W goes to jail for assaulting OW

[My_Other_I]

I wouldn't say she will become an 'awful' person, but I do I think it's completely justified if she's MAD as HELL and reacts. Her whole life, turned upside down, NOT by choice. Wouldn't you be pissed off and react?

 

That last line I can't even comment on, to me that is JUSTIFYING it in your head. Makes NO sense. None.

 

WWIU,

I was actually defending the W's reaction. Affairs are a tough punch to take and emotions take over. I wouldn't be nice, either, if I was cheated on. I think you might have misunderstood my comment.

What I was trying to say is that the OW might think (to justify her actions) that the W is a witch, when, in fact, she's not. But after the W discoveres what has been happening, she might go nuts and become the witch the OW always hoped she was. I'm getting lost in this. Hope you understand now.

[Ladyjane14]

Interesting points Lady Jane. I live in the UK so it might be different to the US but isn't that already enshrined in law, in the sense that a divorce can be granted on the grounds of adultery? Incidentally, in a religious arena it is the only grounds (I think) for a legitimate divorce.

 

Lucky you....to live in the UK. I love history, and Great Britain is RICH in it.

 

Here in the U.S., each state has it's own laws governing divorce. In some states, adultery is considered as grounds, and divorce granted because of it. Some of our states are 'No Fault' though, and grounds for divorce are pretty much all chalked up to 'Irreconcilable Differences'.

 

In some states, you can't even make your cheating spouse move out of the house....no matter how BLATENT his/her affair is. You'd have to wait until you could bring your case before a judge.

 

It all depends on where you live. If memory serves, there are only two states in which you may sue an OP for 'Alienation of Affection'. That leaves 48 states where OP are free to 'plot and stalk' to their hearts content. (And before anybody gets their panties in a bunch:p....I recognize that most OP aren't "stalking". But in cases where the OP is particularly aggressive, the best you can usually do is to get an RO, and that's only if you can prove that s/he's a threat to your person.)

 

On the other hand, I agree with what you are saying about a pre-nup agreement that lays out what people expect because so many people get married without even really listening to the vows. I sure as heck wish I'd told my husband that copping off with a co-worker who was bored with her husband was not really on my list of things that would make for a great marriage. However, I think to say that if a person puts on 100 pounds that you can annull a marriage is taking it a bit far. What happened to the 'for better, for worse' bit of the vows? Sometimes people put on weight because they are ill/depressed whatever. Being dumped by their spouse because of it would be the last straw.

 

I'm pulling examples out of the air there. We have seen quite a few threads in which 'weight' has become an issue in the marriage. I know it doesn't matter much to me how much my husband weighs, and my husband feels the same way. It's no big deal to him either.

 

But for those people who have concrete expectations, dealbreakers if you will...why not? If you were negotiating a marriage contract, you could put anything in it you wanted.

 

In historical terms, I think that marriage without a contract is probably the more modern idea. In olden days, even estate planning was negotiated before the marriage.

 

so the ow shouldnt really f*** somebodys husband, but, that is an act of trying to be happy. what is violence an act of?

 

Well, I guess we can't take a baseball bat and relieve our frustrations on the OP. But "trying to be happy" shouldn't actively hurt somebody else. It leads to intense feelings of anger and frustration on the part of those who get "hurt". I agree with MyOtherI that something like that can change a person.

 

I think that when we discuss 'blame' as it applies to the OP, it's Forgiveness that is integral to the discussion. Oftentimes, the BS freely forgives the cheating mate....and yet harbors intense loathing for the OP.

 

Most BS's will share at least a portion of the blame for creating problems in the marital relationship. Most will recognize that there are things they could have improved upon that would not have left their mate impoverished emotionally and vulnerable to an affair.

 

When you accept your part of the responibility for the deficits in the relationship...you're in a better position to not only understand your mate but to also REPAIR the relationship. You recognize that your mate had a problem with you. He had a REAL beef.

 

Not so, the OP. Oftentimes, this is a stranger who just gut-punched you for no other reason than the fact that YOU had something they wanted. There's even times when the OP is someone you thought was a friend.

 

So, what excuse can you give to the OP? What possible reason could they have had for butting into your life that you could use as an excuse to forgive them?

 

This is such a difficult concept for the youngest of OP's to understand. They're still walking around with their idealism intact.Why blame the OP, when it's the MM/MW who made the vows?

 

In the end, I think it's because the OP is not special to the BS. They are not loved by the BS. The BS has committed no transgression against the OP that would warrent such intrusive behavior. There's no incentive to Forgive.

 

those that condone this violence, do you still consider yourselves to be above ow in terms of morals?

 

A discussion of "Morality" is a pretty BIG discussion, and subject to personal perspectives. Yeah....my behavior is dictated by the parameters of morality as I define it by my own value system.

 

Within my personal value system, behavior that harms other individuals IS immoral....so I refrain from it. I have a conscience that bothers me on any occasion that I step outside of my own self-determined "parameters". My value-system continues to grow and change over time. It's different now than it was in my "idealistic" youth.

 

I'm not a cynic yet, and I don't expect to be....but I am a more of a REALIST. I see real "harm" when people chase their personal happiness at the expense of others, hence I see it as "immoral" behavior. I don't see the harm as limited to only the betrayed spouse and children either. I see it as damaging to the married person as well, thus selfish on the part of the OP.

 

In TRUE friendship and love, you can't encourage a person to continue in destructive behavior. Rather, you would encourage them to seek resolution of their problems. If someone gets married....that means that they have at least some sort of minimal belief in the institution of marriage. Whether that belief is past or present...it needs to be resolved. Because when it's not...the MP is operating outside of their belief system and causing damage to themself as well as the other people affected by his/her infidelity.

 

I just can't make reasonable sense out of an affair. Nor, can I make it in any way "moral".

[elmejor]

so the ow shouldnt really f*** somebodys husband, but, that is an act of trying to be happy. what is violence an act of? those that condone this violence, do you still consider yourselves to be above ow in terms of morals?

just questions.

Like the woman in California who killed her ex-husband and his wife? Or the wife in Texas who killed her husband by running over him? Scary, scary acts of violence by women who have no clue that they were wrong for what they did. It just seems that some people are too jealous and crazy, and maybe things in general would be better if there weren't such an hysterical stigma with infidelity. The business of constantly having to worry about a partner being attracted to others, and yes sometimes acting on it. The incessant worry involved seems so pointless. If someone is going to fall in love with another and leave their spouse, there really isn't anyone or thing that can stop it. (imo)

[newbby]

Not so, the OP. Oftentimes, this is a stranger who just gut-punched you for no other reason than the fact that YOU had something they wanted. There's even times when the OP is someone you thought was a friend.

 

i think alot of bs seem to take it personally. as though it were an attack or an act of theiving. in fact in most cases the wife barely exists to the ow. the mm very much acts a single man, and it is usually very difficult to imagine him with a wife. it is like everything in this world, i suppose. when you buy fashion labels, the people working for a pittance in terrible conditions, in a third world country to produce these items is usually the last thing on your mind, and yet it should be....

Why blame the OP, when it's the MM/MW who made the vows?

i dont think it is an argument of why blame the ow, but, why blame the ow MORE

[newbby]

I'm not a cynic yet, and I don't expect to be....but I am a more of a REALIST. I see real "harm" when people chase their personal happiness at the expense of others, hence I see it as "immoral" behavior.

 

what if 'happiness' appears to be chasing them?

 

I don't see the harm as limited to only the betrayed spouse and children either. I see it as damaging to the married person as well, thus selfish on the part of the OP.

 

see this is what i was talking about. the married person that seeks an affair, is vulnerable, yet the person he SEEKS an affair with is not and should also take responsibility for forseeing negative outcomes of and stalling actions of wandering in fact outright STALKING spouse. interesting.

[Ladyjane14]

see this is what i was talking about. the married person that seeks an affair, is vulnerable, yet the person he SEEKS an affair with is not and should also take responsibility for forseeing negative outcomes of and stalling actions of wandering in fact outright STALKING spouse. interesting.

 

Oh, I see your point...and I agree with you.. The OP is particularly "vulnerable". It feels good for ANYONE to have an attractive person of the opposite sex take notice of them. Very flattering.

 

For folks who are suffering from low self-esteem, previous abuse, or loneliness..... the attention and flattery are going to make a REAL BIG impression on them. For youthful idealists who see injustice in how their "friend" is being treated at home, or who believe that their own philosophy regarding sexual expression is the only correct one....those kind of people are vulnerable to becoming an OP.

 

Pretty large group of people, wouldn't you say?

 

Yeah...I agree that you don't necessarily have to be a self-absorbed sociopath to become involved in an affair. I just don't agree that a person should stick their head in the sand and NEVER wise up to all the undercurrents at work.

 

When a 'friendship' with a married person becomes self-serving and the OP becomes dependant on have their ENs met by their 'friend'....they've allowed themselves to become vulnerable. That 'vulnerability' is NOT in their own best interest. And it's certainly not in the best interest of their married 'friend'. A good friend would give you better advice, right?

 

Let's face it...a MM has a choice to leave his marriage before venturing into an affair. He CHOOSES not to. Most of the time it's a simple matter of taking an OW out on a "test drive". He doesn't want to turn loose of the 'bird in the hand' until he's sure. He doesn't want to RISK hearth and home....until he's sure. He's not happy, but he's not so miserable that he's made a choice yet. And you know....all that doesn't necessarily make him The Devil. The MM isn't always a "self-serving sociopath" either. Usually, he's just an average guy who doesn't know what the heck to do next.

 

But it doesn't change the fact that EVERYBODY get chewed up in the deal. In his ambivalence, he hurts his wife. He hurts his children. He hurts the OW. And he hurts himself.

 

i think alot of bs seem to take it personally. as though it were an attack or an act of theiving. in fact in most cases the wife barely exists to the ow. the mm very much acts a single man, and it is usually very difficult to imagine him with a wife.

 

I agree with you on that one too. Folks don't always THINK about what they're doing. But man....it SUCKS when you finally do think about those things. When you realize that your actions have hurt people and the guilt finally catches up to you. Hey, I was young once too....so I can identify. You learn a few things, your philosophy changes a little here and there....and you'd dearly love to have a few of your previous choices back.

 

I don't know what to tell you, Newbby. It's not that I don't get it....I do. It's just that I can't see any winners in cases of Infidelity.

[mopar crazy]

Oh, I'm sorry Erika. I see what you mean about Mopar. I did read a few more of Mopar's messages. But, please tell me that the marriage was not saved by a big-screen TV! You know what occurs to me, though? Ok, so here's a MM screwing around with the OW. Not Mopar's husband necessarily, but anyone's husband. The wife finds out, chaos breaks out, then the result is that there are two stupid women with poor judgement (and questionable taste in men) fighting over a lying cheat. I don't know, we can never totally predict our future reactions, but if I were either one of those women I guess I'd be tempted to look for yet another lying cheat! er, I mean a man--is there a difference?---half kidding---

 

 

LOL! I hope my M wasn't saved b/c of a big screen TV, lol!

 

I don't see myself, or the exOW as stupid, and honestly no one is really stupid, ppl just make bad choices, that's all. And TBH, I don't blame the exOW being attracted to my H, he's an attractive man. I don't blame her for falling for his sense of humor, his looks, ect. But I do blame her for persuing him for three years, biting him on the neck b/c he was wearing a new cologne to the Christmas party and it turned her on, and telling him she was attracted to him then shoving her tongue down his throat.

 

When I found out about the A yes there was chaos, and a lot of s*** hit the fan, but why wouldn't it be that way? If I went into the M having any doubts that my H would one day have an A I would of never M him. I never thought he would have an A. I trusted my H 110%. After 11 years of M and he goes and has an A tore me up so much.

 

And I can't say that the exOW and I fought over him. All I did was asked her to plz stay out of our M problems until we decided to D and it was final. She knew that H had filed for a D, and she filed for a D from her "happily M" H a week later. Happy? MY A$$! That was just her f'in cover-up to hide that she was after my H. She also knew that my H and I were trying to work on our M b/c H thought he moved too fast w/ the D filing. I asked her to plz respect my wishes and stay away from him until we knew what we were going to do, D, or stay M. We needed to separate for awhile to figure out what we wanted. Well, she didn't stay out of it, she never told H that until he knew what he wanted she was staying out of a relationship w/ him.

 

If my H was the one doing the persuing of the exOW I don't know if i would of taken him back, I honestly don't. I don't think I could of b/c then I would of known he was doing it on his own free will and was doing the persuing.

 

I know at the time of the A we were having some problems and she made him feel good again. He even admitted she made him feel like a HS boy again. This woman was so damn convincing, sweet talking, and full of charm she could make anyone believe her lies, even her own mil told me that. She even had me beleiving there was nothing going on but my friends and her own H told me differently. I can't believe I beleived HER over them but that is how convincing she is.

[elmejor]

Lucky you....to live in the UK. I love history, and Great Britain is RICH in it.

 

 

It all depends on where you live. If memory serves, there are only two states in which you may sue an OP for 'Alienation of Affection'. That leaves 48 states where OP are free to 'plot and stalk' to their hearts content. (And before anybody gets their panties in a bunch:p....I recognize that most OP aren't "stalking". But in cases where the OP is particularly aggressive, the best you can usually do is to get an RO, and that's only if you can prove that s/he's a threat to your person.)

Well, I guess we can't take a baseball bat and relieve our frustrations on the OP. But "trying to be happy" shouldn't actively hurt somebody else. It leads to intense feelings of anger and frustration on the part of those who get "hurt". I agree with MyOtherI that something like that can change a person.

I think that when we discuss 'blame' as it applies to the OP, it's Forgiveness that is integral to the discussion. Oftentimes, the BS freely forgives the cheating mate....and yet harbors intense loathing for the OP.

Most BS's will share at least a portion of the blame for creating problems in the marital relationship. Most will recognize that there are things they could have improved upon that would not have left their mate impoverished emotionally and vulnerable to an affair.

When you accept your part of the responibility for the deficits in the relationship...you're in a better position to not only understand your mate but to also REPAIR the relationship. You recognize that your mate had a problem with you. He had a REAL beef.

 

Not so, the OP. Oftentimes, this is a stranger who just gut-punched you for no other reason than the fact that YOU had something they wanted. There's even times when the OP is someone you thought was a friend.

 

So, what excuse can you give to the OP? What possible reason could they have had for butting into your life that you could use as an excuse to forgive them?

 

This is such a difficult concept for the youngest of OP's to understand. They're still walking around with their idealism intact.Why blame the OP, when it's the MM/MW who made the vows?

In the end, I think it's because the OP is not special to the BS. They are not loved by the BS. The BS has committed no transgression against the OP that would warrent such intrusive behavior. There's no incentive to Forgive.

A discussion of "Morality" is a pretty BIG discussion, and subject to personal perspectives. Yeah....my behavior is dictated by the parameters of morality as I define it by my own value system.

Within my personal value system, behavior that harms other individuals IS immoral....so I refrain from it. I have a conscience that bothers me on any occasion that I step outside of my own self-determined "parameters". My value-system continues to grow and change over time. It's different now than it was in my "idealistic" youth.

I'm not a cynic yet, and I don't expect to be....but I am a more of a REALIST. I see real "harm" when people chase their personal happiness at the expense of others, hence I see it as "immoral" behavior. I don't see the harm as limited to only the betrayed spouse and children either. I see it as damaging to the married person as well, thus selfish on the part of the OP.

 

In TRUE friendship and love, you can't encourage a person to continue in destructive behavior. Rather, you would encourage them to seek resolution of their problems. If someone gets married....that means that they have at least some sort of minimal belief in the institution of marriage. Whether that belief is past or present...it needs to be resolved. Because when it's not...the MP is operating outside of their belief system and causing damage to themself as well as the other people affected by his/her infidelity.

I just can't make reasonable sense out of an affair. Nor, can I make it in any way "moral".

Why when in your discussion of "morals" do you need to mention "punching the BS in the stomach" and "going after the OW with a baseball bat?" While there are many interpretations among people about morality in love relationships, you may have noticed that violence against another person is pretty much universally considered wrong to most people. Also, here's something else I think you're not getting: The OW is living her own life, not "butting into" the wife's life. The MM she is involved with is her lover, not the prize she has won from the BS. I'd bet that OW often don't care to know anything about their lovers' wives. Why should they? I can't imagine the OW and MM ever discussing the BS at any length either, because they are primarily interested in each other when they are together. In other words, the W is not important to them at all in the context of their relationship. You think the OW is "harming" the MM in some way, by loving him? That sounds like wishful thinking on the part of the BS. And as for the children being "hurt", they are frequently hurt by the behavior of their mothers, the scorned women who choose to involve the children in their marital problems, using them as pawns rather than protecting them, in an effort to save their marriages. I personally see using children this way as immoral. Your mention of "Alienation of Affection" laws...not worth discussing....

[erika2610]

Why when in your discussion of "morals" do you need to mention "punching the BS in the stomach" and "going after the OW with a baseball bat?" While there are many interpretations among people about morality in love relationships, you may have noticed that violence against another person is pretty much universally considered wrong to most people. Also, here's something else I think you're not getting: The OW is living her own life, not "butting into" the wife's life. The MM she is involved with is her lover, not the prize she has won from the BS. I'd bet that OW often don't care to know anything about their lovers' wives. Why should they? I can't imagine the OW and MM ever discussing the BS at any length either, because they are primarily interested in each other when they are together. In other words, the W is not important to them at all in the context of their relationship. You think the OW is "harming" the MM in some way, by loving him? That sounds like wishful thinking on the part of the BS. And as for the children being "hurt", they are frequently hurt by the behavior of their mothers, the scorned women who choose to involve the children in their marital problems, using them as pawns rather than protecting them, in an effort to save their marriages. I personally see using children this way as immoral. Your mention of "Alienation of Affection" laws...not worth discussing....

 

Violence is usually considered wrong yes, but so is being an OW. Scorned women don't 'choose' to be in the middle of problems. The kids have no choice.

[mopar crazy]

Why when in your discussion of "morals" do you need to mention "punching the BS in the stomach" and "going after the OW with a baseball bat?" While there are many interpretations among people about morality in love relationships, you may have noticed that violence against another person is pretty much universally considered wrong to most people. Also, here's something else I think you're not getting: The OW is living her own life, not "butting into" the wife's life. The MM she is involved with is her lover, not the prize she has won from the BS. I'd bet that OW often don't care to know anything about their lovers' wives. Why should they? I can't imagine the OW and MM ever discussing the BS at any length either, because they are primarily interested in each other when they are together. In other words, the W is not important to them at all in the context of their relationship. You think the OW is "harming" the MM in some way, by loving him? That sounds like wishful thinking on the part of the BS. And as for the children being "hurt", they are frequently hurt by the behavior of their mothers, the scorned women who choose to involve the children in their marital problems, using them as pawns rather than protecting them, in an effort to save their marriages. I personally see using children this way as immoral. Your mention of "Alienation of Affection" laws...not worth discussing....

 

I haven't read a lot of LJ's reply, short on time, however I wanted to comment on your reply. I also wanted to punch the exOW right in the face. I also wanted to beat the s*** out of her w/ a baseball bat but what would that proove? Nothing, just my butt sitting in jail for awhile, that's all. Thinking about wanting to do it and actually doing it are two different things.

 

The exOW was in fact butting into my M. When I first called and confronted her about the A she of course denied it. She said H and her were just friends and how confused he was and she asked me if I still loved him, if I still got butterflies in my stomach when he held my hand, crap like that. Of course she was very convincing, I started to believe her like a total idiot. She told me she would talk to H about not filing for a D. Yea, she sure talked to him b/c a week later he filed then she did! Yes, she butted into my M! And H admitted to me awhile after we got back together that the exOW only asked me to babysit her child was to get closer to him. She was constantly asking me to watch her child and I always gave her the same answer why I would not. She pretended to be my friend and all along she was after my H, just waiting for the perfect timing to see our M falling apart so she could jump in and rescue him. I know my H could of said NO to her advancements and he should of, he realizes that now and kicks himself for being so stupid. But, if it weren't for this exOW persuing him so damn hard for so many years I don't think he would of ever had an A. I'm not saying any other woman couldn't of persued him like she did, they could of but shewas the one that did it so I honestly put more blame on her than him. She clouded his judgment. Instead of stepping back and letting him decide on his own what he wanted she was right there convincing him to leave me.

[another opinion]

Elmejor: I may be wrong, but I do not think that you have ever been married. In fact, I must admit that I’ve wondered whether you have ever been in a long-term (let’s say, greater than 5 years, or greater than 10?) relationship? I do not say this as a judgment of you – I have no idea of your age or situation – but it’s clear at least that you either can’t or won’t see the situation from the BS' side. You are an OW, and you empathize with women in your situation, and understandably also feel defensive about it because OW are so often attacked.

 

But I suspect, from the oversimplified words you've used to describe why you think affairs happen, that you do not know what it is to be in a relationship with a person where, after a long period of time - after years of living together daily, dealing with the ups and downs of daily life, of working and raising kids and loving and fighting and having sex and making dinner and, oh, just everything – yes, both partners do indeed begin to take certain things for granted. They take time for granted, they take love for granted, they take each other for granted. It’s not right, no, of course not - but it’s human. It happens to many, many people. That does not mean they have stopped loving each other, or caring for each other. And they may know that it isn’t right, that they diverged from joy in each other at some point toward reaching goals or buying a house or building a career; and they may still want things to be different.

 

But it’s hard to know where to begin; it becomes difficult to alter the habit of years, to breach the silence, to point to one strangeness where many have grown up – what are the signs? What is the key thing to have changed, when so much has changed over the years? How do you identify the right hurts to address, when the distancing partner will not communicate what is wrong to the other, or even that something is wrong?

 

Then, elmejor, it is false to say that the marriage has just gone “down the tubes”. Something may indeed be seriously wrong, and serious work may be required to fix it. Perhaps one partner will not want to do that work. And that's their choice - they aren't yoked together physically. They just took a certain, a very specific kind of vow.

 

And here we come to the true nature of marriage “vows”. It’s not about setting legal definitions, or religious morality, or any such thing. Those are things that different cultures, beliefs, may indeed impose over the underlying bond. But the real trust that is broken, when a partner cheats, is this: both partners vowed to tell each other when the marriage is faltering and when they have needs that aren’t being met. It is a simple, difficult and profound statement of trust: You have vowed to at least try to fix those things, if they are fixable. When a person has an affair without first doing all they can to confront those issues, s/he has broken that trust in a very painful, debilitating way. If indeed, those wrongs cannot be righted within the relationship, then both partners should leave. But a person who has an affair is choosing not to give their partner the chance to try.

 

I do think that sometimes, a partner may be so emotionally exhausted, may want out in such a thorough way, that they do not want to deal with telling their spouse (whether or not an OP is involved). They do not want to face it; they would rather just tell their spouse that it's over, and leave, or tell them nothing at all, and cheat, and/or leave. It happens; happens all the time. It's human, sure - but it's not honorable, and it's not kind. If those things matter to you in a partner, then that is something for an OW to watch out for, too. That kind of leaving is rather cruel and certainly selfish.

 

Given what you’ve said on here, perhaps long-term relationships are not for you; many do find them unrealistic. But then, anyone who feels that way probably shouldn’t enter into a “marriage” at all. Because that is the underlying assumption – that you will, at least, try. That you vow to work on it together, without involving a third party (unless that was the initial agreement, of course). And the MM (or MW) who wants out, who no longer feels that way, should exit the “marriage” with honesty and integrity, stating that it isn’t the relationship s/he wants. Perhaps that is a kind of morality, but it’s not religious morality, or legally defined morality. It’s simple kindness to fellow man.

 

Truly, I’m not sure how one could possibly argue with that – although I’m sure some will try, on the basis that any use of a phrase involving "people should" inhibits fundamental freedoms. And in fact, I don't support the idea that such kindness-based morality should be legally defined - but that anyone would think that it's okay to behave otherwise is quite incomprehensible to me.

[elmejor]

Violence is usually considered wrong yes, but so is being an OW. Scorned women don't 'choose' to be in the middle of problems. The kids have no choice.

 

Violence is a criminal act; being an OW is not. Violence will result in prison sentences, being an OW will not. If "society" considers a choice I make in my life wrong, I don't care. So what. It is not my responsiblity to keep the W of the world happy. To all you W with so little self esteem, I don't know, why don't one of you patent some kind of hubby tracking device--something that will beep to remotely alert you if a woman who IS NOT YOU dares to glance approvingly at him, or worse yet, dare to speak to or even smile at the man you share an address with. Just a thought--channel your insecurities. As for children being in the middle of problems due to the breakdown of their parents' marriage, maybe the H and W need to handle this situation better, to protect their children from being exposed to adult problems that children can't do anything about. And maybe some scorned women do choose to be in the middle of problems when they are party to a marriage that is no longer worth a s**t. Their H is unhappy and strays, so it's automatically the OW's fault to these BS. The BS who keep insisting here that the OW needs to stop their affairs because they are, "wrong, immoral, etc" are missing the point that the OW may love the MM and have no intention of stopping. As for myself, I may not be an "OW" at this point of my life, nor have the "security" (!) of a marriage, but I do know that I refuse to feel guilty about loving someone. If others who view themselves as the morality police want to think I'm wrong, so be it.

[My_Other_I]

Violence is a criminal act; being an OW is not. Violence will result in prison sentences, being an OW will not. If "society" considers a choice I make in my life wrong, I don't care. So what. It is not my responsiblity to keep the W of the world happy. To all you W with so little self esteem, I don't know, why don't one of you patent some kind of hubby tracking device--something that will beep to remotely alert you if a woman who IS NOT YOU dares to glance approvingly at him, or worse yet, dare to speak to or even smile at the man you share an address with. Just a thought--channel your insecurities. As for children being in the middle of problems due to the breakdown of their parents' marriage, maybe the H and W need to handle this situation better, to protect their children from being exposed to adult problems that children can't do anything about. And maybe some scorned women do choose to be in the middle of problems when they are party to a marriage that is no longer worth a s**t. Their H is unhappy and strays, so it's automatically the OW's fault to these BS. The BS who keep insisting here that the OW needs to stop their affairs because they are, "wrong, immoral, etc" are missing the point that the OW may love the MM and have no intention of stopping. As for myself, I may not be an "OW" at this point of my life, nor have the "security" (!) of a marriage, but I do know that I refuse to feel guilty about loving someone. If others who view themselves as the morality police want to think I'm wrong, so be it.

 

Even though I agree that this may be true for some,I believe that your view is one-sided.

I also believe that not all M are bad when the H strays. Different reasoning, different personalities, different affairs.

Yours might be like that, but it doesn't necessarrily apply to everyone.

[whichwayisup]

WWIU,

I was actually defending the W's reaction. Affairs are a tough punch to take and emotions take over. I wouldn't be nice, either, if I was cheated on. I think you might have misunderstood my comment.

What I was trying to say is that the OW might think (to justify her actions) that the W is a witch, when, in fact, she's not. But after the W discoveres what has been happening, she might go nuts and become the witch the OW always hoped she was. I'm getting lost in this. Hope you understand now.

Ah k. Makes sense now. Now, back to the Bachelor...

[mopar crazy]

Violence is a criminal act; being an OW is not. Violence will result in prison sentences, being an OW will not. If "society" considers a choice I make in my life wrong, I don't care. So what. It is not my responsiblity to keep the W of the world happy. To all you W with so little self esteem, I don't know, why don't one of you patent some kind of hubby tracking device--something that will beep to remotely alert you if a woman who IS NOT YOU dares to glance approvingly at him, or worse yet, dare to speak to or even smile at the man you share an address with. Just a thought--channel your insecurities. As for children being in the middle of problems due to the breakdown of their parents' marriage, maybe the H and W need to handle this situation better, to protect their children from being exposed to adult problems that children can't do anything about. And maybe some scorned women do choose to be in the middle of problems when they are party to a marriage that is no longer worth a s**t. Their H is unhappy and strays, so it's automatically the OW's fault to these BS. The BS who keep insisting here that the OW needs to stop their affairs because they are, "wrong, immoral, etc" are missing the point that the OW may love the MM and have no intention of stopping. As for myself, I may not be an "OW" at this point of my life, nor have the "security" (!) of a marriage, but I do know that I refuse to feel guilty about loving someone. If others who view themselves as the morality police want to think I'm wrong, so be it.

 

Elmejor, are you saying that if the OW gets involved w/ a MM where the M is s*** that it's ok? What I'm getting from you that OW shouldn't be blamed for getting involved w/ a MM if the M is s*** anyhow. Maybe the M is s***, but that doesn't give her the right to open her legs for him does it? My M was

s***, I admit, and maybe H would of eventually had an A w/ someone else but he didn't, he had the A w/ his co-worker, a woman that persued him for three years. Like I said, if he persued her then I don't even know if I would of stayed w/ him to work on the M. Just like many women, men can fall for a woman's charm too if she makes him feel good about himself. I don't blame the exOW for the whole A, I blame both. I am not going to put all the blame on my H, the OW deserves some of the blame too.

[BUTAFLY]

I think she should have punched the HUSBAND. Wasn't he the one who vowed to love ,honor and forsake others til death do them part? Us women let men off way to easy and they know it and exploit this.

 

In Eddie Murphys old stand up act,he talks about how his W caught him having sex in their bed with another women and was able to talk his way out of any trouble. He said baby I love YOU and only YOU. She seduced me and yes I may be having sex with her but I make love to YOU.

 

Every time I see that I crack up because I know that type of s**t works. While the W is busy punching the OW the H is on to the next one.

 

Now its on her record and for what? protecting her marriage?..I sure he was more than a willing participant.

 

how silly

[elmejor]

Mopar quote:

"Elmejor, are you saying that if the OW gets involved w/ a MM where the M is s*** that it's ok?......"

 

 

Well, yeah I guess that's pretty much what I'm saying. You've said that the OW and your H had been friendly/flirtatious before he was promoted, and before he took her on as his assistant, but he hired her as his assistant anyway? It sounds like they were both already attracted to each other. Yet, you claim she kept "persuing" him? It didn't work both ways? Furthermore, their affair didn't go from EA to PA until you had kicked him out? You say you "asked her to leave him alone until he could decide what he wanted to do" regarding his marriage. That was when you were separated also? But you became angry when she didn't do what you asked? You said, "Well, she didn't stay out of it!" (stop "persuing" your H) She had no reason to abide by your wishes! Because you made the request that she should stop her A with your H, you thought she was obligated to do so? She's living her life too, and both M were on the way to D, (and may still be for all anyone knows) And if your H admitted to the A, rather than deny deny deny when his job was on the line, that was a mistake too, imo. You've said more than once, "I never thought my H would have an A." Never say never.

[mopar crazy]

Mopar quote:

"Elmejor, are you saying that if the OW gets involved w/ a MM where the M is s*** that it's ok?......"

 

 

Well, yeah I guess that's pretty much what I'm saying. You've said that the OW and your H had been friendly/flirtatious before he was promoted, and before he took her on as his assistant, but he hired her as his assistant anyway? It sounds like they were both already attracted to each other. Yet, you claim she kept "persuing" him? It didn't work both ways? Furthermore, their affair didn't go from EA to PA until you had kicked him out? You say you "asked her to leave him alone until he could decide what he wanted to do" regarding his marriage. That was when you were separated also? But you became angry when she didn't do what you asked? You said, "Well, she didn't stay out of it!" (stop "persuing" your H) She had no reason to abide by your wishes! Because you made the request that she should stop her A with your H, you thought she was obligated to do so? She's living her life too, and both M were on the way to D, (and may still be for all anyone knows) And if your H admitted to the A, rather than deny deny deny when his job was on the line, that was a mistake too, imo. You've said more than once, "I never thought my H would have an A." Never say never.

 

No, it didn't work both ways. The first night (company Christmas party) I met the exOW I actually thought she was nice, very friendly, and seemed like a pretty cool person. When H and I were away from her I told him she seemed pretty cool. He said he didn't like her, she always had to have attention. When he came home from the party ( I left early to pick up our children from the babysitter and told him he could stay and have fun) he told me what she did. She had bit him on the neck and told him he smelled good. That is all it took, I didn't care for her anymore. She still tried being my friend. Every time I went to see H at work she would actually run over to talk to me, even gave me a hug one time. As the years went on H never really talked about her. He didn't start talking about her until he got promoted and hired her. I got so sick of hearing about her I flat out asked him if he wanted to sleep w/ her and he said "If I weren't M." WTF! He told me he wondered what she would be like in bed b/c of the way she acted (very flirtacious w/ him and other men, MM and SM.) Today, three years after the A, H told me he hired her b/c she was the only one experienced enough to do the job. She had previous experience w/ the inventory. Now why would he lie to me about hiring her three years after the A was over? He hates the exOW, has said some awful things about her, things I wouldn't even say. I know he has no feelings for her anymore, and I know there is NC between them anymore either.

As for the EA turning to PA....H admitted she was the one that told him first she was attracted to him and she kissed him. He pulled away and said they couldn't do that. That was a month b4 he said he wanted a D.

Yes we were separated when I spoke to her and asked her to stay away from him until we knew what we wanted, the D or the M. We were talking about reconcling. She was clouding H's judgment. She was in the middle of yet trying to convince him to leave me. If she would of stepped out of the picture we could of worked on our M w/o a third person trying to interfer.

I know she didn't have to abide by my wishes, it was her choice not to.

 

It's a long story why my H admitted to the A. The exow was afraid H was trying to fire her so she turned him into the HR department. My H told the HR dept that they had an A and she was worried that he was trying to fire her, which he wasn't. I believe they both should of been fired but knowing the exOW, she was probably screwing some guy in the HR dept too.

 

The exOW is D from her H. She filed for a D from him a week after my H filed from me. A couple days later (after he filed) my H called me and told me he moved too fast about filing and he thought he should of waited to see what he wanted. I was in denial of the A, like a fool but a month after he filed I moved away w/ our two children and started my life over. It was a month later that my H called and admitted to everything and he was tired of lying to me.

 

The reason why my H had an A is b/c he wasn't getting what he wanted from me. Why would I give him what he wants when he was never a father, nor a H? He wanted to party and leave me home alone w/ our children while he went out and had his fun, came home drunk several nights a week. I got tired of it, told him he either quits drinking or the M was over. He did quit, but 6 months later he was w/ the exOW. He says in a love letter to her that he was getting out of a relationship where I was trying to change him to my liking, not his. WTF? All I wanted was to have a H who would stay home and spend time w/ his children and be a H and a father, is that too much to ask? Anyhow, he didn't have those kind of demands w/ the exOW. It was all fun and games w/ her. Those fun and games weren't so fun after he realized what he lost.

I have read in several of your replies to other ppl's threads. You say that there are MM who do leave their W's for the OW. I agree, there are plenty of MM who do leave their W's. My H claimed the OW had nothing to do w/ him filing for a D. However, when we got back together he admitted she was part of the reason for the D. He said he was going to end our M and start his life over w/ the OW, so he did leave me for the OW. But it didn't take long for him to realize he made the biggest mistake of his life by leaving me for her.

[AJS]

I posted this on OM/OW forum-

 

A few years back my H and I needed a nanny to help us out some. One of my H's friends had a young gf whom needed a job so we hired her. She was great with my kids and a big help around the house. I really liked her. Well, after a while I started to notice she seem to like being around my H more than me or the kids. He noticed it too. One day I get a phone call from a friend of hers telling me that this girl was after my H. She told me that the girl said she was getting my H, home, and my kids, that I was going to be out in a matter of months because she was younger and prettier than me so he would go for her no doubt.

 

Well, he was working on his car a few days later when she tried to execute her plans....he fired her on the spot and came inside and told me. I in turn went to her bf home and slapped the **** out of her, then told him what she was up to. She lost everything at that point. I hope the little skank learned her lesson, just because you are young and pretty doesn't mean you get what you want by using your body. Some women are just that stupid I guess. Just thought I would share as this story has gotten many laughs from our family and friends.

 

She KNEW better than to have me arrested. My H didn't do anything wrong in this case or it would have been him I slapped.

[Guestperson]

Affairs are not against the law, assaults are. .

 

That depends on what law you're going by where affairs are concerned.

Hey J!

[mopar crazy]

That depends on what law you're going by where affairs are concerned.

Hey J!

 

GP

 

I honestly think that A should be illegal when it come to infedilty in a M. You put your spouse health/life at risk when you decide to screw someone else. And not to mention if the W is pregnant, an STD could be passed onto the unborn fetus.

 

I certaintly would rather be punched than end up w/ some incurable STD. The WS who gets punched, slapped, spit at, called names, has it a lot easier than the BS if they catch an STD. Just the pain alone that a BS has to go through for several months or years is a lot worse than being hit. JMO

[silktricks]

believe me, when you know the OW and know they have been persuing your H for several years you tend to want to let her have the wrath too. He might of made his vows to me but she knew from the beginning he was M but she continued to persue him.

 

From my experience, I don't think it would matter if you knew the OW woman or not - the anger comes from the pursuit of your H (especially over a long period of time.)

 

Also, though the husband usually gets his fair share of the anger directed his way, if he really wants to work things out with the W, then far more of the anger is directed at the OW. If you aren't trying to get things worked out, then the anger gets more evenly spread around.

[mopar crazy]

From my experience, I don't think it would matter if you knew the OW woman or not - the anger comes from the pursuit of your H (especially over a long period of time.)

 

Also, though the husband usually gets his fair share of the anger directed his way, if he really wants to work things out with the W, then far more of the anger is directed at the OW. If you aren't trying to get things worked out, then the anger gets more evenly spread around.

 

I agree, it doesn't matter if I knew the OW or not. If I knew that some woman was pursing my H it wouldn't matter if I knew her, I would still be angry. I guess the point I was making is that I personally knew the exOW, she tried so hard to be friends w/ me and all along she was pursing him. Made me feel reallllllyyyyy stupid for talking to her I can tell ya that. I knew she flirted w/ him, did for years, but I thought it was harmless. She flirted w/ everyone else, I just figured it was just the way she was so I never made a real big deal out of it. I never thought she was actually pursing him until it was too late.

[My_Other_I]

That depends on what law you're going by where affairs are concerned.

Hey J!

Can you explain?