I don't know how I feel about these friends.

[Keeves1]

Hey!

I will talk about Alex, Nivek, Mark, Andrea and Mike. Mark is friend of Andrea. Andrea is Nivek's big sister. Mike is Nivek's little brother - Nivek, Mike and Andrea are in their same family. (All false names)

I'm not sure where I stand on friendships when it comes to Alex and Nivek. These are the main character. I'm hoping I could get your point of view by writing this.

Let's start with Alex. I've known him since I went on high school by a mutual friend. We used to go out and drink alot in our teenage years. I'm 1 year older than him. Once we got older we were drinking less and were hanging out casually like strolling around the city, watching movies, etc...

During one of my toughest moment in my life after the breakup Alex was the first person who knew all of the story even before my parents. He came over to my place and I could speak freely about it. After I told my story he of course supported me by telling me what I did right and wrong. He was listening and helping. He do not have a girlfriend and has not experienced a breakup. After that we hung out like we used to do, but I still had to vent to him and let out my thoughts. He was ignoring it everytime I just did not feel comfortable being around him.

He said; "We cannot always talk about your problems" and I answered: "true but you have not experience what I am going through and if I was in your shoes I would listen and help as much as I can as a friend" I just felt like he was helping me one time and that's it. That feeling I felt was true. We did not hang out after that. 

We had some conflict afterwards. Someday he sent me a message saying: "What's going on with you? You're not hanging out with me? fine just be miserable the whole life"

I answered: "It's nothing wrong with me. I'm not hanging out with you because I'm tired of always taking iniative to ask you to hang out. (Yes it's always been me) It would be nice if you could reciprocate." He did not took that well and kept being passive aggressive blaming me not being a man because I'm too sensitive. It was alot of text going back and forth and I suggested that we take the conversation on the phone which he agreed and it were much better in terms of the communication. He agreed to be better at asking me to hang out. 

After some weeks had past by I noticed that he kept he's word and asked me but I rejected it and then he became passive aggressive again saying: "What's wrong now? You told me to reciprocate and then you're not doing it?

I replied: "There is no need to be passive aggressive. To be honest with you it has been very cold lately and you know that." There was couple of weeks here in Norway that the busses and trams did not go because of the coldness (Yeah it was that intense) He said we could just relax on the mall but I refused saying it's boring. Other reason to why I rejected hanging out with him at that time was because I felt like I could only speak about positive things as he did not want to hear about my problems. I said that to him and he said "Fine let's meet when it's getting a bit warmer" I said "Yeah ofc!"

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now this is the Nivek part. Including Andrea, Mike and Mark.

Nivek supported me all the way during my breakup. He took me out to eat dinner with he's family, friends and just us two. We were together alot watching movies, trying different restaurant in Oslo, having game night at my apartment etc.. It helped me forget about Maria and I always felt good after he went home. I could also vent and say things I have in my thoughts without him being impatient or passive aggresive. He was not bothered as I did not vent to him everyday just to clarify. Both Alex and Nivek had breathing space. Nivek was the opposite to Alex. 

Nivek and our friend group is always playing almost everyday and we are playing the new Call of duty together. Recently he told me that he's not playing anymore because he has done all the challenges and find the game boring, I respected it and said that I'm on and if you ever feel like playing you can join us whenever. At that time Nivek were going through some issues with he's family. He communicated it with me openly and honest and said that it is why he's not online to play as much. He also said that he would explain to me what the reason behind the "Family issues" were when he is ready. I did not say anything but I do have an idea of what it is about. 

Here is when Nivek's brother comes in. Mike were also going through breakup the same time as me. Mike is arond 15 I think I'm not sure. He had been giving a note where he said that he could not send any messages to he's ex, visit her or call her. All contact has been limited by the police. Mike did not take the orders from police and they came one day at their home and took Mike and he's phone. Their mother and sister Andrea were crying. It was basically that Mike had worsened the situation by not listening to the police. It caused alot of trouble and issues in their family. 

Last time I saw Nivek was when I went to see my psychiatry as Nivek's workplace are near my therapist. I went on to say "Hey and see how it goes" He said: "everything is going fine now" and I did not notice any strange body language or anything in that realm. After my session with my therapist were over Nivek called and asked me if I was down to try a new asian restaurant. I said yes I would love to. He said great just wait outside my workplace and I will come with a car and pick you up. 

Nivek was with Andrea and Mark in the car. Andrea and Mark are good friends and it was them who had planned to visit the asian restaurant. Andrea (big sister) invited her brother Nivek to come along with them. Nivek thought of me and asked me to join. 

At the dinner we did not talk alot. He asked how I'm feeling and I said that I feel great. He responded to "I can tell"

Recently I have been playing with Nivek's little brother Mike. Even then Mike is a bit weird. He says he will play but then never comes on and never replies to me. The times we are playing are when Mike feels like it. I don't want to take it serious as he is a kid and it's not a big deal. During our game session I can hear the background of her mother and Andrea talking to each other alot. They are talking friendly to each other. No issues but even If I have an idea that it has to do with Mike there could be something more. I just don't know what it is, if that is the case...  Oh and Nivek are in he's own room and Mike is playing in the living room. 

I might be overthinking but the reason why I mention Nivek is that I'm sort of having a second thought. Is he saying he has family issues just because he does not want to hang out? 

What are your thought about the whole story? Are they good friends? 

Thank you for reading and best wishes,

Keeves 
 

[SlimShadysWife]

You're acting like a girlfriend, his girlfriend. Very needy and testy.

 

[MsJayne]

No offence intended here, just an honest answer. You sound very intense, and intense people can be quite demanding, and that often drives people away. Your friend Alex was honest with you, he found your constant need to talk about your problems draining. He's your friend, and he's been as supportive as any friend could be expected to, likewise for others who you feel are backing away. If your problems are big enough to warrant major ongoing discussions, perhaps see a counsellor or therapist rather than unloading on friends to the point where you're exhausting their sympathy. 

[Wiseman2]

Please continue therapy and especially keep addressing respecting the rights and feelings of others instead of demanding people do everything you want the way you want it. 

Edited February 8 by Wiseman2

[Keeves1]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

Please continue therapy and especially keep addressing respecting the rights and feelings of others instead of demanding people do everything you want the way you want it. 

Could you elaborate and show examples of that I want people to do everything for me? And how I'm not respecting feelings of others?

[Keeves1]

2 hours ago, MsJayne said:

No offence intended here, just an honest answer. You sound very intense, and intense people can be quite demanding, and that often drives people away. Your friend Alex was honest with you, he found your constant need to talk about your problems draining. He's your friend, and he's been as supportive as any friend could be expected to, likewise for others who you feel are backing away. If your problems are big enough to warrant major ongoing discussions, perhaps see a counsellor or therapist rather than unloading on friends to the point where you're exhausting their sympathy. 

How have I been demanding? I'm sorry but I don't understand if it's demanding that I wanted him to reciprocate asking me to hang out? I believe that when it comes to friendship it should be fair and not one sided.

Just because I wanted to vent to him more often than not and it was true when he said that it is not about my problems I still gave him breathing space. I did with both Alex and Nivek. I'm sorry but I do not see how I am demanding... as you and everyone else says it

Edited February 8 by Keeves1

[Keeves1]

5 hours ago, SlimShadysWife said:

You're acting like a girlfriend, his girlfriend. Very needy and testy.

 

Could you please elaborate on how I am needy?

[S2B]

1 hour ago, Keeves1 said:

How have I been demanding? I'm sorry but I don't understand if it's demanding that I wanted him to reciprocate asking me to hang out? I believe that when it comes to friendship it should be fair and not one sided.

Just because I wanted to vent to him more often than not and it was true when he said that it is not about my problems I still gave him breathing space. I did with both Alex and Nivek. I'm sorry but I do not see how I am demanding... as you and everyone else says it

You shouldn’t treat “friends” like they are your personal dumping ground.

get a skilled therapist and see them once a week until you understand what a healthy relationship/boundary looks like.

[Keeves1]

4 hours ago, S2B said:

You shouldn’t treat “friends” like they are your personal dumping ground.

get a skilled therapist and see them once a week until you understand what a healthy relationship/boundary looks like.

I think this is a cultural thing. Friends are there to help each other. It's not like there should not be any negative talk in friendship. The only downside to talk about things like breakups is that they could use it against you in the future. Both of my friend Alex and Nivek would sooner or later ask what happened between me and Maria. I could either choose to explain it short or I could tell them everything. I told them the short story but they wanted to listen to all of it. SO if I were not to "Dump" my problems to them they would have asked for it sooner down the line. That is why I think it's a cultural thing. This may not been allowed where you are but here in Norway it is normal to talk about stuff  and topics like that as long as we don't overdue it. We are just more open. 

With that being written I'm sorry but I do not agree with everyone's statement 

[NuevoYorko]

Evidently your friends do agree with the perspectives of others here though.  Or Alex (I think it was him) would not have said this:

"We cannot always talk about your problems"

You told us clearly that he was there for you and listened, supported, etc. when you shared with him. But it seems like your needs are too much for your friends.  I'm sorry but if all you want to do is talk about yourself, your breakup, your feelings, you are not holding up your end of your friendships and these people are not reaching out to you to hang out because they are not down for another time of going over your troubles with you.

So please do get a therapist if you need to explore all the intricacies of your pain further, and think a little more about offering some support and maybe fun when you're hanging out with your friends.

[Keeves1]

45 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

Evidently your friends do agree with the perspectives of others here though.  Or Alex (I think it was him) would not have said this:

"We cannot always talk about your problems"

You told us clearly that he was there for you and listened, supported, etc. when you shared with him. But it seems like your needs are too much for your friends.  I'm sorry but if all you want to do is talk about yourself, your breakup, your feelings, you are not holding up your end of your friendships and these people are not reaching out to you to hang out because they are not down for another time of going over your troubles with you.

So please do get a therapist if you need to explore all the intricacies of your pain further, and think a little more about offering some support and maybe fun when you're hanging out with your friends.

Yes I agree that Alex were bothered by my problems and it was to much for him. I'd still gave him breathing space but as you can see if we compare Alex and Nivek. This is very individual. It's your and everyone else's opinion. I have my own. Look I get it, I came across as needy when I wanted to have someone to talk to. It was risky because I could ruin friendship but at that time I did not have a psychiatrist. I knew that I could just not sit home alone with all those toughts. You seem to be new on my threads. Most people who comments on my post know that I have personality disorder. I have been diagnosed with mild personality disorder and my relationship to my parents are not good either, so that left me with no choice to talk it out with a trusted friend. I did not have a psychiatrist, I could not talk to my parents due to bad relations, and I knew I could not sit home. All I had was those two friends. If I ask you what would you have done if you were in that position? 

When it comes to Nivek I was overthinking. As a friend I should trust him regarding he's family issues. I'll just do what I like and wait until it get's a bit warmer and see if he keeps he's word. It's sounds weird that I'm waiting but the right word would be that I don't stress about it when it comes to Nivek. I'll just take it as it comes. It's not like Nivek always has to speak to me or anything like that. Just because he asked me how I was is just to be nice and check upon me. 

Edited February 8 by Keeves1

[MsJayne]

11 hours ago, Keeves1 said:

How have I been demanding? I'm sorry but I don't understand if it's demanding that I wanted him to reciprocate asking me to hang out? I believe that when it comes to friendship it should be fair and not one sided.

Just because I wanted to vent to him more often than not and it was true when he said that it is not about my problems I still gave him breathing space. I did with both Alex and Nivek. I'm sorry but I do not see how I am demanding... as you and everyone else says it

It’s not about him ‘reciprocating’. The reason he wasn’t doing that is likely because  he couldn’t take any more of your negativity. Like I said, it’s exhausting listening to peoples problems, that’s why therapists get paid a lot of money. Needing friends to be supportive all the time is demanding, friendship is about mutual interests and fun, and yes, if you have a problem it’s nice to have a listening ear, but once is enough, no need to keep moaning every time you see someone. It’s boring and drags other people down. And no, Norway is no different to most other cultures as far as interpersonal communication goes, people in every country in the world have problems and need others to listen to them, and I can assure you that there’s no topic off-limits among close friends. I’m exhausted just from reading your responses to people on here offering help, you’re dismissing everyone’s words, disagreeing with everything anyone says. Why post a question asking for opinions if what you really want is other people to agree with you and blow sunshine up your rear? You don’t seem to possess awareness of other people’s autonomy, the understanding that you’re not the centre of everyones universe and other people have their own thoughts, so I hope this is something your therapist is helping you work on.  

[Keeves1]

36 minutes ago, MsJayne said:

It’s not about him ‘reciprocating’. The reason he wasn’t doing that is likely because  he couldn’t take any more of your negativity. Needing friends to be supportive all the time is demanding, friendship is about mutual interests and fun, and yes, if you have a problem it’s nice to have a listening ear, but once is enough, not to keep moaning every time you see someone. It’s boring and drags other people down.
 

Why post a question asking for opinions if what you really want is other people to agree with you and blow sunshine up your rear? 

It’s not only about reciprocating yes but how would you feel if you were the one who always takes initiative? It’s just going to be one sided

I was not needing him to be supporting all the time. As I have written earlier I did give them breathing space. 

I post question asking people to read about their opinion. It does not mean I MUST agree to them and do as they say. I’m my own individual human being. I’m taking in the recommendations, critics etc.. but we all have our own values. If I were to agree and to do what people here recommends and all that then my values would not be authenthic. What I’m saying is that yes I don’t agree and I have written the reason here. I have my own values about what critics, recommendations etc that I should take inside with me or not

Kind of funny that I’ll get cancelled just because I don’t agree on something. Almost like it’s not allowed to say if I agree or not. 

Edited February 8 by Keeves1

[MsJayne]

54 minutes ago, Keeves1 said:

Kind of funny that I’ll get cancelled just because I don’t agree on something.

No one's cancelling you. I'll stick to the issue of him not reciprocating with the hangout invites. If someone doesn't make an effort to foster a friendship, it means they don't value the friendship. It's then up to you to make a decision on whether to confront the person, or to assume, based on their actions, that they don't value the friendship as much as you do and stop putting in effort - and then the friendship fades. You chose to confront Alex, and your own account of this interaction suggests that you were behaving like a petulant child, asking him to invite you to hang out and then refusing when he did. It all sounds like attention-seeking behaviour, and most people will see through this and not want to be around it. I'll use a long-time friend of mine as an example of this - for the past five or so years she's been very unhappy, and every time we speak I hear all about how no one cares about her and no one ever comes to visit her, so much so that recently I became very concerned about her well-being. When I confronted her about some of the worrying things she'd been saying she downplayed it and implied that I was over-reacting - implied that, even though she's been dumping her bitterness on me for the last five years, I'm the one with the problem. This pissed me off to the point that I now have resolved to not listen to her moaning any more, and that may mean that our friendship is over because I am not going to pander to her self-absorption. It sounds like Alex has made that same decision, and that's his right . 

[Keeves1]

13 minutes ago, MsJayne said:

I'll stick to the issue of him not reciprocating with the hangout invites. If someone doesn't make an effort to foster a friendship, it means they don't value the friendship. It's then up to you to make a decision on whether to confront the person, or to assume, based on their actions, that they don't value the friendship as much as you do and stop putting in effort - and then the friendship fades.
 

You chose to confront Alex, and your own account of this interaction suggests that you were behaving like a petulant child, asking him to invite you to hang out and then refusing when he did. It all sounds like attention-seeking behaviour, and most people will see through this and not want to be around it.

I'll use a long-time friend of mine as an example of this - for the past five or so years she's been very unhappy, and every time we speak I hear all about how no one cares about her and no one ever comes to visit her, so much so that recently I became very concerned about her well-being. When I confronted her about some of the worrying things she'd been saying she downplayed it and implied that I was over-reacting - implied that, even though she's been dumping her bitterness on me for the last five years, I'm the one with the problem. This pissed me off to the point that I now have resolved to not listen to her moaning any more, and that may mean that our friendship is over because I am not going to pander to her self-absorption. It sounds like Alex has made that same decision, and that's his right . 

I would not exactly say that I «confronted» Alex. You’re judging a book by it’s cover now because you don’t know how I resolved it. Yes it may sounds like I was petulant child when writing about it but it DOES not mean I was petulent child. I resolved it by communicating what has been bothering me. That’s should be the way we adults do. If I were a child I would have been passive agressive and shouted negative words. I did not do it. We resolved the issue without any more trouble. 

I’m still friends with Alex. Everything is good. We’re still communicating and talking so yes even if he was honest and said it was too much even if I gave him space he still are patient with me. 

It’s cool that you’re sharing your story but that’s your way of handling the situation. 

[Foxhall]

just be careful you dont push these friends away altogether,

I have not read every detail of your post- but on balance I think these people are actually good enough friends,

In truth I pushed away a few decent friends back in my mid 20s and while Ive made new friends along the way- you know in hindsight I did not realise at the time how genuine those original friends were,

You get to the point where you read people (maybe your not there yet) you can get a feel of how much of your stories they want to hear and know when to back off,

If your getting the cold shoulder- that is your hint to back off. if you sense avoidance- dont push your luck.

 

[Acacia98]

If you don't mind my asking, why exactly did you post about your situation? What were you hoping to gain? I ask because, when you respond to people, you seem to have all the issues figured out already. You asked in your first post if these two guys were good friends to you, but you seem to have already decided how to rate them. So are you actually benefitting from reading folks' opinions?