Was a Christian, not anymore

[lonelybird]

I was a passionate born again Christian because I had some special experiences that led me to believe there are invisible forces and some Christians approached me and told me about JC. But several years ago I discovered that New Testament was a lie, but I still believe in G-d.

[Gebidozo]

It is impossible to discover that the New Testament is a lie, just as it is impossible to discover that it is true.

The New Testament is neither a scientific nor even a historical book, and thus it can’t be verified as either truth or a lie. Like all other religious books, either you believe in what it says, or you don’t. Believing in it doesn’t make it true, not believing in it doesn’t make it a lie.

Personally, I believe that the New Testament is bolder and more precise than any other religious book in its attempt to give us a glimpse of the great metaphysical unknown.

I also think that its ethical teaching is incredibly powerful even if we don’t trust its supernatural claims and disregard its theology.

Culturally, spiritually, and historically its influence has been immense, probably bigger than any other book. Western civilization as we know it wouldn’t have existed without it, and a whole lot of the values that we hold today and consider essential and progressive wouldn’t have been entrenched in our minds and souls if it had never been written.

That said, I find the whole “born again” movement and generally any kind of fundamentalist Christianity a gross oversimplification of whatever messages the New Testament is trying to send us.

Above all, simplistic interpretations of the events of our lives as manifesting that or another act or will of God strike me as being as arrogant as they are silly.

 

[lonelybird]

I am not talking about New Testament as a scientific or historical book. I said NT is a lie because if we trace all the quotations from OT that NT quoted as proofs that JC is legit, we will find out NT twisted the meaning of the quotations, and took the quotations out of context, and by doing so  they let quotations fit into New Testament narratives. As christians many of us don't go back to original Old Testament and read the whole context. most believers just listen to pastors and priest and simply believe what they said. I know I was guilty of this in the past. And this is not only one unbelievable thing that NT does, NT even went further changed the original scriptures in order to make the scriptures sound like "talking about JC". If you find out all dishonest things that NT committed and committing, can you honestly still believe it? But they do the tricky business very well, because most believers don't know Jewish language, don't know to which degree they changed the original text, and twist its meanings. However, Even so many updated versions of new Bible, they cannot cover well enough all the lies. we don't need to go too far to find discrepancies. If we go back to Old Testament, and read the context, we will find out the lies. It was shock for me to discover these lies, and it was sad.

I don't deny NT has huge impact on civilization. The problem is in it mixed good with bad, bring an idol into the picture and changed some real important concepts and rules.

I have a couple challenge question to ask, there are many

1. G-d hates adultery, but NT says he impregnated an engaged young girl. Will G-d do things that Himself hates?

2. G-d forbids us from drinking blood, but JC told you to drink his blood symbolically. by the way, drinking blood was a pagan practice. Will G-d again do things He hates, even symbolically?

3. Lamb was a god that Egyptians worshipped, that is why Mosses sacrificed lamb when they were escaping from Egyptians, to show them he despised their god. but NT pictured JC as sacrificing lamb who give salvation to others. Again, G-d hates idols, why He would picture JC as a sacrificing lamb which was a god to Egyptians? another contradiction?

Edited July 22 by lonelybird

[Gebidozo]

3 hours ago, lonelybird said:

I said NT is a lie because if we trace all the quotations from OT that NT quoted as proofs that JC is legit, we will find out NT twisted the meaning of the quotations, and took the quotations out of context, and by doing so  they let quotations fit into New Testament narratives.

That’s your opinion. But it’s not a fact. If you don’t believe the Christian interpretations of the OT prophecies, don’t believe them. But calling them a lie is just very silly, not to mention quite offensive. Nobody intended to deliberately deceive or mislead people here, people wrote down what they honestly believed. Feel free to disagree, but there is no need for slander.

When arguing about religious beliefs, please try to avoid words like “lie”. That’s the language of fundamentalists or cult members, which displays intolerance and inability to have a proper interfaith dialogue. By stating that your opponent is lying, you are only weakening your own opinion.

 

3 hours ago, lonelybird said:

And this is not only one unbelievable thing that NT does, NT even went further changed the original scriptures in order to make the scriptures sound like "talking about JC". If you find out all dishonest things that NT committed and committing, can you honestly still believe it? But they do the tricky business very well, because most believers don't know Jewish language, don't know to which degree they changed the original text, and twist its meanings.

I actually did read the Old Testament in the original language. It is called Hebrew, not “Jewish” as you say. And I compared different editions of the controversial passages in the OT, Masoretic text vs. the Septuagint for example. And I still see no “lies” in the New Testament.

Do you really want to argue with me about the details? Because anyone who calls the original Hebrew language of the OT “Jewish” is probably not equipped to have a serious exegetical or theological conversation about either Judaism or Christianity. Are you sure you’re really ready to discuss such intricacies as, for instance, whether the original expression כארי in Psalm 22 means “like a lion”, or was a misspelling of the past tense of the verb “to pierce”?

Your further questions about the various menial points of the Mosaic law and how they relate to their reinterpretation in the NT, or even laughably unrelated passages in the NT, only show how superficial your understanding of these complex textual, linguistic, literary, cultural, ethical, religious, spiritual problems is. Sorry, but this is not the level on which I I’d want to have a religious discussion, especially not after having spent almost a decade debating religious issues on major forums with very knowledgeable Christians of all kinds, Jews, Buddhists, atheists, and so on.

My impression is that you have been somewhat brainwashed by a cult or by one person who has a strong influence on you yet not much knowledge about Christianity at all. Judging from the precise nature of your “critique” of the New Testament and the way you spell “G-d”, it’s probably either a Jewish person or some sort of a judaizing para-Christian sect (something akin to Jehova’s Witnesses, perhaps).

Like I said, you are completely free to disbelief and dislike anything and everything written in the New Testament or taught by the Christian authorities, but accusing the authors of the Christian holy scripture of lying is not something that is welcome during interfaith dialogue or any religious discussion in general. 

[lonelybird]

“I, I AM 𐤉𐤄𐤅𐤄 your SAViOUR, REDEEMER, SOVEREiGN

and besides ME there is no saviour

YeshaYAHu 43:3,11,14,15 (Isaiah)

 

I have many of these examples of cutting verses out of their context, and this is one of the them. Food for thought 

Jesus told you that he was a false prophet and spirit of contamination! Some of you need to listen!

NT quote:

Matthew 26:31Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad.

Mark 14:27 And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered.

Tanakh quote: (this is the verse Matthew and Mark quote from Zechariah 13:7. Let's check out the context )

Zechariah 13: 1On that day, a spring shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for purification and for sprinkling.

2And it shall come to pass on that day, says the Lord of Hosts: I will cut off the names of the idols from the earth, and they shall no longer be mentioned. And also the prophets and the spirit of contamination I will remove from the earth.

3And it shall come to pass, if a man still prophesies, that his father and his mother-his parents-shall say to him, "You shall not live, for you have spoken falsely in the name of the Lord." And his father and his mother-his parents-shall thrust him through because of his prophesying.

4And it shall come to pass on that day that the prophets shall be ashamed, each one of his vision when he prophesies; and they will not wear a hairy mantle in order to lie.

5And he shall say, "I am not a prophet! I am a tiller of the soil, for a man entrusted me with his cattle from my youth."

6And one will say to him, "What are these wounds between your hands?" And he shall say, "That I was smitten in the house of my friends."

7O sword, awaken against My shepherd and against the man who is associated with Me! says the Lord of Hosts. Smite the shepherd, and the flock shall scatter, and I will return My hand upon the little ones.

8And it shall come to pass throughout all the land, says the Lord, two parts of it shall be cut off. They shall perish, and the third shall remain therein.

9And I will bring the third in fire; and I will refine them as one refines silver, and I will test them as one tests gold. He shall call in My name, and I will respond to him. I said, "He is My people"; and he shall say, "The Lord is my God."

[ShySoul]

Ned Flanders: I've done everything the bible says. Even the stuff that contradicts the other stuff.

I was raised Catholic. Even went to a Catholic university for college. But what I realized is that no matter what the bible or any religious source says, there will always be issues with it. No source is going to be perfect and things can be misinterpreted, changed, have different connotations, etc. But just because you have issues with specific parts, doesn't mean you have to throw everything out as well. It doesn't make the entire religion a lie.

There are many parts in the Bible that captures what I believe is the essence of things... that God is love. Putting aside all the specifics and details, look at the underlying message. Love. Compassion for one another. There is a reason most religions have some form of the Golden Rule.. do onto others as you would have them do onto you. Because the most important messge to take is how we treat one another. If we are doing our best to care for each other, then that is God's will. That is what religion is about. It's focusing not on differences or things that divide. It's not in spreading hate or anger over something. It's in caring for and loving each other, realizing we are all in this together, and striving to make the world a better place for all.