Versacehottie Posted June 16, 2022 Posted June 16, 2022 1 hour ago, Versacehottie said: and it becomes a negative feedback loop. ooops, I mean a FALSE or ERRONEOUS negative feedback loop because, the person usually thinks that they didn't come up with the right "strategy", picked the wrong set of phrase, called her saturday am instead of friday and so on...when instead a different mindset in your own self would have had the biggest impact. Interestingly, over thinkers, still do not fail to draw conclusions from which there may/may not be any correlation AND think of the after effect in absolute or pervasive terms, such as "I'm always friend zoned". Often the one thing they fail to consider is that the main constant in that is their own attitude and belief system so if you can change that you can likely change your outcomes. You also need to be willing to try different things/approaches, UP the number of reps or experiences so you have a large enough sample population of experiences from which to draw conclusions (likely this isn't the case), and be open enough or have a mentally clean enough slate to ALLOW for different experiences than you have had in the past. One thing I think is helpful for people that think like you do, (which does not involve ignoring reality) is to say: "it hasn't worked yet, but it's possible; what are MY inputs--what can i change with MY inputs (the stuff I control). Also look for examples of "possibility". Often it's easier to recognize those in other people. Let's say, for example, you see some nerdy or awkward guy with a pretty girl that looks like she's accomplished or whatever, that's an example. You might even wonder: wow, I've got more to offer than that guy (just speaking surface for sake of this example and no one know what the girl is really like beneath the pretty or what he's like underneath the awkward). Anyway, it's evidence it's possible. People in a negative, overthinking, less than confident state will see those 'examples" and take it even further negatively, like "it NEVER happens for me, even this loser found a girlfriend, I'm doomed" instead of seeing it as an example of it's possible for you as well, ie there is no never/always. Just opening your mind up like that, usually allows you to start working on the actual mechanics of it. Like when you see this awkward guy who seemingly has success with the sort of girl you might be interested in, you start wondering with ACTION steps , how, where, who etc of how he made that happen. Makes you a lot more productive, confident about trying and effective. So try to clear slate to ALLOW for the possibility that it could happen for you as well. It's a lot more empowering to take action when you believe something is IN REACH and REALM of possibility for you. That in itself, becomes a confidence builder or something you don't have to fight against. 1 1
introverted1 Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 I say go for it. @Versacehottiegave you some good ideas about how to approach/what to say. Bottom line is that you haven't seen her in 3 years so if it doesn't work out, what have you actually lost? And it very well could work out. 3
Versacehottie Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 4 hours ago, introverted1 said: Bottom line is that you haven't seen her in 3 years so if it doesn't work out, what have you actually lost? And it very well could work out. excellent point (bolded)!!! 1
Author Broonie71 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Posted June 20, 2022 God this is brutal.... I ended up visiting her town on Saturday in the end. So I'm trying to use that in the text. "Hey <name>, Long time no speak..Was in <your town> at the weekend attending a festival when I realised I must be close to your neck of the woods... How have you been?" Does that sound creepy?
Wiseman2 Posted June 20, 2022 Posted June 20, 2022 10 minutes ago, Broonie71 said: "Hey <name>, Long time no speak..Was in <your town> at the weekend attending a festival when I realised I must be close to your neck of the woods... How have you been?" That's fine. Not too forward and breaks the ice for some contact. 1 1
Alpacalia Posted June 20, 2022 Posted June 20, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Broonie71 said: "Hey <name>, Long time no speak..Was in <your town> at the weekend attending a festival when I realised I must be close to your neck of the woods... How have you been?" Does that sound creepy? No, not creepy. Creepy would be "hey, I'm standing right in front of your house." The message you wrote is a good one. Send away. Edited June 20, 2022 by Alpacalia 2
Versacehottie Posted June 20, 2022 Posted June 20, 2022 2 hours ago, Broonie71 said: God this is brutal.... I ended up visiting her town on Saturday in the end. So I'm trying to use that in the text. "Hey <name>, Long time no speak..Was in <your town> at the weekend attending a festival when I realised I must be close to your neck of the woods... How have you been?" Does that sound creepy? no, not creepy. I would try to do sooner than later...that way it's like it's spontaneous and low pressure vs that you've been stewing on it too long or fretting about it. Speaking about fretting...don't say in your head that "God this is brutal"...your mindset will color the interaction and your thoughts surrounding everything you do toward it etc. You need to put yourself in a more relaxed and positive headspace. What is brutal about it? She's your friend. It's nice to reach out to friends. Good luck 2
ExpatInItaly Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 7 hours ago, Broonie71 said: "Hey <name>, Long time no speak..Was in <your town> at the weekend attending a festival when I realised I must be close to your neck of the woods... How have you been?" Does that sound creepy? No, not at all. It's a pretty neutral way to break the ice. 1
glows Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 9 hours ago, Broonie71 said: "Hey <name>, Long time no speak..Was in <your town> at the weekend attending a festival and thought of you. when I realised I must be close to your neck of the woods... How have you been?" Does that sound creepy? It sounds fine. If you prefer, keep it more brief and simple. I edited it in quotation. 2
Author Broonie71 Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 Quite right - strike whilst the iron is hot... Now messaged her on Fb. She's on Fb alot. Thanks for the advice. :) 1
Versacehottie Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 28 minutes ago, Broonie71 said: Quite right - strike whilst the iron is hot... Now messaged her on Fb. She's on Fb alot. Thanks for the advice. hmmm, don't get all in your head about this but i think taking the FB route is more likely to just be a "hello" and sort of a one time conversation. It was sort of the least risky option (still not a bad thing) but if you want momentum, I think you should have taken the text route--that is more immediate, closer/more intimate, better connected and would probably be more likely to foster continued conversation. Here's the thing before you start freaking out over "having made the wrong move"... a) this is just my opinion (lol I think I'm right but still just one person's opinion who thinks the easier way to "get closer" would be this. b) you can change the method of communication at any time. I wouldn't ask permission. Just when she replies, perhaps just switch to texting. I think the mode of communication that gets you into a more "familiar" space is better, ie in person > phone calls> texts>FB messages. Point being that people have 500 friends on facebook for example, but only 30 that text them regularly, and 10 that call regularly and 5 they spend time with in person (random number to illustrate the point). Anyway the bigger point is that you can change how you stay in touch at any time, don't feel or get yourself locked into a less form of communication. Which brings me to my next point: c) get comfortable with making "mistakes". I wouldn't even call this a mistake or misstep but perhaps it could have been more optimal. Does that mean all is lost? No, of course not. With the right person, it usually doesn't matter and the right person doesn't mind and is happy to hear from you. Usually in trying to get something off the ground there will be a lot more "mistakes". Which the quotation marks are because they aren't really mistakes, they just represent the uncertainty of making that choice and really knowing how it impacted the other person. That said, while you get comfortable and confident just being you and just going after what you want, of course, when there is a choice, obviously try to push your choices toward the optimal ones (i,e don't take the timid road or be too safe if you want to stand out and appear confident). Can't wait to hear how she responds! 2
Author Broonie71 Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 Thanks - So i checked my Contacts and I no longer have her number, hence Fb is my only option. The message has arrived but unread as yet. If I can get a conversation going on Fb, then I can somehow ask for her number. We've spoken before (7-8 years ago, when she was last single lol) on Fb so its something thats familiar... Your advice (all the advice) is great so thanks. Will keep you posted lol... 1
Author Broonie71 Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 Sh*t!!! She responded giving a brief update. She's recovering from COVID so is off work atm. I now have spent 10mins researching open ended questions to get the conversation going. She posts regularly about her kids doing well in sport so I've asked if they got that prowess from her (trying to lighten the conversation). If she wanted to discuss work, I would write an essay lol, but I'm hopeless at small talk. Any conversation pointers would be great - thanks!!! :) 1
glows Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 2 hours ago, Broonie71 said: Sh*t!!! She responded giving a brief update. She's recovering from COVID so is off work atm. I now have spent 10mins researching open ended questions to get the conversation going. She posts regularly about her kids doing well in sport so I've asked if they got that prowess from her (trying to lighten the conversation). If she wanted to discuss work, I would write an essay lol, but I'm hopeless at small talk. Any conversation pointers would be great - thanks!!! Is she a chatty person via text? How does she respond to you so far? Some people don't like small talk and endless questions. If it were me, I'd keep these brief and let her recover in peace. Suggest you meet the next time you're in town. 1
Versacehottie Posted June 22, 2022 Posted June 22, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, Broonie71 said: Sh*t!!! She responded giving a brief update. She's recovering from COVID so is off work atm. I now have spent 10mins researching open ended questions to get the conversation going. She posts regularly about her kids doing well in sport so I've asked if they got that prowess from her (trying to lighten the conversation). If she wanted to discuss work, I would write an essay lol, but I'm hopeless at small talk. Any conversation pointers would be great - thanks!!! Great. See? You approached it sort of like a friend and of course she was happy to hear from you. First pointer is don't say that to yourself (the bolded)...your beliefs will color what you are capable of and how you approach what you try. In other words, when you are needing confidence, you need to be supportive of yourself rather than tear yourself down with limiting beliefs. You seem fine at conversing here. Again, lower the stakes. Talk with her like a friend that you care about. Keep it more simple with less at stake. Along those lines, I don't think you need to research what to say. It might come off forced or awkward. A key component of being good at conversation is to be "in the moment" , nimble/flexible, and a good listener. Compliments like you gave her are nice but might feel like they are coming out of left field (or forced) and then fall flat. That sort of compliment IMO is much better as the result a conversation that leads you to that place. In other words, don't try so hard to win her over. Because that usually doesn't work via compliments alone. IMO, banter, understanding, "getting" the person, building a connection, expressing who you are take you farther along. Any conversation, has little nuggets that you can pick out and expand the conversation (if you are a good conversationalist, which anyone can be; it requires listening and then bringing some of yourself to the moment). A riff on a simple thing such as "having covid so stuck at home": you can ask what she is doing with her time, which can turn into a discussion of tv show, movies, books, games, food, etc. Any topic she brings up, you can/should expand on with more questions, light-hearted jokes, THEN a compliment perhaps (ie compliment is IN RESPONSE to her expressing herself or showing you something about herself). Ugh I'm not explaining it well at all--hopefully you get me. Anyway, you could also send her funny memes or recommendations for shows or books. The point is even on something as simple of a fact as "Have covid and stuck at home" can branch out into a ton of topics or things to talk about. That's why it's good to be flexible and not rely on "research" or some pre-planned thing to say. You want to roll with what is actually being said and contribute who you are. Like you said, you could write a novel about work stuff...if there is a way to talk about work without sounding like a big complaint machine, but make her laugh or peak her curiosity about something that's another good avenue. You could also joke that either she is faking covid to get out of work or thank God she has it to be missing xyz (something along those lines--also don't use this if it will fall flat with her or if you don't know her well enough to know how it would go over). Idk, i could go on and on but good conversations with people that are close or becoming close are sort of ones that often jump all over the place. People always give clues in what they say to you about what they would like to talk about---all of which is a signal to you, the good conversationalist haha--to pick up on that point and run with it or come back to it after you finish the primary conversational intention... in other words, noticing the secondary little nugget is often what makes people feel like you really 'get" them. I will try to use an example if one arises in something you post soon. Even staying on the sports subject since you went there. Rather than just sum it up as she is athletically-gifted and give her a compliment. Why not delve deeper into what sports she does, did, her personal history. ie ask what sports she did as a teenager herself, find out a lot about that and then you can even ask (generally) what she was like as a teenager. Lot of this is much better verbally/in person or on phone than over text. She might tell you she was a nightmare as a teenager ie rebellious and then it opens up to ask how things are going with her kids. You just have to look at a conversation as a river with a ton of tributaries (possible ones!). I wouldn't overwhelm her. A key component is being able to " read the room" and sense the vibe. i think go for the vibe which is the residual feeling you always want a person to come away with: wow, that was fun, i liked talking to him, he feels like he understands me. Ok good luck! Edited June 22, 2022 by Versacehottie 4
Versacehottie Posted June 22, 2022 Posted June 22, 2022 oh importantly because I believe this. While I'm saying all this conversation stuff, my real belief is that this stuff has MUCH more impact in person (or second choice on phone so people can hear the vocal intonations etc). So I would try to get her to meetup vs taking this conversation over FB on endlessly (and sort of waste the potential impact). I mean on one level now if you are messaging back and forth even if it's more basic and not a lot of emotion into it, you can sort of easily jump to: "hey, I'm so glad I contacted you; as soon as you've recovered from Covid, let's go to coffee/drink/lunch/dinner to catch up".....To be honest, the covid sort of gives you a good reason to say that whereas if she didn't have it, it might feel like a bigger hurdle (IMO), ie life normal and smooth for her and then you have to make up some other excuse to see her...in this the excuse (covid) is built in for you. Ie you treat it as if it's the only thing standing in the way of you catching up properly. And people like to have things to look forward to for when they get over covid. 3
Author Broonie71 Posted June 24, 2022 Author Posted June 24, 2022 (edited) So we've been messaging back and forth on Fb... just pleasantries and a catchup. Nothing more - which is fine. I messaged today say hey its been great chatting and have a great weekend. To which she replied "lovely chatting too...have a great weekend"... so my next steps are (I know I overthink)... leave it for a week or so (she's got COVID) then in a weeks time say to her I'm going to be in her area for car repairs...is she free to grab a coffee.... I'm worried if I keep messaging every day she'll get p'ed off (although she is responding..)... How does the above sound? BTW thanks to ALL for the pointers... its been a real benefit even if nothing comes of this, I can use going forward. Edited June 24, 2022 by Broonie71
Wiseman2 Posted June 24, 2022 Posted June 24, 2022 27 minutes ago, Broonie71 said: in a weeks time say to her I'm going to be in her area for car repairs...is she free to grab a coffee.... Excellent, but leave out the car repairs nonsense. By trying to sound too casual you're making it sounds like an afterthought. Instead ask her when she is free. Focus on her not your transmission. Do not burden people with your car trouble. 2
Alpacalia Posted June 24, 2022 Posted June 24, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Broonie71 said: So we've been messaging back and forth on Fb... just pleasantries and a catchup. Nothing more - which is fine. I messaged today say hey its been great chatting and have a great weekend. To which she replied "lovely chatting too...have a great weekend"... so my next steps are (I know I overthink)... leave it for a week or so (she's got COVID) then in a weeks time say to her I'm going to be in her area for car repairs...is she free to grab a coffee.... I'm worried if I keep messaging every day she'll get p'ed off (although she is responding..)... How does the above sound? BTW thanks to ALL for the pointers... its been a real benefit even if nothing comes of this, I can use going forward. Agree. Wish her good night next time you're chatting (but indicate the same, such as you hope she has a good night or rests well tonight) and you enjoy talking and texting and would like to take her out for coffee over the next few days. That way your intentions are clear. Edited June 24, 2022 by Alpacalia 1
Versacehottie Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) I don't think you should "leave it for a week". You should use momentum, which is in your favor (always). And just say we should meet up for a coffee (or drink or meal) while wrapping up one of your FB conversations. BTW, other than "wrapping up" that conversation where you ask her out essentially, I don't think otherwise you should WRAP UP any conversations like you did with "have a good weekend". Why? A wrap up message like that cuts the conversation--and stalls momentum. Why would you want to do that? Someone like you that overthinks will have to then think of a new reason to reopen the conversation....so if she does not do it herself, you are sort of stuck again. Just keep it flowing IMO. But also anyway, you are at the point where it's good to graduate to "let's meet up!". I, personally, would not favor coffee because I think it feels business-like and stiff but if that's your only way in or only way you feel comfortable, still go for it. I think drink or a meal is more fun and gives more of a vibe that takes thing where anything is a possibility. Also reflects on you as a measure of how uptight or not that you are. Conveys a message. Lol, you want to sweep someone up in what fun it can be to be in your life and your love of life and what you do to have fun. That's the dream you are selling! You want it to be Starbucks where lots of people go daily by themselves and very sterile in a sense or you want to inject a little personality? I'd opt for something that injects some personality. The beginning of relationships tend to TRANSPORT people out of their regular life so all the things that are out of the norm, like a place that is more unique than a coffee is better IMO. But still if you feel coffee if your only option, still take it. Also I think you need to be careful about signing off for the weekend...why? That is keeping things in colleague territory only. And perhaps planting the seed where she wonders if you are dating someone. I don't think you need to "wait" either until she is over COVID. She can process the decision now to say yes to meeting up with you as soon as she is better, if she is chatting with you on FB. Don't be too literal with that. You want to use momentum, which you have now. Good luck Edited June 25, 2022 by Versacehottie 2
Author Broonie71 Posted June 25, 2022 Author Posted June 25, 2022 Yeah good point about wrapping up the conversation and momentum. I'll need to think of a way of restarting it without coming across as bombarding her with messages which may make her think "why is he suddenly contacting me"... I think coffee would be a simpler option to start with so its a 30min meet and if it goes well I can suggest a drink/meal next time. There are some cool independent coffee shops in town which are not any of the brands lol... 1
Author Broonie71 Posted June 25, 2022 Author Posted June 25, 2022 I might restart the conversation early next week with "Hope you have recovered from Covid..." and then when she replies, say "lets meet up - when are you free?" 2
Versacehottie Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Broonie71 said: Yeah good point about wrapping up the conversation and momentum. I'll need to think of a way of restarting it without coming across as bombarding her with messages which may make her think "why is he suddenly contacting me"... I think coffee would be a simpler option to start with so its a 30min meet and if it goes well I can suggest a drink/meal next time. There are some cool independent coffee shops in town which are not any of the brands lol... lol that's exactly why you don't want to "wrap up" because then you NEED to restart it. If you just trail off and restart whenever, no explanation is needed. You just flow and can bring her more into your every day life and be more into hers. You "restart" by picking up where you left off rather than fully have an opening line again. Ugh, hope i'm making sense. Ok not to make you overthink it but I would just caution with each of the bolded items above that you are defaulting to timid and tip-toeing. That, IMO, is not the best. If you are trying to sell yourself, you need to brim with confidence---of which a tiptoeing method is not the best. In a way, if you are worried about "bombarding her with messages" and her thought process about why are you in contact, the underlying message is that essentially you have an ulterior motive to eventually lull or trick her into liking her INSTEAD OF the underlying thought of "why wouldn't she be happy to hear from me" . I think if you do not adopt this attitude and quickly you won't be operating at optimal YOU and it will likely affect your chances with her. If you are worried about doing everything right, take it BACK to FRIEND level. That should make it easier to have in your mind, "she will like to hear from a good friend; I'm a good friend". lol it's definitely not my preference any coffee date, but if you honestly believe she will think that as sort of exciting (maybe a cerebral type discussion person or foodie or intellectual); I definitely get the feeling that you are defaulting to that because you think it's the least imposition and most you are "allowed" to ask for. Inherent to that is you aren't holding yourself at the same level as she is. That is not good, my friend. People want their equal or better. You will not get far if you are approaching this timidly. *did you say you often get friend zoned? This most likely is the reason if so. If you keep playing it safe, you won't get far. You aren't going to be able to "hide" yourself until she falls in love with you. Basically each opportunity squandered without showing her how awesome it would be to date you, is a wasted opportunity. Lots of girls on this site will say they are fine with a coffee date though they generally mean off an app where they want a quick escape route and not to invest a lot to meet up (also a mistake but I digress). You guys already know each other. An independent cool coffee shop is better than Starbucks but not by a lot People will disagree with me on the venue but I don't think many will disagree on the fact that acting timid or her up there, you down there is a bad vibe. So snap out of it Edited June 25, 2022 by Versacehottie 3
Author Broonie71 Posted June 26, 2022 Author Posted June 26, 2022 Thanks more wise words. I'll suggest a drink - knowing my luck she'll be Tee-Total now though lol
Wiseman2 Posted June 26, 2022 Posted June 26, 2022 1 hour ago, Broonie71 said: Thanks more wise words. I'll suggest a drink - knowing my luck she'll be Tee-Total now though lol Try not to overanalyze. Be much more flexible as far as where, when and what. For example ask if she is free over the weekend for a coffee, drink or lunch. Boxing yourself in with car repairs, overly specific times, dates and places will leave you guessing if she simply can't make such a ridged appointment or simply isn't interested. keep an open mind and be flexible. 2
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