What does this gift mean?

[Janelle-elle]

First off, Merry Christmas everyone. I got a gift from my husband that has rocked me quite a bit. I just don’t know how serious it is and he’s being very coy about it.

I will briefly set the scene so you know who we are and out relationship so it can be judged in context. We’re married 17 years, together about 20, no kids, a very active sex life, loving, communicative, in all honesty pretty damn good. We often use fantasy, role playing and toys to the extent I could probably start a store with my toys and outfits, lol, so I’m no prude when it comes to experimentation, but always just us. Of course the fantasy often extends to other people but never ever has there ever been a discussion to do it in reality.

So the gift. I was given a plaque that granted me hotwife status. This was not just something typed up on a computer, this was professionally made, it actually looks really good. It basically says I’m now a hotwife* and then the asterisk has conditions such as frequency and that I have to tell him when I get back etc. I won’t go into all the details but you get the drift. It came with some lovely lingerie to “wear on your first date”.

I really didn’t know how to take it when I opened it but it was more his words that I’m concerned with. He was like I can’t wait, you can see as many as you want, please let me watch sometimes and he was quite turned on if you know what I mean. I think he got the feeling that I didn’t like it and he started quizzing me about that. I told him there was no way, ever, and he can get that thought out of his head right now. Then suddenly it was my fault, this gift was a prop to use in our role playing and I’ve misunderstood. It was never meant to be serious.

I’m not sure I can believe that and that makes me real angry. I’m so disappointed that he would be so willing to just hand me over to other people. I don’t need nor want anyone else. It makes me wonder whether he wants the same for himself.

What do you think? Was it a gag gift and I misunderstood or was he testing waters hoping I would be open for it? And if it was the latter where to from there? You can’t just tell your wife you want her to screw other people and then take it back and expect everything to be the same

[Gebidozo]

It does look like he is seriously suggesting to you to be a hotwife. The way he backed off after you’d told him you weren’t interested feels forced and awkward.

Naturally, you shouldn’t do it if you don’t want to. But perhaps you could see it a bit differently, not as an insult or something that would make you angry and disappointed.

Imagining your partner with other men is a very common fantasy. It’s true that not everyone would act upon it. I’m very much into this fantasy but I’m not really interested in enacting it in real life.

However, I don’t think that a man who does want to experience it means any disrespect to his partner or somehow loves her less because of that.

The fantasy stems from a very deep-rooted element of male sexuality that views a woman as particularly desirable when she is desired by other men. The thought of the partner being with another man activates something on a hormonal level that compels us to “win” the woman again. It has something to do with the fact that only one man’s sperm can impregnate a woman at a time, regardless of how many men she’s had sex with. Apparently, the urge to compete is very powerful.

Also, I’m pretty sure that his desire to share you with other men doesn’t mean that he wants to sleep with other women as well. This kink rarely goes both ways.

 

[Alpacalia]

Think he was def testing the waters.

 

[Janelle-elle]

10 minutes ago, Gebidozo said:

I don’t think that a man who does want to experience it means any disrespect to his partner or somehow loves her less because of that

I understand what you've said but I just can't see it in real life if you love your partner unconditionally.

We've role played before where I've kissed him goodbye and gone to a bar and let people flirt with me only for him to come in a bit later on a sweep me off my feet, so I get the fantasy. Kissing him goodbye and actually going to a hotel room, I don't even feel comfortable typing it to be truthful.

I'm trying to understand you but it still makes me feel like a piece of meat he's just handing out. Let's assume it is his fantasy then it just feels like he's handing me off to anyone so he can get his thrills. What do I get out of it?  I mean at least if it was swinging it's something we would share together, not that I would do that either but that makes more sense to me.

[Gebidozo]

1 hour ago, Janelle-elle said:

I understand what you've said but I just can't see it in real life if you love your partner unconditionally.

You can’t, but he can.

People love in different ways. Try to accept that he entertains thoughts of sharing you sexually without loving you any less.

Anyway, you have refused his offer. If he keeps insisting or gets frustrated, then there really will be reasons to suspect him of selfishness and lack of consideration. But so far, he asked once, you said no, no harm done.

 

1 hour ago, Janelle-elle said:

I'm trying to understand you but it still makes me feel like a piece of meat he's just handing out.

I’m pretty sure he doesn’t intentionally want you to feel like that. On the contrary, he is aroused by your sexual autonomy, by the fact that you’d voluntarily, consciously engage in sexual acts with other men. At least that’s what I’d feel if I went ahead with realizing my fantasies.

Men who view women as objects are normally on the other end of the spectrum - possessive, jealous, and controlling types, those who are horrified by the mere image of their partner having sex with someone else.

 

1 hour ago, Janelle-elle said:

What do I get out of it?

Women who have done this kind of thing usually say it’s liberating, empowering, refreshing, stimulating, or they simply like the thrill of having multiple sexual partners. There can be many reasons. That’s not the point, though. If you think you get nothing out of this, just don’t do it. He has to respect your decision.

 

1 hour ago, Janelle-elle said:

I mean at least if it was swinging it's something we would share together, not that I would do that either but that makes more sense to me.

I understand, but that’s just a different fantasy for a different mindset. For example, I don’t have it at all because the presence of another woman for me to sleep with would remove the focus from the perceived hypertrophied sexuality of my partner, which is the whole point here.

 

[Alpacalia]

4 hours ago, Janelle-elle said:

I understand what you've said but I just can't see it in real life if you love your partner unconditionally.

We've role played before where I've kissed him goodbye and gone to a bar and let people flirt with me only for him to come in a bit later on a sweep me off my feet, so I get the fantasy. Kissing him goodbye and actually going to a hotel room, I don't even feel comfortable typing it to be truthful.

I'm trying to understand you but it still makes me feel like a piece of meat he's just handing out. Let's assume it is his fantasy then it just feels like he's handing me off to anyone so he can get his thrills. What do I get out of it?  I mean at least if it was swinging it's something we would share together, not that I would do that either but that makes more sense to me.

Yes, it's one of those things where it's hard to take back because you know that he wants to cross the boundary of fantasy to into something real, and once that line is crossed even just in his mind it changes the way you see the trust between you. It’s not just a kink anymore, it’s about wondering whether you’re still on the same page about what intimacy, loyalty, and partnership mean.

[Sony12]

This actually is a very common fantasy and shouldn't be something you should be insulted by. If you don't feel comfortable doing it then don't do it but if you have a desire to have sex with another man just know he is opening up the door for something like that to happen.

Many men enjoy watching women they are attracted to perform sex acts so watching them perform sex acts on another man can naturally become a turn on (men are interested in porn not only to see attractive women take their clothes off but also because they enjoy watching attractive women perform sex acts).

Definitely don't have sex with another man if you aren't comfortable with it but you also might want to try some new things with him.

Do you two do much in the way of recording yourselves having sex with each other? That might be a good middle ground. You can still only have sex with each other but he can still watch you as an observer at the same time.

[ShyViolet]

This was a tone deaf gift, for sure.  Instead of springing this on you in the form of a gift, he should have brought up the idea gently one day, found out what your feelings about it would be and whether it would be something you would be interested in.  Men can be dense sometimes.

[Sony12]

25 minutes ago, ShyViolet said:

This was a tone deaf gift, for sure.  Instead of springing this on you in the form of a gift, he should have brought up the idea gently one day, found out what your feelings about it would be and whether it would be something you would be interested in.  Men can be dense sometimes.

At times yes. However if these two have a history of role-playing and experimenting it isn't surprising he brought it up or would be interested in it. If she has told him before about certain guys or certain types of guys she wouldn't mind doing things to he very well could have thought she might have gotten a kick out of it being a 'present' for her 

Definitely wouldn't be the first time a lady has gotten a 'present' like that.

If she was very sexually reserved then yes it probably would have been inappropriate for it to be a present. But the OP has made it pretty clear in this thread that she isn't sexually reserved.

[Sanch62]

8 hours ago, Janelle-elle said:

I’m no prude when it comes to experimentation, but always just us. Of course the fantasy often extends to other people but never ever has there ever been a discussion to do it in reality.

Okay, so you may want to consider that you both read those discussions differently. Sounds like he took whatever you may have expressed more literally than you intended.

I'd be careful about removing any hint of an accusatory tone with further discussions because that will deprive you of valuable information. Instead, I'd adopt a tone of curiosity to learn his thought processes behind this gift. You can be receptive to learning why he believed it would turn you on, and what specifically turned him on about it.

If you can encourage him to trust that you won't think badly of him for anything that led him to believe you may have wanted to experiment with other men, you can learn more about his rationale and what desires may have driven it.

From there, you can operate on real information rather than on assumptions alone.

[ShyViolet]

1 hour ago, Sony12 said:

At times yes. However if these two have a history of role-playing and experimenting it isn't surprising he brought it up or would be interested in it.

The idea of opening up the relationship and hooking up with other people is totally different than just being sexually adventurous, using toys, etc.  Relationships require communication.  He didn't communicate properly about this whatsoever with her, he just sprung this on her.  And of course, since it's something she isn't into, and he never communicated about it first, she had a negative reaction.  What he should have done is mentioned the idea so that he could find out how she feels about it before doing anything like this.  That's called communication in a relationship.

[Janelle-elle]

3 hours ago, ShyViolet said:

What he should have done is mentioned the idea so that he could find out how she feels about it before doing anything like this.

Yes. This. 

[Janelle-elle]

The explanations here as to his possible mindset have been very helpful. I've thought about this a lot. I've actually softened my stance around this a little. I'm not suggesting I want to do it, far from it, but if I was 100% against before now it's only 80%. 

It's quite titillating to even think this could be a real possibility, which has opened my eyes to how he might have been thinking about it. 

Obviously next step is to talk to him. That will be happening as soon as he's home. I just hope I don't embarrass myself and tell him it's a small maybe, that we can discuss it and who knows, maybe one day, and then he turns around and says it was genuinely just a joke gift. 

This is why I love communities like this. My eyes have been opened, without this place I could have carried anger and confusion around with me unnecessarily.

[Sony12]

22 minutes ago, Janelle-elle said:

The explanations here as to his possible mindset have been very helpful. I've thought about this a lot. I've actually softened my stance around this a little. I'm not suggesting I want to do it, far from it, but if I was 100% against before now it's only 80%. 

It's quite titillating to even think this could be a real possibility, which has opened my eyes to how he might have been thinking about it. 

Obviously next step is to talk to him. That will be happening as soon as he's home. I just hope I don't embarrass myself and tell him it's a small maybe, that we can discuss it and who knows, maybe one day, and then he turns around and says it was genuinely just a joke gift. 

This is why I love communities like this. My eyes have been opened, without this place I could have carried anger and confusion around with me unnecessarily.

Good deal. And honestly this really isn't as uncommon as you might think. Many people have an agreement or have a bit of a swinging lifestyle to various degrees. For many as long as they are honest with each other and they aren't having sex behind the other persons back their relationship doesn't suffer a huge deal from it. 

If you do do it make sure the person is your choice and not your husbands. I'm sure you likely have guys you are attracted to and men you wouldn't mind having sex with if you weren't married. Well now you have permission to do stuff to them/with them. 

 

[Els]

I think he was testing the waters, and I don't like that he gaslighted you when you called him out on it. 

That being said, if he respects your "no", it wouldn't be a major issue to me. I certainly wouldn't assume that it means he wants to do it himself. The way I see it, he suggested something (albeit poorly and awkwardly), you said no, end of story. 

If he keeps pressuring you then it's a red flag.

[Els]

6 hours ago, Sony12 said:

At times yes. However if these two have a history of role-playing and experimenting it isn't surprising he brought it up or would be interested in it. If she has told him before about certain guys or certain types of guys she wouldn't mind doing things to he very well could have thought she might have gotten a kick out of it being a 'present' for her 

Definitely wouldn't be the first time a lady has gotten a 'present' like that.

If she was very sexually reserved then yes it probably would have been inappropriate for it to be a present. But the OP has made it pretty clear in this thread that she isn't sexually reserved.

I dunno, man. H and I do a lot of kinky stuff (suffice to say that we probably have enough gear to tie dozens of people up simultaneously, lol), and that would still be a really bizarre "gift" in my opinion. 

This isn't even about the fact that gifts should be about the receiver, instead of the giver, although that cardinal rule was certainly broken. It's about the fact that something so clearly different from anything you've ever done together should be discussed openly in person. "Gag gifts" and assumptions are a poor substitute IMO.

All in all, poor decision on the husband's part but I wouldn't consider it a dealbreaker.