Last Night................

[CeeJayXX]

I have found that my MM comes to me to discuss his health because he doesnt know what to say to W to not upset her. I try to give him insight to where her head is in all of this and how much he means to her. (They actually have a very close relationship)....She knows he and I are best buddies and has always supported that because when no one else can get through to him, I can and she has relied on me for that for a very long time.

 

I think NC isnt an option.....I think it would create a more upseting and ill filled life unless its something you must do. I know I will be jumped on for my thoughts. I will never allow NC between me and my partner. It just isnt an option we will allow......not after 3 years.

 

Thanks for your support. My thoughts are with you.

[serial muse]

basically it was just a fact that there marriage is bad anyway and depending on how crazy she gets over this it may just finally be enough and he will leave......

 

Wait...how do you know their marriage is "bad"? Didn't you say before that he never talks about her and you were really curious so you looked her up online, wanted to see her picture, etc.? The fight you mentioned was probably about her suspicion that he's having an affair. Seems like kind of a reasonable thing to fight about.

 

Look, I just hope you're not just going on the strength of his word about them. It's far safer to assume you don't know the whole story either.

 

i don't understand why she would have told me what his reason was for texting me...... if the situation were reversed and it was me calling the ow i sure as heck wouldn't be telling her what my husbands story was..... i would of ask why she was texting him and seen what she said to see if the stories matched....... i guess i feel like now all i have to do is stick to the story he used......

 

I don't know, this doesn't seem that complicated to me. Perhaps she just wanted to appeal to you, person to person, woman to woman, whatever. Maybe she's just a direct sort of person who simply wants to know the truth, already.

 

And you have to remember that she's probably in a lot of shock. You've had time to think over what you'd do, but she hasn't, and is probably just reacting without planning too much in advance. Knowing that someone's lying and also telling you you're crazy for thinking what you think - it's the most maddening, hurtful feeling in the world, especially when it comes from someone you trusted. Her husband's a champion liar. You're the only other possible source of information. So she calls.

[Sup?]

isn't this forum to support people not lay our moral bible thumping BS on the OW/OM?

 

just checking,cause seems like there are people in this thread just posting here to jump on thread starter..(like this guest person) not very helpful if you ask me.

 

 

 

yes. what we talked about in another thread..this is why even with the lies I'm learning my MM is spinning..he really has become my dearest friend and I am certian I'm his...it's going to be like my best friend has died when it's over

 

With out Morals, there would be NO laws, and many of Americas laws ARE founded on the bible. So if they are trying to remove God out of everything, they would also have to abolish ALL laws that we know and uphold. The end result WOULD be chaotic.

[CeeJayXX]

With out Morals, there would be NO laws, and many of Americas laws ARE founded on the bible. So if they are trying to remove God out of everything, they would also have to abolish ALL laws that we know and uphold. The end result WOULD be chaotic.

 

And you speak a world of truth....BUT this is an OW/OM forum .... supporting each other in however we can. Most of the posts here do recognize that we know we arent right in being an OW but also arent ready to walk away from a situation we are in.....YET. In saying that, I don't think its neccessary to shoot us where we stand.

 

I can appreciate your words completely.(and this comment is not intended towards you)..but for some of the comments that Ow's have received on this forum, I wish I could live on the perfect side of the fence...where choices in life that were made were always the right ones.

[lovernotafighter]

I have found that my MM comes to me to discuss his health because he doesnt know what to say to W to not upset her. I try to give him insight to where her head is in all of this and how much he means to her. (They actually have a very close relationship)....She knows he and I are best buddies and has always supported that because when no one else can get through to him, I can and she has relied on me for that for a very long time.

I think NC isnt an option.....I think it would create a more upseting and ill filled life unless its something you must do. I know I will be jumped on for my thoughts. I will never allow NC between me and my partner. It just isnt an option we will allow......not after 3 years.

Thanks for your support. My thoughts are with you.

 

wow, you really have a amazing relationship with your MM. I commend you. I can't imagine how hard this must be for all of you.

 

and honestly if my MM were diagnosed with cancer right now I wouldn't leave him either..though it would kill me not to be there the way I'd like to be. at least I'd know I was in any capacity possible.

 

as far as me though if my lump does turn into something..I am perplexed as to even tell him more..I already told him it's probably nothing even though inside I'm freaking out.

 

we had a relationship built on total trust and this past week found he hasn't been as honest as I once believed..I'm not mad at him just disappointed and might try NC for all reasons..though it's going to be harder if I'm sick and need him to be here for me in some way.

 

thank you too,I wish you the best

 

And you speak a world of truth....BUT this is an OW/OM forum .... supporting each other in however we can. Most of the posts here do recognize that we know we arent right in being an OW but also arent ready to walk away from a situation we are in.....YET. In saying that, I don't think its neccessary to shoot us where we stand.

I can appreciate your words completely.(and this comment is not intended towards you)..but for some of the comments that Ow's have received on this forum, I wish I could live on the perfect side of the fence...where choices in life that were made were always the right ones.

as wrong as we can seem to others the truth is if god didn't want us to love it wouldn't be possible...it is the jealousy of human nature that's makes our love for others damnable sin.. ever read "conversations with god" ? it describes to love with out condition..if we all could do that this world would be a better place.

With out Morals, there would be NO laws, and many of Americas laws ARE founded on the bible. So if they are trying to remove God out of everything, they would also have to abolish ALL laws that we know and uphold. The end result WOULD be chaotic.

so after saying what I just did Sup? to you, cast a stone if you are in fact with out what the bible (not I) calls sin.

if not take your soap box else where,we are trying to support each other here not listen christian rhetoric

[CeeJayXX]

Must ask you this.... you said he wasnt as honest as you thought?.... My OM and I have had days were he hasnt quite told me everything that maybe I should or shouldnt know.....(actually his W filled me in on personal details that he actually hadnt shared with me...whoops!)...anyway, I guess as the OW I just dont expect everything to be completely honest all the time....after all, I am the OW....second on the list.....and I respect that.

 

Not trying to talk you out of your relationship. I wish I was first on MM's list but I know that it isnt possible....that agreement was made from the beginning. It can be tough at times but I look at how much detail he shares with his other close friends and then see what detail he shares with me...there is quite a difference.

[lovernotafighter]

Must ask you this.... you said he wasnt as honest as you thought?.... My OM and I have had days were he hasnt quite told me everything that maybe I should or shouldnt know.....(actually his W filled me in on personal details that he actually hadnt shared with me...whoops!)...anyway, I guess as the OW I just dont expect everything to be completely honest all the time....after all, I am the OW....second on the list.....and I respect that.

 

Not trying to talk you out of your relationship. I wish I was first on MM's list but I know that it isnt possible....that agreement was made from the beginning. It can be tough at times but I look at how much detail he shares with his other close friends and then see what detail he shares with me...there is quite a difference.

heres where it is tricky for me..because like you and your MM we started with a understanding. but we stated we wanted to best friends and share everything in every capacity we can that we never could with anyone else..point blank this is what we agreed to do..be everything in reality and fantasy that we wanted..with honesty and trust..something both of us were missing in marriages

 

we had the initial talk ^ in November but are crush and friendship started in February last year..so I guess I can say our relationship is a little over a year old.

 

but see after the sexual aspect has been introduced into our relationship..he brings up wanting a divorce and tells me how horrible life is at home (loveless and such) at least once a week if not more..I always tell him to hang in there and not to talk like that. I never tell him about my home life,or rather very rarely. (I should say my problems..I talk about home but leave my husband out of most talk)

 

so I told him last week that in fact I am going to separate from my husband and if everything he is telling me is true and we are in love he should join me. he said every excuse possible not to get a divorce..I wasn't to surprised after reading post from this site..and that was fine.

 

it's just the fact he kept telling me how awful his home life is..but it really isn't..now I have to wonder what kind of game he is playing,you know...I never asked him anything..in fact I really didn't want to know..so now I will be questioning everything he has to say....it's disappointing.

[CeeJayXX]

Well that sheds a whole new light on the situation. That is a very difficult situation to deal with......... I don't know how to even try to help you with this. my relation differs on this aspect. We know where the extent of the relationship is.......the only way we would be together 24/7 is if something happened to W...(but I would never hope or wish for that!)

[lovernotafighter]

Well that sheds a whole new light on the situation. That is a very difficult situation to deal with......... I don't know how to even try to help you with this. my relation differs on this aspect. We know where the extent of the relationship is.......the only way we would be together 24/7 is if something happened to W...(but I would never hope or wish for that!)

 

no defiantly not...I'd never wish anything bad of my MM's wife either.

 

and this is part of what would drive me nuts when he'd throw around the 'D' word all to often..I really did not get involved to split them up.

 

and I more or less told him about me getting ready to split up with my husband just to see if what I read on these boards is accurate..which it is. it might have been the wrong reason to tell but at least I know the truth and he might not be tossing this at me any more.

 

thanks for listening though..talking about it actually has helped my mind..I'm not sure what do from here either..I want NC but can't..I can try to be his friend but can't. I won't fight with him ever..and I love him..I'm just screwed really.

 

when I first realised I was falling in love with him I had to get on anti depressants, I'm thinking a trip to the doctor for that as well as my lump is in order.

[CeeJayXX]

I remember a "disagreement" between my MM and I..... as he sat there (not about to budge) he says " I don't (need) you...". I couldnt help but smile and said..... "then why are you still sitting here". His reply was "because I want you".... To this day, Im still not sure what the hidden detail of that conversation was.....

 

We deal with things day by day...as needed.

 

Can you make a new deal with you MM to stop talking about divorce and that making his W look like the bad one isnt why you are in the relation. (If anything its more of a push to step back).

 

I have defended my MM's W in many conversations. She is a good caretaker and honestly I dont think I could fill her shoes if the time came.

[erika2610]

Not ready to share secret? Apparently you were ready to BANG OM, and have orgasmic sex with him, we all assume this of course. When it does come out chances are you will lose you hubby in the process, not getting needs met is NO EXCUSE whatsoever to cause all this. One day your son WILL find out, then what kind of role model will you be to him, he'll have to live with the shame. Take it from someone who knows..... one of my parents messed around, and the kids at school knew about it and told me

 

So this is how I see it. One of your parents messed around, so now you're going to come here and spew bitterness at all the OW. Listen, please go somewhere else. This is a place for support/advice for OM and OW. We all know what we're doing is wrong. People come here because they're heartbroken over what is going on. We've all done things in this life that are wrong. Just because a person makes a bad decision, does not make them a bad person. Why come here if all you're going to do is judge?

[lovernotafighter]

I remember a "disagreement" between my MM and I..... as he sat there (not about to budge) he says " I don't (need) you...". I couldnt help but smile and said..... "then why are you still sitting here". His reply was "because I want you".... To this day, Im still not sure what the hidden detail of that conversation was.....

 

We deal with things day by day...as needed.

 

Can you make a new deal with you MM to stop talking about divorce and that making his W look like the bad one isnt why you are in the relation. (If anything its more of a push to step back).

 

I have defended my MM's W in many conversations. She is a good caretaker and honestly I dont think I could fill her shoes if the time came.

 

I have to agree as far as my MM's wife goes i know she's a good woman and I have no desire to hurt her.

 

I asked my MM about 3 weeks ago to never bring this up to me again..it lasted two weeks. I even told him it makes me feel like he's waiting for me to make the choice for him and he'd say "no I'm just venting..can't I talk to you?". I was like well yea..what can I say?

 

I am going to see him tomorrow and tell him i don't want either of us talk about our spouses for awhile..I think I'm going to tell him I need what we talked about and nothing else..especially now. and i'm gonna back off as well and try to take it all in for the moment.

 

we write everyday and call a couple times a week and we also see each other almost everyday for hmm 15mins to a half hour (sometimes hour) at work (different shifts and depts. make this hard) and we try to go out for lunch or something once a week.

 

I think some nc in letters and things will help a bit..at least get my head together any way:)

 

(actually I was reading my short journal I kept of he and I for the last few months and it doesn't paint a pretty picture..it seems he hurts me more than I'd like to admit..I really need to think this over,I am confused...perhaps just need some Zzz's I'll have to post a update tomorrow..perhaps my story in a thread finally?)

[kpin124]

Hello everyone and thanks to all of you who have given me support and advice... I came here to this board looking for exactly that and i have gotten that from many of you but i do not appriciate being told that i deserve my husband to dump me and that i do not care about my husband..... I do care about my husband for the most part we do have a decent relationship and i am ashamed of myself that i have got myself into this position.... my husband knows that i talk to this guy he knows that i meet him online and he knows that i have been texting him.... what he doesn't know is the part were i went and meet him and i have continued to go and meet him....... I just don't understand how someone can get on here and say "i hope your husband dumps you" well thanks for those great words of wisdom....... you know i would hope that my husband would decide to work on our relationship its not all my fault that are relationship is broken i feel that we are both to blaim... not that long ago my h had an emotional affair with a girl that he worked with i am not sure if it went any further he says it didn't but i don't know that hurt me alot around that same time i started talking with my mm and things grew from there so with that being said this whole mess we are in is both of our faults and we both need to work on the relationship if we want it to work....

 

 

now for an update on mm ....... i got 2 private calls on sunday evening i am pretty sure they were from his w but not certain..... i bought a calling card this weekend so i can call him at some point this week and when the number shows up on the bill it will be untraceable..... i just want to know where things are at..... what she has been told so i am on the same page..... you know what if some woman just shows up on my doorstep i want to know it is her.... i don't want to be caught off gaurd..... i have also decided that if i do get any text messages on my phone the person on the other end is going to have to prove to me that they are who they say there are i am not taking any chances with it being the w and trying to get info that way... i guess that is something i would do if my husband had been doing this to me and i didn't know about it.... i still don't want the friendship to be over that means more to me then the sex the two of us talk about all kinds of things we talk about our children we talk about vacations we talk about our jobs we just talk about everything... and i don't want to let that go not yet......

[kpin124]

ok wanted to post an update...... i just heard from my mm and i can't tell you all how releaved i am to have finally talked to him....... as for right now he says his wife is calmed down and is ok with things... she is still asking questions every now and again but the biggest thing she wanted to know was what did we talk about......he also told me that he wanted to apologize for all of this and he wanted to let me know that his wife said she was sorry as well she just didn't know what was going on and called me and felt bad about doing so and was sorry if her message sounded mean..... so for now we are laying low and not talking he said he is scared that she is going to find out something so he doesn't want to chance it right now.... so i feel alot better about all of ths..... it kind of stinks that i can't talk to mm as much as i would like to right now but i am willing to lay low for a while to save our relationship.....

[Chump64]

It might be a few days or a few months, or even a year, but the OW will tell your husband. Betrayed spouses obsess, obsess, obsess and are hurt for a really long time, until every stone is overturned and every truth is told. That will take months or years. At some point she will realize that (a) the truth needs to come out for all parties involved, if she is going to save her marriage and keep her husband from seeing you again; and (b) the hurt she is feeling is not hers alone -- there are others who are hurt by this deception and they should know about it; she will then tell your husband.

 

Do yourself a favor and tell him. Have the decency to do it before someone else does. I am a betrayed spouse and I did not have to tell the OW's husband. I let her do it. But I made sure she knew that I would not keep the secret from her, and I followed up with her husband. It's only a matter of time. Do you really want to live with that threat hanging over your head? That is sort of like a double betrayal to your husband. First, you betray him by cheating on him. Second, you betray him by not confessing, when the other hurt party knows about it. If your goal is to save your marriage, stop the affair, fess up, and get into counseling.

 

If your real goal is to continue this behavior, then ignore my post.

 

No need for kids to get involved. We have three (including two preteens) and they are clueless re: my husband's behavior and waht we are gong through right now, to try to repair our marraige.

[Michael86]

kpin124 - So what I get out of this is basically even though you're laying low for now until the dust settles, you're relieved that this affair of yours can continue. As I said in my post, my mother had an affair for many years which I found out about at a very young age. I carry the effects of that affair to this day. It would be very tempting for me to get on here and spew my anger at those who are having affairs. But instead I shared with you the pain it caused me (and my sisters) and the damage it did, hoping you won't make the same mistake with your son. You came for advice and I gave you mine based on my experience. However, you haven't responded to that at all. Have you even thought about what I said? I know he's young and perhaps you think he'll never find out. But he will someday.

[kpin124]

i am relieved that my friendship with mm can continue....... if i never have sex with his again or never kiss him again i am ok with that but as long as i have him in my life as a friend that is all i really need.... like i have said before we were friends for 2 years before we began a sexual relationship so if it goes back to friends i am allright with that......... I am not sure what you want me to say to your response michael86....... i am sorry that your mother had an a when you were younger and that is has left a lasting impretion on your life.... i don't know what the circumstances were of your mothers a i don't know if your mother was doing it right underneath everyones nose or was she going away and doing it.... my mm lives over 3 hours away and no one in my community would ever have a clue about this..... so i don't think my son has to worry about going to school and having kids tell him that his mother cheated on his dad..... i do love my husband and i don't know how to explain this to someone that hasn't had an a there is just things in our relationship that aren't good and i have found them with mm one thing that is a big thing for me is mm is so much more mature than my h and that is a huge thing for me i have struggled with it alot with my h also my mm makes me feel wanted for more than just folding his clothes or washing the dishes or ironing his shirt...... he wants me for just me i don't have to do all of those things for him to make him happy.... it is just hard to explain.... and might i ask you just exactly how do you know that my son will find out about all of this someday??????

[whichwayisup]

Your son could find out because he over heard something. ALL kids at some point in time, listen in to conversations...When you think they're not, they ARE.

 

He could hear gossip, if it comes out and someone saw you and your MM. Or your son could see you two together, when you're least expecting it. Don't say it couldn't ever happen...It could, so just be aware.

[Michael86]

The kids at school didn't tell me my mother was having an affair. I found out all by myself in spite of the fact that my mothers MM also lived hours away. She thought that distance was her safety net too. Nothing she did in all those years of her affair ever got by me. She never had a clue that I knew. Just remember you came thisclose to being found out. Next time you may not be so lucky. I realize your marriage is anything but perfect. But it will never get better as long as you have this other man in your life, nor will you make the effort. My mother had the same feelings about her marriage. My father was a true blue family man who would have done anything he could to make it better if he was given the chance. But she chose her boyfriend over her family. I could go on and on with this but it's obvious that you'll rationalize this any way you can to keep this affair going, so I'll say no more. If you want to risk hurting your family, that's your choice. Good luck.

[Michael86]

Your son could find out because he over heard something. ALL kids at some point in time, listen in to conversations...When you think they're not, they ARE.

 

He could hear gossip, if it comes out and someone saw you and your MM. Or your son could see you two together, when you're least expecting it. Don't say it couldn't ever happen...It could, so just be aware.

 

Exactly. I found out because I saw her attitude towards my father. I noticed the suspicious phone calls. I noticed her going out when the other kids mothers didn't. I noticed that even me being sick wouldn't keep her home and away from her boyfriend. It was too important to her. I'll give her credit....she kept it hidden from alot of people for alot of years. But not from me.

[whichwayisup]

That's a very heart felt post Michael, I feel for what you went through, must have been just horrible.

 

I don't think kpin124 is quite ready to hear and see what is 'outside the box' and 'around the corner'. Many OW's have blinders on, have a certain way of thinking (this isn't a judgement to anybody, it's just a fact) so right now she isn't ready to hear alot of the advice and let it sink in. I hope someday before it's too late, it does sink in...Your husband, marriage and son is on the line - For a MM who is NEVER going to leave his wife. Is it worth that risk?

 

Just a suggestion, IF you ever are close enough to ending your affair, seek counselling. Many OW have because they can't cope and deal with the loss and sadness of ending it, moving on with life. So, therapy is one way of learning how to move on, learn about yourself and most of all - Gain back that self confidence and self respect.

[whichwayisup]

Exactly. I found out because I saw her attitude towards my father. I noticed the suspicious phone calls. I noticed her going out when the other kids mothers didn't. I noticed that even me being sick wouldn't keep her home and away from her boyfriend. It was too important to her. I'll give her credit....she kept it hidden from alot of people for alot of years. But not from me.

 

Ouch. That must have hurt like hell.

Do you mind me asking? (if you want to reply great, if not, I understand) how are things now? Do you have any sort of relationship with her?

 

kpin124, this is why I stress, KIDS ARE NOT STUPID. They 'feel' changes in the air at home, tension, stress, and the truth of it is, kids are nosey at times anyway, so they'll listen in and LOOK for things they shouldn't be - out of curosity - not maliciously...

 

Just from what Michael has posted, please put your child FIRST always, before your MM. You are this child's mom, now and forever - Remember that. Your MM should be LAST on your list IF you decide to keep on seeing him. Never pick your MM over your child.

[kpin124]

wow the fact that you guys are now indicating that i could put mm first over my child is a bunch of crap...... i have never and would never put mm first on my list that is just crazy.... the relationship we have is kind of a 9-4 type relationship during "work hours".... we don't talk at night we have never seen each other at night i don't make up excuses to leave my house when i should be home with my family...... i have fantisized about having an overnight with him but i know that could never happen..... i have only seen mm 4 times in person over a 6 month time period i have known him for 3 years and just 6 months ago we started seeing each other..... all i can say to that is i know that i would never do anything to put my son in second place in my life he comes first always has and always will........

 

i also wanted to say that his wife thinks that he has never meet me and that he has never talked to me so as for her telling my husband i really am not to worried about that right now....... the other hurt party doesn't think that we were having an affair she thinks that we meet playing card games on the internet and started talking just as friends and nothing more...... its not like she knows that i slept with her husband and am having an affair with him now let me tell you if she knew that then yes i would tell my husband beause i would want him to hear it from me and not from her.... i do agree with you on the kids not needing to know.... it is grown-up stuff and they don't need to be bothered with it........

[whichwayisup]

I'm sorry if I made it sound like you were going to...I guess just how Michael talked about his feelings on it made me just say that you should always put your child first...Didn't mean for it to jump out and imply that you were going put your son last.

[kpin124]

thank you and i undertand...... i guess i should also say i am glad that you cautioned me about that it did really make me stop and think maybe i'm not putting my son first.... but after thinking about it i relized that this is not the case and would never be the case..... my little boy is the world to me i had a very hard labor and delivery and we have a close bond and i love him so much and would never make him my 2nd priorty he is always going to be # 1