Still hoping to find a FWB

[Happy Lemming]

13 hours ago, poppyfields said:

I don't know if this was true for you @Happy Lemming, but HE may not want to be the one to initiate as it suggests more of a dating situation than FWB.

 

You are correct... It is kind of an unwritten rule that the guy is NOT allowed to ask for sex in a FWB.  I'm guessing an FWB relationship empowers the woman to tell the man when to come over.  She has control, not him.

In a dating situation, yes... I would plan the date, call the woman and present my date plan for a "yes" or "no" answer.  But in a FWB relationship the roles are reversed.  The woman initiates the encounter and the man comes over.

13 hours ago, poppyfields said:

He doesn't want to mislead you so prefers and may even expect you to initiate your meets. 

This is 100% true, the man doesn't want to mess up a good thing (FWB sex) by calling and pestering the woman for more sex.

13 hours ago, poppyfields said:

JMO but I think it's unusual to find a woman who truly only wants sex.

@Happy Lemmingdid but again I don't think that's the norm, most woman, at least the ones I associate with, dislike NSA arrangements.

Again, you are correct... it is rare.  Often there are other factors in the woman's life where she just doesn't have the time or energy to go through all the hassle of dating and just wants her needs met.

19 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

As @Happy Lemmingsaid, he may love to hear from you and more than happy to see and have sex with you again

He simply doesn't want to mislead you into thinking it's more.

Oh... I know he is hoping to hear from the OP.  I guarantee it. 

***As a side note***  @Girl_about_town FWB relationships can be A LOT of fun and you can do things as friends.  You can also be playful with it.  It doesn't just have to be mechanical sex.  Without going into details, I had one FWB that would surprise me with all manner of playful ideas. 

The first thing you want to do is come up with a set of rules.

Can he call for sex??  Can he spend the night?? If he does spend the night, do you want to go out for breakfast (after a quick shower)??  How often would you like sex?? How often would he like sex??  Add whatever parameters you want.  I had one FWB that liked this specific pizza that was made by a little "Mom & Pop" shop near where I lived, so she would ask me to grab that pizza on the way over. Another liked tequila, so I always kept a bottle in stock in my pantry --- ready to grab and go.

One FWB I was with, used to travel A LOT for work, so I'd drop her off at the airport and pick her up.  Again, things a friend would do.

[ExpatInItaly]

9 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said:

It is kind of an unwritten rule that the guy is NOT allowed to ask for sex in a FWB

Woman here. This is not always the case, based on my experience. I'd definitely been asked for sex by FWBs in the past. 

 

[poppyfields]

29 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Woman here. This is not always the case, based on my experience. I'd definitely been asked for sex by FWBs in the past. 

I'm curious did it start out that way, with your FWBs initiating?

Or did it come after some time after they realized you truly wanted FWB and nothing more?

Also @ExpatInItalyyou are an exceptional woman in that you are strong and secure, have realistic expectations and that may be why in a FWB situation, men felt comfortable initiating. 

JMO of course, I've never had FWB just going on what some men have told me and what I've observed.

Edited July 17, 2022 by poppyfields

[Happy Lemming]

26 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Woman here. This is not always the case, based on my experience. I'd definitely been asked for sex by FWBs in the past. 

 

Nothing is 100% in life, and yes men can ask their FWB for sex.  There are exceptions to every rule.

But in general, it is usually the woman that drives the FWB and schedules the sexual encounter.

After one time, I do think the guy is waiting to be invited for round 2.  If they had been FWB's for a number of months, then he might be on firmer ground to ask for sex.

[Wiseman2]

51 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said:

FWB relationships can be A LOT of fun and you can do things as friends.  You can also be playful with it.  It doesn't just have to be mechanical sex.

Unfortunately sex-only apps are strictly for no strings sex and one night stands.

Getting to the "friends" part is the problem in this case. The men don't communicate or even respond to communication after sex.

This is why I personally would recommend casual dating to develop some interpersonal rapport without any sort of labels (Including FWB, GF/BF, whatever). 

Edited July 17, 2022 by Wiseman2

[Happy Lemming]

1 minute ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately sex-only apps are strictly for no strings sex and one night stands.

 

I never used an app.  I found my FWB's organically (real life encounters/situations).  One was someone where we both participated in the same sport.  One was kind of a quasi-business associate.  Another was a friend of a friend type of deal and so on and so forth.

I can't speak about the guys on the apps.  Can the OP specifically ask for an FWB??

[stillafool]

36 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said:

But in general, it is usually the woman that drives the FWB and schedules the sexual encounter.

Really?  That doesn't seem fair.  No wonder guys are moving to casual sex, FB (sex only) apps.  There it's clear what they want without having to make any promises.

[Girl_about_town]

Hi again and thank you for all the comments. I decided to go for it and write him a message asking if he wants to meet again before I go away on holidays. It was short and to the point. It's been a couple of hours and he has left it in unread

Obviously, he could still reply but it's feeling like a replay of my last ghosting. Thankfully, this time I am better prepared and less invested but I am starting to wonder if I am just unlucky, I somehow pick the wrong men, or I am doing something wrong to scare them away.

[Girl_about_town]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately sex-only apps are strictly for no strings sex and one night stands.

Getting to the "friends" part is the problem in this case. The men don't communicate or even respond to communication after sex.

This is why I personally would recommend casual dating to develop some interpersonal rapport without any sort of labels (Including FWB, GF/BF, whatever). 

You may be onto something, it may be the app that makes the men feel like it's understood, that even if we talk about fwb beforehand, they can just ghost the girls after the first time

[stillafool]

8 minutes ago, Girl_about_town said:

You may be onto something, it may be the app that makes the men feel like it's understood, that even if we talk about fwb beforehand, they can just ghost the girls after the first time

That's right  Also there are women on those apps looking for the same type of situation (not FWB) so quite naturally these guys are going to go through as many women as they can.  That's why those are the wrong places to be looking for a FWB.  If you can't wait around for sex those apps are for you.

[Girl_about_town]

17 minutes ago, Girl_about_town said:

Hi again and thank you for all the comments. I decided to go for it and write him a message asking if he wants to meet again before I go away on holidays. It was short and to the point. It's been a couple of hours and he has left it in unread

Obviously, he could still reply but it's feeling like a replay of my last ghosting. Thankfully, this time I am better prepared and less invested but I am starting to wonder if I am just unlucky, I somehow pick the wrong men, or I am doing something wrong to scare them away.

UPDATE: he replied! Phew! He's busy this week but wants to meet when I am back from my holiday. We'll see what happens then but for the moment I am just glad that he is interested  

Edited July 17, 2022 by Girl_about_town

[stillafool]

Just now, Girl_about_town said:

UPDATE: he replied! Phew

What did he say?

[Girl_about_town]

3 minutes ago, stillafool said:

What did he say?

He's busy this week but wants to meet when I am back from my holiday. We'll see what happens then but for the moment I am just glad that he is interested  

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, poppyfields said:

I'm curious did it start out that way, with your FWBs initiating?

Or did it come after some time after they realized you truly wanted FWB and nothing more?

Also @ExpatInItalyyou are an exceptional woman in that you are strong and secure, have realistic expectations and that may be why in a FWB situation, men felt comfortable initiating. 

Thank you, Poppy. That's a very kind observation!

And to be honest, I can't remember who started out initiating. It was several years ago now and memory doesn't serve me that well, I'm afraid. There were just a couple men who I would consider to have been real FWBs, but I recall it was an easy-going volley of invitations to meet up. No particular rules, just had a good time and then went about our business. 

[Versacehottie]

11 minutes ago, Girl_about_town said:

UPDATE: he replied! Phew! He's busy this week but wants to meet when I am back from my holiday. We'll see what happens then but for the moment I am just glad that he is interested  

It feels like to me that you are too emotionally invested in this arrangement.  Whether it's this specific guy or whatever future hopeful FWB, I sort of think you don't have the right attitude and expectations to set yourself up for success. You are looking for validation externally in the type of relationship that is sort of devoid of emotion and care and looking out for your feelings. You're already on edge about your self-esteem (and before I saw that you mentioned that I was going to say ego). 

I don't really see you being successful with this type of arrangement...but if you did, I would suggest trying a guy you are actually already friends with. If you are looking on apps for casual, my guess is that it's going to be super brutal wake up call for you. I know that's not what you want to hear and of course nothing is an absolute but I really think you are putting yourself that by your own description of what you want and the way the majority of guys/people are going to interpret what you want and what they give, I think you are going to get disappointed and hurt. I don't know if you are actually clear on what you REALLY want deep down. A lot of the things you've said are at odds with each other. 

maybe this guy will fit your arrangement but don't be surprised if he "ghosts"....which is in quotes because in no universe would I consider it ghosting but you call it that. Ok good luck

[Girl_about_town]

2 hours ago, Happy Lemming said:

 

Oh... I know he is hoping to hear from the OP.  I guarantee it. 

Thank you so much for giving me the confidence, you were right!

2 hours ago, Happy Lemming said:

***As a side note***  @Girl_about_town FWB relationships can be A LOT of fun and you can do things as friends.  You can also be playful with it.  It doesn't just have to be mechanical sex.  Without going into details, I had one FWB that would surprise me with all manner of playful ideas. 

The first thing you want to do is come up with a set of rules.

Can he call for sex??  Can he spend the night?? If he does spend the night, do you want to go out for breakfast (after a quick shower)??  How often would you like sex?? How often would he like sex??  Add whatever parameters you want.  I had one FWB that liked this specific pizza that was made by a little "Mom & Pop" shop near where I lived, so she would ask me to grab that pizza on the way over. Another liked tequila, so I always kept a bottle in stock in my pantry --- ready to grab and go.

One FWB I was with, used to travel A LOT for work, so I'd drop her off at the airport and pick her up.  Again, things a friend would do.

Thanks for the tips! We'll see how things evolve but yes, it'd be nice to have a friendly relationship and not just sex buddies.

His texts just now were friendly so that is a good start!

[Girl_about_town]

12 minutes ago, Versacehottie said:

It feels like to me that you are too emotionally invested in this arrangement.  Whether it's this specific guy or whatever future hopeful FWB, I sort of think you don't have the right attitude and expectations to set yourself up for success. You are looking for validation externally in the type of relationship that is sort of devoid of emotion and care and looking out for your feelings. You're already on edge about your self-esteem (and before I saw that you mentioned that I was going to say ego). 

I don't really see you being successful with this type of arrangement...but if you did, I would suggest trying a guy you are actually already friends with. If you are looking on apps for casual, my guess is that it's going to be super brutal wake up call for you. I know that's not what you want to hear and of course nothing is an absolute but I really think you are putting yourself that by your own description of what you want and the way the majority of guys/people are going to interpret what you want and what they give, I think you are going to get disappointed and hurt. I don't know if you are actually clear on what you REALLY want deep down. A lot of the things you've said are at odds with each other. 

maybe this guy will fit your arrangement but don't be surprised if he "ghosts"....which is in quotes because in no universe would I consider it ghosting but you call it that. Ok good luck

Yes, I have my own self-esteem issues but I am working on them (including therapy) and I don't think that it should mean that I must remain celibate or not date to avoid getting hurt, does it?

I am working through my issues by learning as I go. If this guy doesn't work out then another will and I will learn that it's not me, it's them.

The only risk would be if all the guys ghost me (and I disagree that you cannot call it ghosting when it's only one time, it's just a lesser degree of ghosting) and I never get anything more than ONS, then my self esteem could have really taken a beating. However, out of three guys, only the first one ghosted me and now I am starting to think that it was my fault for texting him too soon and too many times  

Edited July 17, 2022 by Girl_about_town

[Girl_about_town]

14 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

OP, a question - would you also be okay with this guy having sex with other women? 

Sorry I missed this expatinitaly. Yes, I would be ok with it except I wouldn't want him to be very promiscuous, sleeping with several women a week or something, because that would increase the chances of catching an std. This guy, unless he has been completely dishonest, is not like that.

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, Girl_about_town said:

UPDATE: he replied! Phew! He's busy this week but wants to meet when I am back from my holiday. We'll see what happens then but for the moment I am just glad that he is interested  

Remember since this is no strings, you can enjoy your holiday and perhaps meet men you can date and have regular contact with. It's nice he replied but it's best not to hope a ONS evolves into a caring loving relationship. 

[poppyfields]

Wow, your mood has shifted quite dramatically into the upswing since hearing from him! 

This strongly suggests you seek validation over and above anything else. 

When you receive validation (he called!) your mood is on the upswing.

If by chance he doesn't call, you're back to feeling badly about yourself and your self-esteem plummets.

Without even knowing the guy or knowing whether you like him or not. 

I'm not judging, this was me too many moons ago.

But it's a dangerous place to be emotionally and am glad you are getting professional help to resolve it. 

[Happy Lemming]

2 hours ago, stillafool said:

Really?  That doesn't seem fair. 

I don't know about fair... but I was OK with it

In reference to the one FWB that lasted 18 months.  She was trying to expand her business. Some nights she'd be doing quotes, some nights returning email(s) and some nights working on her income/expenses/quarterly taxes (occasionally I would help her with those).  On nights she finished up early or didn't really have anything to do, she'd call me over.  In the evenings, I was working on a house that I wanted to flip. Unless I had just opened up a 5 gallon bucket of paint, I could clean up, jump in the shower and go over to her place. 

1 hour ago, Girl_about_town said:

Thank you so much for giving me the confidence, you were right!

 

Glad things are working out for you.  I do hope you enjoy your FWB relationship with this gentleman.

[Girl_about_town]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

Remember since this is no strings, you can enjoy your holiday and perhaps meet men you can date and have regular contact with. It's nice he replied but it's best not to hope a ONS evolves into a caring loving relationship. 

Thanks Wiseman2, on my holiday I'll be with family so I will focus on them (and on myself).

When I am back I will keep my expectations low as you recommend, and I don't expect a loving relationship at all.

I'm hoping (not expecting) for something friendly, as it's been so far. I also have to add that this guy told me today that he would let me know when he wants to stop and that I should do the same so at least in principle we are in the same page.

[basil67]

3 hours ago, Girl_about_town said:

Yes, I have my own self-esteem issues but I am working on them (including therapy) and I don't think that it should mean that I must remain celibate or not date to avoid getting hurt, does it?

Of course you can't live a life without risk, but I would suggest that making choices which are less likely to leave you hurt would be sensible.  And I wouldn't just give this advice to you:  I would argue that unless a person's personality bulletproof, that a bit of risk analysis is never a bad thing.  

 

[stillafool]

Is this the first guy who you thought ghosted you or is this the guy you saw after him that you weren't as excited about?

[Versacehottie]

3 hours ago, Girl_about_town said:

Yes, I have my own self-esteem issues but I am working on them (including therapy) and I don't think that it should mean that I must remain celibate or not date to avoid getting hurt, does it?

I am working through my issues by learning as I go. If this guy doesn't work out then another will and I will learn that it's not me, it's them.

The only risk would be if all the guys ghost me (and I disagree that you cannot call it ghosting when it's only one time, it's just a lesser degree of ghosting) and I never get anything more than ONS, then my self esteem could have really taken a beating. However, out of three guys, only the first one ghosted me and now I am starting to think that it was my fault for texting him too soon and too many times  

I just think you are using the wrong tactics and FOCUSING externally for validation which won't work for your self-esteem (or growth) at all. 

On the bolded, that is not exactly true. In reality, why this doesn't "work out" may very well be on you. I'd say the the amount of contact or feeling that they "must" be in touch is going to be high on the list of things that will cause this type of arrangement to go wrong. And let's face it, you are doing that part for validation--so it's a bad circle that probably chip away at your self-esteem if I were to guess. 

We will agree to disagree about the word ghosting..It's fine to use it here since it means that to YOU and this is your thread and sums up that they are disappearing on you. 

Second bolded, that would be my guess too.