear-based motivation? I think not. It's what I am learning about myself in AA -- to live your life because you are afraid is not living. It's an excuse. It's whiney. You need to get up and do, face your fear. Fear is no reason to do anything.

I never said you didn't have boundaries.

But how can you have them if you don't really understand what they are?

In any event, try looking up the concept in wikipedia. They can give better answers than I. It's not like this is new research or anything. I believe it was popularized in the 1990s with the whole codependency fad.

slow day at work today b_O?

[blind_otter]

slow day at work today b_O?

 

How did you guess? THis is what happens when I bust my ass. The next day I'm like....blaaaaahhhhh, I'm so booooored. I even volunteered to run an errand this morning.

[Walk]

But how can you have them if you don't really understand what they are?

 

hmm.. I'm upset by your remark.. Basically your saying I dont' have boundaries because I believe that people work from a gain/loss theory, instead of saying I go with my gut.

 

Interesting.....

[blind_otter]

hmm.. I'm upset by your remark.. Basically your saying I dont' have boundaries because I believe that people work from a gain/loss theory, instead of saying I go with my gut.

 

Interesting.....

 

I didn't say that -- your inference is yours alone. I was trying to see how you could have them if you don't understand them -- you insinuated that doormats do have boundaries, but weak or shoddy ones, so I wanted clarification. Don't get defensive, man.

 

Fundamental attribution error. Not everyone is taking the time out of their life to actually attack you. Sometimes it's just a misinterpretation.

[Walk]

I didn't say that -- your inference is yours alone. I was trying to see how you could have them if you don't understand them -- you insinuated that doormats do have boundaries, but weak or shoddy ones, so I wanted clarification. Don't get defensive, man.

 

Fundamental attribution error. Not everyone is taking the time out of their life to actually attack you. Sometimes it's just a misinterpretation.

okay... you said I had boundaries, then asked how a person could have them if they don't understand what they are. Then refering me to a place so I could learn what boundaries were.

 

never mind.. it's not you.. just pissy today. Sorry. Take care... I'm gonna go running and burn off some aggression.

[alphamale]

... I'm gonna go running and burn off some aggression.

OK, just leave your laptop at home

[blind_otter]

okay... you said I had boundaries, then asked how a person could have them if they don't understand what they are. Then refering me to a place so I could learn what boundaries were.

 

never mind.. it's not you.. just pissy today. Sorry. Take care... I'm gonna go running and burn off some aggression.

 

Dude, I feel like I'm arguing with my BF. You said, this. I said, that. Blah dee blah blah....I didn't want to make you feel bad and now I am totaly confused.

 

What the hell did I do? Jeeeeeebus.

 

Weird.

[starlight2025]

A doormat is a doormat for a reason. Obviously the doormat believes he's getting some kind of desirable reward out of being a doormat otherwise he would have no choice but to stand up for himself. In my own life I'm probably more of a doormat in my workplace than in my relationships. Why? because I feel it's the only way I can keep my job.

[basscatcher]

There are those of us who come from childhoods where we weren't taught healthy backgrounds.

Many of us end up in situations where we become abused. Mostly for me it was taken advantage of because I didn't want to say NO to anyone. I was afraid if I did then I would be punished.

 

 

When we are faced with discovering or nearing upon the discovery of a belief we thought was healthy really isn't we naturally will become pissy, defensive, arguementive, and in denial.

It's hard to accept that our beliefs are wrong when we thought they were right and there was nothing wrong with us.

 

I am one of those people who get pissy, I get attitude, I get very defensive because my belief has been challenged and I feel like I am being told that I am wrong; then I take that being wrong as being no good. I don't want to be told I'm no good; I'm wrong; what I believe is false. After all I learned from my mother and am I not suppose to trust my mother?

 

I am being told to test my beliefs all the time by a certain friend because I wasn't raised in a stable, healthy, loving and balanced home.

 

WALK--I hope your run did some good and you were able to feel better..

[blind_otter]

There are those of us who come from childhoods where we weren't taught healthy backgrounds.

Many of us end up in situations where we become abused. Mostly for me it was taken advantage of because I didn't want to say NO to anyone. I was afraid if I did then I would be punished.

 

 

When we are faced with discovering or nearing upon the discovery of a belief we thought was healthy really isn't we naturally will become pissy, defensive, arguementive, and in denial.

It's hard to accept that our beliefs are wrong when we thought they were right and there was nothing wrong with us.

 

I am one of those people who get pissy, I get attitude, I get very defensive because my belief has been challenged and I feel like I am being told that I am wrong; then I take that being wrong as being no good. I don't want to be told I'm no good; I'm wrong; what I believe is false. After all I learned from my mother and am I not suppose to trust my mother?

 

I am being told to test my beliefs all the time by a certain friend because I wasn't raised in a stable, healthy, loving and balanced home.

 

WALK--I hope your run did some good and you were able to feel better..

 

That was really nice, Pada. I like the way you put that together.

 

I can be harsh sometimes, when I look back on what I read. I am that harsh with myself, as well, so I forget that it can make people really upset.

[basscatcher]

That was really nice, Pada. I like the way you put that together.

 

I can be harsh sometimes, when I look back on what I read. I am that harsh with myself, as well, so I forget that it can make people really upset.

 

Some time's harsh isn't the correct word to call what you are doing..

 

I would say you are direct, you don't sugar-coat things when you fully believe what you are saying. I understand your intent is not the hurt anyone but to have the effect that the person you are attempting to help will see reality the way you see it.. That person can then have another angle or view point to test their beliefs.

 

B_O - I know you know that we ARE our WORST critics... NO ONE can be harder on us then OURSELVES.. Sometimes (actually often) I am told to lighten up on myself because I will tear myself down for things I said or did wrong or for bad choices.. You are a wonderful, caring, and helpful lady...