whichwayisup Posted March 23, 2006 Posted March 23, 2006 I know he has interest in me but why doesnt he know how he feels about me? he is so confusing. Because of his past...How quickly things got started...Intiated by him, yes, but it did move fast - And because of that, you let your feelings grow..Which maybe scared him. Just remember he IS being honest. Hurts, yes, but in an honestly approached way. I'm glad I didn't come off harsh, and you took it as a reality check. (I got the VISIT today by a certain big DOT, lol, so I'm being careful how I word things today...) they would have already passed a number of tests to even make it to the six month mark... Yeah, that made me laugh alpha. I could only imagine...(Leave me, to my sick and tainted thoughts...la la la...)
whichwayisup Posted March 23, 2006 Posted March 23, 2006 Gawd I don't want to hear this. I don't want my life to whirlwind down. This is not settling with me. I can't swallow it. I can't accept it. Not yet. DO not go there. That isn't what he is thinking...You are right, you shouldn't have to accept that now or even make it a possibility.
Author basscatcher Posted March 23, 2006 Author Posted March 23, 2006 DO not go there. That isn't what he is thinking...You are right, you shouldn't have to accept that now or even make it a possibility. I can't see it with everything he and I have shared. We havent abused each other. Neither of us has physically abused the other. Neither of us has been unfaithful (TMK). It's just the matter of how he feels about me. In all aspects.
whichwayisup Posted March 23, 2006 Posted March 23, 2006 This has nothing to do with abusing...I don't know why you'd bring that up? I am not sure if all of it has to do with his feelings...It doesn't just boil down to ONE particular thing. I don't think right now is the time to be talking about that stuff. I have my own thoughts on it, but the timing is not right to open that open today.
Author basscatcher Posted March 23, 2006 Author Posted March 23, 2006 This has nothing to do with abusing...I don't know why you'd bring that up? I am not sure if all of it has to do with his feelings...It doesn't just boil down to ONE particular thing. I don't think right now is the time to be talking about that stuff. I have my own thoughts on it, but the timing is not right to open that open today. I bring up abuse because most of what I have known in my life has volved around abusive relationships. Myself, my family, witness and endured with friends. I have witnessed most relationships I've been in or around have broken up due to abuse. that is most of my knowledge regarding breakups.. You have me curious what you think... Im gong to go take a nap. I need it. I'm exhausted.
whichwayisup Posted March 23, 2006 Posted March 23, 2006 I will tell you, it's not that crucial...Just think right now the timing isn't right. Your frame of mind, that's all. I understand your reasonings - Relationships ending because of abuse, so maybe in your mind, what is worth breaking up about if it isn't about abuse? Try not to let your thoughts take over. You need a break from all this, otherwise you will make things harder for yourself.
Delectable Posted March 23, 2006 Posted March 23, 2006 How much time does a guy need to figure out what he feels for a woman??? Pada: I am very much aware of how you feel...you were so kind to me when I posted on this subject: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t77981/ It's almost 9 months and still no I love you from Mr. Wonderful...but I know he cares...so much...and accourding to our AlphaMale for me? six month minimum and a year maximum.... so I will remain as patient as I can... Your need for physical affection is valid. I am learning to "learn by what Mr. Wonderful does not what he says" as actions speak louder than words...so you do need these actions from Charlie...I hope he realizes that. (((((((((hugs for pada))))))))))
blind_otter Posted March 23, 2006 Posted March 23, 2006 I can't see it with everything he and I have shared. We havent abused each other. Neither of us has physically abused the other. Neither of us has been unfaithful (TMK). It's just the matter of how he feels about me. In all aspects. IMO people who have experienced a lot of abuse in their relationships will settle for what other people who haven't gone through that experience would consider intolerable. They learn to live of scraps, so they can find emotional sustenance with very little to work with. I hope you feel better soon.
riobikini Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 Pada, I'm not sure if anything I have to share does anything but just mirror some larger chunks of what you are going through and cast doubt on any hope of the overall picture of your circumstances turning out a positive outcome. On the other hand, the possibility of what I'm sharing about my recent circumstances which are so similar to yours in many ways, may be useful in knowing, as I have stated, the darker side. I don't know how often these kinds of circumstances (commitment, lack of communication and affection issues) are repeated within our society, on any basis of time, -but the more I look at this thread and research others, here, -it may be overwhelmingly more than I ever thought. And I wonder why that is. Is it an issue brought on by the way we've voiced our opinions so publicly about such private matters? Is is because men, in general, during recent years have felt so 'put upon' by the way women (or all of us) have bantered the subject of women's preferences in regards to emotionally strong men vs emotionally weak men to death in our forums and tv shows and books so much so, -and still haven't come up with the 'right' answer, and have done nothing more than cause more generations of men to withdraw and become so confused that they adopt these dysfunctional behaviors and patterns? Is is a societal issue? There's no question it has always existed, but has it (CP, lack of willingness to communicate, and/or show affection) escalated due to a specific reason brought on by ourselves? Man, I don't know the answer to that, -but I'd just about give my right arm to know. -Rio
Author basscatcher Posted March 24, 2006 Author Posted March 24, 2006 Your need for physical affection is valid. I am learning to "learn by what Mr. Wonderful does not what he says" as actions speak louder than words...so you do need these actions from Charlie...I hope he realizes that. (((((((((hugs for pada)))))))))) Yes, physical affection sometimes can give me more stability then the time. I remember that post. I went back and reread it. Like you--I was accepting Charlies actions more then his words but his actions started to fade a bit and I started to question. I expressed to Charlie that I think maybe his actions faded because he became comfortable with me and therefore didn't have to work at 'catching me'. Charlie needs his space and I understand that. I am feeling that I have pleaded with God (in prayer) to help him and to open up his heart and mind to reality and allow him to find his answers through reality and not through fear or selfishness. I cannot BEG God to make him feel a certain way; but, I believe God can help him see truth. Six months to a year is drastic in my beliefs. Right now, at about 6 months, is the point where Charlie is looking into what he feels. If I were you, would be cautious still in your situation. If your Mr. Wonderful is expressing himself through touch, affection, glances, time, and not expressing his words he may just be afraid to hear himself say those words.. Charlie has backed off on his touch.. It is weird. I think your better off then I am right now. IMO people who have experienced a lot of abuse in their relationships will settle for what other people who haven't gone through that experience would consider intolerable. They learn to live of scraps, so they can find emotional sustenance with very little to work with. I hope you feel better soon. Yes this is true, I use to be this way. I have up'd my level of acceptance and pushed out my boundries greatly. I am not a dog and not even a dog should be treated badly as such many of us have endured.. I fall hard for the ones who actually treat me good physically and respectfully
Author basscatcher Posted March 24, 2006 Author Posted March 24, 2006 Pada, I'm not sure if anything I have to share does anything ------------ Is is a societal issue? -Rio Yes, what you have said does make a difference. Just knowing someone understands is a huge comfort. The support I have recieved here on LS has been some of the best support and advice I have EVER recieved in my life... Experience makes us better experts then the experts sometimes.. Is CP a societal issue? I think it is. Is the dysfunction of men and womens roles due to societal issues? I think it is. Is the dysfuction of men and womens feelings about love and commitment due to a societal issues? I think it is. Simply because we are a society of copy-cats. We think the grass is always greener on the other side. We thing that the neighbors have a better life and are happier then we are. We want what everyone else has and therefore we take it or we subconciously run after that same thing only to be left disappointed if we get it too. We are a selfish and greedy people. We are typically self-centered and this world has become a ME ME ME ME ME society.. I know I find this in myself.. I have very often went against the grain of what people think as 'normal' and I've been called strange, weird, odd, goofy. It's written all over in my High School year books. I dared step out of the trends and social norms. I still do. I am ME.. If being true to what my feelings and instincts say makes me out of the loop then so be it.. I think too many people follow the social 'norm'.. Even in relationships. I like to look at other peoples thoughts, feelings, experiences, opinions, ideas, similiarities to find other stimuli to help myself. I don't take a trend and follow it through. Maybe most of the regulars here in LS feel the same way. We feel different then the majority of he public and that is why we are all drawn in here? We acknowledge what we feel & think. We don't kill it. We are trying to accept what we feel & think. We don't run from it. I have met lots of people in the real world that hold all this in, move about life like a robot. They put on simulated smiles to fit in and they go home feeling numb. I think our society of 'you have to have this, you need to be like that, you must do this and that' has made all of us confused in this world. Since when did men become weak? Since when did women become bitchs? Do you think our sexs were thought of like this in caveman days????
riobikini Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 RE: Pada: " He said he isn't ready for marriage (I stopped him and said I am not either but someday I would like it.) He said he may not be ready for 10 years he didn't know. I said I understood that also because I'm not ready for marriage either. I don't want to rush into it." B** also slipped in his question of this one day, -he asked it this way: " Would you just live with someone or do you have to be married to them?" I was driving, trying not to seem like it was even a topic I wanted to discuss, -yet, I was glad he brought it up. I replied to him, " I like marriage, at some point -if I'm in a 'forever' type relationship, but its OK to be in an alternative committed relationship...it just depends." The weight in my answer obviously shifted more to the former than the latter, to which he replied, " No, -you would live with someone, -wouldn't you?" I just smiled, -but gave no answer. The real answer I was thinking: "Yes, -but it still would depend...." It all goes to show, they (men) do want to know your views on the subject -and I truly think- its because its a subject that's always going to scare the hell out of them, and they want to get the facts straight on it right off the bat. Relieves a big chunk of stress off their shoulders. More time and room to play, -if your answer was the 'right' answer. ___________________________________________________ On this subject: Pada: " He said he doesn't even know if he wants to be in a serious relationship right now.. (Know what the hell---this pisses me off ..Why string me along for almost 6 months then tell me this. WTF? Why was he paying big $$ for a matchmaking service then?)" Deja vu (as I'm falling off my chair!) Same lines, different man. Actually, your reaction was also the same as mine. I was appalled, angered, shocked, hurt...hell, -you name it, I probably felt it. I kept thinking, " How can someone all grown-up do that??? Didn't he realize I have feelings, too? But like you say, below, regarding Charlie, -I believe he really did know. He must have. So what was he thinking? -or was he thinking, at all? At least, Charlie admitted he knew you had feelings for him. Whether that's significant to your outcome or not remains to be seen. I hope it is, -and I hope its a positive outcome. ________________________________________________________ RE: Pada: " He told me he understood that I was having a hard time right now. I said I am, a very hard time. He said he knows how I feel about him. He said said to be a tough chic and don't start crying. He reminded me he likes tough chics not weak ones. Shyt he needs to piss me off then.. " Only a short comment on the above, -B** also seemed to prefer stronger women. Looking back, I see that as part of why certain women may attract him while others do not. Also, it may allow him to be less responsible to them emotionally, due to his thinking they are strong enough to do without him, or do without emotional feedback, or the worst one: maybe they think she's tough enough to easily survive a heartache. _________________________________________________________ RE: Pada: " I didn't pour my feelings out to him. I held them back but I did give him enough to remind him I care deeply for him." Me, either. I didn't want to overload the emotional input and overwhelm him with how I felt, so I didn't tell him how I felt, -but I did go far enough that anyone with a single brain cell would have known. Also, not gushing my feelings, while his were still in question, was a way to protect myself from appearing majorly stupid. (My feelings about that, now? -Duh!) _____________________________________________ RE: Pada: " Neither of us has been unfaithful (TMK)." We discussed the issue of having/seeing other partners. That was at the very beginning. Since neither one of us (I thought) wanted to see other people and were truly seeking a monogamous relationship, we were in agreement right away. Now, looking back, I can see where I just may have been the only faithful partner, after all. Which really pisses me off for two excruciatingly important reasons: having other sex partners increases health risk -and two- I trusted him. For the record, I'll just purposely leave out the part where I loved him, -it didn't matter. Pada, I hope some of this may help you in knowing where to turn in your own situation. -Rio
Author basscatcher Posted March 24, 2006 Author Posted March 24, 2006 I like reading your comparisons. Your words are interesting. You make my mouth go 'awe' and laugh out loud. May I ask where you are now with your B**?
riobikini Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 B** and I began the downward slide in November just before Thanksgiving, when I began to notice the same things you have begun to notice now. It progressed downhill pretty fast, but it seemed like everything moved in such slow-motion for me, -I guess, due to the extra-terrific emotional trauma it caused me. I'm normally a very 'prepared' person, ('a place for everything' kind of person) and wasn't expecting any of this happening to me...(Smile)..I was the last person who'd ever let something like this happen to herself, -Right? I heard from him in person just before Christmas, -we went to dinner- but then I couldn't take the strain of just not knowing, and having to guess his feelings and just resented the feeling of not making sense of anything that was going on in my life or happening to me. I refuse to feel like a victim in anything, and I despise being kept in this sickening 'limbo...so I bluntly ended it myself, just after Christmas. The whole holiday season last year was a blur and was marred so terribly by all this, it was near-impossible to keep things 'normal' for my two young daughters, at home, and who, by the way, absolutely adored B**. I did not hear his voice again until two weeks ago when he called my cell phone. Reason for the call: There had been these little emails between us being exchanged since the break. None of them really gave or got significant or hopeful-sounding information about each other, but, rather were just an annoying form of e-contact that only served as a painful reminder. I finally had enough of them appearing in my email, so I sent him a note telling him to discontinue the little emails and that I did not want to be friends, either. You see, I cannot do that, -being friends is out of the question after all I had been through. After receiving the email from me, he obviously had an excuse to respond via phone. So he did. He admitted to being a commitment-phobe....I was shocked he admitted it! I told him to get help, he said he probably needed it. (Still hanging onto a shred of denial, there, Pada, despite his outward admission) He said he was sorry...again I was shocked....he said he felt 'guilty'. Again, I was/am surprised. What he does about his problems, only time will tell. We haven't spoken since the call. Would I accept him back? God needs to be involved in that answer....I only live in circumstances, as they are, which I cannot change, and must accept them, -those which I can change, I do. The rest is not up to me. -Rio
Author basscatcher Posted March 24, 2006 Author Posted March 24, 2006 A part of me is kind of at that crossroad myself if I should end it and stop the lingering-drawn out wait for him to figure out what he wants and how he feels about me and let him have a chance to come back if I don't move on first. I don't know how much patience I have to wait for him to discover himself. I love him but not so much I would wait forever for him. My love for him is still new enough that I can move on. (after some time has passed.) I am not ready to make that decision yet. I think I should give him a week or two first. He just started his distance. Like you I am usually prepared and set up a possible plan for survival--even if I don't need it or use it I prepare a road to turn down if I should need too. It's my safety net. I don't do well floating in tow of a man who is aloof.. At least if I chose to end it while he is floating around himself he wont feel the added pressure of keeping in check with me and I can feel free to go about and do as I PLEASE without feeling guilty if I find myself attracted to someone else while I am out and about. He doesn't know what he feels for me this far into the relationship who is to say he WILL DISCOVER he does? He surely doesn't know. Why should I wait months and months for him.. It is true emotional torture. I don't want to be waiting, wondering, holding myself back, in toil and dispair. I don't want that pain.. Maybe that is what is going on with me right now. All these rollercoaster feelings is me disconnecting already and his Not Knowing/Self Searching is the same thing.. ? Weird how from day to day I am changing my outlooks, thoughts and feelings.. hmm I don't understand myself these days.
a4a Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 A part of me is kind of at that crossroad myself if I should end it and stop the lingering-drawn out wait for him to figure out what he wants and how he feels about me and let him have a chance to come back if I don't move on first. I. Pada (again not being mean, just trying to help) you are going through hell waiting for a guy that could not provide you with the primary things that you need out of a relationship. Are you hoping he comes back as the man you want him to be? Sorry you are so upset.
riobikini Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 RE: Pada: " Maybe that is what is going on with me right now. All these rollercoaster feelings is me disconnecting already and his Not Knowing/Self Searching is the same thing.. ? The feeling of becoming slowly 'disconnected', like a program faltering in the background, was something I experienced, too. It was also what I meant when I said, in one of my earlier posts, that B** had already 'deleted' or begun 'deleting' me from his life before I was even aware. I believe it was because he had already recognized my discontent, and knew, from his own past experiences with this, exactly what was next. So he didn't exactly fight it. I think CP's live in a kind of consistently 'numb' mode with their emotions, always expecting (knowing) that its likely to end, so they don't invest too much with feelings, which only goes to support my personal, experiential theory that this causes them to live in a cycle. I guess, Pada, you could say that someone who has trouble embracing romantic feelings is always 'disconnected'. ____________________________________________ RE: Pada: " Weird how from day to day I am changing my outlooks, thoughts and feelings.. hmm I don't understand myself these days." I found myself on that same roller-coaster. Strange, -I didn't notice any funny-looking little guy selling tickets to that ride...the gate was standing wide open... -Rio
Walk Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 Wondering... You said Charlie initiated the majority of the steps in the relationship. First contact, first kiss, first dates, etc. I'm wondering if maybe (could be very wrong on this) he got scared about where the two of you were heading when you started placing more demands on him? Ie. more affection and communication. Since the relationship had been set up so that he was the one making all the first steps when he was ready. Was it a case of your stepping up and saying you wanted more, and him viewing it as a next level? And since he didn't initiate the next level, he backed off? This isn't coming out as clearly as I had hoped. Basically, I'm wondering if part of the reason he was so happy in a relationship with you is because he didn't feel threatened. He was allowed to take his time, and do things at his own pace. And now you've asked for the pace to be quickened, and he hadn't gotten there yet. And because of his past, he doesn't feel ready to move forward yet, so he has withdrawn. Maybe feeling as though you've pushed the issue, and you are asking for a decision right now on whether he wants to spend the rest of his life with you. (ie bringing up the topic of marriage and not being ready) So instead of just questioning his feelings for you, he's attempting to decide if the 6 months of knowing you has created a deep enough level of love and trust in order to commit the rest of his life with you. Not just "does he love you". But will he be with you forever. And I think that would scare the shyt outta any man. I could be completely off base on this one. Just was wondering if maybe that's how he's feeling. He sounds like a man who likes to do things his way, feel in control of the situation, and now he's lost the control he felt he had. Which possibly scares him.
blind_otter Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 Pada (again not being mean, just trying to help) you are going through hell waiting for a guy that could not provide you with the primary things that you need out of a relationship. Are you hoping he comes back as the man you want him to be? Sorry you are so upset. I think this bears repeating and is an important question to reflect on right now.
alphamale Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 I think this bears repeating and is an important question to reflect on right now. actually the reasons for his behaviour could be any of a multitude of things. there is really no sense in trying to analyze it. who knows what motivates people to act in certain ways or to do certain things.
riobikini Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 RE: Walk: " I'm wondering if part of the reason he was so happy in a relationship with you is because he didn't feel threatened." I think you have a point with this. Again, though, speaking from my experience, it appears to me, that people who are stuck in a pattern of holding back emotionally in a romatic relationship, seem to only be able to operate within the 'non-threatening', more 'superficial' mode that defines the distinctive beginnings of a relationship, -but never the deepening mode. When the 'deepening' part is expected, they withdraw, automatically. Now whether their fear of the expected 'deepening' is coming directly from their partner, or whether it is coming from the knowledge of their past experiences, is a question I have asked myself. Could very well be both. They seem to only be able to be happy with the beginning phase, where nothing -yet- is expected. This is, I believe, where the 'eye' or nucleus of the cycle is: we all know that certain hormones creating a kind of 'high' is mass-produced during the intitial phase of a relationship (the attraction or 'lust' stage). It is based on how attracted you are -mostly in a physical sense- to your partner. But during this 'lust' stage, is it not possible that these who are having problems with allowing or accepting deeepening feelings, may just be using the euphoric 'high' produced in this stage of the relationship to soothe and mask the pain and fear of 'letting go' of their feelings and being in a committed relationship, due to negative past experiences with it? Just my theory. -Rio
whichwayisup Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 I agree with alpha. Noone right now knows what is going on inside Charlie's head, except Charlie. I don't think sitting around, trying to figure it out is a good thing for Pada right now. She needs to focus on herself during this time. She can't be consumed by this 24/7.
alphamale Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 Noone right now knows what is going on inside Charlie's head, except Charlie. Chances are that even Charlie does not know what is going on inside his head...
Art_Critic Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 Chances are that even Charlie does not know what is going on inside his head... Actually Alpha it is my opinion that Charlie does know.. he just hasn't figured out how to tell her yet without hurting her more.
whichwayisup Posted March 24, 2006 Posted March 24, 2006 Chances are that even Charlie does not know what is going on inside his head... Coming from you, that makes sense...But I personally think he knows - And just needs time to think about what he wants, how he feels.
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