I Luv the Chariot OH Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 I've found this is a forum I leave for months and always return to when I have a question. I'm now 4+ months into my "pretty much perfect" relationship (and it definitely still is pretty much perfect), and we've begun to make future plans, like moving in together when he's done college and whatnot. Today we were talking and very out of the blue, he asked if I expected him to stop eating meat once we're living together. I'm a pretty militant vegan (for moral reasons), and he's...well, a carnivore. He's gotten better since he met me, in that he often goes meals now without meat now (especially around me), and he's beginning to try soy milk despite being a very picky eater--but he's nowhere close to even vegetarianism. I told him I'd very much like not to have meat in the house we share, and he seemed a little off-put by that (I use the argument that meat is expensive and generally unhealthy, then he counters that fish is one of the healthiest things one can eat, and isn't always that expensive). So, my question is basically, should I expect him to eventually drop eating meat for me (or at least, keeping it in our future house)? Or is this unreasonable? On the one side I think it's unfair to him, since it's sort of repressive. On the other side, though, I think it's unfair to me, because I don't not-eat meat for fun; it really does make me sick to look at it and think that it died to feed our selfishness and hedonism. But hey, that's another thread altogether!
whichwayisup Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 To be honest, I don't believe that is fair to ask him to stop eating meat. That is your own belief system and you may have to compromise. Like yes, he can't eat it at home, but he can if he goes out. I don't know...I just smell trouble because it seems it will bother you if he doesn't and that could end the relationship. I feel for you, but you two really need to figure this out now because it is a huge issue.
Fester Lungblood Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 My suggestion is don't move in together. There's no way in hell that'd work out. Instead keep separate appartments and carry on what will become a weird and unfulfilling relationship.
TeaCooler Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 well, try thinking of it this way. what if he got to you first and requested that you start eating meat, or he didn't think you could live together? it might sound ridiculous to you, but to him, asking him to stop eating meat is just as silly. see what i mean? it sounds like things are going pretty well. and part of a relationship is compromise. actually, most of it is compromise. there has to be a way that makes you both happy. don't let meat come between you.
Author I Luv the Chariot OH Posted February 5, 2006 Author Posted February 5, 2006 TC: Like I said, my reason for not eating meat it's for fun; it isn't arbitrary. It's very important to me. If a moral reason existed FOR eating meat, and he abided by it, obviously I'd have to change my views and try to see it his way. But as it stands, his reason for eating meat it "it tastes good;" my reason for not eating it is "it's morally wrong and inhumane." FL: That's not a very good plan for people who want to know if they could eventually get married (not to mention much more expensive). whichwayisup: That's what I was thinking too. If he just eats it when he goes out with his friends and whatever, but doesn't keep it in the house. It's sort of a compromise, I guess.
Fester Lungblood Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 Please. That's not a compromise. You get what you wanted: no food in the house. That was your bottom line. He gets to look like the biggest wuss in town. 1
TeaCooler Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 TC: Like I said, my reason for not eating meat it's for fun; it isn't arbitrary. It's very important to me. If a moral reason existed FOR eating meat, and he abided by it, obviously I'd have to change my views and try to see it his way. But as it stands, his reason for eating meat it "it tastes good;" my reason for not eating it is "it's morally wrong and inhumane." i understand you, i really do. i don't do the whole meat thing either. but the problem is that he doesn't have the same moral issues with it as you do. my boyfriend eats the meat. we live together. it works out. (we eat out much of the time anyway.) but if he has meat here, i don't freak out. why? cause it's his house too, and he has a right to have it here regardless of how strong my beliefs are...because they're MY beliefs, not his. and i don't feel i have a right to impose on him. if he was catholic and i was an atheist, i certainly wouldn't become a catholic just to live with him. i did choose to live with the meat though; you don't have to. it's a personal thing, you know? you know what you're not willing to compromise on, and maybe this is one of those things. just be prepared to not necessarily get exactly what you want. please let me know how it goes. i've never seen this problem on any forum before, so i really am curious.
Fester Lungblood Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 what a nice post Tea Cooler. i'm serious.
noclobber Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 I've found this is a forum I leave for months and always return to when I have a question. I'm now 4+ months into my "pretty much perfect" relationship (and it definitely still is pretty much perfect), and we've begun to make future plans, like moving in together when he's done college and whatnot. Today we were talking and very out of the blue, he asked if I expected him to stop eating meat once we're living together. I'm a pretty militant vegan (for moral reasons), and he's...well, a carnivore. He's gotten better since he met me, in that he often goes meals now without meat now (especially around me), and he's beginning to try soy milk despite being a very picky eater--but he's nowhere close to even vegetarianism. I told him I'd very much like not to have meat in the house we share, and he seemed a little off-put by that (I use the argument that meat is expensive and generally unhealthy, then he counters that fish is one of the healthiest things one can eat, and isn't always that expensive). So, my question is basically, should I expect him to eventually drop eating meat for me (or at least, keeping it in our future house)? Or is this unreasonable? On the one side I think it's unfair to him, since it's sort of repressive. On the other side, though, I think it's unfair to me, because I don't not-eat meat for fun; it really does make me sick to look at it and think that it died to feed our selfishness and hedonism. But hey, that's another thread altogether! nice to meet you again the fact that you asked this question on this forum shows how serious you are about this issue! in my opinion it is not fair for you to expect your boyfriend to change his eating preferences. i know he eats it only "b'cos it tastes good" but still its difficult to go vegetarian all of a sudden. you go to look from his perspective as well. if you are very strict about this then i suggest that you both live in separate apartments.... but once that happens i am not sure how well the relationship would go. good luck anyway..
Outcast Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 But as it stands, his reason for eating meat it "it tastes good;" my reason for not eating it is "it's morally wrong and inhumane." Taking a position of moral superiority over your supposed beloved is not exactly 'compromising'. It's only been four months. The cracks have only just begin to show. How many other things do you think he should change about himself for you?
neek Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 This is a sensitive issue, among others that come up in relationships. Right now my fiance and I are trying to figure out how we will work out our religious differences, which is not easy, but we obviously love each other enough to come to an understanding for each other's side. I think that if you each respect each other's rights and lifestyles, you will be able to come to some sort of agreement. I don't think you can fully ask him to give up meat completely, but I don't think he should wave it in your face either. I don't, however, think it is impossible for you to live together. You just have to discuss the issue maturely before you do so. Don't give up on the situation.
ladyinwaiting Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 I don't think it's reasonable to expect a boyfriend of 4 months to become a vegetarian for you. It's a huge change of lifestyle that will require a rethink of his diet and may have ramafications for any fitness regime or sporting activity he is involved in. Besides, vegetarianism is an ethical and moral choice, and if he doesn't share those values, what's the point? However, it *may* be reasonable to agree that you won't have meat in the house. Depending on how serious he is, he might be willing to save meat for food courts and restaurants. I had a simillar agreement with a strictly vegetarian roomate for a while and it was okay, probably largely because I ate out pretty much all the time and had my big meal at lunch anyway. Problem is, my relationship with my roommate was a transient thing that lasted through a couple of years at college. If I was facing a lifetime of not being able to keep canned tuna in the cupboard, I probably would have found alternative accommodation ... I'd approach this with care. It's a very difficult situation and there doesn't seem to be an easy long term compromise - other than you being able to convince him that vegetarianism is the best option and he chooses it voluntarily!
Author I Luv the Chariot OH Posted February 5, 2006 Author Posted February 5, 2006 It seems like a lot of you are getting the gist of what I'm saying then offering your quite-off speculations into our relationship. No, I'm not asking him to change completely for me right now (I know if I offered it as an ultimatum he'd do it, but that's the last thing I want to do), and I'm not even asking him to necessarily become a vegetarian. This will only become an issue when we're living together, which we don't plan to be yet, seeing as we're going to school in different cities. TC: I'll definitely keep you posted about this. I know our relationship is strong enough that something of this calibre won't affect it much, it's just hard to find that initial compromise! outcast: There are no "cracks" in our relationship ; this is an issue we've been aware of since day one, and it will only affect us once we live together. And no, I don't expect him to change anything at all about himself. Him watching porn or not and him having meat in our future house or not aren't the sort of life changes that affect one as a person. noclobber: hello to you too!
newbby Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 what i would do in this position, is to have two fridges, seperate cooking pans, and seperate plates, washing up bowls, cloths etc. i dont know if you can argue it on moral grounds, but on grounds of it making you feel physically sick (something i can understand) then that is fair enough.
ThatOneGuy Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 If you really love this man you won’t make him change a thing about his morals/personality because you are under the impression that your morals/personal traits are better. If you love this man, let him put into his belly what he will. And if you love him, you’ll compromise. When your living TOGETHER with him, things aren’t “Mine and yours”. They become “Ours”. I suggest getting a refrigerator with a compartment where he can keep all of his meat products. Then everybody wins.
Woggle Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 Why not ask him not to eat it around you and when he does eat it you don't want to know about it. Keep it out of sight and out of mind. I know couples where one is a smoker and one is not and the smoker does not smoke in the house. I guess this is sort of similiar. I would ask him to not bring it around you but what he eats away from you is his business. 1
ThatOneGuy Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 Why not ask him not to eat it around you and when he does eat it you don't want to know about it. Keep it out of sight and out of mind. I know couples where one is a smoker and one is not and the smoker does not smoke in the house. I guess this is sort of similiar. I would ask him to not bring it around you but what he eats away from you is his business. Well, that might drive a wedge between them. If he's not a big fan of veggys, he'll hardly ever have dinner with her and so on. I mean, seriously: “Sorry honey, I don’t want celery or carrots tonight, I’ll just take my steak outside.” That doesn't exactly ring "Healthy relationship" to me.
Woggle Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 Well, that might drive a wedge between them. If he's not a big fan of veggys, he'll hardly ever have dinner with her and so on. I mean, seriously: “Sorry honey, I don’t want celery or carrots tonight, I’ll just take my steak outside.” That doesn't exactly ring "Healthy relationship" to me. Get some pasta or something. There are plenty of good meatless dishes.
Author I Luv the Chariot OH Posted February 5, 2006 Author Posted February 5, 2006 newbby: How can one not justify not eating meat morally? It's a completely moral issue to me. TOG: Okay, so if my boyfriend's a drug dealer, I should say "Aw hun, that's cute, it's your morals, so do whatever you want!" If he becomes a murderer...no, I'm not allowed to go there anymore. But you get the idea. All I want to do is compromise without having to spend a great deal more money. Also, if he's not a "fan" of veggies (ie. doesn't eat them at all) he'll die of scurvy, so you have to draw the line somewhere. ;p Woggle: That was my initial suggestion, that he just eat it behind my back and don't tell me, but he thought it was too deceitful. And yeah, he loves pasta.
newbby Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 newbby: How can one not justify not eating meat morally? It's a completely moral issue to me. you are with your boyfriend in a relationship, this issue only came up as a result of a moving in conversation, that shows that you accept him as a person including his morals. having meat in the house therefore must be a different issue from morals.
Curmudgeon Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 I stopped hunting for moral reasons after I returned from Vietnam. Needless taking of life, even or especially defenseless animals, really bothered me. However, I eat meat. We're animals ourselves and by the nature of our digestive systems and construct of our teeth, born carnivores so there's a biological precedent for eating meat, not to mention it tastes good. I'm not convinced a strict vegan and a carnivore are compatible, no matter how well they agree on other issues. Good luck!
Outcast Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 How can one not justify not eating meat morally? It's a completely moral issue to me Exactly. So between this and the porn, you really don't like the man as he is. You want to make him over so that he takes on your morality or else pretends to not be himself. Go see the thread where men talk about why they love women - they love the women who don't try to redo them entirely and redoing someone's morality is, essentially, trying to recreate someone since morality is pretty essential in one's makeup. You will never be satisified with this guy, IMHO.
Touche Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 I agree with Curm. Your beliefs and his may just not be compatible. They could spill over into other issues other than just the one at hand. Not saying that it will but it's a valid point. The bottom line here, as I see it, is you want to change something about him and you get to stay the same. Not fair. I don't care if it's a moral issue or not for you. You either accept him as he is or you don't. Sounds like he's a meat eater who likes porn. Are the other parts of your relationship good enough to overlook this for you? They either are or they're not. The minute you try to change someone else, you're headed for trouble. If he wants to make some kind of compromise with you on this front, then fine. But if you push it and it's against his will then he'll only end up resenting you for it later. Personally, if someone told me I couldn't enjoy a good steak on the grill at home, I'd say "See ya!"
newbby Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 i think it is fair enough to not want meat in your house on the grounds of it being disgusting
TeaCooler Posted February 5, 2006 Posted February 5, 2006 I agree with Curm. Your beliefs and his may just not be compatible. They could spill over into other issues other than just the one at hand. Not saying that it will but it's a valid point. The bottom line here, as I see it, is you want to change something about him and you get to stay the same. Not fair. I don't care if it's a moral issue or not for you. You either accept him as he is or you don't. Sounds like he's a meat eater who likes porn. Are the other parts of your relationship good enough to overlook this for you? They either are or they're not. The minute you try to change someone else, you're headed for trouble. If he wants to make some kind of compromise with you on this front, then fine. But if you push it and it's against his will then he'll only end up resenting you for it later. yeah. i love ya, chariot, but making someone eat meat behind your back isn't a compromise. it's kinda...weird. i understand where you're coming from, but i see this being a huge problem. you can have all the moralistic reasons in the world for doing what you're doing, but if someone doesn't share those moralistic reasons, you can't really ask them to sacrifice something they are accustomed to for you. and if he was a drug dealer, that's different...it's illegal. eating meat is not. i am surprised you would even want to be with a meat-eater, given that you really do hate it and find it repulsive. i find wrestling repulsive, so i don't date a wrestler...and i wouldn't live with a wrestlet under the agreement that he could wrestle when i don't know about it. i just wouldn't bother. i guess the point is that nobody wants their lives imposed up on by somebody else's beliefs. and if he agrees to it, great--maybe it'll work out. but it would also make me wonder why he is so quick to give in, which isn't necessarily the best human trait ever. i also think the more you try to keep someone away from something, the more they want it, and the more they will fight for it.
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