Injustice or not??

[lilmrcheerful]

Hi, i hope you can help me regarding this situation i am in.

 

I met a girl in november last year on a depression forum. I am 34 years old and she is 20, i know the age gap is quite steep, however, she prefers older guys and also for her age she is very mature. Age was never the problem.

 

The reason why we were on the forum was because she suffers from major Panic Attacks, where as i have a serious confidence issue and insecurities due to my divorce from a 15 year mariage, so of course i would be feeling depressed. Even though i am over the divorce, i was left with how bad i was feeling about myself.

 

In getting to know her, it became clear that we really did like each other until we got to the point where we had to meet. We fell crazily in love, she is so lovely, more than i ever wanted in a person... We met up and had a great time, she stayed with me a couple of times, nearly 2 weeks in total...

 

She has never had a boyfriend before me, i was her first one and was also sexually her first partner.

 

But as with everything, there were problems and i think maybe they were all down to me, that is why i wanted an opinion and some advice..

 

During the time when we were still getting to know each other, she asked me if i had joined up to any dating agencies. Now, knowing that she's a very sensitive person and has a jealousy problem, i panicked and said that i did not, but only now i realise this was a very big mistake because she has since found out i had signed to a few (she browsed my laptop) and she found some links to dating agencies. I used to use them many many months ago *way before i met her* but i had actually stopped using them, i just wasn't really that bothered to be honest. The most i would do anyway would be to just reply to a match, chat to them a couple of times and then thats it really. I've actually never dated one from any of these sites. A lot of it really was done out of curiosity, i was not actively looking anyway because i had just gone through a divorce, but it's just one of the things i tried, more out of curiosity.

 

I am a very insecure person, especially when it comes to relationships now. I was married for 15 years prior to this relationship, and a lot of the time i felt so overwhelmed that i was in love again, almost like i could not believe it and that it felt that she was too good to be true and was almost waiting for her to change her mind... when she was not around, i felt lonely and would often say stupid things on forums such as "oh, im so so lonely all i really wanted is someone to be with and cuddle up to at night". She read this and took it very badly, she now also thinks she isn't enough for me, when i tried to tell her that i am trying to get over the insecurities of the past.

 

She browsed my laptop last Saturday when i was at work.. She found all the above information, and she messaged me saying i was a liar and she didn't know me anymore. She really did not give me a chance to explain, and every time i tried to tell her something, she called me a liar each time... it made me so panicky because i felt i was losing her with how she was reacting... in the end, she said she was leaving, and before i had a chance to try and see her face to face, she called a taxi to the train station and went back home... i was totally devastated....

 

I got a couple of text messages later that day, indicating really that she did'nt want me anymore.. i was then asked by her friend that i should stay away from her to give her time to think what she really wants to do...

 

it's been 4 days now and ive not heard a thing.... she has since deleted me from her MSN friends list...

 

All this is indicating to me that i will never hear from her again...

 

This is really devastating to say the least. When we were together, it was perfect, she was so so happy and she had said she had never felt like that before.

 

I feel so helpless and totally devastated, i hate myself so much.. I feel that as a person, I end up failing because in amongst all the good i do for people, all the love and passion i have, all the care i express, all the generosity i show, and all the understanding i have, i STILL manage to ruin it by being careless, this could include anything ranging from stupid things i say down to not being totally honest about things... this is why i don't have confidence in myself... and by this i mean i don't allow myself to be true about myself, sometimes i can screw up or have done things that were not too clever, but rather chosing to be open, i chose to hide them instead... i should realise more that people are understanding and should learn to trust people more and also start to learn that its actually OK to mess up, but as long as you are honest about it...if there is something about yourself you were not happy with or if something you had done that would embarrass or tarnish the way someone thinks about you... i just panic at this so much, i hate the thought of people thinking bad of me, because i am not a bad person.. just careless and most often misunderstood.. and that is why i hate myself and do not feel confident in myself.. i don't know if you understand what i mean.... i am actually ever so tired right now as i've not been sleeping well lately...

 

I don't know if what i have done is such a terrible thing to warrant being dropped from a high place, or am i just being too harsh on myself and that she has taken things a little out of proportion. I just don;t know what to do and i dont know what to think.. i just cry all the time, just begging for a chance to tell her im so sorry and that i love her so much and would never do anything to hurt her...

 

Is there still any hope here? Will she contact me ever again? I don;t know what she is feeling apart from hurt, but what is she feeling towards me? What can i do?

 

It's amazing though, it seems to have fallen apart after the first hurdle. Surely a test of a true and growing relationship is to try and work through problems, because there's always going to be some, no matter what they are... i don't know, maybe im wrong in thinking this...

[CaliGuy]

She needs some recovery time. The best you can do is send her a heartfelt email explaining that you hadn't been on those sites in a long time (if that is the truth) and apologize.

 

Given the situation she is in, I can understand why she is acting this way and you may never recover. Give her some space, wait a week or two without any contact then send the email and wait.

[lilmrcheerful]

and you may never recover. .

 

Hi ya Cali,

 

thank you so much for a great response. Can you please explain what you meant with the above quote? Did you mean that this situation is not recoverable or just that i may never get over it?

 

Regarding the email, i actually did it already and sent in on the Sunday, may have been a big mistake but i did'nt know what to do... on the Sunday afternoon, her friend emails me and asks me to refrain from all contact and allow her to contact me "if" she wants to. Of course i totally respect that and that is what i have done and shall be doing. I am not going to contact her at all because i feel so ashamed and embarrassed and so guilty to the point where i just want to be sick... to be honest, i can't see a way out of this.. i can only hope though.....

 

thanks again so much for an honest reply...

take care

[ehead]

I'm on the opposite end of this right now, and all I can say is it completely bites.

 

Not to rub things in, but hopefully you will learn a lesson from this. Just in case you were wondering, it's the "not being totally honest about things" part where you really f*cked up.

 

Just try and think about things from her perspective for a second. She probably was just as high and happy about the relationship as you, and now suddenly she is in the awkward position of not being able to trust you anymore. Not being able to trust your SO is simply devastating. Believe me, I know. I feel like I can't believe one word out of my SO's mouth right now unless I can independently verify it.

 

I believe if you have a foundation of love with someone you can overcome virtually anything. The problem is, being genuine, honest, and authentic are the things upon which the foundation is built. In other words, by not being these things you have rocked the foundation.

 

I don't want to leave you feeling utterly depressed and hopeless though. I understand that sometimes people can love someone so much they are literally petrified of loosing them, and this fear will drive them to lie. You lie to manipulate the other persons feelings for you. You are afraid of how the truth will alter their feelings for you.

 

I'm trying to figure out for myself what can be done about this mess I am in. I'm not sure if it's salvagable or not.

 

If I were you, I would write up the most heartfelt and honest letter of my life, and confess all your lies, even ones that you don't think are important, and explain to her WHY you lied. Tell her you realize you have a problem with this and that you are willing to do anything you can to overcome it and to earn her trust back. Of course, only tell her this if you really mean it.

 

Whatever you do, start being honest, open, genuine, and authentic now. If she does give you another chance, you better not let her down.

[CaliGuy]

Hi ya Cali,

 

thank you so much for a great response. Can you please explain what you meant with the above quote? Did you mean that this situation is not recoverable or just that i may never get over it?

 

Given her situation, she may never come back to you.

 

Regarding the email, i actually did it already and sent in on the Sunday, may have been a big mistake but i did'nt know what to do... on the Sunday afternoon, her friend emails me and asks me to refrain from all contact and allow her to contact me "if" she wants to. Of course i totally respect that and that is what i have done and shall be doing. I am not going to contact her at all because i feel so ashamed and embarrassed and so guilty to the point where i just want to be sick... to be honest, i can't see a way out of this.. i can only hope though.....

 

thanks again so much for an honest reply...

take care

 

Then do what she asked and be patient. If she decides to forgive you then it will be on her own accord. Nothing you can do now will change things. You can however make it worse if you hound after her or cling to her for dear life.

 

She needs some space and time to think. Give her that time, let her miss you a bit and see what happens.

 

Do not make any attempt to contact her. Show her you respect her by giving her the time she needs to think.

[lilmrcheerful]

Thank you so much guys, you don't know how much your responses mean to me... And the more honest they are, the more hurtful reading they make, the more i am learning about the seriousness of what i have actually done...

 

i myself am a complete wreck, im not eating well, sleeping well, thinking straight, and having a lot more panic attacks... i need to work on this and try to remain calm.. but i just can't bare the thought of what i have actually done, to the person i love so much with all my heart mind and soul..

 

she is a very deep thinker, very VERY affectionate, she really does know how to love someone and when we were together, it was pure bliss.. she's a very soft and fragile person anyway by nature, fragile i meant with emotions, she can easily be hurt and take things to heart... and up until that point, i did everything absolutely right... and what hurts the most is that this issue is a dead one, in the sense that it was not the fact i was caught actually signing up to dating agencies and browsing them, that i could understand, what makes this even worse is it could have been all avoided IF i had just said "yes" when she asked the bloomin' question all those months ago.. thats all.. and i hate myself for this... just absolutely careless...

 

Cali, i had no intention of contacting her again, i've done enough damage already, ive already sent a heartfelt email and a complete explanation in which she has not replied to and wasnt really expecting as much, but that was only a day after the event... i will keep my distance, she deserves that.. i wont allow myself to further cause grief, ive done enough as it is, the last thing i want to do now is take away ANY little ounce of hope that she may even give me the chance to talk, let alone anything else... im not that kind of person, i respect people far to much to hound them... no i no as far as im concerned..

 

i love her so much, i miss her dearly and i would do anything to have her back... but i have to think of her now, and all i want for her is for her pain to subside, for her to find peace and happiness again, and if that means without me, then i am just as happy, as long as she is OK... i love her too much to care about me....

 

thanks so much again or the responses, they mean alot..

[lilmrcheerful]

I have been sent a very sarcastic and almost abusive message from her friend, he has been extremely facetious towards the way i have been feeling and suggesting i'm "gay".

 

I guess i am getting 2 things here,

 

a) the deserved abusive hate they are feeling for me

b) perhaps a confirmation that i will never hear from her again

 

I feel so ill...

[Becoming]

You seem so intent upon beating yourself up that it seems pointless to say anything constructive that might help. You'll probably just use it for more self-flagellation. You might want to stop that. It's annoying.

 

You say

i hate the thought of people thinking bad of me, because i am not a bad person.. just careless and most often misunderstood.. and that is why i hate myself and do not feel confident in myself..

 

BS! You're a bad person, and you know it. But here's the thing: we all are, so join the humanity club and get over your bad self! Cause we're also good. But no one has a pristine moral record.

 

You don't feel confident because you still have work to do on yourself, as have we all. But you won't feel confident until you know who you are and act in accord with your values. Is lying one of these? Or is covering your butt in a pinch?

 

I don't want to be harsh here but why do you seem so intent upon seeing yourself as a victim of other people's perceived misunderstanding of you? YOU think you're a bad person and project it onto others so you don't have to take responsibility for it. Grow up.

 

I'm sorry she hurt you. I'm even sorrier you hurt her with a careless lie. You might want to stop that, too.

[lilmrcheerful]

Hi Becoming,

 

Thank you very much for your reply. Thank you for making me see it from another angle, this is what i needed. Playing the victim all the time i guess, trying to find reasons why i do what i do and it is pathetic you are right.

 

I will change, i have to. And with the help knowing where i am going wrong (like you have pointed out), then surely it's a good thing to say i will endevour to start now?

 

Im not making excuses, but being depressed you don't always look on the positive side, and i give up too easily too. Again, something i have to change. And i am willing to change it.

 

It may be too late to save this relationship, but at least i know where i need to grow to be ready for any future one.

 

Thank you so much and take care

[Becoming]

Ah, you took that well, DD. I know depression, too, and it does distort our perceptions.

 

I think depression is a way of slowing us down to take care of some major issues we have. The one thing depression has taught me is that I have to be who I am and act in accord with what I value and quit giving into fear.

 

Could you really be distressed at having not acted in accord with what it is you really value, like honesty? And a desire to not hurt someone. I see you as someone honestly searching. And beating yourself up for a stupid mistake, which really isn't helpful. The desire to not hurt anyone needs to extend to you, doesn't it?

 

Be who you were put on the planet to be and you will attract love. Easier said than done, of course. It's easier to blame others for why we are the way we are. I know this because I've played the abused child card to keep from taking responsibility for my behavior for quite some time, but it really doesn't work in the long run. (See, I presume no perfection here!)

 

Look at it this way: you've learned some valuable things about yourself and relationships, haven't you?

 

She may or may not come back, but YOU will come into yourself. And that is an awesome thing awaiting you at the end of this depression.

[lilmrcheerful]

Hey ya Becoming! Now why would i have not taken it well? Truth hurts, but it's how you take it that makes all the difference, you can chose to fight back and try to justify yourself, but you will always be where you are. I don't want to remain here, i want to be the person i think I can capable of being, and even with all the traumatic experiences of my past (and there are many, this was just yet another one added to the catalogue), i can get there...

 

So what has this particular experience taught me!? Apart from the obvious (not to hide anything in future no matter what it is), it has also taught me that i should love myself more which would then reflect and convey on the person you love, and it will show them that you mean it, because i can honestly say that i don't think my gf maybe really believed it fully, even though i expressed it in practice, im sure she still had an element of doubt by my actions away from her, eg, such as negative postings on threads saying the silliest of things about being constantly lonely.. This has got to stop, and it will do..

 

Whether i will hear from here again is another thing, i as more positive yesterday than today, now that i have received that rather vindictive response from her friend, (and she could have put him up to it, or at least read it herself), then now im not feeling that confident, however, the door is always open. I just pray it has not turned to hate on her part, and worse still, seeking revenge, surely that is going a bit beyond the boundary? I didn't think there was quite the need to be so sarcastic or degrading towards me. In all the months of knowing her, i did not think for one moment she was that way inclined, although she could say the same about me thinking i could never be dishonest.

 

I will remain positive, and hope, thats all i can do. I shall not contact her, im keeping to that, i don't want to fuel anything more. But i know her, she is the kind of person that likes to be persued... But again, this circumstance is different though, i can't afford to make any more mistakes now....

 

But i would still like some advice on where to go from here.. i guess just wait really, and if something happens, good, otherwise wish her well (in spirit).

 

Take care

xxx

[lilmrcheerful]

Hi everybody, just wanted to see how you were all doing.

 

Losing someone you truely love is the biggest hurt you can experience. Thus; the power of love, takes you from one end of the universe to the other; in metaphoric terms.

 

One question if i may. If someone truely loves someone with all sincerity, if they went directly into another relationship, or worst still, one night stand, then what does that say about the person? Did they ever love the other person in the first place even though they were costantly telling them they loved you with all their heart? Can that love die overnight for someone? Or does true love take time to fizzle out (even if you were the dumper?).

[lilmrcheerful]

Hi again,

 

I'm really really sorry to keep posting here but i have nowhere else to go to that will give me professional advice. A lot of my friends are biased and are not saying the right things, they are saying she has reacted OTT which i don't want to hear it, i know this is my fault and it's something i need to deal with.

 

No matter what i do, i can't stop thinking about her, she is always on my mind. What goes around in my head is the constant thought of how wonderful we were together, it was, aww, just pure utter bliss, that's what makes it worse.

 

It's been exactly a week now to the day. Still early days? Again, i won't contact her. But i do want to put things right, and honestly tell her how truely sorry i am for being dishonest about not revealing the fact i HAD signed up to agencies, BUT also at the same time explain to her that it was'nt as bad as she thinks, eg, i did not pursue any of the sites especially in our time together.

 

I feel more positive about myself now, and it's really a shame it's taken something like this to really appreciate what i had with her. Also, a lot of it comes down to distance, we live so far away from each other so the chances of us being together were pretty remote at the best of times, she is still at Uni and I work in IT Support (working silly hours). We live 4 hours away from each other.

 

If (and it's a big IF) i do hear from her again, i will make the following proposals, i would love some feedback on this if i may.

 

- Set up a brand new Email address and account

- Set up a new MSN account

- Get a new mobile phone number

- Format my Latop and rid of all crap

- Allow her access to everything on my PC & Mobile (i did before anyway), but she can monitor me as much as she likes, i want her to curfew all fears and install trust in me once more.

 

I don't know what else i can think of, but i would want to try and see im sincere and that im working towards earning her trust again. I don't know what else i can suggest.

 

That is of course assuming she does materliase, but i want to be prepared and in the right frame of mind with a positive approach and with a permament solution to this that would never surface again.

 

Take you so much

Take Care

[ehead]

Just a couple of observations ... and some things I found on other forums.

 

One:

She f*cked up too. She shouldn't have been snooping on your personal computer.

 

Two:

Everyone has lied.

Everyone has misled.

Everyone doubts.

Everyone is insecure sometimes.

Everyone has snooped.

Everyone makes mistakes.

 

I don't break up with someone I love over a MISTAKE, because I know I'm not perfect either.

The important thing is what they are like as a person. We all f*ck up and go against our nature sometimes, but do you believe they are fundamentally a good person inside ? If so, forgive and forget.

I won't break up till I see a regular pattern.

I guess I just believe in redemption. I believe people can learn and change too.

 

Three:

You'd probably be interested in this:

http://forum.psychlinks.ca/index.php?topic=3920.0

 

Four:

If she can't forgive you for your very human f*ck up (not to trivialize it), are you really sure you want to be with this girl anyway ?

 

Five:

Don't give her access to all your crap. You are not on probation here. She has to take a leap of faith and trust you again, and you have to take a leap of faith and trust that she will not be such a snoop again. Both of you f*cked up ... now the real test is whether you guys can get over it and move on. If not, I'd say she isn't the girl for you.

[Becoming]

Actually, I think allowing her open access to everything is an excellent idea in order to reinstate broken trust. Some people's trust is minimal due to childhood issues, so it doesn't take much to break it, so while ehead may not be able to see her behavior as altogether rational or acceptable, I can understand that for her this is a big issue.

 

Offer this and then also ask her what it would take and if it's even possible to regain her trust.

[lilmrcheerful]

Thank again for the advice from both ehead and becoming.

 

Ehead, i can sympathise with what you say, however, i do believe i am more in the wrong, even though she went on my laptop (and i really did'nt mind), she found links to sites i said i never visited in the past, so therefore that's instantly being dishonest.

 

Becoming is right, because she does have issues of trust and even more so, of severe jealousy, so therefore this issue has been amplified tenfold, maybe it would not have been the case with someone else, but with this particular girl, it's a big problem.

 

I've still not heard from her, even though my sister keeps in touch with her, and my sister is the only go-between i now have, but from the gist of things she is still not really interested in contacting me, so i still have to assume the worst until otherwise.

 

Yes, i will make those suggestions, because i love this girl so much i would be willing to do anything to let he know she can trust me and that although i was dishonest, i was not being devious or deceiving her behind her back, that is a different issue altogether.

 

This is going to be a virtually impossible recovery job, but you always have to believe there is hope in everything, and even though it's maybe a 5% chance here, i'm still going to hope on it and see where it goes.

 

The worst of it all really is that she is not even posting on the forum i met her on, and i know she loved it there, she was a prolific poster and helped many people. I really hope she feels she can't post there whilst i'm there, that would break my heart because i love the forum too and i have been there a lot longer and made many friends.

 

Such a tough situation... I hope and pray things return back to some sort of normality...

 

Pray for us....

 

Take Care...

[lilmrcheerful]

Hi guys, i hope i am finding you OK.

 

Having a bit of a down day, sorry about this

 

It's been almost 2 weeks and still no contact, or any sign of contact. I am starting to lose all hope now although i really didn't want to feel this way, but it's looking increasingly like i won't ever hear from her again.

 

I see her come online on MSN, but i won't send her a message, again, i will always honor and respect people's wishes, and her friend has told me to give her space and time, and that is what i will keep on doing. I just hope that this does not send her the wrong signals, or that she is actually waiting for me to make the first move because she does not know how to? But i don't think it's that, i think perhaps she has moved on, in which case, i would have welcomed some sort of "final" message to say to that effect.

 

Really what i should be doing is picking myself up and trying to remain positive, but at the moment it's quite hard to do. Any suggestions in how i can move on? She is always on my mind, and i kinda want to not make her the prominant figure in my mind anymore mainly because it's beginning to kill me mentally and emotionally.

 

I don't want a suggestion of "find someone else to take your mind off things" because a) i'm not like that and would'nt do that to a person, b) i don't feel like i could date again for a very long time, this being the 2nd major disaster in relationships for me, but this time it was not quite 15 years as previous!

 

Thank you for listening, i don't want to appear negative or moaning, i just want some peace of mind, to feel positive, some help on what my next move should be really..

 

Take Care

[lilmrcheerful]

Hi guys,

 

I'm feeling extremely down today

 

It's been just over 3 weeks now, and still no contact, i guess to be expected?

 

My sister has got involved now, she sent her 2 emails and a few text messages which i didn't feel it was a great idea, but they were good friends so i didn't want to interfere with that, however, she did not reply to my sister at all.

 

On my part, the only thing i have done was send her a St Patricks day ecard just saying "Wishing you a great day and i hope you are OK", and nothing more. Maybe it was the wrong thing to do, but i just wanted her to know i cared and hoping she was OK, nothing more *although of course i'd love to actually talk to her*.

 

I am not sure if this a consistent feeling amongst people who have been through this NC scenario, but i am finding that if she did approach me, i would actually panic!

 

Thanks for listening.

[lilmrcheerful]

Please, can anybody give me some advice, i am really not feeling too great today with how it's going. I know i should not ephasis on it too much, but i can't stop thinking about her, it feels like forever...