Covert Narcissism and questioning reality

[AlexisH33407]

Myself, 38F and my fiancé 45M have been together for 3 years. We both have kids and are not currently living together. Id love to get some insight into someone who has been in a similar situation and if there is any chance for reconciliation. Right now I'm trying to figure out if the last 3 years of my life have been a lie and struggling to try to trust him again. I apologize for the length of this already... its a long one lol. 

In the beginning things were great. We are very compatible and got along very well. We have known each other for over 20years are are both single parents. In the beginning I was loved bombed and told everything sweet I wanted to hear. I always thought it was weird that he didnt have any friends and when talking about our pasts, always had this victim mentality about everything. Me, being a empath, I felt terrible that someone would feel this way and have such a terrible childhood/past. He had an unexpected issue come up with his living arrangements, so I not only co-signed, but agreed to pay his rent for 3 months in order to help. 

About 3 months later things started to shift. The first devaluation  phase started when he told me that he didnt love me romantically and that he was no longer attracted to me because of my weight. I At that point, I had gained about 15 lbs since we started dating, however my weight (an issue I'm aware of and he knows I'm sensitive about) was not something I thought was an issue at that time. He blindsided me and took me completely by surprise. However 2 weeks later hew told me he didnt mean it and that it was only said because he was struggling with his own feelings. He told me he loved me, loved my body and everything about me, etc etc. So I moved on. I thought that he loved me for me and that his reasoning was genuine. This was the FIRST cycle that has now happened 7 time total. Fast forward 3 years later, I admit I have gained a significant amount of weight and as of 2 months ago Ive started going back to the gym, eating better and have lost 15 lbs. My position with my employer recently changed so I'm able to have more free time to exercise and take care of myself.  

The reason I bring all of this up is because that has been his MAJOR reason for his treatment of me over the last 3 years. We have went on 1 date over 3 years. There is always an excuse for why he cant, however if we do plan for a night together, usually a dat or two before he cancels and blames it on my weight. That hes not sexually attracted to me, and that I'm selfish for wanting to have alone time with him, since that usually ends up in having sex, and that since I know that he doesnt want to have sex with me until I lose weight, that he would be more willing to have alone time with me once the weight is gone. Hes went as far as telling me that he would be more affectionate towards me if I lost more weight too because he has a hard time even wanting to kiss me. (Mind you, Ive went from about 150-215. I agree that is a drastic difference and I'm not making excuses and understands he likes what he likes, but want to reiterate that). Now- EVERYTIME he says this and does this, like clockwork, a week or 2 later he tells me that he didnt mean it and that he loves everything about me, about my body and doesnt care if I lose weight or not.  It has now been 7 times this same cycle has occurred and I'm now practically paranoid to even be around him because I dont know what to believe. This has also drastically affected our sex life because I'm paranoid to be intimate with him because I dont know if hes just doing it to placate me or if he even wants to. In the same breath, he will throw that we never have sex in my face and blame me for it. Whenever I try to have a conversation with him, I'm gaslit and told I'm too soft and that he will not be apologizing for being hurtful about it. 

My biggest issue is with his lack of effort. I was working 75 hours a week in order to be able to support both households. My savings account of $70,000 is now at 12 cents. I completely support, fund and pay for every single living expense for him and his son. I have also been guilted into buying overly expensive things ($3,000+ items) for his son even if we didnt have the money for it. He constantly uses his son as an excuse for why hes unable to work and put in effort for anything. I have spent the last two Valentines Day alone (this last one he bought me a gift but allowed his son to steal it and take it and thought it was funny), he have never celebrated my birthday aside from a cake, card and gift, I have never gotten anything aside from empty promises for Mothers Day but have taken both of our kids out to get him something for fathers day and celebrate it. Whenever I ask him to do anything for me, it is met with an excuse but gets upset that I ask others like family to help when it is needed. He has told me that he would never force his son to stay the night at a family members house if he didnt want to in order to make me happy to have alone time. Ive been told that I do not do anything for him aside from paying for everything  and that going to work everyday to make sure him and his son are supported is not effort. Thatonce I actually start doing something for him he will give effort in return. I cant even spend the night when I'm over there because he still sleeps in bed with his teenage son (14) and doesnt care if it upsets me. 

I have told him how his actions and words have made me feel and how I feel like shell and his ATM. I have tried to cut him off however Im usually guilted into coming back and paying for something. I have tried explaining how I feel used by him, that I feel emotionally neglected or abused because hes holding things like affection and attentional over my head, or on ocassion will muster up enough dignity to stand up for myself. I am consistently met with blame shifting and gas lighting. I'm told I'm too soft, crazy, making things up... and that HE IS RIGHT 99.9% OF THE TIME so therefor he will not apologize unless he knows he was wrong or that he IS THE BOSS and will ALWAYS be the boss and I need to learn how to play my position as a woman and be submissive and stop controlling him. This goes on an on until about twice a year I have a blow out and explode on him. I become so fed up and frustrated I tear him down, which I know isnt right and apologize typically right after or the next day. He tells me that the effort he puts in is talking to me on the phone and not sleeping with anyone else because most other men would. 

I say all of that because 2 weeks ago he had planned a date night for the two of us. He was bragging to his mom the day before about how hes excited to take me out and how Ive been working on losing weight and how hes proud of me. We had agreed that I would call him once i was done getting ready so he could pick me up. I sat there dressed up in a new outfit, my hair, makeup, nails done, waiting.... and he didnt answer. Finally 30 minutes later he told me how he was working (he started Door Dashing) and that hed rather do that tonight instead. He started going on about how he does not love me romantically and isnt sexually attracted to him and wont feel bad for feeling those ways. He called off out engagement and ended things. 

After going back and forth for an hour I immediately went no contact with him. I have now been visiting my therapist more and they suggested writing him an email laying everything out and on the line and to stop paying for him. I have done both and at first I received an email back from him with great remorse saying hes crying and is so ashmed of his actions... but now several days later... hes now back to telling me how ive caused more issues in this relationship than he has (again, I know I'm not a saint and have done wrong and have things I need to change) an that he wants to work on things but refuses to do what Ive asked him. 

He doesnt understand that I'm questioning if the last 3 years of my life have all been a lie to use me and put in minimum effort. I'm questioning if anytime he was ever nice, sweet or affectionate was even real or if he had a MO. I struggle because when things are good, theyre great between us and he is loving, supportive and affectionate. Has anyone ever been through something similar? If so what are things I'm able to do in order to try to work things out if possible ? 

 

 

 

 

[basil67]

Oh what a mess.  I honestly can't understand why you're even thinking of letting him back into your life, let alone trying to trust him again.  I mean, not only did he use you, but he's quite open about not loving you and does not find you attractive.

The only advice I can give you is that you should close your wallet immediately and block him from contacting you.  And then in therapy, work out why your self esteem is so low that you've accepted such appalling treatment.

[BrinnM]

2 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

when things are good, theyre great between us and he is loving, supportive and affectionate.

Can you explain this further? That’s pretty much the only positive thing I read in your post and it doesn’t really match the rest of your description. How is he loving, supportive and affectionate? He doesn’t want to kiss and have sex with you, he doesn’t take you out, he uses you for money and he’s rude about your weight.
Also, if he’s really a narcissist, which we don’t know, I would not put him in the covert category. I know we only get one side of the story here, but nothing about his behavior that you describe is “covert”. He’s actually pretty blunt and brutal. And for this reason, I’m asking myself what it is that you want to work out? According to you, he’s been financially & emotionally abusing you. You have no money left and he treats you disrespectfully. Heck he tells his mother he’s taking you out on a date because you’ve been such a good girl losing weight! And then cancels on you, of course. That’s just awful. Nobody deserves this. 

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

My biggest issue is with his lack of effort. I was working 75 hours a week in order to be able to support both households. My savings account of $70,000 is now at 12 cents. I completely support, fund and pay for every single living expense for him and his son.

Ok, I read your first few paragraphs when you talked about his comments about your weight and I thought to myself - why are you dating this jerk?

And then, I hit the above quote and I stopped reading. Why are you working yourself to the bone and giving your money to this guy?? Seriously - my biggest issue is not be his lack of effort - I’m primarily concerned after reading this about your total lack of boundaries. Girl, you got to stop giving this guy your hard earned money!! 

3 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

Right now I'm struggling to try to trust him again.

You shouldn’t trust this man, absolutely not. I hope you end it and put some of the money you would have given to him toward a really good counsellor.

I’m sorry, I’m sure this sounds harsh but really… this is not good. Take care of yourself. 

Edited July 16, 2022 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

43 minutes ago, BrinnM said:

That’s pretty much the only positive thing I read in your post and it doesn’t really match the rest of your description.

Agree.

44 minutes ago, BrinnM said:

If he’s really a narcissist, which we don’t know, I would not put him in the covert category.

Agree. I’m not one for labels - bad behavior is bad behavior, in my humble opinion. And, this is bad behavior. It’s gone on way too long already, please don’t go back for more OP…

[ExpatInItaly]

Forget him for a moment. He's clearly a weasel. 

What's up with you? Meaning, how have you reached the point where you accept a miserable non-relationship and throw all your money away on him? Don't worry about armchair diagnosing him. Concentrate on your own issues instead, because they will follow you even when this guy is gone. Getting your life back on track has little to do with him, and everything to do with you. 

What is your therapist's take on why you are attracted to the dysfunction? 

[Alpacalia]

What you see is what you get.

And what you have is someone that is not sexually attracted to you and deprives you of physical and emotional affection that is using you financially.

The thing about you is that you are always hopeful and accommodating, and you keep trying to win back his love and affection.

In the meantime, you are constantly being undermined in terms of your self-esteem and independence. 

The time has come for you to plan your exit strategy, and you should do it ASAP.

[Wiseman2]

8 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

.My savings account of $70,000 is now at 12 cents. I completely support, fund and pay for every single living expense for him and his son

How is your co-parenting relationship with your children's father?

You need to support and take care of yourself and your children.

This has nothing to do with weight. It would be best to end things.

[BaileyB]

14 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

The first devaluation  phase

He may have devalued you, but you are the one who is going to the gym to try and lose the weight (to appease him) and you are the one who has been paying his bills. 

In that way, I would say that the person who has devalued you - is you. You stayed, with a man who has belittled you and taken your money. That was your decision. 

I sincerely hope that the comments here have confirmed for you that you made a good decisions when you left. This relationship needs to end and you have some work to do to understand why you accepted this for the past few years…

Edited July 16, 2022 by BaileyB

[ShyViolet]

Not many posts on this forum leave me speechless, but this one.......

It is just incredibly sad how you had such low self-esteem that you stayed in a relationship with this man for three years.  I just can't understand why on earth you stayed with this man who treated you horribly, and you paid for his living expenses and drained your bank accounts since he refused to work?  This relationship should have been ended long ago.  Honestly you should have broken up with him the FIRST time he told you that he wasn't attracted to you and didn't love you.  That would have been the appropriate time to end it.

I hope you are no longer paying a cent for his bills.... that needs to be cut off immediately.  And I really hope that you are not for a second considering taking him back into your life.  This man is TOXIC and this relationship has no redeeming value whatsoever.  You need very intense therapy to work on why you had such incredibly low self-esteem that you allowed a man like this to stay in your life for three years, and such poor judgment that you paid his bills and let him drain your bank account.  I can't understand why you didn't say no?  This is all very dysfunctional.  Please don't date again until you work on these issues.

[BrinnM]

14 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

If so what are things I'm able to do in order to try to work things out if possible ? 

You are asking the wrong question.

What you should work on is your self-esteem/self-respect. You need to cut this man out of your life completely. What he has put you through is outrageous. You will never get these 3 years back, or the money you lost. Make it stop now! Don’t talk to him. If he contacts you, ignore & block.  

Edited July 16, 2022 by BrinnM

[mark clemson]

Hmm. End things, and be firm and don't let him rope you back in next time around. He is awful, but you are the one letting yourself get sucked back in.

Don't worry about whether the last 3 years of your life were a lie or not. There is no answer to that, they were what they were. But it very much sounds like you should FIRMLY resolve to NOT let the next 3 continue to be like them.

[AlexisH33407]

Thank you to those of you that have responded and shown support! I appreciate it!!! 

Ill be honest, when we first started dating,  my self confidence and self esteem were great! I wasnt even looking for a relationship. I didnt start off paying his bills or anything until about 4-5 months in. The person he was living with was selling their house and he was given short notice. So I had agreed to help him for 3 months until he found a job or was able to get disability for his back. Months turned into years. 

My therapist had  said that once he made the first initial comment on my weight and I stuck around that he knew it could continue and that he took advantage of that. She also used the term covert narcissist because he is not typically overt, boisterous, etc. That since he is more introverted, lacks friends, and thinks poorly of himself is why she feels that way. 

I have not given him any money or paid any bill for him since the day before we were supposed to go out on a date and didnt. I have had very little contact with him. He wrote me an email saying he would do whatever it takes, and then two days later his attitude was completely different and 'blames 90% of whats wrong with this relationship on me'. 

Youre right. I stayed because I was hopeful and didnt want to leave him and his son high and dry. Every now and then for a few weeks at a time he was loving, and caring. He would kiss me and tell me everything I wanted to hear. Then I was blind sided again with mean, hurtful comments and shame. Thats why I said it was cyclic. It was constantly up and down. Unfortunately, I'm not sure if that was part of his plan the entire time. 

I'm just baffled and hurt and it feels like the last 2 years of my life were a complete lie. How do you look someone in the eyes tells them you love them, propose to them... and not mean it at all?!?! I will never understand how sick someone could be to do that to another person. 

[ShyViolet]

58 minutes ago, AlexisH33407 said:

I'm just baffled and hurt and it feels like the last 2 years of my life were a complete lie. 

I still think that you have a very unhealthy mindset.  You're making it sound like he swindled you and lied to you the whole time.  He was actually quite honest with you and showed you EXACTLY who he was..... he treated you horribly throughout the relationship, told you outright that he wasn't attracted to you and didn't love you many times, took your money and drained your bank accounts.  You chose to stay with someone like that when there were neon signs all the time that he was a toxic person.  It wasn't "covert".  You will repeat these poor choices unless you intensely work on your own issues and examine why you made these choices.

[Alpacalia]

1 hour ago, AlexisH33407 said:

I have not given him any money or paid any bill for him since the day before we were supposed to go out on a date and didnt. I have had very little contact with him. He wrote me an email saying he would do whatever it takes, and then two days later his attitude was completely different and 'blames 90% of whats wrong with this relationship on me'. 

Okay.

Stay no contact.

Many abusive relationships only become apparent after the fact, and when things are looked back on and it's easy to see how and when things went wrong, hindsight is always 20/20.

Nevertheless, when you are in the midst of it, everything seems to unfold in accordance with a masterplan. In a way, it is the same as boiling a frog. You don’t feel the need to escape until it’s too late to run.

There's nothing wrong with you - it's all down to him. You fell for a manipulative person - not a flaw in your character.

Instead of blaming, take responsibility for your actions going forward.

Keep moving onward.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Alpacalia

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

I'm just baffled and hurt and it feels like the last 2 years of my life were a complete lie. How do you look someone in the eyes tells them you love them, propose to them... and not mean it at all

Research "Hare Psychopathy Checklist". Using someone for  profit is what he did. You're not the welfare department and he exploited a vulnerability he saw. Hopefully your therapist focuses on helping you.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Wiseman2

[BaileyB]

I agree with shyviolet. You are beginning to see the light but you are still focused on the wrong things and asking the wrong questions. I get the sense that you do feel like you were swindled - “it feels like the last 2 years of my life were a complete lie.” In truth, he showed you pretty early on the kind of person that he was - you just didn’t believe him. You saw what you wanted to see in this relationship. You failed to heed the warning signs. 

When he told you that you had gained weight and were not attractive to him - your response was to lose weight in an attempt to appease him and gain his affection. You continued to pay his bills because you wanted to be a “good and supportive partner” - he didn’t actually care as long as you continued to pay his bills. 

I would suggest that you not focus on this man. It matters not at this point - “how do you look someone in the eyes tells them you love them, propose to them... and not mean it at all?!?! I will never understand how sick someone could be to do that to another person.” Of course you don’t understand how he could do this - it’s hard for people who are good and kind people to understand the motives and lack of remorse shown by those who would lie and take advantage. The simple truth, your low self esteem and codependent tendencies make you vulernable to anyone who would take advantage. It’s important for you moving forward that you understand why you didn’t walk at the first sign of trouble… 

Edited July 16, 2022 by BaileyB

[Lotsgoingon]

You saw the red flags: lack of friends ... that's huge. And then he got into financial trouble and asked you for money. Another major red flag.  NEVER give someone money early in a relationship. NEVER!

Save your empath tendencies for other situations. Don't date with an empath strategy. You date with the mindset of a critical employer evaluating job applicants. The employer has standards—you want to have standards, in fact much higher and more critical standards than an employer.

I'm sorry you took seriously his criticism of your weight. Uh, people don't fall out of love with us--or in love with us--because of 15 pounds. I'm sorry you bought that insulting nonsense from him. You NEVER date when someone holds your weight (or some other thing) like a ransom above your head. (Lose weight or else.) That’s just designed to undermine your confidence—to groom you to put up with him being a jerk. And unfortunately it worked. You’re hear explaining why you gained weight and that you have lost weight. Accept yourself as you are. If you want to get more fit, you do it for YOU!

The past 3 years does not have to be a waste of time--as long as you go back and reflect and think hard and perhaps get to therapy to examine how and why you ignored some major red flags. If you don’t do this work, you will likely put up with another jerk once you’re done with this one.

Note: you're an empath and you foolishly (though kindly) loaned him money. Then he talks in return about your weight?! Can you see the imbalance there? 

 

 

 

[spiritedaway2003]

Close your wallet.  He's using you as a ATM.  There was no need for you to support yours AND his household.  Why you felt like you had to - that's something to be examined.  But I hope you're at a place where you could rebuild your savings and make sure you go NC with this man.

Because how you describe this man is not love.  People do fall in and out of love at times, but he was gaslighting you from the beginning it seems. 

It does not matter whether the last 3 years was a lie or not.  Work on instead on why you tolerated it for as long as you had.   I am an empath myself, so I understand where you are coming from.  However, recognize that there are boundaries that you need to set for yourself, to guard and protect yourself, whether financially or emotionally.

I wouldn't spend too much time thinking about whether the time was wasted, but rather what you can learn from it and move on from this bad situation. 

[AlexisH33407]

Here’s the thing… I love him and I can’t help who I love. I love him, I loved waking up next to him, I loved what he future promised that our life would be like. I fell in love with a promise of what our life would be like, I fell in love with words. 
 

I know that I need to work on myself, my convictions and am trying to do that now being in therapy. 
 

I guess I’m just looking for other females that have been through something similar and to share our experiences with eachother. 
 

For example- after he told me he would be willing to do whatever it took to earn me back… I told him that he would have to self evaluate his actions; see and understand how his actions or lack of could hurt others and give me a plan on how he will work on that moving forward… TODAY I was called a fat, mouthy, selfish, self centered, delusional [ ] for asking him to do something like that and not understanding that I’ve caused 90% of the damage in our relationship! HE LITERALLY  TOLD ME HE WOULD RATHER TALK ABOUT ME HINGS IN PERSON SO HE COUKD SEE MY REACTIONS TO WHAT HE HAS TO TELL ME FACE TO FACE… 

Again… I know what he has done is inexcusable and that I am at fault for not setting boundaries and allowing him to use me. But I cannot help that I still love him and feel that I miss more of the person he promised he would be instead of the man that he was! I miss the attachment to him more 

Edited July 17, 2022 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
language

[basil67]

I don't agree that you love him.  I think you love the idea of what your future could have been if he'd been a decent man.

[BaileyB]

34 minutes ago, AlexisH33407 said:

Here’s the thing… I love him and I can’t help who I love.

I agree with basil, I think that you love the idea of this man. And, I think that you love the way that you feel when he isn’t calling you names and putting you down…

34 minutes ago, AlexisH33407 said:

TODAY I was called a fat, mouthy, selfish, self centered, delusional [ ] for asking him to do something like that and not understanding that I’ve caused 90% of the damage in our relationship! HE LITERALLY  TOLD ME HE WOULD RATHER TALK ABOUT ME HINGS IN PERSON SO HE COUKD SEE MY REACTIONS TO WHAT HE HAS TO TELL ME FACE TO FACE… 

What is it about abusive men that attracts you, exactly? Because, to recount this story and then say - “I can’t help it, I love this man…” speaks to a certain dysfunction. 

If you do love this man, I would suggest that you love him from afar. 

Edited July 17, 2022 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

19 minutes ago, S2B said:

rules of engagement… #1 do NOT engage!

Yup! Nothing like trying to reason with an unreasonable man… 

[ShyViolet]

2 hours ago, AlexisH33407 said:

Here’s the thing… I love him and I can’t help who I love. I love him, I loved waking up next to him, I loved what he future promised that our life would be like. I fell in love with a promise of what our life would be like, I fell in love with words. 

There's a very deep dysfunction here, that you would love a man who is abusive.  Your "picker" is broken.  Recognize that.

[ExpatInItaly]

You're in love with hope, OP. 

Hope that he will change into a different person. Hope that he will someday love you. Hope that all this suffering will be worth it. 

But it's time to get real with yourself. The man you hope will be is not the man he is, nor will ever be. Only you can decide when hope isn't enough to waste your life on.