how a traumatic marriage impacts a man's start of next relationship - mid life love

[Zoewong]

I met someone for casual sex and I had a crush on the guy. He checked all the boxes (MD/PHD, cute, caring etc).

He was unwilling to say anything about himself but from pieces of info, his ex was not only mentally unstable, she is almost like a criminal stealing his money. She doesn't even care about what her family thinks of her, and she did not even love the two kids. The busy doctor had to minimize the time the two 12, and 13 year old sons staying with the Mom therefore he seems to be spending all his time outside of work with the two sons. There were restraining orders etc involved in the divorce. He mentioned that he stayed in the abusive relationship purely for the kids - he knew he would lose the kids time if he divorce before kids 12 since he is working full time. He waited until kids can testify in the court - so so so sad.

He texted me a few times a day 100% sexual languages before the second meeting. In the second meeting, I noticed that he did not know french kiss, did not know how to use condom, and cum prematurely. It seems he did not have a lot of sexual experience.

After the second meeting, he suddenly ghosted me for about 3 weeks, despite a couple texts, and a long email I sent to him showing similar experience on a traumatic marriage and divorce. When he reached out again last week, I responded positively and showed a lot of enthusiasm. I talked to him that I wished we met 15 years ago to have kids so we can love the kids together. He doesn't text me except for responding to mine since last week. His language to me is 100% sexual. But he would use something like "I missed do deeply all the time.""I love you" which confuse me as these are more for relationship than for sexual partner.

He could not find time to meet again as he seems to spend his 24 hours either working, sleeping or with kids. He used very vague language like "maybe next week".

He never asked any questions about me and even when I talked about myself, he does not respond much. He treated me very casually (or primarily for sex) but I just had so much mentally invested in him. I dreamed about being able to date and getting to know each other and sharing life together.

How do I approach this kind of man who's hurt so much in the past? His life seems to be still full of drama that he's said his ex was sick (he took the two sons to see mom's family during Thanksgiving while mom's not there herself) and his ex is mean to him etc. He may not be in a good state to see anyone? How do I tell him that I want more than just sex and not scare him away again?

[basil67]

If you think this guy checks all the boxes, you need more boxes.  

* knows how to use a condom

*knows how to have sex

*has easy relationship with ex and kids

*demonstrates that the wants more than sex

*makes time for you

Honestly, this guy is an absolute mess.  And if you're scared to lose him because you want more than sex, then the relationship is imbalanced in his favour.   And for what it's worth, the initials after a person's name means nothing outside of their professional world.  

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, Zoewong said:

How do I approach this kind of man who's hurt so much in the past?

You don't. Instead, correctly read the signs that he's not interested anymore, and stop all contact. 

1 hour ago, Zoewong said:

a long email I sent to him showing similar experience on a traumatic marriage and divorce.

No, no, no. Zoe. You hardly know this person. It is not appropriate to be sending things like this. 

1 hour ago, Zoewong said:

I just had so much mentally invested in him. I dreamed about being able to date and getting to know each other and sharing life together.

Unfortunately, you are learning the hard way why this was a mistake. You need to slow down - way down - and get to know a man before you start imagining a future together. 

1 hour ago, Zoewong said:

How do I tell him that I want more than just sex and not scare him away again?

Again, you don't. It's very clear he doesn't want more than sex, so there is no point expressing your desires. Just walk away from all of this. 

[Zoewong]

His sexual underperformance is probably the result of years of being deprived of physical and mental needs from the 15 year abusive marriage. I understand currently there is imbalance since I somehow fell for him even tough out initial meeting was for sex only. This is a hurt man (my believe). I did go to court record and hospital record and verified what he told me. Which way should I go?

1) ask if he is emotionally available to date me? And if yes, great, if not, then move on and do not meet again.

2) meet causally for sex (i enjoyed it also) and slowly give him some hint and wait for him

3) continue to meet for sex only.

[Zoewong]

5 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

You don't. Instead, correctly read the signs that he's not interested anymore, and stop all contact. 

No, no, no. Zoe. You hardly know this person. It is not appropriate to be sending things like this. 

Unfortunately, you are learning the hard way why this was a mistake. You need to slow down - way down - and get to know a man before you start imagining a future together. 

Again, you don't. It's very clear he doesn't want more than sex, so there is no point expressing your desires. Just walk away from all of this. 

Thanks for the feedback. This is I guess a "crush"? That I did not seem to have good control and how I just fell for him.

I think I gave him too many "passes" because of his past marriage and current ongoing drama. I went through the same thing therefore I could relate how messed-up and damaging this could be to any man.

[ExpatInItaly]

Yes, this was a crush. 

But he's virtually a stranger to you. You like the idea of him, and maybe you are impressed by his job, but there is really nothing here to work with. He's not going to become your boyfriend, and barely seems interested in regular sex. It's time to forget about him. 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, Zoewong said:

  How do I tell him that I want more than just sex and not scare him away again?

Unfortunately, that's all he's ready willing and able to offer. He's a cargo ship full of red flags.

Cut your losses and refrain from trying to fix, heal or change him. He can afford attorneys and therapists for this.

All he's looking for is hookups. If you are ok with that, fine but don't set yourself up for headaches and heartaches with someone who clearly has too much drama going on.

[Zoewong]

4 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately, that's all he's ready willing and able to offer. He's a cargo ship full of red flags.

Cut your losses and refrain from trying to fix, heal or change him. He can afford attorneys and therapists for this.

All he's looking for is hookups. If you are ok with that, fine but don't set yourself up for headaches and heartaches with someone who clearly has too much drama going on.

I understand many of the things you said here. The only reasons I am giving chances here is that

I myself went through similar and understood that he may be confused, very hurt, long term deprivation of physical and mental pleasure, etc
I would not be thinking about seeing anyone when I was still in ongoing mess, but slowly I became better. Should I at least ASK him opening before moving on?

[Wiseman2]

1 minute ago, Zoewong said:

I myself went through similar and understood that he may be confused, very hurt, 

He started out with sexting. He seems to not want a relationship. If you came from a bad situation, don't jump into another.  Dating is not a therapy group. Step back and reflect on why you're seeking out damaging men. 

[ExpatInItaly]

41 minutes ago, Zoewong said:

he may be confused, very hurt, long term deprivation of physical and mental pleasure, etc

You don't know this man well enough to assume anything, OP. 

He might not even be telling the truth about a lot of this. And even if he is, be careful not to project your own experiences onto him. He isn't you, so you cannot assume he experienced his past the same way you did. He might be managing just fine, and simply looking for hook-ups after being married a long time. 

43 minutes ago, Zoewong said:

Should I at least ASK him opening before moving on?

No. There's no point. You should instead reflect on why you got so attached to man you hardly know, who is all about sex. What is it inside you that is attracted to this? Are you lonely? Maybe not healed from your own traumatic relationship? 

[Will am I]

In addition to previous replies by @Wiseman2 @ExpatInItalyand @basil67: you sound like you’re completely buying the story.

That story goes like this: “I was mistreated by my (ex) wife; I need more kindness; I may not be able to deliver on my side; because I was damaged”.

It’s a narrative that seeks to establish an unbalanced relationship, in which he gets all the favours and none of the hard work.

Not surprisingly, many cheating husbands might use similar narratives for their OW.

[BaileyB]

6 hours ago, Zoewong said:

How do I approach this kind of man who's hurt so much in the past?

You don’t. 

Don’t involved yourself in his drama. He was interested in sex, nothing more. You see the signs - heed them. 

[Wiseman2]

6 hours ago, Zoewong said:

3) continue to meet for sex only.

This is all he's offering. The rest is drama anger and too many red flags. You can have good sex with more balanced men who are ready, willing and able to have a relationship with you the way you want.

[glows]

I think you may pity him a great deal. He has to learn to lean on better sources for help such as therapy. 

Speaking ill of any ex is a major red flag and he seems to be full of complaints. I’d explore why this appeals to you or what is it that draws you to this type of person. Is it the doctor thing that’s throwing all caution to the wind? He’s like anyone else and doesn’t hold any more credibility. Look at his actions and words. Does it look or sound like a man who has anything to offer you? Don’t get pulled away and carried away with your own feelings. It’s appalling that he would drag someone else into this mess. 

Since he isn’t always responding to you or the communication seems one-sided, I wouldn’t bother communicating it’s over. Just stop responding and block. 

You may also want to look into therapy for yourself or consider counselling if you’re still feeling the effects of your marriage and divorce. Getting involved with someone who is an “old you” so to speak is just moving backwards.

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by glows

[ShyViolet]

8 hours ago, Zoewong said:

How do I approach this kind of man who's hurt so much in the past? 

Why are you even asking this question when this guy is clearly NOT interested in you?  He has only been involved with you for casual sex, he talks to you in only "sexual language" when he does talk to you, he goes long periods of time not responding to you, and he tells you he is too busy to see you.  You need to learn to take a hint when a man is not interested in you.  You are making yourself look desperate here.

8 hours ago, Zoewong said:

I talked to him that I wished we met 15 years ago to have kids so we can love the kids together.

This is one of the most cringey things I have read on this board.  This was so inappropriate to say, especially to a guy who is just a casual hookup, who you are not in any type of relationship with, and who shows every sign imaginable that he is not interested in you.

8 hours ago, Zoewong said:

How do I tell him that I want more than just sex and not scare him away again?

He already knows you would be interested for more, and he has clearly shown that he doesn't feel the same way.  You cannot "make" him want to be with you.  I'm sorry but that's not how this works.  You really need to work on your self-respect, because right now you are acting like you have none.  Don't be that person who is so desperate that you chase after a man who is not interested in you.

[poppyfields]

@Zoewong, I'm sorry to say this, but sadly (imo and experience) you're lacking proper insight into the situation and as such making extremely bad choices for yourself.

Referencing your thread title, his "traumatic" abusive marriage did NOT mess him up. 

He was messed up prior to which is why he was drawn to the drama of an unstable abusive relationship /marriage and ultimate 'trauma'.

Meaning, the man has got serious emotional issues that were well in place before the marriage and will continue to be unless he decides to get himself into therapy and fix himself. 

I realize as women our nature is to nurture and care for.

However, I see nothing good or positive about nurturing and attempting to fix a man as broken as he is and again was damaged and broken well before his abusive dysfunctional marriage, NOT because of his marriage. 

I hope someday you will be able to tell the difference and avoid men like this, there is nothing for you to fix or do anything about except take care of YOU, nurture yourself. 

Love yourself first.   No one else ever will until you do. 

As my late mom used to say "the good Lord did not place us on this earth to be martyrs." 

Wish him well and and move on.

P.S:  When people trash their ex's the way he trashes his ex, it speaks much more to their own dysfunction rather than their ex's.

I hope someday you will learn this too and avoid people who engage in such toxic "blame the ex" behavior.

All the best moving forward, ideally without him.  

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by poppyfields

[smackie9]

It's possible he is well aware of what he is doing....he just wants to get off. Was hoping for bareback sex, no frills, only interested in his own satisfaction. He's just love bombing you....none of what he says is of meaning. Plays a victim to lure you emotionally. Sorry but you are caught up in a crappy situation and it won't get any better than this. I believe he's pulling the wool over your eyes. You deserve better, go find it somewhere else.

Edited November 27, 2022 by smackie9

[Zoewong]

Thanks all for your responses, I really appreciate you all.

A little background on why I am doing this. I am not the type of woman who fall for guys easily. I had a few casual sex before and never fell for any of them.  I have lots male coworkers and very rarely I had a crush on anyone (last one probably 7 years ago).

I was able to verify many of the things he told me, and clearly he is not good at lying. I verified his hospital website profile and the picture was him. He told me I can meet him in the hospital.

I checked county court record and found that he filed for divorce with a restraining order in year 2019.

One morning when we were on phone, one of his sons woke up and crying. This verified that he did have kids with him in the mornings (he told me he had to send them to school). 

His sextual performance (don't know french kiss, don't know how to use condom and premature) shows that he is not sleeping around type.

This all matches what he told me. He is clearly a very mannered man but has so much drama going on.

There are many red flags yes like he wouldn't tell me where he lives, may not use his real phone number. He went long period without responding, he doesn't have time to see me, he isn't interested in getting to know me and he doesn't tell me much his side.

He was technically not wrong as we met for sex only. It was me who changed to wanting more. 

How many of his current behavior can be attributed to his traumatic experience and current drama going on? Can you imagine a doctor (works 10 hours a day min) and need to take care of his own two kids (12 and 13) as much as possible so the kids don't have to have anything to do with the mom, at the same time deal with court paper, hearings and crazy mean ex?

How about the kids may have conditions also given the mom's abusive behavior. For example, on the phone the 12 year old boy was crying a little. I have a 12 year old boy too and it's rare he would get up in the morning and cry. I am trying to say he may have to deal with kids situation also. But this is pure guess.

I think clearly he is not in the situation for more, but I also feels he is sincere and if I give him time slowly he may learn to open up. But again he may never ever able to recover from the previous trauma either.  

[Zoewong]

I totally agree that I need to work on myself and take care of myself. In general though I have successful career of my own, highly educated and I am happy, confident and self aware. I have some friends and two beautiful kids. Overall my life is good therefore I am not the low self esteem type. However I haven't touched dating or relationship for a long time. Separated three years ago and have been juggling kids and career therefore I remain single and never thought of relationship too much, until I met this guy.

[poppyfields]

17 minutes ago, Zoewong said:

His sexual performance (don't know french kiss, don't know how to use condom and premature) shows that he is not sleeping around type.

Agree this shows he doesn't sleep around but NOT because of what you think.

What it also shows is that he never had an active healthy sexual relationship with his own wife!  Or any other woman.

Which strongly suggests he has a deep fear of intimacy (sexual and emotional) which again most likely existed well before his toxic marriage. 

And added to the marital breakdown. 

This and other things you mention suggest you are either wearing blinders, in denial and not seeing the situation clearly.

I'm really sorry, good luck.  

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by poppyfields

[Zoewong]

43 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

@Zoewong, I'm sorry to say this, but sadly (imo and experience) you're lacking proper insight into the situation and as such making extremely bad choices for yourself.

Referencing your thread title, his "traumatic" abusive marriage did NOT mess him up. 

He was messed up prior to which is why he was drawn to the drama of an unstable abusive relationship /marriage and ultimate 'trauma'.

Meaning, the man has got serious emotional issues that were well in place before the marriage and will continue to be unless he decides to get himself into therapy and fix himself. 

I realize as women our nature is to nurture and care for.

However, I see nothing good or positive about nurturing and attempting to fix a man as broken as he is and again was damaged and broken well before his abusive dysfunctional marriage, NOT because of his marriage. 

I hope someday you will be able to tell the difference and avoid men like this, there is nothing for you to fix or do anything about except take care of YOU, nurture yourself. 

Love yourself first.   No one else ever will until you do. 

As my late mom used to say "the good Lord did not place us on this earth to be martyrs." 

Wish him well and and move on.

P.S:  When people trash their ex's the way he trashes his ex, it speaks much more to their own dysfunction rather than their ex's.

I hope someday you will learn this too and avoid people who engage in such toxic "blame the ex" behavior.

All the best moving forward, ideally without him.  

 

 

I agree that he did not make the right choice when he was younger. However lots people made wrong choice and got divorced. My included and a very traumatic marriage also. I don't think I am damaged and couldn't have a healthy relationship anymore.

One should never trash his ex yes. But his ex is like a criminal. It's extreme case.

[glows]

15 minutes ago, Zoewong said:

I think clearly he is not in the situation for more, but I also feels he is sincere and if I give him time slowly he may learn to open up. But again he may never ever able to recover from the previous trauma either. 

It’s more likely that he doesn’t see you as dating material to be very honest. You’re the fwb or fix he gets for sex because he’s already seen you’re not someone he’d date in a relationship sense. 

A man who immediately jumps to sexual language and is vague with you isn’t interested in sharing his life with you regardless of “trauma”. That’s not him being sad and confused. It’s a person who doesn’t care that much about you - what you feel or what you think. 

Are you divorced from your ex or still married/separated?

[Zoewong]

1 minute ago, glows said:

It’s more likely that he doesn’t see you as dating material to be very honest. You’re the fwb or fix he gets for sex because he’s already seen you’re not someone he’d date in a relationship sense. 

A man who immediately jumps to sexual language and is vague with you isn’t interested in sharing his life with you regardless of “trauma”. That’s not him being sad and confused. It’s a person who doesn’t care that much about you - what you feel or what you think. 

Are you divorced from your ex or still married/separated?

We had sex first time therefore the language has been sexual. He also use terms like "I love you", "I miss you so deeply" etc.
My divorce also not finalized. We had custody agreement and now work on asset division. This doesn't impact me going out to date anyone though.

[Els]

9 hours ago, Zoewong said:

He was unwilling to say anything about himself but from pieces of info, his ex was not only mentally unstable, she is almost like a criminal stealing his money. She doesn't even care about what her family thinks of her, and she did not even love the two kids. The busy doctor had to minimize the time the two 12, and 13 year old sons staying with the Mom therefore he seems to be spending all his time outside of work with the two sons. There were restraining orders etc involved in the divorce. He mentioned that he stayed in the abusive relationship purely for the kids - he knew he would lose the kids time if he divorce before kids 12 since he is working full time. He waited until kids can testify in the court - so so so sad.

What kind of person says those things to a woman he's only met once, for casual sex?

I'd actually bet that he's saying all that, and is only interested in casual, occasional sex (AND has very little time to meet anyone) because he's still married, and looking for an affair partner. It's the classic "poor ol' me" spin.

[poppyfields]

29 minutes ago, Zoewong said:

A little background on why I am doing this. I am not the type of woman who fall for guys easily. I had a few casual sex before and never fell for any of them.

@Zoewong, this^ is quite telling. 

The fact you typically don't fall for men easily but yet you fell hard for this man, who by all appearances is dysfunctional, damaged and not interested in you. 

What does that say about you?  

I would suggest looking within to determine why you are drawn to such toxicity.

Do you have your own fears of intimacy and commitment?

And as such unconsciously (or consciously) seek out and fall for men unwilling and undesirous of providing that to you? 

Look within.  That is where the answers to most questions and confusion can be found. 

Edited November 27, 2022 by poppyfields