SmoochieFace Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 I think the difference WHICH DOES NOT MAKE US BETTER is that we (and Smooch you need to confirm this because I'm speaking for you) have healthy senses of identity that are not disturbed by others' opinions. ALAS! Someone who is starting to *get it*... I'm handing the prize right back to you, Outcast. You are correct here. It's all about knowing who I am - knowing my beliefs, convictions, values, etc. and standing up for them... things that I have formulated on my own without the *help* of *popular culture* or an assorted set of gurus. Being an individualist, forming my own unique attitudes and views, and being strong enough to resist those attitudes and views that run contrary to mine - that's what I'm about.
a4a Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 The problem, Smooch, is that they all think you think you're better than them. They think I think I'm better than them. And we can tell them until we're blue in the face that we don't but they have decided that's how we are and, as I have discovered to my sadness, when someone is intent on believing something about you (for good or ill) there's pretty much nothing you can do to change their minds. well good I am so glad that is settled :lmao: a4a
SmoochieFace Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 The problem, Smooch, is that they all think you think you're better than them. They think I think I'm better than them. And we can tell them until we're blue in the face that we don't but they have decided that's how we are and, as I have discovered to my sadness, when someone is intent on believing something about you (for good or ill) there's pretty much nothing you can do to change their minds. Classic *Halo Effect*... thanks for pointing that term out to me some moons ago. I take solace in the fact that I know that I am not *better* or *worse* than anyone and the issue of being *better or worse than others* doesn't matter to me so if other people choose to have inaccurate thoughts/beliefs about me then that is only on them. I take no responsibility for their thoughts and feelings. The burden of interpretation is strictly on the reader - not on the author. Psst... read the first line of my sig...
whichwayisup Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 It's harder with family for sure, WWIU. You're bonded to them so their validation bears more weight. Still, if they don't offer it without condition, then sometimes you have to find it other ways for your own sake. Or better yet, learn how not to depend on others' opinions because their opinions are so often a product of what's going on inside them and not really about you at all. Yeah true. Especially too, when ya have a mom like mine who still LOVES to treat me (and my sis/bro too) like "kids." The BEST line I had to her once...(Here's the quick version) At her place, about to have a big family gathering...Hubby and I came early to help her set up the house etc...So, I was in the kitchen, cutting up carrots, pita bread and getting all the finger food ready with her. I excused myself to go to the bathroom...Came back, and obviously when cutting pita and carrots you kinda touch them abit, right...LOL! --->SHE says to me, completely serious "Did you wash your hands? Are your hands clean?" Hehehe...Needless to say I did NOT say my first thought...But I did say, very calmly and nicely, "No mom, I didn't wash my hands, I pissed all over them and now I'm handling the food!" LMFAO!! She didn't like that comment one bit, and told me so too. Told her her response was silly and that I wasn't 5! Ah well, family...Gotta love 'em eh??
Outcast Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 WWIU - my MIL said to my fiance when we were planning a trip to her town for the shower she was giving me 'make sure she wears a dress' ROTFL!!! We didn't take dress clothes when we visited them because we never went out - but I own about 10 ballgowns ROTFL!!
SmoochieFace Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 well good I am so glad that is settled :lmao: a4a Now that it has been *settled* go on and play with your tatoes.
Outcast Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 No OUtcast you are dead butt wrong there! Didn't mean 'you' in the specific sense. Yes, because you and Smooch take it sooooo well when people disagree with you Time for a reality check - neither of you cope well with opinions different to your own. Or do I need to prove this by proclaiming my undying love for Dubya... and make us all hurl Again, RR, it's not personal. If I disagree with someone's discussion, it's the discussion I disagree with and if I debate it, it's on the strength of the logic and the debate. It isn't personal to me if people disagree with me. And I used to think everybody was like me in that but it seems that almost nobody is and this confuses me. I'm not proclaiming it proudly or anything else - just saying that I seem to differ in this. It's a source of puzzlement because to me the person and the discussion are different. I've even agreed with Alpha on things so it's not about the PERSON to me. How many other people operate that way? Show of hands, please. Because I didn't use to think I was such an oddball/different person - it's these sorts of situations that have started to persuade me that maybe I'm not 'just like everyone else' which I always thought I was.
Outcast Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Gotta check out and earn a living. Now, kids, play nice and be sweet to each other. I don't want to come back and see a pitched battle and another closed thread. Hugs all round, 'k?
d'Arthez Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Online agreements / disagreements are much more political in real life. Add in the reputation system, which penalises disagreements (and thus discourages the expression of deviant thought) and you can guess what direction discussions can be heading. It seems we occupy ourselves with the petty politics of LS, and simply do not bother with the politics of importance anymore (national, international). Which again, is exactly what is to be expected, if we are heading back to the original subject.
whichwayisup Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 That's too funny! I have to admit, (not meanly ofcourse or out of spite in a malcious way) my sister and I sometimes DO those same little things just to get a rise out of my mom...She hates seeing shoes...One day she had made a comment to my sister "there are too many pairs of shoes seen..." LOL! So, afew weeks later I was at my sis's place and she mentioned mom was coming by. "Quick, go down to the basement and get ALL the kids shoes, mine and hubby's...Bring 'em up here..." So I did!! We lined up about 20 pairs of shoes along the floor in the hallway! When our mom showed up, you should have seen the look on her face and the shoes completely set her off. (we later told her our little joke...hehe)
d'Arthez Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Grrr... forgot a word, and can't edit anymore. My statement should have read: Online agreements / disagreements are much more political than in real life.
a4a Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Didn't mean 'you' in the specific sense. Again, RR, it's not personal. If I disagree with someone's discussion, it's the discussion I disagree with and if I debate it, it's on the strength of the logic and the debate. It isn't personal to me if people disagree with me. I did not take it as a YOU comment as I stated they were examples that not all people have that train of thought in the lower portion of my post. And I would have to say that you do allow some personal feelings to show through. Alpha you do seem to take kinda personal, and posts about mental disorders. Of course I could just be reading that wrong. You do not post much about your personal life so............ cannot really say. But it does seem that you do take certain things personal.....or have emotion showing over them. I could be wrong, would not be a first. I will now continue to walk in a circle. a4a- most humans do not have rear legs!
whichwayisup Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Grrr... forgot a word' date=' and can't edit anymore. My statement should have read:[/quote'] Yeah I know! Now, I can't edit mine either as you and a4a posted. Don't really like that new feature...
SmoochieFace Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Again, RR, it's not personal. If I disagree with someone's discussion, it's the discussion I disagree with and if I debate it, it's on the strength of the logic and the debate. It isn't personal to me if people disagree with me. And I used to think everybody was like me in that but it seems that almost nobody is and this confuses me. I'm not proclaiming it proudly or anything else - just saying that I seem to differ in this. It's a source of puzzlement because to me the person and the discussion are different. I've even agreed with Alpha on things so it's not about the PERSON to me. EXACTLY!!! Seems to me that once a person gets on the *bad side* of things then their posts will be viewed negatively - even if the content is *sound*. The messenger is more important than the actual message. This is something that I do not understand. There have been times that Outcast has disagreed with me on some of my posts and I haven't taken it personally or held a grudge against her or put her on ignore (very childish, IMO). We RESPECT each other because we DON'T make it personal. Another example is that there have been times where I have actually agreed with Alpha. However, since he has *lost respect* for me because I have called him out on some of his posts it doesn't matter that I agree with him. He, OTOH, HAS made it personal.
SmoochieFace Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 It seems we occupy ourselves with the petty politics of LS' date=' and simply do not bother with the politics of importance anymore (national, international).[/quote'] But aren't the two related? Isn't the *politicking* that goes on here a microcosm of the larger world of politics?
a4a Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 EXACTLY!!! Another example is that there have been times where I have actually agreed with Alpha. However, since he has *lost respect* for me because I have called him out on some of his posts it doesn't matter that I agree with him. He, OTOH, HAS made it personal. Ahhh....... Smooch you get personal too...... with Alpha ..... with Moose.....ect. Ain't nobody perfect here.... except me of course! a4a
SmoochieFace Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Ahhh....... Smooch you get personal too...... with Alpha ..... with Moose.....ect. Only when they have gotten personal with me.
d'Arthez Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 I would say, that people get more occupied with the petty small scale politics, as the big scale politics get more and more incomprehensible, and more and more meaningless. Even in Europe, with countries which have a large number of parties to vote for (totally different election systems, so votes for smaller parties are not wasted votes), you cannot tell the Greens from the Christian Democrats apart, if you read their program (unless there is a statement with the Bible explicitly mentioned).
blind_otter Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 I will now continue to walk in a circle. a4a- most humans do not have rear legs! It's meditative, really. You can achieve enlightenment if you bang your head against a brick wall long enough. Or is that permanent brain damage? I always get the two confused.
whichwayisup Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Ain't nobody perfect here.... except me of course! a4a Perfect and tastey too!
a4a Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 It's meditative, really. You can achieve enlightenment if you bang your head against a brick wall long enough. Or is that permanent brain damage? I always get the two confused. Actually I truly believe they are one in the same!!!
blind_otter Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Smooch, here's how it works: 1. Observe behaviour you don't like 2. Ascibe motivation to the person - of course it must be negative motivation remember what Hobbes said about humanity 3. Accuse the person of having the motivation you have ascribed 4. When he says that he doesn't have that motivation, don't believe him because you know what he thinks better than he does. 5. Get mad at/dislike the person because of the motivation you have ascibed to him, whether or not he agrees you're right Get it now? Essentially, people will believe their perceptions of you even in the face of you explaining that their perceptions are wrong. I used to think that people all were scrupulous about wanting evidence and proof of their beliefs but they don't. They just want beliefs and then they cling to them. That's true. And if they assume you are a good, kind person even lacking the supporting evidence, the same will be true as if they assume you are a bad person or someone they dislike. The problem is that those who assume the best usually get s*** on the most. I'm just SAYIN'.
newbby Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 OUTCAST: Ah, but if you badly wanted kids, and were unhappy about not having them, you would say that the person who is excited is 'rubbing it in your face' and then get mad at them for it even if that's not what they're doing. NEWBBY: well i understand your argument now. you are saying that because everybody else is not individual, then it bothers them because smoochie is rubbing it in their faces that he is. okay now i see where you think i do not understand your argument. i should have said, it bothers them because in their perception, smoochie is rubbing it in their faces. it was a hurried response, but i did actually understand your argument. do you think it would have made a difference if smooch had said "i am an individual", and other people had said "i am an individual too"
ReluctantRomeo Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 do you think it would have made a difference if smooch had said "i am an individual", and other people had said "i am an individual too" And everyone says "we are all individuals" together... apart from one person at the back who says "no, I'm not" *Romeo is channelling Monty Python*
newbby Posted February 7, 2006 Posted February 7, 2006 Get it now? Essentially, people will believe their perceptions of you even in the face of you explaining that their perceptions are wrong. I used to think that people all were scrupulous about wanting evidence and proof of their beliefs but they don't. They just want beliefs and then they cling to them. outcast, i have actually gotten the same from you before now. an assumption that i dont understand what you are talking about for example, maybe because i am not educated, i dont know.
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