Struggling

[EJay1987]

Hello, 

I know I am not the victim in the situation but I am also struggling and hoping to find some form of help or support. Please no judgement, I give myself enough of that. 
 

I have been the OW for 2 months now. The other person is engaged and lives with his partner. He says that he loves me and wants to be with me but it is going to take  time. It’s clear that this causes him a lot of stress and upset, this was never planned or intended to happen and we both tried to resist it. I have never asked for anything from him or pressured him. 
 

The struggle right now is that they are on a preplanned holiday. This hurts me so much. I am jealous when it’s not really my place to be. I am worried that he may be perfectly happy and I’m the idiot sat at home missing him. I am annoyed that I have put myself in this situation and it hurts a lot right now. 
 

He is still making an effort to contact me whenever possible, he says he misses me, he loves me and that he knows it’s hard right now. 

I don’t really know how to cope with all of these emotions. It’s causing me a lot of anxiety and I just want the week to be done with. I also feel silly for sitting around waiting for someone who’s on holiday with someone else but I don’t doubt his feelings for me.

I don’t want to let my emotions get the better of me and do something irrational like end things or be mad at him. I am trying to keep busy.

[Will am I]

Don't beat yourself up too much. These things happen and it's not all your fault. Your affair partner is at least as guilty as you are.

 

For your affair partner I have a simple advice.

I believe that your affair partner should call off the wedding if already before marriage he needs to be with someone else. I fear he's setting himself up for misery and will incur major emotional and financial costs by getting married now and divorced later.

 

5 minutes ago, EJay1987 said:

I am jealous when it’s not really my place to be.

Of course you can be jealous. You are in an intimate relationship. Even if that relationship should maybe not exist in a utopic world, it is there now. You are in love and it hurts you that your AP is with another woman. These feelings are natural. The fact that you're somewhat used to this situation and that the relationship of your AP with his fiance predates your relationship  will not completely take away these feelings.

8 minutes ago, EJay1987 said:

I don’t want to let my emotions get the better of me and do something irrational like end things or be mad at him

Controlling your emotions is good. 

But you're careful not to get mad at your AP or end the affair. That tells me that you really want the affair to continue.

I advise you to reflect. I think no woman should settle for the position as an OW. It doesn't provide you with the amount of love, attention and respect you deserve. You don't need to live on crumbs of love; you should be with someone who is devoted to you. In the long run, OW always end up getting hurt. You deserve better. You should not want this affair to continue because it is not good for you or your AP.

 

Maybe you have a future with your affair partner. But only if he has the guts to break his engagement. 

 

Be strong and give him the choice between devoting himself to you or to his fiance. If he picks her, you will cry but ultimately you will find new love and it will be better.

[EJay1987]

11 minutes ago, Will am I said:

Don't beat yourself up too much. These things happen and it's not all your fault. Your affair partner is at least as guilty as you are.

 

For your affair partner I have a simple advice.

I believe that your affair partner should call off the wedding if already before marriage he needs to be with someone else. I fear he's setting himself up for misery and will incur major emotional and financial costs by getting married now and divorced later.

 

Of course you can be jealous. You are in an intimate relationship. Even if that relationship should maybe not exist in a utopic world, it is there now. You are in love and it hurts you that your AP is with another woman. These feelings are natural. The fact that you're somewhat used to this situation and that the relationship of your AP with his fiance predates your relationship  will not completely take away these feelings.

Controlling your emotions is good. 

But you're careful not to get mad at your AP or end the affair. That tells me that you really want the affair to continue.

I advise you to reflect. I think no woman should settle for the position as an OW. It doesn't provide you with the amount of love, attention and respect you deserve. You don't need to live on crumbs of love; you should be with someone who is devoted to you. In the long run, OW always end up getting hurt. You deserve better. You should not want this affair to continue because it is not good for you or your AP.

 

Maybe you have a future with your affair partner. But only if he has the guts to break his engagement. 

 

Be strong and give him the choice between devoting himself to you or to his fiance. If he picks her, you will cry but ultimately you will find new love and it will be better.

Thank you, this really helped.

I know I’m reaching my limits on how much I can handle right now but I’m also scared to ask him to make a decision in case it’s too soon and I push him away. He has always praised how patient and understanding I am, I am not naive to the fact that this works in his favour but I do genuinely believe he wants to be with me, it’s just a daunting thing for him to do

[Will am I]

Easy for him to say.

"oh you're so understanding and so patient". Which means he can be with his fiancee and keep you on the side. Because you're the patient and understanding one, the one who will wait for him forever. 

He needs to realize that this situation is already hurting you now, that it will hurt you more and more in the future and that he needs to man up and decide between his two women.

 

For you: don't be "ms. patient and understanding". Expect your AP to make a decision soon. Don't be afraid to walk away from this relationship if he refuses to make that decision (even it it will hurt you and make you cry). Remember that your strength in any kind of negotiotions always comes from having alternatives and being willing to choose the alternatives. Beggars can't be choosers.

Realize that staying in the current status quo will also hurt you. And incrementally over time it will hurt yoiu much more then ending the affair.

Realize that you deserve better. Your AP had a good reason to fall in love with you right?  

 

[EJay1987]

7 minutes ago, Will am I said:

Easy for him to say.

"oh you're so understanding and so patient". Which means he can be with his fiancee and keep you on the side. Because you're the patient and understanding one, the one who will wait for him forever. 

He needs to realize that this situation is already hurting you now, that it will hurt you more and more in the future and that he needs to man up and decide between his two women.

 

For you: don't be "ms. patient and understanding". Expect your AP to make a decision soon. Don't be afraid to walk away from this relationship if he refuses to make that decision (even it it will hurt you and make you cry). Remember that your strength in any kind of negotiotions always comes from having alternatives and being willing to choose the alternatives. Beggars can't be choosers.

Realize that staying in the current status quo will also hurt you. And incrementally over time it will hurt yoiu much more then ending the affair.

Realize that you deserve better. Your AP had a good reason to fall in love with you right?  

 

I needed this, thank you 

[Will am I]

It's good that you're here. Many people here, men and women, with many different perspectives. Most people here seem to have experience in relationships that didn't go as well as they should have (which is probably the common denominator that drew us here in the first place).

 

My perspective is that of a married man with a short history of indidelity. I have given a lot of thought to questions like "what made me do this", and "what does it mean" and "where does life go after an affair". I also reflected with many people here and it's given me a lot more understanding. 

 

In your first post you suggest that your affair was never planned or intended. May I challenge that a little bit?

Of course you didn't set out to be in this situation. Neither did your AP. But, both of you have at one point opened up for the possibility. It could only happen because you opened up and he did too. Looking at my own situation: I also said that I wasn't looking for an affair. I was feeling very lonely in my marriage (and had been for a long time). I was opening up to meeting new friends. Find some joy, find some people outside our shared social circle, make it a little bit easier to talk about my feelings without this echoing back to my wife. I joined a few online communities (no dating sites, more like forums about hobbies and interests). And then *poof* there was a new friend, and she was nice and we could write so openly and I felt at ease because she's half my age so I assumed she would never be into me romantically or sexually. And then *poof* she was. And she went for it with a directness that I have never experienced in any woman. I was blown away and I didn't resist one bit. 

But is it really true that I wasn't looking? The reality is that I wasn't actively approaching people romantically, but at the same time my heart was very open to the idea of receing a crumb of love and experiencing some romantic feelings. I felt starved for those.

So I hadn't set out with bad intentions to cheat on my wife, but I did open the door for the possibility. I think we need to be honest about our motives, even if they aren't always good. It's that kind of honesty that will ultimately help us achieve more success and get into less trouble.

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, EJay1987 said:

I have been the OW for 2 months now. The other person is engaged and lives with his partner. 

they are on a preplanned holiday. This hurts me so much. 

Sorry this happened. Do you work together? How old is he?

 Since you are not exclusive and he's off vacationing with his fiancee, why not use that time to get on some quality dating apps and start talking to and meeting quality single men?

You're not trapped in this after just 60 days. Delete and block him from all your social media and messaging apps so you don't have to see their vacation pics.

[Will am I]

9 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

You're not trapped in this after just 60 days.

Amen.

As much as OP is invested emotionally, it is still "only" a short relationship without very strong ties. 

 

I also support the idea that another man (and a single one this time ) should take her out on candlelight dinner and a romantic walk on the beach. Even if OP is totally in love with AP and nothing would come out of such a date, it's good to expand the horizons and make her feel like she has other options.

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, EJay1987 said:

I know I’m reaching my limits on how much I can handle right

If this it true, you would be wise to tell him to contact you when he breaks off his engagement and he is available to be in a relationship with you. 

It’s only been two months, you are no so invested that you can not take a step back and say - “if you mean what you say, please contact me when you are no longer in a relationship with another woman.” His intention will be very clear to you. If you are truly the person that he loves - he will end his engagement to be with you.

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, EJay1987 said:

I know I’m reaching my limits on how much I can handle right

If this is true then involving yourself with a man who is in a relationship with another woman is a very poor decision. Because - such is the life of the other woman, to watch from the sidelines while he lives his life with his chosen relationship partner. If you are not prepared to suffer this pain and anxiety indefinitely, you would be wise to end this affair. 

[stillafool]

If 

4 hours ago, EJay1987 said:

He says that he loves me and wants to be with me but it is going to take  time.

Did he tell you why it's going to take time to tell her the truth and end the engagement?

[Will am I]

4 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

If this it true, you would be wise to tell him to contact you when he breaks off his engagement and he is available to be in a relationship with you. 
 

Yes. And I believe that AP should break up with his fiancee.

If you're engaged to be married, you should be on the "upward flank" of a relationship. There's the excitement about the partner, the joy of a relationship that is rapidly deepening, the anticipation of the wedding etc. If you're in that situation and despite all this excitement you're falling in love with other women, to me that is a crystal clear sign you should not get married. So I believe that AP should terminate his engagement.

Remain two options for AP. Either he leaves his fiancee and devotes himself to OW. Or he takes not one but three steps back, breaks both relationships and starts with some self analysis as to why he's having problems committing.

 

[EJay1987]

15 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Thank you Will am I, but I'd rather see OP's answer to this question and what he actually told her.

I didn’t really ask or push it to be honest. I know it’s a daunting thing for him with a lot to sort out (house) and the emotional trauma of ending a relationship when in his eyes the other person hasn’t done anything wrong. Also the holidays booked etc 

[stillafool]

2 minutes ago, EJay1987 said:

I didn’t really ask or push it to be honest. I know it’s a daunting thing for him with a lot to sort out (house) and the emotional trauma of ending a relationship when in his eyes the other person hasn’t done anything wrong. Also the holidays booked etc 

I see, but if he's serious why continue to lead this woman on if he's going to break up with her and end the engagement?  Why go on holiday with her when he can just end it and let her take someone else on the trip to ease her pain?  If you don't ask and push him to do the right thing by her and you, he will end up marrying her and keeping you in the OW position.  Do they live together?

[EJay1987]

3 minutes ago, stillafool said:

I see, but if he's serious why continue to lead this woman on if he's going to break up with her and end the engagement?  Why go on holiday with her when he can just end it and let her take someone else on the trip to ease her pain?  If you don't ask and push him to do the right thing by her and you, he will end up marrying her and keeping you in the OW position.  Do they live together?

They own a house together. 

I do get the feeling he knows what he wants he is just very reluctant or scared to do it and wants to make sure it’s the right thing. I think the holiday was seen as an opportunity to clear his head see how he feels with some distance but then I guess I am being too patient and letting him have the best of both worlds right now.

[stillafool]

32 minutes ago, EJay1987 said:

They own a house together. 

I do get the feeling he knows what he wants he is just very reluctant or scared to do it and wants to make sure it’s the right thing. I think the holiday was seen as an opportunity to clear his head see how he feels with some distance but then I guess I am being too patient and letting him have the best of both worlds right now.

Yes you are letting him have the best of both worlds.  That isn't fair to either you or his fiancee.  Isn't it interesting that he's too afraid to tell her he's in love with you and break up to be with you; but not too chicken to cheat on her and have sex with you?  You do realize he's putting her wants and needs ahead of yours and you're allowing it.  You need to break it off with him and tell him when he's broken up with her to contact you.  Then you will see if he's serious or not.  

[Will am I]

1 hour ago, EJay1987 said:

I didn’t really ask or push it to be honest. I know it’s a daunting thing for him with a lot to sort out (house) and the emotional trauma of ending a relationship when in his eyes the other person hasn’t done anything wrong. Also the holidays booked etc 

His practical, financial and emotional hurdles of leaving the relationship are only going to grow. He either needs to make a quick exit or stick with his fiancee/wife forever (and hope she never will find out about you). I do not see a middle ground where he spends another 6 or 12 months with her and then comes to you.

Both viable outcomes require the same behaviour from you: break up with your AP, immediately.

Either it will force him to realize that he wants you above anything and he'll show up on your doorstep very soon. Or he doesn't and you're free to find love with another man, hopefully a loving and devoted parter, for you alone. 

I can't predict which of the two outcomes is more probable. But here's the thing: both are better than the outcome you will have by staying in the affair.

 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, EJay1987 said:

I know it’s a daunting thing for him with a lot to sort out (house) and the emotional trauma of ending a relationship when in his eyes the other person hasn’t done anything wrong. 

It's best to step aside if they are getting married and vacationing together. Don't be his "last fling", so to speak, before he ties the knot.

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, Will am I said:

He's afraid of his fiancee's reaction and possibly the other consequences if he comes clean to her. So he's pushing forward that dreaded moment, living day by day, hoping to dodge the storm

What storm? 

He could end the relationship, they could put the house on the market tomorrow and divide the assets when it sells. He can move in with his parents, crash with a friend, or find his own apartment within a matter of days. Honestly, there is nothing stopping him from making a different decision - if he wanted to. The rest, is just logistics. And as you say, it only gets worse the longer this goes on…

If he means what he say, it won’t take much time for him to untangle himself and form a relationship with you. 

Realistically, he’s unlikely to throw away an engagement and sell the home that he bought with his partner for a woman he has know/“dated” for two months. Don’t fool yourself OP, if he loved her enough to propose and buy a home with her - there is something that keeps them together. The fact that he could express undying love for another woman he’s known for only two months while essentially making a commitment to another woman should be more of a cause for concern than celebration. If this isn’t a HUGE red flag, I don’t know what is - 

Edited June 24, 2022 by BaileyB

[mark clemson]

Hmmm. Since he's not actually married yet, it would seem wise of him to break it off in advance. As hard as that might be, it's probably a LOT easier than a divorce later as folks are pointing out. This affair may be as much a sign that he's not fully on board with committing to his fiancee as it is a sign of anything else.

There may be a lot of social pressure on him to carry forward as well as financial pressure if there are shared obligations (this house you mention).

I would say this could go either way. Plenty of relationships continue for "practical reasons" as much as anything else. It also certainly wouldn't be the first case of someone calling off their wedding for another and/or getting cold feet.

If you really want this guy, I think your chances are a bit better than most, e.g. when the guy has been married for a decade or more. That said, I still think it's a toss up whether he leaves.

"Pressuring" him might push him in either of those directions, which is perhaps a worry for you. But - IF it pushed him into the marriage, that would have the advantage of making it clear more quickly how things were likely to play out eventually.

I've heard some "successful" OWs on this site, who wound up with their partner, say that insisting he end things with the open partner was a key element. However, that's not a very large sample size, so dunno.

I'm not sure finding a new guy right now is the solution. Maybe for some women it would be, but you seem more emotionally attached. I could certainly be wrong, but it sounds like you're more likely to see how this plays out. You could consider setting some sort of reasonable deadline, perhaps 2-4 months, for him to leave or start moving out AND resolve to not succumb to "sunken costs fallacy" if he doesn't. If he doesn't come around, then resolve not to "throw good money after bad."

[heartwhole2]

Maybe I'm reading my own experience into your story, but I'm getting a very heavy feeling that this man is conflict avoidant with a capital C. Yes, he wants to leave her, but he hates conflict and he despises feeling like the bad guy. So he's probably just treading water hoping that she will miraculously end the relationship herself. Then he gets out, but without the conflict and blame! Win/win, for him at least. But why would a person who hasn't been clued into her partner's dissatisfaction end the relationship?

These types of affairs are very common because the conflict avoidant cheater associates hard conversations with conflict and drama, so they avoid them at all costs. This leads to a lot of unspoken resentments, which the non-conflict avoidant partner is oblivious to (often this person is a direct communicator who assumes the conflict avoidant person is sharing when they need to). So then comes an opportunity for an affair, and the cheater feels very justified in taking that plunge based on all of their unspoken grievances. The affair partner thinks, great! We have an amazing relationship that he's never experienced before. Obviously he's going to end his other relationship. But the conflict avoidance that got him into this mess is keeping him stuck. (According to Patterns of Infidelity and Their Treatment, the conflict avoidant affair has one of the highest chances of reconciliation for the original couple because learning to communicate stops the cycle in its tracks.)

As others have pointed out, not even being married is an ideal time to leave a relationship, and yet . . . he isn't/can't/won't? If he's 100% planning to end it and not marry her, then every day he spends pretending otherwise is an extreme cruelty. The only logical explanation is that he isn't 100% sure. Maybe he can keep biding his time and have one of you dump him first; then he doesn't have to make a hard decision and doesn't have to upset anyone.

People always say . . . look at their actions, not their words. For some people, there's a big gap between the two. That means that person isn't exactly acing the self-actualization part of life, and you'd be foolish to expect to have a healthy relationship with someone who can't figure this out.

[SingFish]

22 hours ago, EJay1987 said:

I don’t want to let my emotions get the better of me and do something irrational like end things or be mad at him.

Why can't you be mad at him?

Ethical non-monogamy is one solution if a partner being with someone else is okay with you.

Do you see other people too?

[basil67]

22 hours ago, EJay1987 said:

I have been the OW for 2 months now. The other person is engaged and lives with his partner. He says that he loves me and wants to be with me but it is going to take  time.

Given that they are not yet married, time is of the essence.  If he doesn't end it soon, they will be married

[Will am I]

This. It’s now or never. OP should force AP into making that choice. 

At the same time she should be careful not to force AP to choose her over his fiancee. (by informing the fiancee and blowing up the engagement for example). It must be his choice. Else I’m afraid she’d only be switching roles and face the prospect of being the betrayed wife later on.

Already a big risk when you marry a cheater, but I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt for now.

[basil67]

OP, if you really want a future with him, I agree that you should force the issue.  Give him an ultimatum:  Her or me.  If he doesn't choose you, then walk away.

That said, be careful of a man who chooses a woman he's been infatuated with for only two months over a woman he's promised a future to.