Judas Christian Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 My wife and I are from different countries and, sometimes, different worlds. We differ on alot of things, so compromise is a must for us moreso than many relationships, because we have to factor in cultural differences. She's from the UK and I'm from the States. She has a couple of male friends who she's known for years (much longer than I've known her) and her relationship with them is very platonic. It's very common for her to "cuddle" them, for instance. When we watch Cheaters on television (if you're not familiar with that show then you may not understand), there are often scenes on video where the cheater and their illicit boyfriend/girlfriend are huggy and walk down the street arm-in-arm, hand-in-hand, etc, and it obviously bothers the person being cheated on, but she'll say "see, I would walk down the street with so-and-so (one of the two guy friends) like that and it wouldn't mean anything." Coming to the point, I'm not used that sort of relationship at all, so it bothers me thinking about her cuddling with these other guys. Her feeling on it is more or less that I'll just have to adjust. I'm big on self-help right now - I have negative things about myself that I am always wanting to change and maybe this is one of them. So my question for you all is - do you cuddle with the opposite sex while dating or married to a significant other, and if so or if not, why? Help me understand and also help me to see what's normal and what isn't. That's what I'm trying to figure out. If I'm silly for it bothering me, I want to change it. If I'm not, then I need to know that. Please help - both sexes are welcome to comment, I need all sides of this.
westernxer Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 Her cuddling with them is not a cultural difference. It's disrespectful. I mean, she is supposed to be your wife. Do not trust her male friends.
ReluctantRomeo Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 So my question for you all is - do you cuddle with the opposite sex while dating or married to a significant other, and if so or if not, why? Help me understand and also help me to see what's normal and what isn't. The cuddling sounds highly suspect to me. And most of my growing up was done in the UK. I'd say it wasn't ok. Particularly if you don't like it.
lilmoma1973 Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 Her cuddling with them is not a cultural difference. It's disrespectful. I mean, she is supposed to be your wife. Iam sorry if this makes you mad Judas but you gave me some great advice and so appreciated it !! But i have to draw the line with what you are saying i don't think this should be acceptable and it is disrepectful and if my h was doing this he would be gone and be with those Platonic friends!!!
JadeStar Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 This is just speculation here, but IMO it would seem to me its highly possible she has just told you that this is one of her cultural differences. Just so it will justify what it is shes doing. I just find that odd. Jade
morrigan Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 So it may not mean anything in your wife's point of view. What's disrespectful is that you told her that it bothers you and she blithely expects you to tolerate it. After this long of time, I doubt she's going to stop behaving this way with her friends. If you accepted it while dating her, she will expect you to accept it married to her.
slubberdegullion Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 What's disrespectful is that you told her that it bothers you and she blithely expects you to tolerate it. Morrigan nailed it. Regardless of cultural differences, IMHO it's more important to respect your partner's wishes than to be held slavishly to some sort of cultural paradigm. This would not, of course, be applicable to anything that smacks of abuse.
LucreziaBorgia Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 she'll say "see, I would walk down the street with so-and-so (one of the two guy friends) like that and it wouldn't mean anything. She may not think it means anything, but I'm sure it isn't a meaningless to them. Some women can be very flirtatious but if the guy is in the 'friend guy' category no amount of flirting is going to have the same sort of meaning for her as it does you. You perceive a potential threat, she doesn't (at least we will assume that there is NOTHING going on with these guys, nor was there ever - if there was, then it becomes a different sort of thing). Regardless of this - if she cannot and worse yet - refuses to agree to some sort of compromise your choices are severely limited: adapt to her ways, or leave the relationship. So my question for you all is - do you cuddle with the opposite sex while dating or married to a significant other, and if so or if not, why? Nope. I don't do the 'flirt/cuddle with the friend guy' thing. It sends mixed messages, and ends up in some serious mindf*cking usually.
Author Judas Christian Posted November 17, 2005 Author Posted November 17, 2005 Thank you all so far, I feel a bit less out-of-touch. Keep responding though, people, because I want a solid panel to stand on here. I'm a bit of a logical person and so yes, pathetic though it may sound, I will read over these and think "x out of y people say it's not healthy." Keep 'em coming!
lilmoma1973 Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 Nope. I don't do the 'flirt/cuddle with the friend guy' thing. It sends mixed messages, and ends up in some serious mindf*cking usually. Me either Lucrezia can make them think that it means something sexual and that can be bad for your relatioship and someone ends up getting hurt!!!
Scottstina Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 J, I would feel extremely disrespected if this was done to me. And it's not very thoughtful of her to keep doing it even though she knows it bothers you. I believe that if you are in any type of exclusive relationship, you keep the cuddling to yourselves. I mean, giving a hug to greet or say goodbye to friends is one thing, but blatant flirtatious, cuddly stuff is just wrong. Have you asked her how she'd feel if the shoe were on the other foot?? Probably not very good.... s.t.
Tangerina Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 I deffinitely don't think from your story that she means any disrespect to you or that cuddling means anything to her or anything like that, but I do agree with others here that the real question is what are each of you comfortable with in the relationship... I was in a situation like this recently where my BF asked if it was ok to cuddle his female friends and I was kind of wishy washy, because I do trust him, but then I felt really bad because I wasn't owning up to the fact that it did make me uncomfortable... so I called him and told him that and felt a lot better... at the same time it really is fine with me if he has a quick snuggle (nothing PG-13 or anything, just like and extended arm around the shoulder or whatever) with old friends where that is an accepted platonic pattern... I have a group of male friends... like best friends... that I have always gone skinny dipping with and it is not a sexual thing, we are just kinda all hippies at heart and it is kind of like a special thing we share... I didn't want this to be wierd for my BF who is relatively new in my life, so we talked about it and he knows all these guys and has even been along so it is fine with him... on the other hand, he said if I went skinny dipping with a new guy I met at school it would make him very jealous... so I would never do that (also don't think I would want to, but hmmmm)... haha, when we were first going out my BF and I and 2 of my female friends went skinny dipping after a hot day of work and he thought I was the best GF ever because I let him see my friends naked... I didn't even think twice about it because it is an accepted pattern in my life.... but if it had been some girls that I knew less well or felt threatened by, forget it!! HAHA, the point of this rambling is that you need to own up to how you feel even if you think it is dumb, because if you are like me you will feel bad if you don't... and the other point is that you need to talk about it from every angle because context is very important and an action that might feel non-threatening in one situation could feel horrible in another... ie my friend Kate, like one of my best friends, is CUDDLY! she cuddles everyone, and kisses them goodbye, it is not sexual, she is really affectionate... when she does this to my BF I don't bat an eye, because she moves right along and does it to me... but if this were a different friend, or someone I didn't know well, I would be PISSED!
witabix Posted November 17, 2005 Posted November 17, 2005 Well Judas I grew up in the UK, and this was not the normal behaviour I remember. I would also feel that it was odd. I have a female friend who carries on in a similar way. I always found it odd that she had so many close male friends and would cuddle with them etc. Then I had my eyes opened, I had split from g/f and was sitting in a bar, she came over and propostioned me, I was dumbfounded and appalled, she had a boyfriend who was a friend of mine! It has made me suspicious in the extreme of women who have 'platonic' male friends, I thought she was a platonic friend, but she had other ideas. Her assertion that you will have to adjust is fair enough. However you have to decide whether you want this kind of thing in your face or not. I would be very very uncomfortable, Westernxer hit it right on the head......DO NOT TRUST HER MALE FRIENDS!!!!!!!!!!!! Does she share time with these guys away from you? Who keeps the friendship up? Her or them?
Author Judas Christian Posted November 17, 2005 Author Posted November 17, 2005 Right now she's in the US with me, and the friends are in the UK, so it's really not an issue. I've met one of them, and I sincerely believe there's nothing "secret" going on here. However, that said, it's still an uncomfortable concept for me because I've never seen such a thing before. But, we may be immigrating to the UK in the future, and it's sure to become an issue, so I'm trying to figure out how to address it now. As for who keeps the friendships up, it seems to be kinda mutual. She doesn't see either of them often (not at all right now, obviously) and it may never be an issue anyway, who knows. The main point is that I've never come across a girl who cuddles a guy she's not "with" at that time, particularly if she's in a committed relationship, so it's difficult for me to get my head around it and I wanted to make sure I wasn't just some prude or fuddy-duddy.
mini696 Posted November 18, 2005 Posted November 18, 2005 I agree with the points already brought up in the above posts. It is very disrespectful to you. It may not mean anything to her (bull****, of course it does), and I bet it dos mean something to the other people. It also depends on how she is to you. If she does the same things, then it may be slightly easier to take, but she would want to do it a LOT more. Takl to her, and tell her it is unacceptable to you.
witabix Posted November 18, 2005 Posted November 18, 2005 Hey Judas, are we going out with sisters? I have never come across this before either. I know EXACTLY what you are on about. It feels really strange doesn't it? My g/f doesn't behave in the same way though, as far as I know that is. But this platonic friend thing is really hard to get your head around, no? I cannot feel comfortable with it, no matter how hard I try to rationalise it. I wouldn't mind so much but I am no teenager, I have a fair bit of experience behind me. You know what though? It depends on how much you are prepared to take for this woman. You must also remember that your uncomfortable feelings probably come from your lack of experience of this situation. At least that is how I have rationalised it to myself. I have decided that if she wants to be with me she will. If she doesn't she won't. But here is the crunch I think.... how much of this is about your self image? Do you feel she is disrespecting you? If I were brutally honest I would have to say that if my friends saw my g/f out with her platonic friend they would make an assumption. Based on that assumption they would change their opinion of me, and if I were honest I would say that that is something I would not want them to do. I am seen as a "hard man", not in the psycho sense, but a man who brooks no nonsense, stands up for himself, is totally honest and lets no one walk on him. Do you have this type of view of yourself, and do you see this view threatened by your SO's behaviour? If so you are facing the same choice as myself. I have decided that if some one disrespects me I will deal with it when and more importantly if it happens. In the meantime I will behave in a gentlemanly and dignified manner. You can never be at fault if you adhere to those principles. You only have to decide that your SO's behaviour is acceptable to you, or not. So I would say to you that if your SO's is not acceptable, tell her so. If she says that you put up or shut up, then lose her, if she doesn't respect you you have nothing. However do not ever force anything on her. If she has a different life view accept it and move on. Don't ever ever ever lose yourself in this. If you are not happy then do not do it.
Author Judas Christian Posted November 18, 2005 Author Posted November 18, 2005 This is the issue really - I don't want to force anything or come across as possessive, jealous or controlling, so I wanted to make sure I wasn't out of line for feeling the way I do about it. If I am, I want to change it. From the feedback I've gotten though, it sounds like I'm pretty normal in my feelings on it.
veronese Posted November 18, 2005 Posted November 18, 2005 Without knowing your wife's personality and character it's hard for anyone to accurately judge if her behaviour is unacceptable of suspicious. If she's always been like this and you were aware of it, it would have been better to have brought it up before. But even so, as relationships grow and develop, the rules and boundaries within them normally change as a result. The fact that she's been open about it is a good sign. But these friends shouldn't be "her" friends only. She shouldn't exclude you when she sees them. If she keeps them separate from you it is most definitely a problem. She shouldn't conceal or hide any communications or contact with them either. When platonic friendships contain an element of secrecy in them,it's because they aren't quite as platonic as they should be. The main thing though is that if it makes you feel uncomfortable you should say so and be honest. If you tell her calmly I can't see why she would have a problem with it. If you're niggly about it though she may not respond so well. She hasn't done anything wrong as far as you know, so don't approach her as if she has. Hopefully one chat will sort the problem out. It's not an unreasonable request and shouldn't be hard for her to respect. SHe loves you after all, doesn't she? Veron
flowergirl Posted November 18, 2005 Posted November 18, 2005 Judas: Your wife seems very disrespectul of you, and also a bulls***er. Part of the difference between a friendship and a romantic relationship in just about any culture is the type of physical contact involved, and in my opinion, cuddling is definitely reserved for romantic relationships. And the fact that you told her you didn't like it, and she didn't stop shows she has no regard for your feelings. You two need to have a serious talk, and if it doesn't change, you need to reevaluate your marriage. Good luck.
NYCmitch25 Posted November 18, 2005 Posted November 18, 2005 My wife and I are from different countries and, sometimes, different worlds. We differ on alot of things, so compromise is a must for us moreso than many relationships, because we have to factor in cultural differences. She's from the UK and I'm from the States. She has a couple of male friends who she's known for years (much longer than I've known her) and her relationship with them is very platonic. It's very common for her to "cuddle" them, for instance. When we watch Cheaters on television (if you're not familiar with that show then you may not understand), there are often scenes on video where the cheater and their illicit boyfriend/girlfriend are huggy and walk down the street arm-in-arm, hand-in-hand, etc, and it obviously bothers the person being cheated on, but she'll say "see, I would walk down the street with so-and-so (one of the two guy friends) like that and it wouldn't mean anything." Coming to the point, I'm not used that sort of relationship at all, so it bothers me thinking about her cuddling with these other guys. Her feeling on it is more or less that I'll just have to adjust. I'm big on self-help right now - I have negative things about myself that I am always wanting to change and maybe this is one of them. So my question for you all is - do you cuddle with the opposite sex while dating or married to a significant other, and if so or if not, why? Help me understand and also help me to see what's normal and what isn't. That's what I'm trying to figure out. If I'm silly for it bothering me, I want to change it. If I'm not, then I need to know that. Please help - both sexes are welcome to comment, I need all sides of this. Watching "cheaters" -- thats a British show thus she must be English ? Good thing she isn't French, she'd be practically making out with complete strangers. LOL. I really don't think we can answer the underlining question about her faithfullness but knowing yourself and your past relationships, can you guage whats going on? If you feel somewhat strongly that she is cheating on you then she probably is, but if you feel it's really platonic then I find little need to worry so much about it. Now, about you, it seems obvious that she's at least emotionaly 'cheating' you out of a level of intamcy by sharing it with these guys and it's impossible to know the reasons for this. Do you have the sometimes typical male wall of emotions which prevents you from being on that level or is it as simple as her just not investing it in you? Just some things to think about. Everyone has "negative things" they want to change, but it seems you are saying this as in you feel a little inferior ? I'm glad you are working towards correcting these feelings and one day you will be hopefully be the typical arrogant American that you should be. LOL. My feelings are that I can understand the concern because I had a similar experience when my now wife who would get phone calls from her "boy friends" because it seemed like it was relationship based (if that makes any bloody sense). She didn't seem like the "platonic friends" type and eventually she told me that the guy had strong feelings for her after he got a divorce. I tried to be cool with it all but it burned me up on the inside but I actually only tried to tell her that I felt that way and that I am not asking for her to change anything. That backfired because she handled it like "I'm the jealous type" when that wasn't the case at all. HOWEVER I wish I still had my "girlfriend" from college because she was a priceless close friend who I was honored to know. I would not only be her friend again I would be affectionate and spend time with just her if given the opportunity again. I actually wish I could have a close platonic female friend like this again because it fit my personality so well but it's almost impossible for other people to think you have platonic motives. In short, you know her, if it's *really* platonic, get over it. Note: a cheap way to "test the perverbial waters" would be to get a close gal pal -- if she is insane about that idea she's def. cheating (or thinking aboutit ). Trust me, it's a consistant as Einsteins Special theory! Good luck, thanks for sharing!
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