amerikajin Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 I just finished my third date (well, two and half 'cause the first was just a coffee date) with this lady I've really been into, and I'm very confused. I thought the first two encounters went well. She was always touching me, laughing at my jokes, and she told me she felt comfortable around me yada yada. So we go out for a 3rd date for dinner and then private karaoke afterward. The dinner went well, I thought. She again was laughing, joking with me, talking and touching me. I was actually thinking that this was going to lead to a kissie kissie session when we were all alone in the karaoke room together. I think I may have started screwing things up from there. Now let me back up and say that the last time we met she had actually pulled me close to her and let me kiss her on the cheek - yeah, normally I go for the lips but it was in public and I didn't want to force the issue. Anyway, we're sitting here and singing together and then I kinda slide my arm around in back of her. I wasn't sure of whether to do this or not but I did it anyway but noticed that she wasn't really giving me a lot of eye contact. Sometimes she would give me eye contact and flash that smile of hers but not for an extended period of time. It just didn't quite create the vibe I was looking for. But we still ended up having a few more laughs out of it and I thought things were cool. I just never really saw the opportunity to push myself in for a kiss because she kept sending me mixed messages with her body language. The thing that got me going initially was that she started touching up her lips before we started. I was like 'Holeeee s***'. But I am wondering if that was just some kind of test to see if I'd flip out or something. So then, we're in the elevator and we look at each other and I started to move closer toward her but she gave me this look as if to say 'Um, not sure if I want to do this'. So I backed off. We then went into Starbucks - it was actually her suggestion - and then we sat and talked for a bit more. I know I was slightly awkward after that but I think the conversation opened up again and we started talking as before - wasn't quite the same, for her or me. So we walked back toward the train station after a while and I dropped her off. I was honestly just content with saying 'Good night' but she again pulled me closer and let me kiss her on the cheek - same as last time. My instincts tell me this isn't really going anywhere and that I should consider moving on, but I was wondering if there are any ladies out there who'd see it otherwise. Something tells me that the perfect opportunity to get closer has come and gone. I guess what I'm wondering is, how possible is it that she's just confused or simply feeling me out a bit more? Are some women just very cautious and not willing to move too quickly? And what's with the mixed messages? And lastly, if you were really into a guy, would you be willing to overlook a few goofs such as not reading her signs correctly?
cal gal Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 It might be easier to just ask her! It's too painful to sit and wonder if is wasting your time and energy!
TheSwordfish Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Well hard to tell. Some girsl wanted me to kiss them as soon as possible, but I am always careful with these things. Some people even think the 5th date is teh apropriate moment to kiss. Taking it slow isn't a bad thing is it?
Author amerikajin Posted January 29, 2006 Author Posted January 29, 2006 She's from Toronto, if this is a factor at all. I'm a damn Yankee, and we Yanks are aggressive when it comes to dating. So back home, 3rd date and no play = see ya. Usually men and women would agree on this, I think.
gfto Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 I'm not a lady, but I'm gonna throw in 2 cents anyway. The problem here is that you haven't given her the all important kiss test. You HAVE to go for that kiss on the lips no later than the second date. If you had done this, then you'd know where you stand. If it lands on her lips, you might have a live one. On the other hand, if she's not interested in you, then you're calling her bluff....she'll turn her head and the kiss will land on her cheek. Guy, your gut is talking to you, but you don't want to listen to it. Never ignore what your gut is telling you. If this girl was really into you, she would've welcomed a smooch right square on the lips in that elevator! All that being said, when you're on your next date, go for the kiss! If it lands on her cheek again, then it's best to flush the number and move on.
clandestinidad Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 I'm curious how she acted that evening before the karaoke. The basis for that is simply that when I'm in an uncomfortable situation I tend to close off, and private karaoke would make me fairly uncomfortable (resulting in the nil eye contact and closed body language). I'm not trying to say that your date sucked, b/c she might have recommended it or actually enjoyed it, but that was my first thought about the situation....that she was uncomfortable. I think its too early to figure out if she wants to move forward or not. Some people start thinking too much after a couple dates (and you kind of seem to be doing that as well). Its only been 2 real dates thus far. She might have had other things on her mind, ya know. She very well might prefer spending more time with someone before kissing them. Some people will just kiss anyone, but other people take it very seriously. I wouldnt read into her behavior too much. She was just uncomfortable with something. That said, I think you shouldnt call her for a couple days. She may have taken a step back and is considering if she wants this to move along. She'll figure that out without you calling....I know youre an intelligent, great guy, and you know these relationship-type things already. I was just hoping to remind you
Outcast Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 If someone wants to be kissed, the clue is often that the person will glance at your lips and back at your eyes a lot.
loony Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 I think all these rules, when and where to kiss her, where to go and what to do on what date, etc. in my opinion are only contributing minimally to your success. If she wants you, you can kiss her on the first date or she will wait patiently (or not ) till your fifth one. If she likes you, you can just take her for a walk on the first, second, third, fourth, umpteenth date, it won't matter what you do, she'll continue liking you. I have said it already in your other thread, your problem would not be how to arrange the perfect date, but to get over your insecurity and your fixation on her looks.
Author amerikajin Posted January 29, 2006 Author Posted January 29, 2006 Wow! I've gotten some really good advice - different types of advice, but all of it good. gfto - yeah, the dude in me is thinking along similar lines. Believe me, I was waiting for an opportunity to close in much earlier than I did, but I somehow think that I may have wasted it. And I agree, typically, after the second or third date, a woman's going to wonder why she hasn't been kissed. outcast - those are typically the signs I look for. I just didn't see it when we were together. I thought I saw her warming up to me in the elevator but that was frankly not a good vibe I sent in retrospect. I could have come across as being too insistent on it. Oh well...at least I knew to back off quickly. Hope that's of some consolation. Kat - thanks for your input as well. I work with her so that makes things a bit more complicated, and I guess the vibes I get from the office will be telling. I never text her anyway except to set up a date.
hyakku Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Maybe you waited to long or missed the moment. When you miss the moment it can sort of screw things up. Still if she's playing you after your next date if you are doing the right htings and she still doesn't let you kiss her, just move on.
TheSwordfish Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Not to shock you guys and girls. But in most cases it is actually the girl making the first kiss possible. Most of my good kisses were initiated by the girl. I don't think its your fault, she's just waiting for teh right moment. Private karaoke isn't a great kissing moment in my book. On the couch in your or her house drinking some tea after the date would be a better place and moment.
whichwayisup Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 She's from Toronto, if this is a factor at all Ha, nope. I don't think her being Canadian makes a difference, let alone Toronto. I honestly don't know what freaked her out. I would ask her outright and ask why she all of a sudden feels not so comfy with you anymore. Be direct but nice about it. Kinda aloof too...That will make her wonder.
Vincent Vega Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Either kiss her on the lips, or not at all. If she pulls you close in a place that wouldn't make for the best settings (like karaoke), whisper something in her ear instead of kissing her on the cheek. Well don't whisper, but just say something at a low volume lol. Girls respond extremely well if they think you have a sexy voice. I've noticed that some can just get turned on by you talking to them in certain ways...sounds weird, but that's women for ya. Two kisses on the cheek is a big no no, even one is bad. Next time you see her, just go in for a good kiss on the lips, it might surprise her, and women like surprises. But I think that first kiss on the cheek really screwed it all up, that's why she changed afterwards.
cygny Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 If I were her, dating and getting involved physically with a guy i work with would be a situation i would consider with greater care than other dating situations. (also it's not clear to me how well you know her, and whether your acquaintence with her at work is very casual or whether you know each other pretty well.) either way, if it doesn't work out, it spills over into the workplace. not good. also, as a woman, i don't like the pressure of having to adhere to a timetable to kiss someone. would you? just the thought that the guy was 'closing in on me' to make the kill on the prescribed 2nd-3rd date would be enough to make me put my lipgloss on, lol. it sounds to me like she felt you were expecting it, and trying to zero in, and that made her uncomfortable. having said all that, it doesn't appear to me that she is wild about you at this point, although if she accepts another date with you, she must like you somewhat and be open to something developing. chemistry is not always immediate. too early to read the tea leaves. like kat said, give it a few days, call her again, and see if she sounds excited to hear from you. if she sounds distanced, end the call without asking her out. she might just be a nice woman who wants to take it slow, and like i said, given that you work with her, i think that is very wise.
cygny Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Either kiss her on the lips, or not at all. If she pulls you close in a place that wouldn't make for the best settings (like karaoke), whisper something in her ear instead of kissing her on the cheek. Well don't whisper, but just say something at a low volume lol. Girls respond extremely well if they think you have a sexy voice. I've noticed that some can just get turned on by you talking to them in certain ways...sounds weird, but that's women for ya. Two kisses on the cheek is a big no no, even one is bad. Next time you see her, just go in for a good kiss on the lips, it might surprise her, and women like surprises. But I think that first kiss on the cheek really screwed it all up, that's why she changed afterwards. trust me, if i really like a guy, a kiss on the cheek will only make me wonder more whether he likes me!
Vincent Vega Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 trust me, if i really like a guy, a kiss on the cheek will only make me wonder more whether he likes me! well that's you. a lot of girls get angry if a guy doesn't make the move and will pretty much not give him another chance.
Vincent Vega Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 or maybe i am just used to fast women because of my location
cygny Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 or maybe i am just used to fast women because of my location second date and a co-worker? and she'd be angry? yeah, that's fast. i didn't know the sf'ers were that bad.
Vincent Vega Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 well i usually date 18-22 year olds, and a lot of the girls around here are...pretty wild
cygny Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 well i usually date 18-22 year olds, and a lot of the girls around here are...pretty wild oh well have fun but if amer is dating one of those, just forget my advice. that's a whole different species lol
TheSwordfish Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 well that's you. a lot of girls get angry if a guy doesn't make the move and will pretty much not give him another chance. Well, offtopic but this makes me wonder, do somes girls get angry if a guy doesn't respond to her signs quikly enough? Even when it come sto asking someone out? Woould you even get angry if a guy you've given all the signs in the book that you like doesnt ask you out within say three weeks? (Would explain some things I've experienced )
Vincent Vega Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Well, offtopic but this makes me wonder, do somes girls get angry if a guy doesn't respond to her signs quikly enough? Even when it come sto asking someone out? Woould you even get angry if a guy you've given all the signs in the book that you like doesnt ask you out within say three weeks? (Would explain some things I've experienced ) some girls do. some girls will get frustrated and make the move themselves, some others will just leave the guy and find one who will make a move, which shows confidence. confidence is key. and if a guy didn't ask me out, i'd be happy, because i'm not into gay buttsex
cygny Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 Well, offtopic but this makes me wonder, do somes girls get angry if a guy doesn't respond to her signs quikly enough? Even when it come sto asking someone out? Woould you even get angry if a guy you've given all the signs in the book that you like doesnt ask you out within say three weeks? (Would explain some things I've experienced ) if she's angry, i'd say she's not relationship material. but if she's a self-centered drama queen, then yeah, maybe i think it's a timing thing--not in terms of how many days or weeks, but when the chemistry and the right moment is there. if the chemistry is strong, then lack of movement will make a girl wonder.
blind_otter Posted January 29, 2006 Posted January 29, 2006 And back to the OP's question. Here's my thing. I don't understand all the questioning. Because if the vibe is there, it's there and you can feel it, right? IME, anyways. I'm sending good vibes yer way, Amer.
kitkat826 Posted January 30, 2006 Posted January 30, 2006 Thinking back to the date's behavior, thats about how I would act if I didn't really like someone "in that way". SOME girls are very, very shy to the point that yet can't express it or only wait for more "perfect" moments, but they are very few I find. I would think of finding someone else who truly digs you.
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