Why do most of the women I date want sex, but not a relationship?

[Shehaari]

 I personally appreciate a man who's honest and communicative about their intentions early on, so I can act accordingly. Perhaps it's because I'm no serial dater and look for intentionality in connections. Knowing what a man is looking for provides me with clarity - not guessing or having to decipher behaviour. 

Sharing your intentions early on, will either invite those who want to get to know you on a deeper level, or it will reveal who does not want the same as you.

My humble advice would be to get curious about what these women are looking for "in that perticular season of life", and see if it matches yours.
Do this BEFORE sharing too much of yourself emotionally and physically (as it seems we might be similar there). 
 

5 hours ago, Repentant said:

Edit: thank you! I do try to not hurt feelings more than it's absolutely necessary, so to speak, which is why I always try my best to communicate my side of things clearly and in a timely manner. I don't do "it's not you, it's me" unless I really mean it, y'know?

 I appreciate this way of thinking in a man. Intention is key and being a man with integrity and having good manners will take you far

 

10 minutes ago, Repentant said:

genuine emotional connection, attention, interest in my person, curiosity about what makes me me, are nicer to me.

I agree! This adds more depth to the relationship and sex would feel so much better when it feels genuine. 

[Sanch62]

9 hours ago, Repentant said:

Honestly, this entire deal is so friggin' complicated, that I have times when I wonder if it's even worth it... Somehow, it seems my dynamic is specific enough to be my main impediment...

I think you've been doing well, and you're getting frustrated by natural odds. Most people need to meet a lot of bad matches before finding good potential, and even then, dating is about exploring whether the match is mutual and sustainable. In most cases, not.

If finding love were easy, what would be so special about it?

Here's one possibility. Do you pull back enough to allow for reciprocation? If not, your pace may be too arduous for most women to keep up with. For instance, even after a fabulous date, I need time to reflect and process. If the guy phones next day and wants to schedule again, my first impulse is to want to ask if I can get back to him. I just need a breather.

Are you giving women a breather between dates? Do you ever allow them the time and space to reach out to you to propose a next date?

If not, try pulling back a bit. You may be exhausting women. You may be teaching them that partnering with you might feel a bit suffocating, and that could be what they are responding to. Consider the value of autonomy during relationships.

[Sony12]

4 minutes ago, Sanch62 said:

I think you've been doing well, and you're getting frustrated by natural odds. Most people need to meet a lot of bad matches before finding good potential, and even then, dating is about exploring whether the match is mutual and sustainable. In most cases, not.

If finding love were easy, what would be so special about it?

Here's one possibility. Do you pull back enough to allow for reciprocation? If not, your pace may be too arduous for most women to keep up with. For instance, even after a fabulous date, I need time to reflect and process. If the guy phones next day and wants to schedule again, my first impulse is to want to ask if I can get back to him. I just need a breather.

Are you giving women a breather between dates? Do you ever allow them the time and space to reach out to you to propose a next date?

If not, try pulling back a bit. You may be exhausting women. You may be teaching them that partnering with you might feel a bit suffocating, and that could be what they are responding to. Consider the value of autonomy during relationships.

I have never really felt that pulling back and waiting to set up another date until another time was a very good plan. Doing so can easily send a signal to the lady that you yourself aren't that interested and she will quickly move on to another person communicating with her who is pursuing her harder. Unless she has a big crush on him she will often lose interest very quickly if the guy is being very casual about pursuing her. There is definitely a middle ground that needs to be reached about not over pursuing but not under pursuing.

[Sanch62]

Just now, Sony12 said:

There is definitely a middle ground that needs to be reached about not over pursuing but not under pursuing.

Yes, exactly. I can appreciate expressing enjoyment of a date and wanting to get together again; I'm not advocating for being uncommunicative.

I can even see scheduling a second date pretty closely to the first and being proactive about that. But afterward, I'm cautioning against glomming onto someone and not allowing for breathing room and reciprocation. Women don't need to be 'sold,' that's patronizing. It demonstrates insecurity, and nobody wants that. It might be helpful to say you really enjoyed a date and offer that if she'd like to see you again, you're open to her picking the next one. Think of it like reaching out to touch fingers instead of grabbing her arm and pulling all the time.

[Sony12]

17 minutes ago, Sanch62 said:

 It might be helpful to say you really enjoyed a date and offer that if she'd like to see you again, you're open to her picking the next one. Think of it like reaching out to touch fingers instead of grabbing her arm and pulling all the time.

That can work but in my experience most of the women comfortable in taking over the scheduling and what not that early on in the process are the exact same types the OP is being weary of. The ones who will be inviting a guy back to her place after the date is over......and sometimes before the date even happens.

[Els]

2 hours ago, Repentant said:

Oh, sorry, I've expressed it ambiguously! I've dated over ten women, but most of those instances didn't last for more than a couple of weeks tops. Overall, I've had four instances which could be called relationships.

I mean, this is like a 30% rate? Which is perfectly normal IMO, and in fact I'd consider it quite high.

It's understandable that you are frustrated, of course. For the relationships that ended, do you know why they ended?

[smackie9]

It's simple...emotional connection just isn't there. Your focus throughout your post is all about the physical...the sex, the making out, having all your ducks in a row financially, fit and healthy, good looking enough to getting your foot in the door, being respectful, able to set boundaries, not a pushover, etc. The truth is women want to be intellectually stimulated. We think, feel, and make decisions with our emotions. Some men are able to tap into that, some don't. That's why you will see a guy that has nothing, isn't all that, but is able to get women to commit to them. Maybe find some self help books that will help you gain the knowledge to connect with women better. 

[Sony12]

53 minutes ago, smackie9 said:

It's simple...emotional connection just isn't there. Your focus throughout your post is all about the physical...the sex, the making out, having all your ducks in a row financially, fit and healthy, good looking enough to getting your foot in the door, being respectful, able to set boundaries, not a pushover, etc. The truth is women want to be intellectually stimulated. We think, feel, and make decisions with our emotions. Some men are able to tap into that, some don't. That's why you will see a guy that has nothing, isn't all that, but is able to get women to commit to them. Maybe find some self help books that will help you gain the knowledge to connect with women better. 

Don't be so quick to give credit to guys who don't really have much going for them who are still able to get women to commit to them. In reality many of those guys have just found a certain type of girl that they can manipulate. For instance there are a lot of guys who prey upon emotionally vulnerable women and completely take advantage of them. Not in regards to sex but they convince these women to fund them because they act like they are being emotionally there for them. All the while living off them. Many of those guys are even worse then the ones who are using women for sex. At least the ones who are using them for sex aren't trying to bleed their bank accounts.

Edited Sunday at 06:56 PM by Sony12

[Repentant]

9 hours ago, Shehaari said:

 I personally appreciate a man who's honest and communicative about their intentions early on, so I can act accordingly. Perhaps it's because I'm no serial dater and look for intentionality in connections. Knowing what a man is looking for provides me with clarity - not guessing or having to decipher behaviour. 

Sharing your intentions early on, will either invite those who want to get to know you on a deeper level, or it will reveal who does not want the same as you.

My humble advice would be to get curious about what these women are looking for "in that perticular season of life", and see if it matches yours.
Do this BEFORE sharing too much of yourself emotionally and physically (as it seems we might be similar there). 
 

 I appreciate this way of thinking in a man. Intention is key and being a man with integrity and having good manners will take you far

 

I agree! This adds more depth to the relationship and sex would feel so much better when it feels genuine. 

I apologise for the delay and thank you! You've lifted my spirits!

You've touched upon several issues with which I've had to deal early on in this journey of romance, as I didn't have the healthiest examples growing up, and so had to gradually correct course over time. I did have a tendency to seek out emotionally unavailable women, or even women with whom those familiar sickly patterns could be reproduced. I've worked on this for several years in therapy and have managed to recalibrate my system of value in terms of relationships, as well as worked on rebuilding myself for myself. I'm sure I've still a lot left to handle, as healing and growing are lifelong processes, but I am in a much, much better place than I used to be. 

And, yes, those sickly patterns included me giving myself away fully and from the start to people who really didn't do much to deserve/earn it, but that has stopped happening a while ago. Now I take things step by step, I try to do as you've mentioned - figuring out intentions from early on, getting a feel for the temperature, which is why the attempts which clearly wouldn't go where I'd want them now last significantly less than before, and with less emotional investment from the start. I still like to give it an honest shot and to get to know the women at least enough to determine with 90% certainty that we're not looking for the same thing, but once that's clear, I don't hang on to "maybe, just maybe." It's unfair to everyone involved, I think.

Thank you so much, I really do try to be sincere and open about these things, as that's ultimately what builds the type of connection I'm seeking, but most importantly because I find it's the least I could do in terms of basic decency and respect. Plus I know very well what it's like to be on the receiving end of ambiguity, of the emotional push-pull, to be blindsided by a full 180 which came without warning or understanding of what caused it, and I genuinely don't want to generate that type of confusion and chaos in anyone. 

And you've hit the nail square on the head! That's exactly it, sex, to me, is an expression of passion, maybe even the purest form there is. And, as I see things, true passion can never be manifested without a deep connection, without knowing my partner's ins and outs, both physically as well as intellectually, emotionally, basically as much of everything there is to know about them as possible. It's also why casual sex doesn't do much for me. Physical gratification alone isn't all that interesting to me, I'm primarily looking for intimacy, for emotional fulfilment, I want sex with meaning, with a full person, with an emotionally and intellectually real and present entity. Sex isn't just with the body, it's with the mind, with feelings, it's with love and affection, it IS love and affection. 

And being a giver, it's one thing to satisfy a beautiful body and an entirely different thing to satisfy the beautiful person I hold dearly in my heart and mind.

[Repentant]

10 hours ago, Sanch62 said:

I think you've been doing well, and you're getting frustrated by natural odds. Most people need to meet a lot of bad matches before finding good potential, and even then, dating is about exploring whether the match is mutual and sustainable. In most cases, not.

If finding love were easy, what would be so special about it?

Here's one possibility. Do you pull back enough to allow for reciprocation? If not, your pace may be too arduous for most women to keep up with. For instance, even after a fabulous date, I need time to reflect and process. If the guy phones next day and wants to schedule again, my first impulse is to want to ask if I can get back to him. I just need a breather.

Are you giving women a breather between dates? Do you ever allow them the time and space to reach out to you to propose a next date?

If not, try pulling back a bit. You may be exhausting women. You may be teaching them that partnering with you might feel a bit suffocating, and that could be what they are responding to. Consider the value of autonomy during relationships.

Thank you so much for the reassurance, it softens the frustration a bit. It's still a very heavy aspect from an emotional standpoint, but it's easier to deal with it knowing it's basically just a math problem. Very good point about the rarity of love, I really should do more to remind myself of that.

As to your point about giving my dates space, yes! I Or at least I try my best to do so, especially if I'm particularly excited about them. I tend to hyperfixate on things which intrigue me so I monitor that aspect and keep it in check when it comes down to people, as I don't like being bombarded with and suffocated by attention, either. 

I do try to communicate openly all the time, things like telling them if I've enjoyed myself, showing appreciation and gratitude, making light of awkwardness, reminiscing, etc., and I generally try to get a feel for my date's rhythm and adapt to it. If it's reciprocal and I know I can count on them to initiate at least as much as I would want to, then it's "one for you, one for me" in terms of asking for another date. However, I've had instances where I've been asked out before I even managed to formulate the sentence, and instances where my dates have been on the shy side, in which case I took more initiative if I saw they were genuinely interested. 

Basically, I focus on paying attention to my dates, to their rhythm, their personality, their person in general, and always try to adapt to their needs (as much as I can without bending myself backwards, to note). At the same time, I do my best to give them the chance to know me as well, to figure out who I am and how that fits into their existence, if that makes sense.

And I want to highlight one aspect in particular, what you've said about autonomy. If there's anything I find holy in this world, that's personal autonomy. And this goes very deep for me, it functions both out of altruism and selfishness. To expand, autonomy is the most important thing for me as far as my existence is concerned, and precisely because I understand its value at such a deeply personal level, I always try to hold space for the other person's autonomy and even reinforce it as much as I possibly can. A person who is thoroughly Themself has my respect through the sheer intentionality behind it, and a woman who is Herself through-and-through is probably my biggest turn-on, to be very honest.

In short, yes, I really want to respect my dates' autonomy as much as I possibly can (maybe even more than I could), even (and especially) if it goes against what I'd want from them.

[Repentant]

9 hours ago, Els said:

I mean, this is like a 30% rate? Which is perfectly normal IMO, and in fact I'd consider it quite high.

It's understandable that you are frustrated, of course. For the relationships that ended, do you know why they ended?

Thanks so much for the reassurance!

To answer your question, I always try to learn whatever there is to be learnt from every experience, as I'd at least want to make new mistakes if they're wholly unavoidable. I've tried to get it from my partners' mouths if they were willing to discuss it openly, discussed things honestly and openly in therapy, did a lot of reading around relationship dynamics, basically everything I had at my disposal to try to learn said lessons.

My first ended because we were both very young, very traumatised, and had the communication skills of turnips, for instance, and I've been working hard ever since on developing healthy and thorough communication skills, as well as dealing with whatever past shenanigans I could find in my composition (that one catapulted me straight into depression, as we were even engaged by the end). The age bit came naturally, thankfully (I guess).

[Repentant]

8 hours ago, smackie9 said:

It's simple...emotional connection just isn't there. Your focus throughout your post is all about the physical...the sex, the making out, having all your ducks in a row financially, fit and healthy, good looking enough to getting your foot in the door, being respectful, able to set boundaries, not a pushover, etc. The truth is women want to be intellectually stimulated. We think, feel, and make decisions with our emotions. Some men are able to tap into that, some don't. That's why you will see a guy that has nothing, isn't all that, but is able to get women to commit to them. Maybe find some self help books that will help you gain the knowledge to connect with women better. 

Thank you very much for the insight!

I really did think on this for a bit, and if by this you mean really being there, present in the moment with them, being open about both myself and my interest in getting to know them, in trying to understand them and their emotional reality, in being vulnerable and trying to offer them a safe space within which to be vulnerable as well, paying attention to their needs, to the things which make their eyes light up with joy, to that one movie, or song, or whatever it may be which always hits them in the feels, offering a warm shoulder, a tight hug, and opening up my empathy when something brought them down (not to fix, but to genuinely listen and feel their feels, so to speak), being playful and curious, even teasing and tantalising, then yes! Or at the very least I hope I've managed to do that for them!

Ultimately, that's what I want out of a relationship, I don't want it for the relationship's sake, I want to have a full and complete person in my life, with their entire internal world, their panoply of emotions, their complexity of though, their unique perspective and takes on things, their ups and downs, their strengths and shortcomings, and I see no other way of achieving that. I mean... what would be the point otherwise? I genuinely want a partner, someone with whom to share my life, someone to whom I could offer anything they wanted out of it, someone who'd have me share in their life as well, someone with whom to share in the joy of the good times and alongside whom to push through the crummy ones.

If it was just to stave off the loneliness, it'd be easier to get a dog:))

[Shehaari]

11 hours ago, Repentant said:

I apologise for the delay and thank you! You've lifted my spirits!

You've touched upon several issues with which I've had to deal early on in this journey of romance, as I didn't have the healthiest examples growing up, and so had to gradually correct course over time. I did have a tendency to seek out emotionally unavailable women, or even women with whom those familiar sickly patterns could be reproduced. I've worked on this for several years in therapy and have managed to recalibrate my system of value in terms of relationships, as well as worked on rebuilding myself for myself. I'm sure I've still a lot left to handle, as healing and growing are lifelong processes, but I am in a much, much better place than I used to be. 

And, yes, those sickly patterns included me giving myself away fully and from the start to people who really didn't do much to deserve/earn it, but that has stopped happening a while ago. Now I take things step by step, I try to do as you've mentioned - figuring out intentions from early on, getting a feel for the temperature, which is why the attempts which clearly wouldn't go where I'd want them now last significantly less than before, and with less emotional investment from the start. I still like to give it an honest shot and to get to know the women at least enough to determine with 90% certainty that we're not looking for the same thing, but once that's clear, I don't hang on to "maybe, just maybe." It's unfair to everyone involved, I think.

Thank you so much, I really do try to be sincere and open about these things, as that's ultimately what builds the type of connection I'm seeking, but most importantly because I find it's the least I could do in terms of basic decency and respect. Plus I know very well what it's like to be on the receiving end of ambiguity, of the emotional push-pull, to be blindsided by a full 180 which came without warning or understanding of what caused it, and I genuinely don't want to generate that type of confusion and chaos in anyone. 

And you've hit the nail square on the head! That's exactly it, sex, to me, is an expression of passion, maybe even the purest form there is. And, as I see things, true passion can never be manifested without a deep connection, without knowing my partner's ins and outs, both physically as well as intellectually, emotionally, basically as much of everything there is to know about them as possible. It's also why casual sex doesn't do much for me. Physical gratification alone isn't all that interesting to me, I'm primarily looking for intimacy, for emotional fulfilment, I want sex with meaning, with a full person, with an emotionally and intellectually real and present entity. Sex isn't just with the body, it's with the mind, with feelings, it's with love and affection, it IS love and affection. 

And being a giver, it's one thing to satisfy a beautiful body and an entirely different thing to satisfy the beautiful person I hold dearly in my heart and mind.

I'm glad it did

Thank you for sharing this. I can absolutely relate to not having the healthiest rolemodels of healthy romance growing up. The fact that you're reflective and aware- both of yourself and relationship dynamics, is very refreshing and will definitly be beneficial for you, regardless of who you meet. You seem to be doing the right things. It sounds like you've just not met the type of women who'd want to get to know you on a deeper level, beyond just physical intimacy. 

Where do you meet the women you've dated? 

Genuine connections and commitment seems much rarer in todays dating, perhaps for valid reasons to many i'm sure, but that's a different conversation for another time.. 

I might not be of much help figuring out the why's and the how's, but as someone with a similar view on dating, I would hope more men were as introspective and clear as you are. Not that there aren't men like this, but I've yet to meet a man who'll lean in to the connection, rather than pull away for a reason that just doesn't make sense. 

I couldn't have said that last paragraph any better than what you just did! 
I would add it also helps building vulnerability and safety which helps sustain a true, genuine connection.

What type of women have you been curious on? Any spesific trates now than before?

Edited yesterday at 01:38 PM by Shehaari

[Sanch62]

2 hours ago, Shehaari said:

I would hope more men were as introspective and clear as you are.

I second this, and it doesn't sound as though you're doing anything wrong. You just haven't found your match yet, and that's just natural odds at work.

Rejections aren't really about you. They speak of the limitations of the lens through which another is capable of viewing you. The right person will view you through the right lens, but that will be rare. It's supposed to be rare. Natural selection is about aligning for the long term with enough patience to find the needle in the haystack.

Women who aren't aligned with you will naturally screen themselves out unless you do it first. So maybe your screening skills could use practice so you don't spend too much time with those who are not right for you.

When your primary goal of dating is to screen out bad matches rather than play out every hand you're dealt to your own detriment, you'll pass on bad matches early rather than acting like a 'candle in the wind', ya know?

Keep opting for resilience, pass on bad matches early, and hold out for simpatico with THE woman who actually 'gets you'. You will thank yourself.

[Nowherenear]

I think part of the issue comes from the fact that many women have a lot of romantic options. When there are so many ways and places to get attention from men, it can create a mindset where there always seems to be a better option, so committing to one person feels unnecessary. I’m not saying women should settle for a bad relationship, but constantly chasing the “grass is greener” idea can be exhausting and even excruciating.

[Repentant]

3 hours ago, Shehaari said:

I'm glad it did

Thank you for sharing this. I can absolutely relate to not having the healthiest rolemodels of healthy romance growing up. The fact that you're reflective and aware- both of yourself and relationship dynamics, is very refreshing and will definitly be beneficial for you, regardless of who you meet. You seem to be doing the right things. It sounds like you've just not met the type of women who'd want to get to know you on a deeper level, beyond just physical intimacy. 

Where do you meet the women you've dated? 

Genuine connections and commitment seems much rarer in todays dating, perhaps for valid reasons to many i'm sure, but that's a different conversation for another time.. 

I might not be of much help figuring out the why's and the how's, but as someone with a similar view on dating, I would hope more men were as introspective and clear as you are. Not that there aren't men like this, but I've yet to meet a man who'll lean in to the connection, rather than pull away for a reason that just doesn't make sense. 

I couldn't have said that last paragraph any better than what you just did! 
I would add it also helps building vulnerability and safety which helps sustain a true, genuine connection.

What type of women have you been curious on? Any spesific trates now than before?

Well, to be honest, it's mostly random nowadays. I used to check out the apps every other year or so, but I stopped entirely a couple of years ago, as they've become ridiculously predatory... Now it's friends of friends, maybe someone catches my eye when I'm out and about and I'll try to strike up a conversation when I see there's space for it, women I get to know through shared contexts, such as work (although I only approach them after either or both of us quit - made the mistake of getting involved with a coworker once and I will never make that mistake again...), hobbies, basically whenever it happens. I honestly wouldn't even know where to actively look for potential dates nowadays, as third spaces have pretty much vanished...

Ah, yes, I agree. I know a lot of people who've been soured on the entire dating deal due to really bad experiences, and I can't blame them for being apprehensive about potentially opening themselves up to more disappointment. My "luck" (if one could call it that) is that I've been familiarised with disappointment from an early age, so I'm partly desensitised to it:))

Thank you so much! Your words really mean a lot, I hope I will continue to live up to them! And I agree, there seems to be a generalised aversion to commitment nowadays... While I can sort of understand where it's coming from, it's still pretty sad... We're pretty much all starved for connection in today's world, yet so few of us actually try to form any...

Oooh, vulnerability is paramount, agreed! Nothing like opening up and being embraced for it! 

As for your last question, I used to go for the "exciting" ones, the ones I could help "fix." Trauma bonding, I know, but I used to cling to that core nugget of truth they all had hidden behind brick walls and thorn bushes, y'know? Nowadays, I'm still a romantic at heart, but I've become more pragmatic, in that I still appreciate someone who "gets it," or at least someone who understands what it's like to have had to survive, not live, from the start, but intentionality is key - I don't really care how much baggage someone has, as long as it's all at least recognised and a genuine desire to grow is present. Other than that, it's very important that they see the world for what it is, an artistic bend is always a plus (especially if it's music oriented), if they're smarter than me I'm swooning, and a strong, well-defined personality is hot! Otherwise, I don't really have that many specific parameters, it's mostly all centered around intentionality and (self-)awareness in various shapes and sizes. 

[Repentant]

1 hour ago, Sanch62 said:

I second this, and it doesn't sound as though you're doing anything wrong. You just haven't found your match yet, and that's just natural odds at work.

Rejections aren't really about you. They speak of the limitations of the lens through which another is capable of viewing you. The right person will view you through the right lens, but that will be rare. It's supposed to be rare. Natural selection is about aligning for the long term with enough patience to find the needle in the haystack.

Women who aren't aligned with you will naturally screen themselves out unless you do it first. So maybe your screening skills could use practice so you don't spend too much time with those who are not right for you.

When your primary goal of dating is to screen out bad matches rather than play out every hand you're dealt to your own detriment, you'll pass on bad matches early rather than acting like a 'candle in the wind', ya know?

Keep opting for resilience, pass on bad matches early, and hold out for simpatico with THE woman who actually 'gets you'. You will thank yourself.

Thank you so much for the encouragement and your wise words! I'll keep on truckin', I'm not one to quit! But maybe I'll take a break every now and again, just to give myself a bit of time to cool down, let those bruises clear up a bit:))

[Repentant]

48 minutes ago, Nowherenear said:

I think part of the issue comes from the fact that many women have a lot of romantic options. When there are so many ways and places to get attention from men, it can create a mindset where there always seems to be a better option, so committing to one person feels unnecessary. I’m not saying women should settle for a bad relationship, but constantly chasing the “grass is greener” idea can be exhausting and even excruciating.

Honestly, I think this is somewhat universal, as I've known plenty of people in general who thoroughly embraced the fast-food-ification of all things as well. But, yeah, I really can't blame anyone for being cautious around men nowadays, what with all the... I don't even know what to call it other than sheer toxicity, which has been peddled all around... We really aren't living in the best of times as far as romance (along with many mmmany other things) is concerned.

Edited yesterday at 05:39 PM by Repentant

[Shehaari]

23 minutes ago, Repentant said:

I hope I will continue to live up to them! And I agree, there seems to be a generalised aversion to commitment nowadays... While I can sort of understand where it's coming from, it's still pretty sad... We're pretty much all starved for connection in today's world, yet so few of us actually try to form any...

I hope you do, too:)

Unfortunately, I agree. Hopefully we'll see changes in the near future, (although I wouldn't bet money on that yet..) Regardless, it all starts with ourselves.
That's why I made it a point to tell you that you're doing the right things, being authentic and leading with intentionality as that is what you're seeking. Keep being up front about what you're looking for and hopefully you'll find a great woman to pursue a genuine connection with. I'm wishing for you what I wish for myself.
 

38 minutes ago, Repentant said:

My "luck" (if one could call it that) is that I've been familiarised with disappointment from an early age, so I'm partly desensitised to it:))

I hear you- the good side of this, is that once you do find the opposite, you'll be even more grateful for what you have. That's rather rare these days too.

Take care of your heart and move forward with dignity and good character:)

 

[smackie9]

16 hours ago, Repentant said:

Thank you very much for the insight!

I really did think on this for a bit, and if by this you mean really being there, present in the moment with them, being open about both myself and my interest in getting to know them, in trying to understand them and their emotional reality, in being vulnerable and trying to offer them a safe space within which to be vulnerable as well, paying attention to their needs, to the things which make their eyes light up with joy, to that one movie, or song, or whatever it may be which always hits them in the feels, offering a warm shoulder, a tight hug, and opening up my empathy when something brought them down (not to fix, but to genuinely listen and feel their feels, so to speak), being playful and curious, even teasing and tantalising, then yes! Or at the very least I hope I've managed to do that for them!

Ultimately, that's what I want out of a relationship, I don't want it for the relationship's sake, I want to have a full and complete person in my life, with their entire internal world, their panoply of emotions, their complexity of though, their unique perspective and takes on things, their ups and downs, their strengths and shortcomings, and I see no other way of achieving that. I mean... what would be the point otherwise? I genuinely want a partner, someone with whom to share my life, someone to whom I could offer anything they wanted out of it, someone who'd have me share in their life as well, someone with whom to share in the joy of the good times and alongside whom to push through the crummy ones.

If it was just to stave off the loneliness, it'd be easier to get a dog:))

This would overwhelm a woman in the early stages...I know it would have me running. I'm talking about shared passions, get excited about things, push and pull, being mysterious, be a little bit of a challenge in a positive way, let things unfold a little at a time, spontaneity, taking the lead. You can't reveal too much of yourself/vulnerability. That would be waaaaay down the road. I think most women, like myself prefer humour, some light hearted convo to lift spirits instead of a "there, there". Most people like some privacy about their emotional stae, thoughts and feelings. It would drive me crazy someone pushing me to talk about my feelings all the time..too deep. Sure there are women out there that need that, but I wouldn't expect it to be very healthy...it would have a co-dependant feel to it. 

[Shehaari]

3 hours ago, smackie9 said:

This would overwhelm a woman in the early stages...I know it would have me running. I'm talking about shared passions, get excited about things, push and pull, being mysterious, be a little bit of a challenge in a positive way, let things unfold a little at a time, spontaneity, taking the lead. You can't reveal too much of yourself/vulnerability. That would be waaaaay down the road. I think most women, like myself prefer humour, some light hearted convo to lift spirits instead of a "there, there". Most people like some privacy about their emotional stae, thoughts and feelings. It would drive me crazy someone pushing me to talk about my feelings all the time..too deep. Sure there are women out there that need that, but I wouldn't expect it to be very healthy...it would have a co-dependant feel to it.

I hope it's ok that I comment on this before OP, but I absolutely see what you mean, and I would assume the same goes when dating men too.
Less emotional intensity, more playful curiosity. I'm learning a few things here too:)

I share the same mentality as OP when it comes to wanting commitment and a relationship, dating/getting to know one person at a time, and wanting emotional depth before being sexually vulnerable. 

@smackie9 A genuine Q: When would it be appropriate to dig deeper and get to know the person beyond surface level if emotional safety comes before sexual vulnerability and the intention is to find a meaningful connection, not just being sexually attracted to eachother and it ending there? 

@Repentant I agree with Smackie that keeping it light and exciting in the early stages (and that being too emotionally vulnerable can seem too intense off the bat depending on the lady), but I also think that showing up in the way you described (highlighted by smackie arlier) can be amazing if paced or once you've established mutual interest for pursuing a relationship (so I have learned). 

The selfless qualities you offer are amazing in a partner. Perhaps they should be shown after a certain time of getting to know each other? Regardless, keep making intentions clear, and if they're willing to dig a little deeper, then share accordingly. 

Edited 21 hours ago by Shehaari

[Repentant]

Oh, agreed, @smackie9 and @Shehaari! I was just firing out elements pertaining to "establishing emotional connection" in no particular order, mostly as an overall view of what it ultimately means to me as a process. All of that at once would overwhelm me as well, especially in the initial stages of dating! Very well said, @smackie9, it would feel very codependent! I may have developed people-pleasing in my youth as a defence mechanism, but I've ultimately been more on the avoidant side of things ("if I give people what they want, they'll leave me alone"). I have worked on both of these aspects throughout the years and have managed to reach a functional and healthy balance with them, but clinginess/codependent tendencies still tend to put me off if they manifest without a clear basis - i.e. I get a bit of clinginess months or even years into the relationship (within reason!), when it'd be potentially justified by an already established connection, but it would feel very disingenuous at the beginning. We barely know each other, what's there to cling to?

Yep, lighthearted, fun, intriguing, with openness and willingness to share and to genuinely listen should things naturally evolve! I'm not big on oversharing or trauma dumping to someone I barely know, as I do need to have a bit of trust established beforehand even for myself - I've had my fair share of burns early on in my dating life and I'm really not looking to acquire more if I can help it in any way! :))

[Repentant]

9 hours ago, Shehaari said:

I hope you do, too:)

Unfortunately, I agree. Hopefully we'll see changes in the near future, (although I wouldn't bet money on that yet..) Regardless, it all starts with ourselves.
That's why I made it a point to tell you that you're doing the right things, being authentic and leading with intentionality as that is what you're seeking. Keep being up front about what you're looking for and hopefully you'll find a great woman to pursue a genuine connection with. I'm wishing for you what I wish for myself.
 

I hear you- the good side of this, is that once you do find the opposite, you'll be even more grateful for what you have. That's rather rare these days too.

Take care of your heart and move forward with dignity and good character:)

 

Sorry about the late reply to this, missed it in the deluge:)) 

Thank you so much! I genuinely hope with all my heart that you'll manage to find that deep connection as well, we deserve to find the kind of love we desire!

[Acacia98]

On 12/28/2025 at 8:30 PM, Els said:

I mean, this is like a 30% rate? Which is perfectly normal IMO, and in fact I'd consider it quite high.

This is my thinking too.

OP, I think you're doing okay. Don't get disillusioned. There are women out there who appreciate a man who does exactly what you're doing (right down to conceiving of friendship as a basis for relationships), including me. Perhaps we're not in the majority, but that's fine. After all, your goal isn't to settle down with most people.

I think I've experienced a bit of the  female version of what you're describing. I've just had to accept that I'm in a minority and most people are not going to appreciate that style of dating/connecting, that perhaps I am a bit "weird" for my context. 

It can be frustrating. But I think it would be more frustrating to try to do something that was inconsistent with who I was.

Edited 13 hours ago by Acacia98

[Repentant]

14 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

This is my thinking too.

OP, I think you're doing okay. Don't get disillusioned. There are women out there who appreciate a man who does exactly what you're doing (right down to conceiving of friendship as a basis for relationships), including me. Perhaps we're not in the majority, but that's fine. After all, your goal isn't to settle down with most people.

I think I've experienced a bit of the  female version of what you're describing. I've just had to accept that I'm in a minority and most people are not going to appreciate that style of dating/connecting, that perhaps I am a bit "weird" for my context. 

It can be frustrating. But I think it would be more frustrating to try to do something that was inconsistent with who I was.

Thank you so much for your comment and reassurance, it most certainly helps to know I'm not just shooting in the dark.

You make a very good point about not wanting to settle down with everyone, very aptly and elegantly put! I think it's precisely what you say about this intent of ours being in a minority which amplifies the impact of failed attempts, as it is pretty hard to even find someone who seems like they might be what I'm looking for, let alone manage to develop the type of connection I desire.

You are absolutely correct with your last point as well! In my case, I feel it would even be doubly so given the amount of time and effort I've put into fixing what others have broken inside me, just to betray the truth and authenticity I've managed to rebuild from the ground up for the sake of settling for something middling.