Avoiding Cynicism

[FredEire]

I'm posting this thread basically looking for advice on how to keep spirits and confidence up in the modern dating game.

I've been working on myself and my attitude recently and have realised that Im someone with a bit of a tendency to be pessimistic and overthink, but I'm fully aware it's not going to help me in terms of anything really but my dating life in particular.

With that in mind I'm doing my best to stay in the moment, regard each interaction as it's own unique thing and if something doesnt work out not to take it personally and move on.

But I have to be honest it can be damn hard sometimes. I've met a couple of girls recently wherein she actually came up to me, quite flirty and engaged, we had a really good vibe going on and agreed to meet up again/exchanged contacts etc. In one case when I reached out the following day I didn't get any reply and in the second we arranged a date but she cancelled fairly close to the time and didnt seem particularly interested in rescheduling.

Now in the first case I usually brush these things off fairly easily because if you dont get a text back thats it, not much to think about. But in the case where you put yourself out there and actually make the effort to take time out of your week and seem to be treated like an option if theyre bored and have nothing else to do... it can start to grate a bit.

I know slipping into cynicism isn't going to help one bit... but to be frank it can be hard not to have an attitude of "what nonsense is it going to be this time" if the general experience is that you make an effort but you don't get even the slightest effort in return.

Any advice for keeping positive? Because I know that there are good people out there who make a mutual effort but it can feel very, very hard to find them.

[Sony12]

It honestly is just something that goes along with dating and something you just can't let get to you. Many people are going to be flaky when it comes to dating and may act on a feeling they are having in the moment but after more time to think about it they decide it isn't what they want. Other times they are just trying to be nice to someone and may make someone think they are more interested then they really are. 

There are lots of reasons why people don't live up to first impressions and it's something we can't let get to us. My advice is make your family, friends, pets the part of your life that is important to you. Don't become emotionally tied to people you are dating until they prove they are worthy of emotional investment by you.

[FredEire]

19 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

It honestly is just something that goes along with dating and something you just can't let get to you. Many people are going to be flaky when it comes to dating and may act on a feeling they are having in the moment but after more time to think about it they decide it isn't what they want. Other times they are just trying to be nice to someone and may make someone think they are more interested then they really are. 

There are lots of reasons why people don't live up to first impressions and it's something we can't let get to us. My advice is make your family, friends, pets the part of your life that is important to you. Don't become emotionally tied to people you are dating until they prove they are worthy of emotional investment by you.

All good advice, thanks.

But the main thing I struggle with is that you have to keep an open mind with each new experience, but you reach a certain point in life where you're no longer a dating novice and the sheer amount of nonsense you experience steers you toward feeling like "what's it going to be this time?" even when the initial meeting is largely or very positive.

Whenever something doesn't get off the ground initially I move on quickly and get on with my life, but stuff like people cancelling just before we're supposed to meet and making no effort to apologise or reschedule is, quite frankly, annoying.

I'm aware of ideas like the abundance mindset but frankly its hard to retrain yourself to expect something positive fun and uplifting when that hasn't been your lived experience for a while. It's a bit of a catch 22.

Edited yesterday at 10:29 PM by FredEire

[Els]

It's a hard thing to do in general. Relationships and careers, especially - many times you'll really put yourself out there and put in the effort, but it's never a guarantee of the end result. And it's hard to keep that from turning you cynical, but you have to, because if you don't, it'll just make things worse for you in the future. 

I feel like this is one of those things where it's a good idea to not to care so much about the outcome, just put in whatever you can afford to give and see where it goes. If it works, great, if not you're not out too much and you've got some practice reps in and learned something new.

Also just focus on taking care of your mental health in general - exercise, meditation/gratitude journals/whatever works for you.

[FredEire]

16 minutes ago, Els said:

It's a hard thing to do in general. Relationships and careers, especially - many times you'll really put yourself out there and put in the effort, but it's never a guarantee of the end result. And it's hard to keep that from turning you cynical, but you have to, because if you don't, it'll just make things worse for you in the future. 

I feel like this is one of those things where it's a good idea to not to care so much about the outcome, just put in whatever you can afford to give and see where it goes. If it works, great, if not you're not out too much and you've got some practice reps in and learned something new.

Also just focus on taking care of your mental health in general - exercise, meditation/gratitude journals/whatever works for you.

Thanks.

Yeah I do make the effort to do all those things. Am physically active, try to have a fairly good nutritious diet etc, am working on my career...

And I've definitely improved on brushing things off since my younger years, but the bit in bold is the difficult part. I want dating to a fun, enjoyable experience for both parties, regardless of whether we turn out to be a good fit for each other.

But it has honestly felt like a slog for a while now with the amount of flakiness or sometimes downright rudeness involved. And the amount of times I meet someone who just seems like a communicative, nice and straightforward person is pretty damn seldom these days. And yes I know I'm not the only person with that sentiment.

But I know if I don't take care of the tendency towards cynicism I'll risk turning into a bit of a curmudgeon as I move into middle age and beyond.

I know there are plenty of other things in my life I need to work on and improve, so I guess part of the picture is upping my efforts to do that.

Edited yesterday at 10:48 PM by FredEire

[Gebidozo]

I think you are right about Catch 22.

Negative experiences lead to negative feelings, negative feelings lead to negative vibes, negative vibes lead to negative experiences, and so on.

It doesn’t matter which of those actually started it all. The point is that you can only change one of them, and that is negative feelings.

Every time you even begin to lean towards cynical, bitter thoughts, your aura (so to say) instantly changes. You start channeling negative vibes, which can be sensed by women, regardless of how well you can hide them. That, in turn, repels women - perhaps even on a subconscious level, and even women who were initially attracted to you.

The harder I’ve been looking at reality throughout my 50 years of life so far, the more I’ve become convinced that my own mindset has determined most of the things that have happened to me, positive and negative. That applies not only to romance but also to my profession and other things.

We all constantly battle negative thoughts, that’s why we all crave positivity. And we can all smell even the tiniest bit of negative thinking from miles away and escape it whenever we can. That’s why, as banal as this advice is, you have to be positive.

Don’t think of those women as callous or lacking substance, think of them as poor creatures who are starving for and unwavering belief, security, and optimism, and are getting doubts, disappointment, and sadness from you instead.

By being positive, I don’t just mean being nice, humble, and intelligent, all of which you are, and all of which are fantastic qualities. Being positive is pretty much the same as having deep faith in yourself, which I feel you might be somewhat lacking.

I always tell my students this, “you’ll have a chance to be good at this only if you believe that you are good, and only if you love what you do”. The same must be applied to dating.

Yes, a lot depends on innate gifts (talent, good looks, etc.) and hard work (studying the craft or studying people), but you must embrace your profession/romance with all its ugly aspects and love it unconditionally if you want to have better chances. And you must believe that you’ll eventually succeed, regardless of how many times you’ve failed.

 

 

[FredEire]

6 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

I think you are right about Catch 22.

Negative experiences lead to negative feelings, negative feelings lead to negative vibes, negative vibes lead to negative experiences, and so on.

It doesn’t matter which of those actually started it all. The point is that you can only change one of them, and that is negative feelings.

Every time you even begin to lean towards cynical, bitter thoughts, your aura (so to say) instantly changes. You start channeling negative vibes, which can be sensed by women, regardless of how well you can hide them. That, in turn, repels women - perhaps even on a subconscious level, and even women who were initially attracted to you.

The harder I’ve been looking at reality throughout my 50 years of life so far, the more I’ve become convinced that my own mindset has determined most of the things that have happened to me, positive and negative. That applies not only to romance but also to my profession and other things.

We all constantly battle negative thoughts, that’s why we all crave positivity. And we can all smell even the tiniest bit of negative thinking from miles away and escape it whenever we can. That’s why, as banal as this advice is, you have to be positive.

Don’t think of those women as callous or lacking substance, think of them as poor creatures who are starving for and unwavering belief, security, and optimism, and are getting doubts, disappointment, and sadness from you instead.

By being positive, I don’t just mean being nice, humble, and intelligent, all of which you are, and all of which are fantastic qualities. Being positive is pretty much the same as having deep faith in yourself, which I feel you might be somewhat lacking.

I always tell my students this, “you’ll have a chance to be good at this only if you believe that you are good, and only if you love what you do”. The same must be applied to dating.

Yes, a lot depends on innate gifts (talent, good looks, etc.) and hard work (studying the craft or studying people), but you must embrace your profession/romance with all its ugly aspects and love it unconditionally if you want to have better chances. And you must believe that you’ll eventually succeed, regardless of how many times you’ve failed.

 

 

I know and that there is a lot of truth in what you are saying, I even said similar things myself in OP. The issue though as you said is that "just be positive" is kind of frustrating advice because you can't really just pull it out your behind at a whim.

Another thing I'm struggling with is well, I'm getting older. I was quite a handsome younger guy and while I did always struggle a bit with negativity it brought a certain amount of positive attention that isn't there anymore to the same extent. While I don't think I look terrible for me age, I probably do look 32, and though it doesnt seem to be too noticeable to most people I'm dealing with hair loss, which was pretty devastating to realise because I have a pretty unique hair colour and used to get compliments all the time for that. I also have quite a large head haha and I dont think "just shave it and look like Vin Diesel" really applies for me. I also have had a number of girls tell me (probably not realising I'm balding and independent of that) that they find bald men repulsive and would never date one.

So all that considered it does feel a bit like I'm dealing with dwindling prospects as I go into the future, which as I said makes it really hard to "just be positive".

Finally just with the point in bold, while certainly in some cases I maybe went on dates that were a bit flat maybe because the energy I was bringing maybe wasn't as light or fun as it could have been, there's been a few cases where someone acted downright poorly/was extremely rude. I don't think in every case that I'm entirely responsible for someone else's behaviour.

[Gebidozo]

5 hours ago, FredEire said:

The issue though as you said is that "just be positive" is kind of frustrating advice because you can't really just pull it out your behind at a whim.

Yes, but that’s the only thing you can actually work on.

The rest simply doesn’t depend on you. Yes, you’re aging. I’m aging. Everybody ages and everybody dies eventually.
 

5 hours ago, FredEire said:

I also have had a number of girls tell me (probably not realising I'm balding and independent of that) that they find bald men repulsive and would never date one.

First of all, why would you even want to date a woman who is so shallow that she’d reject a man because he has no hair?

Second, I’m personally familiar with several completely bald guys who have a lot of success with women. One of them is my brother. He was noticeably balding already at the age of 30.

 

5 hours ago, FredEire said:

Finally just with the point in bold, while certainly in some cases I maybe went on dates that were a bit flat maybe because the energy I was bringing maybe wasn't as light or fun as it could have been, there's been a few cases where someone acted downright poorly/was extremely rude. I don't think in every case that I'm entirely responsible for someone else's behaviour.

Of course not, I wasn’t implying that.

I’m merely saying that on those dates where everything seems to go well and there is apparent chemistry, but then the woman backs off for some reason, your mindset would be the first thing to check.

Edited 9 hours ago by Gebidozo

[FredEire]

43 minutes ago, Gebidozo said:

Yes, but that’s the only thing you can actually work on.

The rest simply doesn’t depend on you. Yes, you’re aging. I’m aging. Everybody ages and everybody dies eventually.
 

First of all, why would you even want to date a woman who is so shallow that she’d reject a man because he has no hair?

Second, I’m personally familiar with several completely bald guys who have a lot of success with women. One of them is my brother. He was noticeably balding already at the age of 30.

 

Of course not, I wasn’t implying that.

I’m merely saying that on those dates where everything seems to go well and there is apparent chemistry, but then the woman backs off for some reason, your mindset would be the first thing to check.

Well everyone has physical preferences at the end of the day. I'd say there are few people who would date someone who is physically unappealing in their eyes no matter how good their personality is. I'm not saying bald dudes absolutely can't find dates but it certainly doesnt help one's chances. I'm on treatment and plan to get a hair transplant so Im doing as much as I can there and if I go fully bald well I know I can't fully control that.

So going back to the mindset thing... of course I'm fully aware of how important one's mindset it. But generally one's mindset is shaped by their experiences, and when positive experiences seem increasing thin on the ground, it becomes very difficult to stay optimistic about the future, or have an abundance mindset, or indeed to stay grounded and not overinvest when something does seem to be going well because you perceive it as scarce (and by default because of the mindset it is, due to the catch 22/feedback loop). How does one actually do that, other than "just try and be positive". That's the main point of the thread I guess.

Edited 8 hours ago by FredEire

[Gebidozo]

3 minutes ago, FredEire said:

Well everyone has physical preferences at the end of the day. I'd say there are few people who would date someone who is physically unappealing in their eyes no matter how good their personality is. I'm not saying bald dudes absolutely can't find dates but it certainly doesnt help one's chances. I'm on treatment and plan to get a hair transplant so Im doing as much as I can there and if I go fully bald well I know I can't fully control that.

This is so strange… I know quite a few bald guys, none of them have any problem with being bald and many of them have resounding success with women.

I’m sort of beginning to think that you’ve been on too many dates with superficially minded women.

 

5 minutes ago, FredEire said:

How does one actually do that, other than "just try and be positive".

The same way as one does it in regard to life as a whole. Life is replete with loss, disease, decay, and general misery, and it ends with death. It’s actually quite rational to think of life as a pointless, cruel tragedy.

Yet people manage to find some meaning in life and have stubborn faith in spite of the merciless reality. I guess if you narrow it down to dating it should still be the same kind of thing.

[Els]

8 hours ago, FredEire said:

While I don't think I look terrible for me age, I probably do look 32, and though it doesnt seem to be too noticeable to most people I'm dealing with hair loss, which was pretty devastating to realise because I have a pretty unique hair colour and used to get compliments all the time for that. I also have quite a large head haha and I dont think "just shave it and look like Vin Diesel" really applies for me. I also have had a number of girls tell me (probably not realising I'm balding and independent of that) that they find bald men repulsive and would never date one.

How young are you dating?

I'm in my 30s and none of my female friends in that age range have said that they "would never date a bald man". I mean, most men go bald eventually... That sounds like something I'd expect a girl in her late teens or early 20s to say, not a woman in her 30s.

[FredEire]

1 minute ago, Els said:

How young are you dating?

I'm in my 30s and none of my female friends in that age range have said that they "would never date a bald man". I mean, most men go bald eventually... That sounds like something I'd expect a girl in her late teens or early 20s to say, not a woman in her 30s.

The vast majority of girls I've dated recently are around my own age. Older or younger by a year or two. Thinking back to said women they were all in their 30s, except one who was someone I had a brief fling with who was actually 42! She told me her ex had started balding aggressively and it was a major turnoff.

[FredEire]

2 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

This is so strange… I know quite a few bald guys, none of them have any problem with being bald and many of them have resounding success with women.

I’m sort of beginning to think that you’ve been on too many dates with superficially minded women.

 

The same way as one does it in regard to life as a whole. Life is replete with loss, disease, decay, and general misery, and it ends with death. It’s actually quite rational to think of life as a pointless, cruel tragedy.

Yet people manage to find some meaning in life and have stubborn faith in spite of the merciless reality. I guess if you narrow it down to dating it should still be the same kind of thing.

Perhaps. One of said women though was a girl I was dating for a few months, I would say in general she was a really nice, considerate person and a good communicator, the closest I've come to a serious relationship in recent times and a hell of a lot less superficial than many other people Ive dated in general. And she said dating a bald guy would be a hard no, it was just her preference.

The vast majority of my friends aren't bald but I have a couple, one guy struggles a lot with women but he says he always did, the other guy was model good looking when he was younger and had no problem finding dates and now struggles a lot, but he does a kind of 3-strand combover which looks awful despite everyone advising him to just shave. And tbf I think there's more going on than just his hair loss.

It's hard to say objectively though, theres tons of online stories about guys dating life tanking after going bald, it suits some a lot more than others. I personally think Id look like I just got out of prison with a shave head, which might appeal to some women lol. If I end up having to embrace it I might lean into it and get a few tats

 

On the second point, that's true, some people have more or less misfortunate lives that others, but generally there are some great moments and really good times to balance out the hardships that come along. When I think back on my dating life when I was younger the same applied. There were always duds sure, some false starts, some not great dates... but mixed in there were a lot of really nice experiences where I got to know some really nice girls even if it didnt transform into something for the long term. Even some one-and-done dates where I left with a feeling that we just didnt click romantically but the overall experience was really fun and enjoyable.

Unfortunately that's getting rarer and rarer now, and I feel it's a mix of the 30+ dating environment, the dating environment in general and my vibes in response to that. I honestly just miss the fun of a good night where I meet someone and we are both enjoying eachother's company, having a bit of a flirt etc. The experience nowadays more often then not is either just stressful or feels like pulling hen's teeth, or both.

Edited 5 hours ago by FredEire