"how do i pursue his proclaimed 'interest' in this particular situation?"

[mememememe]

Ok so i will start by saying that my main issue in relationships/dating has been my PASSIVE AGGRESSIVE behavior. so i will state some facts for the record before asking for advice on my latest and greatest challenge:

 

so, all for the record: first i will not be modest, and i will tell you that i am a knockout. however i have never dated on looks alone; there have been downright ugly guys, models, grunge, rock, pretty...whoever i found attractive on the inside. so while at first i know my looks are really intimidating, most guys see that i don't judge others. and F looks, i could go through my car window tomorrow. anyway, my point is, i know my looks play a role in my dating obviously. second, i am seemingly extremely confident....but i suffer from severe fear of rejection and anxiety of emotional seperation because my mom was very abusive growing up. i am working SO SO hard on my issues. third, i am very outgoing and nice to all people. i will talk to anyone who is interesting or half-way decent. guys have told me i am a hard read based on all of this. they see that i treat everyone the same and they try to match all of the above together. so.........here is my story, i hope the above equips you all for some good responses....

 

two weeks ago i was at an event and i caught this very handsome guy staring at me from afar. he made it a point to come my way and give me his card so i could attend other events. i figured he was probably nice, but because i know he models i figured he was pretty heavy into that little scene...which didn't bother me, but i usually date more worldly guys and i didn't go out of my way to talk to him. however, as i think everyone is special and has their own story to tell, he and i began talking later on in the evening and we surprised eachother. he found out i was beyond the "scene" and i found the same in him. however a couple people had made negative comments about him and i had only just met all of them. but comments can be made out of jealousy, i have had it happen to me. so, he and i hung out for a couple of hours and i had a great time with him. we exchanged numbers, but i later heard he had a gf so i dismissed the whoooollllleee thing. i don't get involved in that sh.t.

 

i ran into him at the same place a week later. he was really staring me down this time, and i went over and said hello. he looked very very intersted in me. by the way, he doesn't drink or do drugs at all (what he proclaims). i socialized with other people, but for some reason, this time seeing him, i felt butterflies and i just wanted to leave the place with him and go somewhere else, more quiet. he told me he wanted to leave and invited me with him....so i gladly did. we spent the whole night talking at a lounge and had breakfast at a diner. we held hands and were smitten in conversation and flirting. at the end of the night, we just said goodbye. he sent me a text that morning saying it was a pleasure spending time with me and couldn't wait to see me again. we never once discussed whether he did or didn't have a gf. he seems pretty direct, too....if i had to guess, they are on the rocks??

 

so, i responded to his text and suggested we get togher, and i left him a voicemail. i later got a text saying that he wanted to say hi...the next morning i got a text saying that he couldn't sleep because he couldn't stop thinking about me....but at this point, why wouldn't he call? too nervous? i mean, he's very handsome and outgoing...then again, i am pretty and outgoing and nervous as hell and NO one would ever suspect it because i am good at masking my insecurities. kind of sad but it's my defense mech.

 

so.....i sent him a this weekend asking where he was, and he told me where. then he left me a voicemail saying where he was. i finally went to meet him, but the whole time i was going i was getting REALLY insecure and thikning i was just impeding upon him because I was the one who suggested plans. i was caught up in why he didn't suggest them...so one of my questions is, in his mind was he suggesting a get together with his texts?? did i do the right thing? well, to continue, we hung out all night again, and this time his guy friend was with us. we had a good time, hoever i was really self-conscious this time for some reason, because i am really really really liking him. it put me on the defense and i wasn't as fun as usual because i was so nervous. however all in all, it was ok, he friend, i think, had the hots for me, so if anything that will help my shot with him. he sent me another text after that.

 

so, obviously he has put his interest out there, but why isn't he calling or pursuing plans? to what extent should i pursue making plans? i'm leaving the whole gf thing out of it because it's none of my biz and he should do the right thing -- either way, i'll know if he doesn't! i mean, he held my hand in public and treated me like someone he was dating! anyone could have seen it given our social setting those times...

 

i feel like he is putting out bait with the texts, but not following through. why the F am i so nervous??? i am questioning everything right now. i hate that he has made me so nervous. how forward should i be with him, and how much effort should i put in? how do i pursue a guy like this? i know he likes me a lot...but i am afraid it will just be another let down. i want to spend every minute getting to know him and it has been eons since i felt like this, it almost hurts the chemistry is so strong.

 

guys, help??

[SMHappyface]

Guys can be insecure too. Just because he converses with models a lot doesn't mean he doesn't get nervous if he likes a hot girl. He could be doing three times - 1, he's just a player; 2, he's playing a game to keep you hopping and will call later; 3, he has no initiative and is waiting for you to call. If you're as hot as you say you are, he may not have the guts. The plan you should play (and I believe works for most guys) is to be available, but not pushy. If he text'd you/called you last, there is nothing wrong with returning the favor in a slight, casual way. The one thing you must NOT do is call him over and over if he hasn't called back or text him multiple times without a response. If he DOES have feelings for you, any little encouragement will solicite a response. If he is THAT nervous, do you really want THAT much of a spineless puppet? And if he is a player, move on chica!

[mememememe]

that makes sense; sadly enough i'm intimidated by his looks and what seem to be some of his accomplishments at a young age.

 

he doesn't seem nervous with me, maybe he is, but i hope he's not playing a game. i was really surprised that after all of his text messages, he never called to make a plan. maybe he's sorting things out in his relationship and deciding what to do? he can't have both and i can tell he wouldn't date 2 girls at once, so i'm assuming he is making some tough decision...that is the vibe i am getting...

 

it's funny how we can be soooooo confident, then just WHEW out the window when we like someone! you would think i was goofy himself the way i felt with him last.

 

i have also heard that nerves are indicative of chemistry? is this true?

[SMHappyface]

There are many indications of chemistry. You can have stomach cramps from chemistry and from the flu, so saying the only reason for nerves is chemistry is a bit untrue. However, being nervous is very natural when you like somebody. You aren't conscious of how you act around a guy you don't like, but with one you do, you notice everything and before you know it, you are a giant ball of nerves spazzing out with random electrical pulses, lol. The one thing you haven't factored is how HE feels - until you KNOW this, you can't really judge if he's into you, I mean, you haven't even really dated yet. Play it cool and you'll find out sooner or later.

[mememememe]

wouldn't that mean he is interested? he sent me a text saying that he can't stop thinking about me and can't wait to see me again. and he went out of his way to hang out with me twice this week...

 

but i will take your advice and play it cool. i don't need to be contacting him. this is the problem i run into with men, though; i either don't call enough or i call too much. WTF?

 

how do i know if i'm being passive or aggressive???...or both???

 

at least, i can say right now, he and i seem to be on the same page...but i'm still confused as to what he wants from me. i also may be giving him way too much credit, as i usually do with men.

[Outcast]

It's turnabout. Or psalm and response. He calls, you call. He texts, you text. If you're offering 32 responses to one psalm you're overdoing it.

[mememememe]

i feel silly -- DUH, you are right, it is a simple turnabout. i don't need to worry about taking the initiative...i'll keep it simple...he texted me this morning, i sent one back. haven't heard since, and if i don't, well, simple.....he is not interested. i suggested a get together in my last text, so he can't say he doesn't know i'm interested.

[mememememe]

so yesterday i got text from him just saying hello...and i replied, suggesting we get together for lunch...obviously he was sleeping all day for his night job, but he didn't call or text when he would wake up -- about 10pm...

 

so i get yet another text from him at 4am which is like 12noon for him. it simply said he was sorry he didn't get back to me earlier, he "just charged his phone" (come on, he didn't have to even give an excuse) and that i should text or call him today to get together and that he "wants to hear my voice"...

 

i don't know about this guy. for one thing, our schedules are totally off and he is not really making an effort to contact me at a time where we ARE both awake. also, i don't like communicating only through text messages. so impersonal.

 

i have decided to just cut the whole idea off. if he actually invites me out and it iis a time that works for me, i'll go. besides that, i don't have time for little texting back and forth games, especially since i don't even know if he has a girlfriend or not, etc. he can ask me out on a proper date, i deserve that much...

 

so for now, i'm not going to respond to his suggestion that I text or call HIM; why can't he do it? if he is bold enough to say things like " I really want to hear your voice" and "I really want to see you again", then he can be bold and man enough to ask me on a proper date.

[latefragment]

meme,

 

yeah sounds like this dude is being way lame. sounds exactly like the guy i was seeing. sort of half-assed attempt to contact me and get together, but when we got together, he was all staring me down, predatory, like he was just after one thing.

 

unfortunately, i made the mistake of sleeping with him after a month of this (during this first month he actually invite me on real dates involving food, alcohol, and/or entertainment, whereby he paid 60-65% of the time - that was the most i let him pay because i'm kind of particular about that kind of thing). after we sleep together, he continues the half-assed contact thing, which maybe wouldn't have bothered me had we not slept together, but i felt like hey, i gave it up, what gives?

 

because i have the same hangups that fun2bme has, after sleeping together the half-assed contact thing really f**ked with my mind (for normal people it wouldn't but i have those insecure things, i have very little dating experience and a lot of serial monogamy experience, which is vastly different from casual dating experience) so i blew up at him. bad news. scared him off. i read your posts on fun's thread so i know you relate. it sucked having him dump me. YUCK. it was pretty sudden, and kind of in a mean way. YUCK.

 

to make a long story short i think this model guy you are dating sounds hot but he is not making an effort to contact you. this could be because:

 

1) he wants to take it reeeeaaalllllyyyyyy sloooooooooooowwww because he is busy or dating other people or whatever. he totally does like you but wants to keep his options open and also just get to know you. if you are ok with keeping *him* on *your* back burner then reply to his texts, but just wait a day or two to do so, don't be so eager to give him a same-day reply. if you don't want to be taking it slow like he is, then NC of course.

2) or he could just really be not interested and stringing you a long for sh*ts and giggles. in which case, NC.

 

if i were you i'd go with option 1. i think that is the most plausible. i think he does like you, he's just occupied. that is how the guy that i dated operated. he was very interested in me but he had a lot of other things going on so i think he wasn't prepared to make a full-on effort to see each other. i didn't mind so much before we slept together but after we slept together it hurt. also, i don't think sleeping with him was necessarily a mistake, it was my insecure blow-up, crying, getting angry that did it.

 

so if i were you i know how it feels to really like someone after ou've gone like, 1 year without meeting anyone cool. it totally sucks when they are being half-assed. i say totally play it cool with this guy, give him back what he gives you. with this kind of guy, the cooler you can play it, the more he'll want you. the guy i dated was SO into me at the beginning, probably because i wasn't very interested in him (yet).

[clynn]

however a couple people had made negative comments about him and i had only just met all of them. we exchanged numbers, but i later heard he had a gf so i dismissed the whoooollllleee thing. i don't get involved in that sh.t.

 

we never once discussed whether he did or didn't have a gf. he seems pretty direct, too....if i had to guess, they are on the rocks??

 

i'm leaving the whole gf thing out of it because it's none of my biz and he should do the right thing -- either way, i'll know if he doesn't....

 

Why oh why oh why? Haven't you asked him if he has a girlfriend. ???

 

Yes - it IS your business!!! If he is stating romantic interest in you and you have been out on dates with him,....then asking him if he has a girlfriend - especially when you've already Heard that he does - is perfectly acceptable.

 

In fact, I hate to suggest this....but do you think you're avoiding asking the question because you don't want to hear the answer ?

 

You must ask him this question.

 

Also, people said negative comments about him. I know that you can't always judge what others say about someone - but it is indeed to be taken under advisement, nonetheless.

 

And no matter how he seems (direct, truthful, honest, exciting, interesting)...you are only just barely getting to know him.

 

Do you really want to be going out with a guy who has a girlfriend? Why are you?

[jdubinva]

You sound really self-involved and then it doesn't matter how attractive you are, you can still be a turn-off for a guy. Do you show interest in him, in things outside of your sphere? I've dated lots of women who would be considered pretty but if their personality is just lame then the fascination with the looks fades fast.

 

By the way, the worst are good looking women who are very smart but lack social skills. They overanalyze everything to the point that having a normal conversation is painful. So, that's for the books...

[mememememe]

Enough with these replies that indicate no reading straight through the post!

 

First of all, I will not "be involved" with a guy with a gf. There has NOT yet been an opportune time to ask yet, but last night I got the full story which I will post here.

 

Second, to jdubinva, no SH.T. I could care less about my looks, I was SIMPLY stating the facts and even said that I could go through a windshield! YES i have shown him inteterst. Please!

 

Anyway, I went out on a date with him last night. NO, we haven't even kissed and we've been out a few times. I like to get the full story first. We chatted for 6 hours until they kicked us out of the lounge we were at because they were closing. I found out that he does NOT have a gf any longer, he DID, and she was threatening to hurt herself when he was leaving. He hasn't had any contact with her in a couple of months. She is in his circle of friends, that's all. I'm still weary of the situation, though, he did bring it up like 10 times. At least he talked about it.

 

BESIDES all of that, I don't know if i'm interested in him anymore. As I mentioned in other posts, the guys I have dated have been ugly, models, whatever....I am always attracted to insides first and barely even notice the outside. That's just how I am. That is why men have a hard time figuring me out, I think, because I see everyone on the same playing field and there are so many superficial mother-ckers out there. I think this guy, though nice, may be a little superficial. I didn't care about hte fact that he is a working model and into the night scene, he doesn't use drugs or drink. However, he seems to have over-confidence and I kept finding contradictions in our conversation. And, I pointed them out to him repeatedly. I don't think he has ever had a woman tell him no or correct him!!! I was barely saying aynthin the whole time, and it was weird b/c i usually don't shut up.

 

For another thing, he mom and him have this seemingly oedipal thing going on. She is young (40!!) and hot and likes to party with him all of the time. She even stays over his place sometimes. He is also only 22 and I'm 27. He's from another country and have an interesting life experience, so at first he seemed beyond his years. But now, after our conversation last night, I feel a bit too old for him. Certain things I am focused on he hasn't even paid thought to yet. I don't know, it's a little disappointing and I WAS extremely attracted to him, but after our conversation I don't know.

 

We'll see!

 

and, please, to people posting here, enough with the stupid, "just because you are good-looking blah blahblahbljhablja" crap -- I didn't write it to get off on it, I wrote all the details to give you a better idea. just because i wrote it doesn't mean i think i'm better! try reading the WHOLE post to get an idea for my personality first instead of sidtracking this thread! thank you!

[whichwayisup]

There is no point in pursuing this guy as he has a girlfriend. Rocky relationship or not, he's seeing someone else.

 

I'd back off, leave him alone and then if he calls or text messages you, then take that opportunity to tell him that you don't get involved with men who have girlfriends already. And if you really DO like him, and he likes you, when and if that relationship ends then that is the time to be pursuing him.

 

Just my 2 cents...

[mememememe]

He Doesn't Have A Girlfriend. They Broke Up. They Have The Same Friends.

[whichwayisup]

Ok sorry.

 

DO you want to go with a guy who just broke up with his girlfriend? I mean, how long ago did they break up...

[clynn]

Hi memememmee,

 

Actually, I did read through the post and I tailored my answer accordingly.

To me, what seemed to me the big issue (to begin with) was to find out whether or not he has a gf. Sounds like he doesn't, so should be a green light situation.

 

Regardless, it all seems for naught now as you don't seem very interested in him.

 

So, carry on - good luck with the next guy!

[Lishy]

Ahem just a question ..... What has your looks got to do with anything? You are digging people for mentioning what YOU wrote.

 

so, all for the record: first i will not be modest, and i will tell you that i am a knockout

 

Quite a statement, and totally un-neccassary relating to your problem. That is why people are mentioning it! And I can say without predjudice that you are totally passive/aggressive!!

 

Regarding your problem I would not contact the guy again, NEVER mention meeting him again - Let HIM chase YOU. You have let him know you are interested, he has proven he isnt that shy, let him work for his dinner now!

 

Good luck!

[jdubinva]

"I could care less about my looks, I was SIMPLY stating the facts and even said that I could go through a windshield!"

 

 

Yes, you could, but that's the benefit of airbags - no pun intended!

[mememememe]

alright, valid points made. don't know why i thought that it was necessary to comment on certain things, but i did....

 

well right now i'm really disappointed in myself! i have brought myself almost below his level i feel like.

 

you know when there is something about the person that just makes you..........angry but you have no reason to be angry? i felt this slightly with him. after my last post, we were texting back and forth (again mostly just texting and why not talking?)

 

so i let him know where i would be last night, and he came to meet me. we kind of hopped around and i had a lot to drink last night....bad move #1.

 

i felt this vibe from him, this time even stronger, that he is really self-involved. the first few times i met him, i got such a different feeling -- i thought he was worth talking to, and i felt butterflies and amazing feelings. but, after our last few times together, it just doesn't feel "right".

 

so anyway, last night we went from place to place to socialize and he was there but not "there". in the back of my head, of course, was his story about his "ex"girlfriend. he said that she is still hopefull they will get back together. hmmmmm i mean if something is over, it's over, right? so he is kind of stand-offish with me last night or maybe i was too intoxicated and i was making stuff up in my head. i don't know. but all of the sudden i just felt very mad at him.

 

i think one thing that upset me was him telling me that one of his friends said that i looked "easy" because i talk to a lot of people. first, i am the farthest thing from easy, and second, i thought it was rude he would even say that to me. so that boiled my blood...and the friend who said it was out last night and it made me mad.

 

*****so basically the whole time we were together i felt like he had somewhere else to be. when we parted ways at the end of the night, i called him to tell him that certain roads were blocked off and it was taking me forever to get home. he didn't pick up; but he sent me a text that said, "sorry i missed your call i was in the shower".......i have a suspicion for some reason that he lives with his "ex" gf...he has only texted me at certain hours when he gets home. so, i called him right after his text.........and he didn't pick up. so, he called me back....from the lobby! i was like, "why can't you call me from your place" he was like, "oh what are you insinuating -- i'm going to get a bite to eat i don't have food here"....i thought that was odd. what i also found odd, and now i was putting 2 and 2 together, was that a week before, he said he couldn't invite me up to his place because his mother was staying with him...because he was helping her with some things....but why would his mom be staying with HIM if her own apartment is like 20 min away? i found that to be odd. and, she has a car, so why would she do that? i am getting the feeling i don't know the whole story...what do you think??

 

i'm sorry this is so incoherent and distorted -- i'm on hardly any sleep and can't think straight. i'm really pissed that i have wasted any time, and i don't want to question myself in my actions. i sent him a text message that said "i think you should be a little less self-involved" -- maybe it made no sense to him, but it was the overall feeling i had. i actually had the nerve to think i should call and apologize this morning. i also sent him one saying that "your friend has a really big mouth" regarding the guy who made that comment about me. i feel childish for sending those texts.

 

something just isn't adding up here. i feel like i have put myself below him, and that is not a good feeling. he either still lives with this girl, or she stays there, i don't know. but i feel intuitive about it.

 

thoughts? again, i will try to mak e my next post more coherent.

[latefragment]

hi meme!

 

i still stick with what i said in my last post to you, which is, i think this guy totally has other stuff going on and he is just "seeing what's out there" and he DOES like you, but he's also otherwise occupied. he's definitely not "all there" to be with you, and i think that you should totally just keep him on your back burner, if at all.

 

i think you're right to be suspicious that he doesn't call you from home and only texts you. that's crazy. no guy that i know texts a girl that he wants to date.

 

i TOTALLY relate to you on when you suddenly start to get angry at someone and you don't know why. i have totally had that happen before. it's just hard for me to figure out if it's my instincts kicking in or if i'm just getting crazy and angry for no reason (because of baggage). this type of reaction due to baggage has really f**cked things up for me before.

 

it sounds like you don't like him anymore, so that's a good thing. he does seem a little young (though i always go for the young guys, i like it when they are a few years younger). if i were you i'd just back off for maybe a week, and see how you feel. just chill out. you can answer his texts if you want to ... but definitely don't suggest meeting him.

[mememememe]

i think that when you get "angry" inside or outside, for no REAL apparent reason, it is more of an instinct kicking in than anything else. last night i did have too much to drink....but the night before, i didn't have a sip of alcohol and we spent 7 hours talking, and I felt similar feelings of disappointment in his seemingly self-involved persona.

 

i guess i am pissed and giving this so much thought because i really want to find a guy to date. it's been over a year since i really felt anything close to what i thought i felt when i met him.

 

i think that i should use my instincts about him....if he is interested, he should call and not text, even if he is busy. granted, he did make an effort by spending 7 hours with me just talking. but something is pissing me off and i don't know what -- and i know i should probably walk away, but i want to "get to the bottom of this" as rediculous as it sounds.

 

i definitely will not suggest plans or anything. it's easier to send a text than make a phone call, and i haven't really felt much of an effort from this guy. and when we DO talk, it's about him or what is going on around him in his little scene. i think this guy is used to getting whatever he wants. he certainly acts like it.

 

i mean, it is also the little things -- such as when we were eating out the other night, i needed a knife........and instead of him getting up immediately, he just kind of sat there talking. finally i was geting up to get it and he stopped me and did it for me. he is not "tuned" into me -- i think he is tuned into my image, my persona (i tend to be a hard one to figure out and i guess it intrigues guys) and possibly watching other people watch me. i suppose it should clue me in that his "ex" is a top model who is a knockout. maybe he is just after looks? according to him, he wants more than that. but maybe he has himself fooled. i mean, his whole world revolves around image.

 

also, he is "over-confident" with stuff. almost has a wall up. it confuses me and it reminds me of this ahole i once dated 6 years ago.

 

in addition, he doesn't get along with his dad and it seems he may be a momma's boy. not to generalize, but most of the "momma's boys" i have dated were borderline abusive and didn't know how to treat women.

 

so basically i know i am wasting my time with him, i feel like an idiot because last night i let him know that i let him get the best of me. like calling him right after we parted ways and telling him i was disappointed that he kind of just "left me". i know he got off on knowing that he got to me.

 

al in all this is not a guy who will go the mile by chasing me. according to him, he doestn' even CALL girls -- he likes them to chase HIM. and, he's got a bevy of models apparently waiting to do so. so no matter how amazing i may be or someone else may be, it's not going to make a dent in his brain because he will always have someone else waiting for him in the wings -- like his"ex" who he has told me all about and said she went suicidal on him. he said he is scared to tell her they will never ever be together again because he is scared of what she will do to herself -- but that he knows it's over. whatever.

 

so i guess when you get all anrgy for "no reason" sometimes it is your intuition knocking HARD.

 

what do you think?

[mememememe]

i am hanging on to this whole stupid tihng because i am infatuated with attraction to him. i am sooooooooooooooooooooooooooo attracted to him, and it is something that is coming from the inside of him as well, i can't explain it.

 

i thikn if i can get over my overwhelming attraction it will be easier. i haven't even kissed this guy yet!

 

also, things seemed so GREAT the first few times we hung out -- what the hell happpened???? i just want it to be what i thought it was the first few times we spent time togetehr. he was SUCH a gentleman and i had such good vibes.

[clynn]

i think that when you get "angry" inside or outside, for no REAL apparent reason, it is more of an instinct kicking in than anything else.

 

so i guess when you get all anrgy for "no reason" sometimes it is your intuition knocking HARD.

 

what do you think?

 

I agree! You're very smart, intuitively - right from the beginning you seemed pretty unsettled about this guy. This doesn't mean there can't be beginning of relationship jitters and all that - but you seemed suspicious of his behavior off the bat.

 

also, things seemed so GREAT the first few times we hung out -- what the hell happpened???? i just want it to be what i thought it was the first few times we spent time togetehr. he was SUCH a gentleman and i had such good vibes.

 

But you didn't really, did you? I mean he seemed like a gentleman on one hand. On the other, you were questioning whether or not he had a girlfriend, .... why he was texting you.....why you initiated meetings.....

 

You sound too good for this self centred, egotistical arrogant, selfish (and very shallow) guy!

[mememememe]

what is grossest to me (i posted on the thread titled "the game of love - with a narcissist) is his narcisissm.

 

of all the things he told me, (in his many rambling stories making himself look heroic) i heard the following:

 

1) he changed his ex's life. he made her pull a 180 and now all of the other guys want her because of the amazing changes he made.

 

2) he went to a psychic and got the truth about his ex...and all of the lies she was telling about her sexual past.

 

3) one day he decided to throw her out because he couldn't take the "lies"....in his mind about how many men she slept with.

 

4) at least 3 stories of guys that he beat the crap out of, including a restaurant patron, and cab driver and his mother's boyfriend.

 

5) how his ex loved to spend $$ on him. and that she cut her wrists when he threatened to leave her...and that he is scared she will kill herself if he tells her he will never be with her again.

 

6) kept telling me to make conversation...even though he was cutting me off and talking about things i couldn't even try to make conversation about because they were so stupid and trivial.

 

7) i could barely concentrate on the rest of the bs that came out of his mouth but there was a lot.

 

ugh i'm just annoyed i wasted time with him. at least it only took a few dates with no physical contact for me to realize he is a captial Narcissist and has issues. these people can be tough to spot....but the key is that they never are able to really connect emotionally in a conversation. everything is VERY surface. i have met several characters like this in the past, and these people are virtually invisible. there is no PERSON, there is only a facade. you fall in love with the facade and NEVER meet the person...because there is none. these people don't ask how you are, how was your day, what are YOU doing....they talk about themselves as well as what you SHOULD do. f-ed up. i have met 2 women like this, and at least 3 men...scary sh.t, i'll say that much. i don't think these people even have souls...it may sound like i am overreacting but i got flashes of people i have met before when i looked at him. he doesn't even really have eyes, he has these black holes...weird!!!!!!!!!! hopefully i won't hear from him again.