This sucks.... Don't know what to do...

[hbeezee]

My girlfriend of 7 months, who I have fallen deeply in love with, and her with me (or so I think...) has been going through some troubles.

 

Lately, she has been having dreams and nightmares about her ex who was abusive and mean. She was with him and living with him for 2 years.. that was over a year ago when they broke up. She has been distant, and depressed, and I cant get close to her. She shows me no emotion, and no feelings, yet she gets mad at me if I ever question her love for me. Her actions speak differently than her words though... as we all know they do.

 

Anyways, yesterday the ex sent her a giant bouquet of flowers to her work... due to the holidays I guess. Along with a card that said hi and tell the family hi and happy holidays. (this is what she said it read)...

 

I am away for a while right now, and wont see her again untill New Years... so tracking this guy down is out of the question right now. But the problem is that she was making improvment, and now she is back to square one. So I thought..... then I made a mistake.

 

Awhile ago, I set her up an email account so she could send me some pictures... she changed the password, but told me what it was... Me, being a little insecure, checked her email last night. I found that she sent her ex a Hallmark e-card that said she was thinking about him, that he would always be close to her heart, and that he made her day with the flowers. GREAT! Now my skin begins to tingle and I am having a hard time breathing.

 

So I kinda let it go, but decided to follow up on todays email actions. I logged in about an hour ago and found that she sent him an email saying he was an angel that made her happy... and gave him her cell number to call her sometime so they can talk. Again, I am not there to police this... so I dont know what is happening.

 

She has been trying to get over this guy for the last month and a half and now she is being nice to him. This guy was abusive, and physicaly hurt her numerous times... WTF!?!?

 

Anyways, I kinda confronted her... I basically told her that if she ever felt like she had to talk to him, she could tell me and I would be alright with it. I thought it might bring her closure...? She said that was out of the question and that she would NEVER talk to him (but I have the emails to prove otherwise...)

 

What the hell do I do... I cant tell her I read the emails because then I am an a**h***... I cant tell her I know, because besides the emails there is no way of knowing. Should I trust that she is trying to talk to him to get some closure? Or should I worry?

 

AGAIN.... I KNOW I MADE A MISTAKE BY READING THE EMAILS, BUT NOW I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT TO DO.

[Rickymoemoe]

Hey I'm just glad you found out now man. Drop her like yesterdays garbage man. Until she can pull herself away from liking abusive relationships she's not the girl for you man.

 

On the other hand you could start beating her up seems she likes that anyhow.

 

CRAZY BITCH don't need them.

[hbeezee]

Thats just it... she's not into abusive relationships, and she has told me how much she hated that one... the guy did a number on her though... She is a forgiver type of person and her means might just to see how he is doing. I know she hasnt had contact with him for the last 9 months at least. I dont feel like dropping her just yet. I am looking more for a way to confront her and have her tell me she wants to talk to him...

[Touche]

If she's still in contact with him in any shape or form then she IS into abusive relationships. I'd give her an ultimatum. No contact with him or your out of there.

 

Oh and by the way...no one can do a "number" on you, unless you LET them! (Unless she was drugged or hypnotized.)

[kitkat826]

I think she started dating you without being fully over and having full closure from the ex, regardless of his abusive nature. She is in denial to you about it, and probably with herself as well. I do not think she is ready to be in any type of relationship right now until she completely exorcises that devil...and no matter how much she begs if you confront her about it, don't think that you can help her solve her problems.

[hbeezee]

When I have confronted her, she gets defensive. So I think unless I get some kind of better feeling about anything, then it is going to be over.

 

I wish I could tell her I read the emails... if I do that, then I definatly know there is no chance for the future... even if she does get closure.

[Sevenmack]

Sounds like you need to dump her and ditch her right now. The reality is that like most women who have had abusive relationships, she enjoys the drama of the relationship as much as she abhors the abuse. When given a normal relationship with a normal human being such as yourself, she enjoys it for a while because she gets good treatment. But ultimately she ends up back either with her ex-abuser or a new one because she misses the drama; she's incapable of having normal sexual-emotional relationships and thus your relationship with her is doomed.

 

Often abusive relationships are like that of a rottweiler to its owner. The rottweiler (the abuser) is a real nasty piece of work, but it's that very nastiness that gives the owner (the woman) reason to keep it around. As bad as the rottweiler is, the owner is even worse because she is willing to tolerate nasty behavior and actually thrives off it, no matter what she says. Remember words are almost meaningless; deeds mean almost everything.

 

Chances are that the contact has gone beyond flowers and e-mails; she's probably seeing him again and cheating on you in the process. You can ask her, but chances are she won't admit it. The fact that she got defensive about you expressing concerns about his contact is signs enough that there's more to the situation than him trying to get her back. She either wants him back and thus entertaining his gifts, cards and the like, or she's just using him and therefore just as nasty a piece of work as he was.

 

She's told you all the bad about the relationship, but it's unlikely that she's admitted to her role in sustaining an abusive relationship that with most people, would have ended as soon as the abuse began. The reality is that abusive relationships are far more complex than 'he hits and she gets hit.' And just because she leaves doesn't mean she really wants it to end.

 

Considering how abusive he is, it's likely that if you continue dating her, you'll be emotionally abused by her and may be subject to a physical beating by him, if he's not too much of a coward. Having her -- and him -- in your life isn't worth the trouble. Tell her to get some therapy, actually look at how she's managing her life -- since her abuse is not simply something that just happened, she made bad choices -- and then move on. There are plenty of healthier women than her out there.

[Sevenmack]

If anything, this triangle is giving her some of the drama she desires. After all, she's got to decide between an ex who is a black knight, evil but with so much charm and sex appeal (and they have a history together to boot) and you, a white knight in shining armor who has saved her from such evil and now must save her from herself again. It's her own version of a Medieval Nights dinner show save for the costumes and fake castle. And her psyche's enjoying every minute of it, no matter her protests.

 

Again, it's time for you to move on. Just tell her to get some therapy, tell her to do a better job of managing her life and dump her. It's not worth your time.

[hbeezee]

Considering how abusive he is, it's likely that if you continue dating her, you'll be emotionally abused by her and may be subject to a physical beating by him, if he's not too much of a coward.

 

 

I hear what you are saying. Trust me I do... and the situation has escalated slightly... however, what you said here makes me laugh.

 

I am 6'3", 260 and a professional athlete. He is 5'11" and the most athletic thing hes ever done was join a bowling league.

 

I have considered scaring the sh*t out of him though...

 

I am just a long distance away right now, and I need some kind of closure or answer to be able to move on. If there is nothing goin on, then I want to give her time to work her problems out. If there is something going on, I will be able to sleep if I know what it is... thats the kind of person I am. I need to know.

 

I have thought about calling him... not in an angry way, but basically to say "if you guys are getting back together, I'm gone..." and see how he reacts. Or something like that.

 

I hate the drama... but the love we have shared untill this point was unreal. And I dont feel like walking out just yet.

[Outcast]

he reality is that like most women who have had abusive relationships, she enjoys the drama of the relationship

 

this triangle is giving her some of the drama she desires.

 

THIS IS COMPLETE BULLSHXT

 

You have zero idea of what they dynamics of abuse are. Shame on you! If it wouldn't get me banned, I'd tell you exactly what I think of people who make such inane statements off the tops of the things they call 'heads'.

 

As for hbeezee, tell her that you saw the emails and then send her links to domestic violence sites. She is making the mistake of thinking he might change or that she needs to, and can, 'fix' him. She needs counselling at a DV centre ASAP. You may anger her by confessing that you read the emails, but you may save her life if you keep her from going back.

 

And Sevenmack, you read some DV sites and maybe go to a DV centre and talk to the counselors and LEARN about DV. :mad:

[hbeezee]

I agree that I do deserve better. And she was that better for me. Things were perfect. She did truly love me and respect me. This is only a recent thing. Part of it has to do with the distance I think... I hope.

 

I dont want to give up on her quite yet. Her whole family calls me and tells me not to leave, and to be patient and have faith in her. They know this ex really screwed with her mind, and she is confused right now. I am just hoping she comes out of it, and realizes what she is doing. On a few occasions she broke down and apologized for treating me the way she was and that she hated doing it.

Her stories about where she's been check out just enough for me to believe that they really aren't getting back together... however, my gut feeling tells me different. But my gut has been wrong in the past...

 

I'm afraid of cutting her loose and the sadness of me leaving her drives her even deeper back to the A-hole and then she ends up in the hospital after a few months, or possibly dead.

 

I have some support from her family and they (being good Christians) are praying for us and going to intervene and keep her around the house during the holidays so she doesnt stray too far away from her dreams (which she still claims are me)

[LN8840K]

Touche

 

" If she's still in contact with him in any shape or form then she IS into abusive relationships. "

 

That is direct,honest, and the 100% truth

 

you're about to get dumped for the abuser,

[LN8840K]

he reality is that like most women who have had abusive relationships, she enjoys the drama of the relationship

 

this triangle is giving her some of the drama she desires.

 

THIS IS COMPLETE BULLSHXT

 

if it's complete BS then why do " most " abuse victims continue to choose abusers ?

 

abuse victims need to take responsibility for their actions, they are not completely helpless, if you're abused it's because you choose to be PERIOD

 

before my above statement is taken out of context ...Obviously I am talking about " most " domestic cases of abuse and not child abuse, sexual abuse, abuse of the elderly and anyone that does not truly have the choice

[hbeezee]

Last night she had a breakdown. She moved back home (she was living alone). She is going to councelling tomorrow morning (which her mother is going with her and called me to tell me about the appointment). She told me that I was the most understanding, and normal guy she's ever met and that she cant stand treating me this way.

 

She told me that she needs some time to figure some things out. She has begun to remove all items in her life that remind her of this guy. As I said before, she is moving back in with her parents untill she figures some things out. She told me she wants to be back to the way she was (with me).

 

I had heard it from other sources that the guy had invited her over to his house after they began talkiing again. She turned him down and he was very upset about it. (a year being gone from the relationship and he is still doing his crap. Her friend who was a mutual aquaintance told me about this.)

 

I think she finally decided that this guy is NOT who she wants in her life, now she just has to get the feelings from her past out of her mind. She is troubled. She doesn't know why she had sympathy for this guy in the first place.

 

The only unfortunate thing for myself is that through all this, she said she doesn't know what she wants right now. She knows she doesnt want him, but she isn't sure if she wants this long distance thing right now. I reminded her that the long distance is only temporary, and in March, I will be moving closer to her (about 3 hours away).

 

Should I stick around? I do love this girl more than any woman I have ever met. We have experienced a true feeling of love and happiness that either of us has NEVER had before. I have the memories and pictures to prove it!

 

I dont quite want to cut and run yet. I know if she clears her head, gets over this guy, and starts missing my affection and attention that things would be great.

 

It just sucks that it is Christmas time.

[Sevenmack]

THIS IS COMPLETE BULLSHXT

 

Ah, Outcast, apparently I've struck a nerve. Sorry. However I do know a few things about abuse -- and not just from reading (Deborah Sontag's Nov. 2002 New York Times Magazine article on the complexity of spousal abuse, by the way, is a great start on the discussion.)

 

See my mother went through plenty of abusive relationships and they often worked out the same way: Complain about the abuse, then excuse the abuse and stay. Or in some cases, go back to an ex-husband who smoked weed, couldn't keep a job and engage in all sorts of emotional and occasionally, physical abuse.

 

That pattern would repeat itself over and over. So would another: How she at times would help start (along with her abusive lovers) the whole crescendo and descrescendo of the abuse -- a little needling here, a cross word there -- until the

 

Back in the early 1990s, my mother got re-acquainted with a rather decent man, who actually had an income, who treated her spectacularly and despite being single, actually liked having her kids (including myself) around. It lasted a year. By the time it ended, she had gone off with her last ex-husband, who may have been a piece of no good, but he wasn't the worst human being on the planet. He was, however, an abuser and the whole cycle started over again. By the time she finally began therapy and left him 8 years later, the emotional and occasional physical scars were all over. If not for my grandfather getting into her head about this, who knows what would have happened.

 

Abuse is complex. Abused women are definitely victims and the men who commit the abuse deserve prison. It's difficult to break apart from the abuse cycle because it's familiar to them, comfortable to them and they sympathize with their abuser. But the abused aren't exactly passive: Many abused women are drama queens, not necessarily in the sense that they display it for the world, but in the sense that in their personal lives, they lack that something that would otherwise keep them out of cycles of abuse. They as much thrive on the drama of the abuse as they do on the abuse itself.

 

Sorry Outcast that reality doesn't fit your worldview. But I'm not here to cater to your ego. I'm giving my own honest take on the matter based on a combination of real-world experience, those of my mother and the research I've done. Don't like it? Tough luck.

[Sevenmack]

And Hbeezee, I wish you all the best and happiness you can find in this tough moment.

[Craig]

I'm giving my own honest take on the matter based on a combination of real-world experience, those of my mother and the research I've done.

So you mention one article from a popular magazine, tell us that you have personal experience because you know one person that experienced dv, lay a few generalized statements that are hard to disagree with and then foist your opinion upon us and expect us to accept your crude and simplistic attempt to provide reality to us.

 

If you had done any research and had any understanding of dv you wouldn't make statements like you have. I find your statements on dv to be less than credible and potentially harmful to hbeezee's future.

[Craig]

hbeezee, I'd say that being supportive of your gf without confronting her about the e-mail would be a good thing to do. I would guess that she is going through a period of hard thinking and it isn't about whether she wants to be with you or the ex. I think the guy has triggered something in her that has disturbed her greatly and she wants to "get better" for herself and quite possibly/probably for you.

 

I think she will come back to you, be quite angry about her ex and probably vow never to have any contact with him ever again.

 

Best wishes.

[Sevenmack]

Actually Craig, it's more than just one article -- note that I said the Sontag article is a great first place to start; perhaps reading glasses are in order for you -- and more than just one woman. But I don't think everyone on this thread wants to be bored by an intramural spatfest. But your opinion about my credibility really doesn't matter; I simply made my thoughts known as you have done and as others have done. And last I checked, none of us, especially you, have offered ourselves up as credentialed psychiatrists, psychologists or clinical therapists. All we offer are our experiences and knowledge and that's it. For those who are seeking real help -- as I've suggested in my posts -- they need to go offline and seek therapy.

 

Last I checked, this is a community of people working out personal issues. Loveshack is built for that purpose; the heavy lifting of long-term therapy has to be done elsewhere. Maybe you have issues that need some of that heavy lifting and you should take some time to do that. Have a nice day.

[Craig]

Actually Craig, it's more than just one article -- note that I said the Sontag article is a great first place to start; perhaps reading glasses are in order for you -- and more than just one woman. But I don't think everyone on this thread wants to be bored by an intramural spatfest. But your opinion about my credibility really doesn't matter; I simply made my thoughts known as you have done and as others have done. And last I checked, none of us, especially you, have offered ourselves up as credentialed psychiatrists, psychologists or clinical therapists. All we offer are our experiences and knowledge and that's it. For those who are seeking real help -- as I've suggested in my posts -- they need to go offline and seek therapy.

 

Last I checked, this is a community of people working out personal issues. Loveshack is built for that purpose; the heavy lifting of long-term therapy has to be done elsewhere. Maybe you have issues that need some of that heavy lifting and you should take some time to do that. Have a nice day.

 

Ah, Sevenmack, apparently I've struck a nerve. I may not use the vocabulary or the techniques that you need to boost your fragile ego but I do know bullshyt when I see it.

 

DV is a serious issue and not something that can be reduced to a few sentences like you tried to do. Saying that abuse is "comfortable" to the survivors is ridiculous. Saying that "many abused women are drama queens" is inane. Saying that "They as much thrive on the drama of the abuse as they do on the abuse itself" is complete misinformation and shows that you don't know anything about abuse at all. Period. End of story.

[LN8840K]

I think " most " DV victims enjoy the drama .. if that was not the case why do so many just keep picking someone who abuses them or stay with the same abuser ? It's a very simple question

 

If I have a dog that continualy bites me I will get rid of the dog or quit bitching about it biting me.

[Craig]

I think " most " DV victims enjoy the drama .. if that was not the case why do so many just keep picking someone who abuses them or stay with the same abuser ? It's a very simple question

 

If I have a dog that continually bites me I will get rid of the dog or quit bitching about it biting me.

You have a fairly common point of view regarding dv survivors but it simply isn't that simple.

 

If your interest is genuine and you want to learn more about DV and DV survivors, why they stay, why they sometimes chose SO's that abuse them and so on have a look at some DV sites where survivors talk about their experiences. Learn about the cycle of violence and how that plays a part in why survivors stay with an abuser either too long or forever.

[JCA]

When I have confronted her, she gets defensive. So I think unless I get some kind of better feeling about anything, then it is going to be over.

 

I wish I could tell her I read the emails... if I do that, then I definatly know there is no chance for the future... even if she does get closure.

 

You definitely need to be straight up with her. You are doing exactly what she is doing to you - hiding something and being dishonest. I agree that it could be over; if you continue to keep this dishonesty between you - you are right. If you both just be straight up you could get beyond this - her by exploring her feelings as to why she is contacting him again and you'll feel 10 times better once you confess that you read her e-mail.

 

the reason she gets defensive is because she has something to hide and she doesn't want to divulge it. Once you show her that you know the truth, she'll freak out - as a smoke-screen to hide what she's been doing wrong - but then you guys can seriously talk and put this behind you.

 

Good luck!

[LN8840K]

save yourself some time my brother ......... .

 

" So I think unless I get some kind of better feeling about anything, then it is going to be over. "

 

It's not going to happen

[LN8840K]

Thanks for the advice Craig ........ I don't understand why I keep picking psycho women, who like to pay me back for every wrong ever done to them by a man since their conception .... but I do .....I guess if you see the injuries, it's easier to say why don't you just leave.