Walk Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Last weekend, the bf got mad at me for playing with the cat for 2 minutes while he was going off about his job, again. (I had a thread somewhere about it.) I agreed it was rude, and although I had felt he'd ignored me and cut me off all day, I still shouldn't have let myself get distracted. Except he just got more and more mad about it, to the point that on New Year's Eve I was balling my eyes out and he's just walking past me whistling. I had apologized three times by that point, but it didn't seem to matter. Nothing I said mattered. He went off on me from 8pm to 10:15pm that night. Said I was a head case and selfish. Damn.. I can't remember it all now. It was bad. At least in my perspective, he didn't call me any worse names then head case or selfish.. just said I didn't work as hard, didn't know what pain was and how my little tummy ache would be nothing to him. (it hurt so bad it made my eyes water, that's bad for me.) It was like a two hour slamfest on me, my inadequacies, and flaws. Oh, and you know that saying "Love means you never have to say I'm sorry." He says it means you do your utmost to never f*** up so you never have to say your sorry. (WTF?!?) Not that loving someone means you accept their good and bad. Just, you don't mess up. Next day.. I try talking to him again. He's rational, calm. He tells me I'm what he wants, that I'm too good for him, that I deserve someone much better then he is or could give me. That he's the one with the mental problems. (Not once did he say the words "I'm sorry" during any of this, which I found slightly off. Seemed as if he was apologizing, yet... not.) And he said he knew my playing with the cat wasn't that big of a deal, but that his mind makes everything into a huge deal. blah blah blah. That evening (above paragraph was morning) I was trying to seduce him to have sex with me, and he tells me no. That we haven't resolved anything. Resolve what? I was confused at that point. I ask what kind of resolution he would like to see. He says he doesn't know. At that point I didn't know what to say because I'm worried we'll argue again if I bring anything up. He talks for a while.. seems to come to his own conclusion on the matter. We have sex and everything is great for the next three days. Fast forward to Thursday... He just woke up to go to work. I slide over next to him and wrap my hand in his. He says "Hunny, you're crowding me." Which means move away now. That hurt. I felt rejected. Then he just stared at the floor for several minutes. I finally got him talking about something.. and then he seemed ok. Unhappy about going to work, but okay. Which irritated me, because I'd stayed up to cook him stuff to take on the road, gotten coffee all ready for him when he got up, brought him his wakeup cup of coffee, filled his thermo's and to-go cup. Basically waited on him hand and foot. Overall it wasn't that much work, but then he tells me I'm "crowding him". I felt... taken for granted, rejected, I guess. This evening (saturday) We'd spent a large chunk of the day with his friend. I "suggest" some physical intimacy after we finally get home. He says "No thanks, I'm feeling apathetic towards sex". Huh? I ask why, but he says something like not in the mood.. **side note: My bf has said many times (many) in the past that I should ask him to go down on me. That he finds it exciting, that it creates intimacy for him, it's something he really enjoys doing, and that for him to feel happy in this relationship I need to ask him to do this for me. Which I have.** So I ask him to go down on me. He says no. He doesn't want anythign to do with sex. at all. I know I'm not supposed to be hurt. If you're partner isn't in the mood for sex, I shouldn't take it as rejection, as though he doesn't love me... But ouch. He wouldn't even touch me. Wouldn't look at me. Nothing to lessen the "no". And I've only told him no three times in the past 2 years. Every time was due to pain, or sickness. He tells me no all the time, and hardly ever initiates sex. (Although he has to have sex at least 3 times a week or he's not happy.) I went to bed. Couldn't sleep. Get back up. He asks why I'm up. I tell him I'm discombobulated by his 'apathy' over sex. I was very calm. Not emotional, or accusing. Just worried. He says he's apathetic because I'm not doing enough to excite him. I ask what that means. He says he doesn't have a good analogy. That's it, that's all he'd say on the matter. I sat and waited, couldn't think of a damn thing else to ask, or say. I head up to bed again. Now he's sleeping on the couch because he can't stand to be in the same room as me. He wouldn't explain, and he won't even sleep in the same damn room as me. I HATE THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm so over this. I'm trying. I keep trying. I let it all go, I turn the other cheek, I forgive, I admit I'm wrong, I apologize... But I'm the one who's ALWAYS f***ING WRONG!!! I do as he says, then I'm F'ing up by not thinking outside the box. I think out side the box, then I'm F'ing up by not listening to what he says. I try to be more exciting in bed, then I'm trying too hard. I do exactly as he says, then I'm not exciting enough. I've had it! I am over it. Done. f*** this. Aaarrrggghhh!!! (tomorrow I'll probably change my stupid pathetic mind. I hate myself.)
johan Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Hey, Walk. You didn't ask for any advice. I guess you know what people will be saying. I think you're doing your best. I can't figure out what he's thinking or why he acts like that. He's not showing a lot of love, that's for sure. I hope he figures out how to treat you at some point. He seems to be determined to make you feel like crap, and that's not right. Don't let him if you can help it.
sanne Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 this doesn't sound like a good relationship at all. your the type of woman guy's dream about, willing to do so much for a guy just to please him. trust me, there are guys out there that really do appreciate women like you. don't get caught up in this guy's immature games, you deserve better than this. i'm not saying breakup immediately, but let him no where you stand and how this is all making you feel and how you won't stick around much longer if it continues.
Qvt221 Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Work on your self esteem, and you will not allow yourself to be with someone who acts and treats you in this way. The last thing you wrote in your post was "I hate myself."... this speaks volumes.
Mary3 Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 You realize you are being emotionally abused and in an unhealthy relationship with someone who is mentally disturbed ? He is jealous, insecure , verbally abusive , apathetic to your needs , insulting ,much much more too but all I can stomach at this time reading your sad post. He has NO clue what love is. He is not giving you love and likely never had the right kind of love in his lifetime. You are giving giving giving and he is kicking you in the butt. He wants no sex with you . I am sorry but I would tell him to shove it and walk out. 2 Years with this Guy ?????
Outcast Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 He's got issues he can't and won't deal with. He expects 'unconditional love' from you, meaning no matter what garbage he throws at you, you're supposed to keep on loving him just exactly the same and never be unhappy. No normal mortal can live in this kind of situation and remain healthy. You will twist yourself into a pretzel trying to be just exactly what he needs when he needs it and, as you've already observed, nothing's ever right. Now here's what I found out when I lived in a similar situation - that what was wrong with him was ENTIRELY about him. He was angry at himself and took it out on me. He wasn't abusive, but like yours, he'd be mad at me even though I'd done nothing. One day, though, I observed him fly into a rage over something he did and that's when the light went on and I realized that it was never me - it was just him. There is little reward in a relationship like this. Sure, there's good days but they get fewer and fewer. Do you think maybe it's time to quit hoping that things will change? Because it sounds to me like whatever's bugging him is something he's just planning to live with - and so you would have to as well. IMHO being alone is better than walking on eggshells constantly.
Woggle Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Ger rid of him. If he is still mad at you over playing with the cat he has issues. You sound like a good woman and there are men out there who will appreciate you. What are you still doing with this guy?
lindya Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 He's got issues he can't and won't deal with. He expects 'unconditional love' from you, meaning no matter what garbage he throws at you, you're supposed to keep on loving him just exactly the same and never be unhappy. No normal mortal can live in this kind of situation and remain healthy. You will twist yourself into a pretzel trying to be just exactly what he needs when he needs it and, as you've already observed, nothing's ever right. Word. It's one thing to make efforts to understand a partner, but if they're bogged down with issues and mental health problems that give them a skewed and irrational approach to life, trying too hard to get into their heads can end up affecting your own mental health. There's such an air of mystery surrounding mental health problems. Self aware people will often be reluctant to challenge the behaviour of someone suffering from such problems because they are conscious of their own limited knowledge about the mental health condition. This is understandable - inevitable, even - but I can't help thinking that it makes it very easy for a person to hide behind their mental health problems. To stop trying to be a better person. To blame every piece of s***ty behaviour they inflict on others on their mental health. Next time he tells you he doesn't deserve you, I'd be inclined to say something like "well, without wanting to put you down, I have to agree with you on that right now. So I suppose you have a choice. You can either start improving your behaviour towards me in order to make this relationship workable...or we can call it quits and split up on as amicable terms as possible." I think there's such a thing as unconditional love, and a very laudable thing it is too. I don't see that unconditional love requires you, however to unconditionally continue in an emotionally damaging relationship. That's just self destructve. Rather than putting all your effort into figuring out what makes him tick and how you can "fix" him, perhaps you need to spend more time considering what it is that's making you persevere in an eminently unsatisfactory relationship that is causing you so much unhappiness.
Blackard Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 I HATE THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Then get out. If everything you are saying is true, and you are not feeding this, doing the passive aggressive thing, then you, dear lady, are in an abusive relationship. The pattern is obvious. First he triggers for no apparent logical reason, abuses you emotionally, then the next day he apologizes, makes nice....then the pattern begins again until the next big explosion. The boy has issues. This is destructive to you. You need to get away from that and find someone more calm, more rational, more on your level. Trust me, when you find that, its like a breath of fresh air.
JS17 Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Outcast basically said what I wanted to say. Just a couple of other notes. If you want this relationship to work then things need to change for him. You have said in the past that his job is taking a huge toll on him. It sounds like his anger is coming from depression so maybe a new job will help, counceling will help too. Personally, I've been here before. 2 hour rants on what a terrible person he thinks you are will wipe away you self esteem. There isn't a human being on the planet that it's worth destroying yourself for. You can't live forever walking on eggshells. 1
FireReady Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 WALK AWAY - and if you need some helping hands, check out girlstalkaboutitall.com. But leave him - he's NO GOOD
Fun2BMe Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 How long have you been together? Has he always been this mean or is it a recent thing? Do you feel like he's pulling away and acting like this as a prelude to break up? How could you be "crowding" him first thing in the morning by holding his hand????????!
JayKay Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 This sounds like a horrible way to live. He went off on you for close to 2 hours for playing with the cat???? He sounds mentally unstable, at best. He said you were 'crowding' him because you held his hand? That's incredibly hostile. You always try to do 'everything he says' and yet you're 'never good enough' You are being manipulated by a controlling and insecure man who is stripping you of your self esteem, self worth and self respect, day by day Please pack your bags and leave this guy
brashgal Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 This is not constant behavior though, right? He'll calm down eventually and be the charming, loving, fun person you fell in love with and you'll question why you were so upset earlier. Maybe a month to six weeks later he goes off on you again. Your self-esteem erodes little by little and your emotions are always tied to his state of mind, you lose yourself. Is this really what you want out of life? You mind is not stupid and pathetic, it's just confused by the passive-aggressive dance. If you can't stand up to him (which I think will bring the situation to a head), get some counselling which should help you decide what to do.
Neptune Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Sorry I can`t be too sympathetic. I have seen too much of this and the bottom line is that some women thrive on this kind of drama in their life. I cannot explain it. But, not everyone would still be in that relationship. When someone hangs around it usually has a place in their life.
Outcast Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 the bottom line is that some women thrive on this kind of drama in their life. This is cr@p. What happens is that the men start out charming and wonderful and seemingly great catches. Then, when the woman has fallen, the real man comes out. By then, she's convinced that what she first saw is 'the real him' and that the bad behaviour is an anomaly and if she only (insert every complaint he has) then he'll feel better. Or she'll think that when (insert problematic situation) is over, he'll be 'the way he was'. She doesn't WANT the drama. She's stuck with it. She thinks if she hangs in there through the rough bits then the great guy she first knew will resurface. Apparently this guy also used to be wonderful, is now under a lot of stress due to work, and is taking it out on her. But won't seek help. So while ordinarily it might be a good thing for someone to wait out a bad patch to see if the partner changes back when the bad patch is over (and that's what I first told her), this guy takes it far too far when he's in his 'bad patch'. I have endless empathy for someone like this guy who's struggling, but a struggling person who refuses to get help is not someone that's worth continuing with because then only one person is working on the relationship.
helena abadi Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 When someone hangs around it usually has a place in their life. good point. time to get out of that place. he does sound v unstable. you've put up with a lot of bad behaviour from him. whatever is happening, whatever you are doing, it is not working. stop trying to fix. fixing doesn't work because you're the one doing all the work. pack your bags and get the hell out the door. i would have picked up the cat and run for the hills.
whichwayisup Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Last weekend, the bf got mad at me for playing with the cat for 2 minutes while he was going off about his job, again. (I had a thread somewhere about it.) I agreed it was rude, and although I had felt he'd ignored me and cut me off all day, I still shouldn't have let myself get distracted. Actually, that isn't a big deal I don't think. So what, you played with the cat! Geez, if that was enough to set him off into a freakout session, I'd hate to know what would happen if all of a sudden you had to head to bathroom in the middle of his conversations... This guy is a control freak, has issues that he needs help with. I'm betting he was probably hurt alot in his past, either by ex's or family growing up. In the midst of his crap, he's hurting you, disrespecting you, treating you really badly. He has NO right to say those things to you. That was him just being a big a**h***!! You have done nothing wrong. I hope you know that and believe that. When you start feeling bad most of the time in a relationship, then it's time to consider ending it. Seems the bad is outweighting the good stuff. Can I ask if you feel awful around him like a teetertotter? One minute he's nice and you feel good, then the next he's off on you or backing off from you? How often does that happen? Daily, weekly? In clumps then things are OK again? Just trying to see if there's a pattern here or if all this is just stress related due to work.
Magister Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Now, some people might say to end the relationship and move on, but if I may paraphrase Thomas Jefferson a bit, Prudence, indeed, will dictate that relationships long established should not be dissolved for light and transient reasons. I think that this is just a bad phase and things will work out soon enough. Its easy enough to hear what is being said and to see what is being done, but it is difficult to understand the reason for those things being said and done. So I don't recommend you break-up unless you're almost certain you know what happened here and have thought up something you can do in the future to prevent you from ending up here again. Because, while the people who are saying this isn't your fault and your guy sucks likely have their hearts in the right place, the truth is that you really could have avoided this is you had better foresight, deeper knowledge, greater understanding, etc. You could very well be most to blame. Then again, your only mistake may have been your choice of partner. Who can say at this point? There are probably hundreds of reasons he could be acting the way he is. Possibly even valid ones. The only sure way to know is for him to tell you. Let's say the reason for his behavior is that he has decided to break up but is too conflicted to just tell you. Well, you think it is at least. If you go confront him about it and that isn't the reason and he sees his behavior as normal and yours as in the wrong, he may see it as you telling him its over and not being sure how to say it. The tools you have to communicate with (words, body language, actions) being so imperfect I do not recommend confronting him about it. Confrontations trigger defensive, angry emotions. You want to avoid these. He isn't going to tell you how he got hurt if you keep agitating the wound. Its hard to talk when you're trying hard not to scream. The best thing to do is find the most comfortable daily pattern that you can and stick with it. If you want to have sex and you see he is unresponsive, get up, get dressed, and go do something else. (I don't recommend going out to eat or to drink. Going for a walk or to the library is fine.) Do not do things aimed at producing angry emotional responses from him. In fact, try to avoid trigger emotional responses at all. (Don't sigh dramatically, shrug you shoulders, or tap your fingers, etc.) If it seems like you can get him to talk more, go for it, but be careful. This whole thing maybe the result of unconscious manipulation on your part. Who can say? Be polite, but not excessively so. If you step on his toe accidentally, apologize sincerely once. Don't apologize any more than a very minimal amount. And definitey avoid doing things you might have to apologize for. If he acts as if an apology isn't enough, ignore him. If he says that isn't good enough, ask him what he wants you to do. After he tells you, respond the best way you can and then move on to something else. Don't try to reason with him about it. In the mean time, try to increase his intake of fruits and veggies if it's lagging.
Outcast Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Do not do things aimed at producing angry emotional responses from him. snip And definitey avoid doing things you might have to apologize for. You clearly have never lived with someone like this. What you advocate is 'walking on eggshells'. The problem is that with one of these guys, EVERYTHING produces emotional responses and EVERYTHING seems to be something you've done. But it's NOT you. It's them. They are angry inside, seek a cause for the anger, and, lacking the insight to see what's going on inside themselves, blame you. You can, as the op did, just touch a hand and get garbage. All I said one day was 'good morning' and got major grief. IT'S NOT ABOUT WHAT SHE'S DOING!!!!!!! It's inside his head. When we're angry or upset, we look for reasons - which usually means blaming others. In some cases, the anger or upset is caused by our own chemical imbalance - there is no 'reason' for it. But we blame all around us because humans don't like to accept that there can be feelings that aren't based on 'reasons'.
Author Walk Posted January 8, 2006 Author Posted January 8, 2006 Can I ask if you feel awful around him like a teetertotter? One minute he's nice and you feel good, then the next he's off on you or backing off from you? How often does that happen? Daily, weekly? In clumps then things are OK again? Just trying to see if there's a pattern here or if all this is just stress related due to work. Teetertotter would be accurate. One week he is the most loving, affectionate man in the world. I couldn't ask for a more wonderful bf. He behaves as though I'm the hottest woman in the world, wants to include me in his hobbies, and friends, will give me back rubs and make dinner. Two days later he's not talking to me, doesn't seem to want me in the same room, and won't touch me with a ten foot pole. Sometimes he talks in metaphors about why he's upset, agitated, frustrated. I'm left confused and frustrated and no better understanding of what's going on then I started with.. Only that I feel like he's pointing the finger at me. Other times he'll finally get to the point and let me know I'm doing X behavior which has caused him to become distant, and upset. The longest we've gone in the past six months is one month of good times. (That was December.) Which was wonderful during that time. If I could bottle that, I'd be rich. It's like cocaine, addictive. Absolutely wonderful. Wish I could tell you if this is monthly, daily. Seems like weekly. How's that. Might only be monthly. I see him try to break out of it somewhat when he gets this way. Like... he came up to bed around 4am last night. Normally he'll sleep as far away from me as possible on his side of the bed when upset with me. (If he comes to bed) this time he was nearly crowding me off the bed. Like he subconciously wanted to be close to me. This isn't normal behavior for him. Then he made breakfast for us when we got up. Wouldn't let me help. (normal when he's upset). (Really upset he wouldn't have eaten at all) After eating I tried to hold his hand while watching a show. He hid his hand. I held his arm. Then he faked moving his phone so that I had to let go of his arm. So I slid away from him and crossed my arms. Tried to talk to him later. Just asked why he was upset and agitated. He gave me a philosophical theory on why people get upset and agitated. Then said it ebbs and flows since his childhood. (huh??) I'm f***ing confused. I went up and took a shower, he went back to bed.
Lishy Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Magister that is the biggest load of tosh I have heard in this forum! Maybe you where brought up 'old school' .. Put up and shut up, but that is not the way for ANYONE to live their life. If he does, in fact, have mental issues and he is not willing to try to sort this problem then Walk will be living with this daily! Would you want your daughter/sister/mother to live like this? Would you be telling her to stay and just put up with it? I doubt it! Seemingly the problem seems to stem from Walk's lack of self esteem, he has been chipping away at it for god knows how long now and soon she will hit the floor. The day she does will be the day she walks! Up until then Walk needs to realise that she is NOT to blame for his mental behaviour and you telling her that she may be to blame is not helping her one iota! Walk baby I am here if you need me, I am so feeling for you right now babe. And my advice remains the same darling and you know what that advice is! ::Big hug:: just for you Walk!
witabix Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 "well, without wanting to put you down, I have to agree with you on that right now. So I suppose you have a choice. You can either start improving your behaviour towards me in order to make this relationship workable...or we can call it quits and split up on as amicable terms as possible." I agree with the above entirely. Sorry I can`t be too sympathetic. I have seen too much of this and the bottom line is that some women thrive on this kind of drama in their life. I cannot explain it. But, not everyone would still be in that relationship. When someone hangs around it usually has a place in their life. I must disagree with part of the first paragraph. I would not be convinced that Walk comes across on this forum as that kind of woman. Mutually abusive relationships do exist due to the negative needs of the people involved. However we are not seeing this IMO. Walk is trying too hard. It is a female instinct, I have seen it myself. Some men do not respond to the caring, I do not know why we do this, it drives women crazy. They try to be understanding and bend to the way they think their partner wants them to be. But he doesn't know what he wants. Some people come across as controlling because they cannot lay out exactly how their perfect, equality driven, relationship would look, or feel like. They lack the introspective skills that would allow them to visualise this situation. They simply do not know what they want. Walk's SO seems to fall into this category. He is caught up in his own suffering, expects everyone to leave him to wallow in his own suffering, expects Walk to understand something he himself cannot or will not explain. She is not telepathic, I can gaurentee that, if his way of letting off steam is to punish her with words and physical distance he needs to examine why he does this to someone who seems to clearly love him. Walk, I do not know what you should or shouldn't do. I do know how hard it is to understand the actions of another when you simply cannot make sense of them. Weigh up for yourself the pro's and con's of your relationship. Then ask. Does the good outweigh the bad? Can I live with the bad? Do not think you can change him, but you can ask him if he wishes to change his behavior in the light of how it affects you and your relationship and feelings for him. Remember, he may be unable to change at this time. Then you need to decide if you are willing to give him time to consider his actions rationally. I do understand your total frustration.
Lishy Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 In the mean time, try to increase his intake of fruits and veggies if it's lagging. Why the hell should SHE increase his fruit and veggie instake? He is a fkn adult let him deal with the crap he hands out so easily! I want to come and pack Walk's stuff and take her away from her toxic situation! I have been at the self same place and it just gets worse! 1
lindya Posted January 8, 2006 Posted January 8, 2006 Why the hell should SHE increase his fruit and veggie instake? He is a fkn adult let him deal with the crap he hands out so easily! Yes. Information on how to be a Stepford Wife won't necessarily remedy the problem. This guy is Walk's lover (or supposed to be) not some colicky baby around whom the world must revolve.
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