itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 This is long...so no big deal if no one has time to read it all...I just felt like getting it all out somewhere.... Mine is a story of irony, as much of what I am going through now is what I believe my wife went through years ago. When we were younger, my wife had a scorching hot temper and regularly embarrassed me in public. She was insatiably jealous, and that also brought embarrassment. This is of course a broad general description of countless events over the years. Over time I started to want to be with her less and less, and it started to show. I stuck it out because we have 3 kids together, and I didn't want them to go through the pain of divorce i wnet through as a kid. My lack of interst showed everywhere, even in the bedroom. I wasn't mean or anything....I just found it hard to act loving, and she sensed that. She tried by sending me notes all the time, buying me cards, and trying in the bedroom. Over the past year or two, as her agressive temper seemed to calm down, things started improving. Things were getting better, but she was still pretty jealous. So I encouraged her to get out more with her friends....thinking more of a social life of her own would make things better when she didn't have to rely on me for every moment. Once she started....she really started enjoying going out. We even set up my night out on friday (poker with the guys), and her on saturday (dancing or a few drinks with the girls). That was cool for awhile, until I realized that there were guys going out with them too. As it turns out..the guys were harmless...just people she works with who I am actually friends with now. But still...i started becoming a bit jealous. This is where the irony comes in. As I became jealous...i became far more aware of how I used to treat her....and wanted to improve things. The problem was....when I started to try....i noticed....which I hadn't really noticed up to that point....was that she had basically stopped trying like she used to. Ironic...because I wanted to stop being so jealous and opressive....but once certain behaviours stopped...like her interest in the bedroom....I started getting more jealous and suspicious. I tried talking to her...repeatedly about why she seemed so different....to which she kept saying I was trying to pick a fight. She said nothing was wrong....but the change in her was so night and day....I kept pressing....I sent her emails telling her how I felt...just to avoid a fight. even those she wouldn't reply to...instead calling me and saying nothing was wrong. So, much like her when she was jealous....I started looking for something wrong. I found no proof of infedelity...but what I found was she had sent pictures from a halloween party to a guy at work. There were two pictures of her topless (we go to the same haloween party every year...the topless thing happens with all the girls every year...but the agreeement always is no one outside the group sees them). I was incredibly angry. It's not like she sent them to a bunch of people...just one guy at work...one guy that I don't even know. I confronted her....and she said she was just sending halloween pics...no big deal....but it was a huge to me. I specifically told her several times that I dont want anyone she works with seeing those...but still she sent them. She said it was mistake...but she didnt feel there was anything wrong. So then I went into full on snoop mode. I got into her myspace account and found her havng a conversation with a guy she knew 15 years ago that she looked up....complaining about married life. Again...I confronted her....and she said it was nothing...she was just kidding....but i read the conversation...it wasnt kidding...he even asked what she meant and she explained... So anyway.....now I find myself checking her email looking for something...which...since I jumped on her about this stuff...probably wouldn't show up in her email now anyway. I feel like my trust in her is shaken. Her refusal to talk openely and honestly about this just throws gas on the fire. I now go out with her on saturday's...and am friends with the people she was going out with. If she had screwed around...the way these people drink with me...no way that would be a secret. But she still doesnt act like she used to. When we are out...she is all over me...but at home...either she isnt in the mood....or, pardon the expression...but she basically just rolls over to let me do my thing....no real interaction anymore....when there used to alot. I am having trouble reconciling the whole topless pictures sent to someone that isnt even part of the group she hangs out with. i am also having trouble with her looking up a single guy she knew and complaining about married life. And by far the biggest issue...I can't reconcile with her lack of interest...when a year ago she was always laying with me, sending me love notes...cards....and always wanted sex....now none of those things are the case. Am I being way too sensitive or am I right to think there is something wrong? I feel like she doesn't want to be married anymore. Like she cant interact with me unless we are out at a club or bar.
clandestinidad Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 It sounds like she's really developed a liking for male attention. I dont know ANY women who, in a loving relationship, would show a male pictures of her topless!! BTW, how old are these women who get topless every halloween!?!? Its like they ALL love the attention they get by being shallow, trashy 'girls'....are they 17!?!?! COME ON!!! That really should be your first clue when someone who's married gets topless in mixed company....thats just weird and dumb. (granted, its different on Bourbon St...but thats flashing, not going topless!!) Doesnt it indicate what this group of girls might do when they go out drinking and dancing??? They need to grow up and assume some morals Anyway, I wouldnt trust this woman one bit right now. She is giving you excuses...and theyre not even good ones!!! She's not even taking the time to come up with GOOD lies/excuses! She doesnt seem to give a $h!t what you think/feel about it. She's being selfish. I cant figure out why she would lead you on at the club and then reject you at home......unless its to toy with you. Maybe you should quit going with her and see if she changes...either coming closer to you or pulling farther away. You cant keep chasing someone thats running, ya know. I think you might want to back off and she how she responds.
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 the women at the parties are all in there 30's. It's just something that started during a halloween or new years party several years ago. I always considered it harmless....there was never anything further than that...and it was several women....just a stupid drunk harmless kinda thing....that said....we skipped that party this year for the first time in years. I don't like that I can't trust her right now. but i don't know how to handle that. On the one hand...I am now a part of what made me jealous...in that we go out together and if she had screwed around and any of them knew....it would be tough to keep it from me. These are the talk until you drop type of drinkers...and she has no problem with me shootin the s*** with them when she isnt standing there listening in. On the other hand....sending those pics to just one particular guy that I don't know and isn't part of this crowd, although they all know him from work.....makes me very nervous. I really don't want to spend my marriage combing through her emails, trying to find an answer she wont give me....but with three kids...how far do I carry it before I say enough? I know thats not a question with an easy answer...its just the question thats been in my head non-stop lately.
clandestinidad Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 I think you might want to remember that even if she hasnt done anything physically with someone else, emotional affairs are very common and develop way before people move forward to physical things. So, just b/c people havent said anything about it doesnt mean anything. Also, people keep their emotional affairs highly secretive.....often they dont tell ANYone. Also, its not hard to open another email account that no one knows about. I'm sorry that I'm not offering any consolation here....but its b/c I agree with you that something is amiss. I still think you should stop going with her, get back to your friends, focus on your children, and see how she responds. After a couple weeks or months of seeing how she acts, you will be able to know if she's getting closer or farther from you. You dont need to read emails or anything. Just relax and see what happens.....if you can imagine it being a helium balloon...just let it go. You'll be able to see whats going on when you relax and have a better head on your shoulders. Snooping, going with her everywhere, calling her all the time, probing her for answers, etc will make ANYONE pull away from you. The only real way to see how she feels about you is to back off and see what she does
whichwayisup Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Two wrongs don't make a right. Each of you have suffered and grown apart from another...And now things are a mess. You have two choices, either both of you can go to marriage counselling and really sort it all out -Talk and listen to eachother, do all that is necessary to rebuild the trust and grow together, or end it. Staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids and not getting along to the point of living separate lives isn't good for anybody. Kids learn from an early age what is normal, what relationships are all about from what they see at home. I know you love your wife, so don't give up. I really hope she has it in her to want to fix things and both of you can communicate what it is each of you want from the marriage, and from eachother. Good luck and keep posting!
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 The problem with pulling away is this all started when we were doing our own thing. We used to go out together every weekend...usually saturday night. She wasn't like this until I encouraged her to go out with her friends more. As for me going out with her...that was the one thing she has done to make things a little better...it was her suggestion. That said...I dont think it would kill herif I didnt go...she would just keep doing the same thing with the same people. I guess this comes down to my dislike of her having several male friends from work....which...her being in the car business...is pretty normal. I didn't worry about that before the email she sent. I think you hit the nail on the head about her needing attention from guys at work....I just don't know how far she has/will go for that attention.
clandestinidad Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Do you both ever go out together anymore? Ever had an overnight somewhere? Maybe downtown for dinner and hotel or something...i dont know where you live, but you could probably think of some things. Does she like romance?? Maybe you could go to the hotel earlier in the day and put rose petals or flowers around the room. Perhaps with some champagne and bubble bath. It doesnt have to be too expensive, either. You can get rose petals at grocery stores, bubble bath isnt expensive, the champagne....I strongly recommend Martini & Rossi 'Asti' (its light and delicious, but about $13-15 if I remember correctly) I'm just throwing out an idea....it occured to me that rather than going to clubs or bars maybe the 2 of you could get away When was the last time you shared something like that?? Edit to add: if you do this, or something similar, tell her that you want to take her away somewhere to have a romantic time alone. Tell her that you've missed her. And tell her that you just want to spend time together. If she says anything about doing it to get laid, make sure to tell her that you did it for HER, not so that you would get some. (but only say that if SHE brings up sex first, otherwise it seems like you were thinking about and wanting sex, and manipulating her)
travellingman Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 I confronted her....and she said it was nothing...she was just kidding.. You bought that? You can tell if someone's heart is in a relationship. Unless you're in some kind of legal proceeding, I really don't know what you'll gain from chasing down hard evidence. I'm in the exact opposite position you're in, and would say more, but Kat23 explained it better than I could. Her comments are dead on, and I'd re-read that post if you're not sure what to do.
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 Do you both ever go out together anymore? Ever had an overnight somewhere? Maybe downtown for dinner and hotel or something...i dont know where you live, but you could probably think of some things. Does she like romance?? Maybe you could go to the hotel earlier in the day and put rose petals or flowers around the room. Perhaps with some champagne and bubble bath. It doesnt have to be too expensive, either. You can get rose petals at grocery stores, bubble bath isnt expensive, the champagne....I strongly recommend Martini & Rossi 'Asti' (its light and delicious, but about $13-15 if I remember correctly) I'm just throwing out an idea....it occured to me that rather than going to clubs or bars maybe the 2 of you could get away When was the last time you shared something like that?? I actually did that for our anniversary. Got us a room in the city, got there before her and had a dozen roses in the room when she got there. We had a decent time...but it was generally a fairly lackluster evening. There are other things I could do...sned flowers to her at work (something she asked for once)...buy her cards for the no other reason than to tell her I lover her...but the one thing she seems to want most is for me to back off trying to talk about everything....and I really dont want to do that. I guess I can try harder and see if it breaks down the wall that seems to be there now. Thanks BTW for conversing with me about this....it's tough not having an outlet.
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 You bought that? You can tell if someone's heart is in a relationship. Unless you're in some kind of legal proceeding, I really don't know what you'll gain from chasing down hard evidence. I'm in the exact opposite position you're in, and would say more, but Kat23 explained it better than I could. Her comments are dead on, and I'd re-read that post if you're not sure what to do. If I bought that I wouldn't be here stressing about my marriage.
clandestinidad Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 I guess I can try harder and see if it breaks down the wall that seems to be there now. No, I dont think that would be good right now. I changed my mind about the overnight thing....... mainly b/c she's telling you to back off and leave her alone...I guess I didnt realize she had actually told you that, so I change my advice back now...sorry if that was confusing so, yeah....I go back to the whole thing about leaving her alone and seeing what she does. She flat out told you to, so if you buy things, and smother her it will get worse.
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 No, I dont think that would be good right now. I changed my mind about the overnight thing....... mainly b/c she's telling you to back off and leave her alone...I guess I didnt realize she had actually told you that The back off part was about me constantly trying to talk about what's going on. She says I am looking for things to be wrong rather than just being happy that we are going out more together and having fun.
clandestinidad Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 but the one thing she seems to want most is for me to back off trying to talk about everything....and I really dont want to do that I understand that youre trying to keep her, but she is telling you to stop doing those things. If you dont stop, you will push her into someone else's life. Let it go, and see what she does over the next few weeks/months What are you scared of happening if you let go and stop talking about it? edit: I understand that she wants the 2 of you to have fun and go out, but why does it have to be with everyone else at the same time?? Can she not have fun alone w/ you?
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 So it seems so far everyone thinks are about as bad as I think they are. Just for a bit of clarity....in our many discussions/arguments lately....I have suggested maybe we should seperate to which she hassaid repeatedly she does not want to do. Also....in years past I have done worse thatn what she has done (that I know of). I haven't cheated...but I have traded emails and conversations with other women...not for a couple years...but I did. She also overheard a conversation a couple years ago where I had some less than favorable things to say about her and our marriage (funny story..my overweight friend's girth hit just the right quick dial button and dialed my wife's cell phone...thats how she heard it). It is for these reasons that I feel like I owe it to her to continue trying hard...because some of the damage i believe is my fault....and some of it is her fault. If she has however cheated...I cant forgive that....her half ass answers to what I found are why I keep looking for proof. If she just came around...I would probably abandon looking.
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 edit: I understand that she wants the 2 of you to have fun and go out, but why does it have to be with everyone else at the same time?? Can she not have fun alone w/ you? That is also a major concern of mine.
whichwayisup Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 If you cheated, would you want her forgiveness, a second chance? Hire a PI, install a keylogger on the computer if you really want to know what is going on. Walking on egg shells and letting her do what she wants isn't going to better your marriage. I said earlier that you both need some counselling. IS she willing to work on the marriage and talk things out? Are you?
Author itisi Posted January 7, 2006 Author Posted January 7, 2006 If you cheated, would you want her forgiveness, a second chance? Hire a PI, install a keylogger on the computer if you really want to know what is going on. Walking on egg shells and letting her do what she wants isn't going to better your marriage. I said earlier that you both need some counselling. IS she willing to work on the marriage and talk things out? Are you? I would want her to forgime me...I just wouldn't expect her too...nor do I think I could forgive that. Like I said about Irony earlier...I defintely want to work everything out....I believe she wants to stay together....but she is unwilling to acknowledge there is even a problem right now. This is the polar opposite of us 3 years ago, where she wanted to go for counseling and I didn't see a reason to.
Author itisi Posted January 8, 2006 Author Posted January 8, 2006 well..I sent her an email ( to eliminate the possibility of argument ) while she is at work today. I told her we need to resolve the issues like why she sent those pictures...with real reasons...no more avoiding it. I explained that if the situation were reveresed and I had done something like that...she wouldn't let it go, and there is no way I am either. She wrote back that we will talk when she gets home. Im just not the type of person who can play the games and try ignoring her to see if anything improves....I need to know if this will be resolved or if it won't. Honestly...i'm thinking my next step, if she cant answer why she did that....will be to talk to the guy she sent the email to. I have his number...and I obviously know where he works. I am a pretty big guy...so if intimidation is what it takes....I will be going that way....That said, Her reply did sound like she is ready to talk it out though...so hopefully....
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