Patience with a guarded woman

[Scotty Riggs]

I went out with an introverted and somewhat guarded woman (a goth in her youth), and it’s tough reading her. I want to get to know her, and I think we had a good first date. She smiled a lot, enjoyed my humor and stories, and asked me questions. As we started to wrap up, she wasn’t eager to depart and noted that I have her number if I want to reach out. I noted Thai (our initial plan), and she acted mildly positive. As we continued chatting outside and finally went our separate ways, I said I would “definitely get in touch again,” to which she smiled and said “Yeah… I’d like that.” Simple words, but they felt earnest given her understated demeanor.

I texted the next day that I had fun, asked how her weekend is going, and noted a project I’m working on. A few hours later, she responded about her weekend and asked about my project. I replied later in the late evening asking if she goes foraging (hoping to set up a hiking date). She responded the next morning and gave a follow-up question, as she has in previous responses.

She's not very punctual or frequent in communicating, but she already was like that leading up to our date, so maybe this is just her pace and personality? I want to get to know her better, but I also feel like I’m more eager, and I wonder about her interest level. I wish I wouldn't get so anxious about these matters. I'll probably let her alone Monday and text her some date ideas Tuesday.

Edited April 18, 2022 by Scotty Riggs

[Calmandfocused]

She’s demonstrating interest in you but she’s not overly investing yet.
 

Not surprising after only one date. 

She doesn’t sound guarded to me. She sounds like a very smart lady! 
 

All sounds positive to me. Enjoy the journey

[Scotty Riggs]

31 minutes ago, Calmandfocused said:

She doesn’t sound guarded to me. She sounds like a very smart lady! 

Thank you. "Guarded" might not be the best description, but understated or restrained. She has a bit of a "dark" charisma, which I find appealing but also hard to gauge. 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, Scotty Riggs said:

. I replied later in the late evening asking if she goes foraging (hoping to set up a hiking date). 

After one good date, she seems interested so focus more on setting something else up than "texting punctuality".

Texting is not dating, so slow down on that. You don't know her. The only way to do that is to see each other in person on dates.

What's up with the foraging? Does she even like hiking? It's ok to ask what her interests are and set something up accordingly.

Some women may not feel comfortable alone on some hiking trails until you've established more presence.

[ExpatInItaly]

She barely knows you, OP. To me this isn't restraint - it's simply her interacting with a guy she met just one time. 

I think you're overly-anxious and it's making you perceive her as restrained, when actually her interactions with you sound quite normal. She has responded positively so far, so I would try to take a couple deep breaths. Everything looks good. 

 

[Scotty Riggs]

16 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

After one good date, she seems interested so focus more on setting something else up than "texting punctuality".

Texting is not dating, so slow down on that. You don't know her. The only way to do that is to see each other in person on dates.

What's up with the foraging? Does she even like hiking? It's ok to ask what her interests are and set something up accordingly.

Yeah, we all have our lives. I sometimes take many hours to respond to text. I just feel like routinely taking several hours to respond seems a little odd, but not too concerning.

She went hiking over the weekend, so I asked if she forages for wild foods. It's a possible springtime date, but you pose a good question about women's comfort level being in the woods with a new person. Since I'm a photographer and am learning to use some new gear I just got, I'm considering asking her to meet me at an old cemetery in town to take some portraits. I love shooting friends' portraits and think the setting would suit our personalities, but I also don't want to ask her to play model if she doesn't want to. Maybe that could be a third or fourth date.

[ExpatInItaly]

3 minutes ago, Scotty Riggs said:

I'm considering asking her to meet me at an old cemetery in town to take some portraits.

My dad is a professional photographer so I can appreciate the artistic merit in this. I've had a camera pointed at me my entire life, including as the subject for some of his professional projects. 

However, I would personally feel quite uncomfortable posing for a man I don't know well (outside a professional studio, I mean) I would save this idea until you get to know each other better. See if she likes you first, then gague whether she'd be comfortable having you shoot photos of her. 

[Scotty Riggs]

17 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

I think you're overly-anxious and it's making you perceive her as restrained, when actually her interactions with you sound quite normal. She has responded positively so far, so I would try to take a couple deep breaths. Everything looks good. 

She seems more low-key and restrained in expressing herself than any girl I've dated before that was interested in me. I don't see anything wrong with that, but I do feel like she has more of a "protective layer" and more smoldering charisma than most girls I've dated. Maybe it's easier to see in person than to be explained in words.

[Scotty Riggs]

11 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

However, I would personally feel quite uncomfortable posing for a man I don't know well (outside a professional studio, I mean) I would save this idea until you get to know each other better. See if she likes you first, then gague whether she'd be comfortable having you shoot photos of her. 

Thank you. I'd just like to think of something other than dining for a date. Something that encourages use of skills and improvisation alongside conversation. Foraging would allow us to explore and talk, and swap our knowledge of edible plants. But so many activities like that have a concern for her comfort and safety.

Edited April 18, 2022 by Scotty Riggs

[ExpatInItaly]

4 minutes ago, Scotty Riggs said:

Thank you. I'd just like to think of something other than dining for a date. Something that encourages use of skills and improvisation alongside conversation. 

There's nothing wrong with that, but you also don't need to try too hard for a second date either. 

If you sense she is low-key, there is nothing wrong with a meal together and a walk around an interesting part of town, for example. 

[Wiseman2]

21 minutes ago, Scotty Riggs said:

 I'm a photographer and am learning to use some new gear I just got, I'm considering asking her to meet me at an old cemetery in town to take some portraits.

No. Just no. Take nature pics on your own time. Maybe it seems like a good date, but it could be misconstrued as creepy to go off in the woods (not bringing food and foraging) then on top of it taking pictures.  A cemetery? Now that is seriously creepy. Ask her what she would like to do. 

[balletomane]

It sounds like you're trying too hard to create a 'unique' second date, OP. I'd avoid that. Going out to eat or to a bar may be what everyone does, but there's a reason for that. Most people are going to be more comfortable in public settings, and with dinner there's always a natural end point for the date. Save the more unusual activities for when you actually know each other and you know what she would like.

[chillii]

You say she takes her time responding but then you say you replied later late that evening, yaknow!!!!

Besides , you know nothing of how she ticks yet that's a nice thing, be pretty boring if you could read her like a book already and she probably knows that. lt's probably just her way for now anyway she doesn't know you either and would've been through all this 100 times. l agree with some above she said a few nice things after your date that's enough, what do you want she throws herself at you. Just go out with her again and see how things go. And ps, yeah also agree the cemetery and photos again she doesn't even know you probably won't want your camera full of pics of her or to be posing like that out at some cemetery.

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by chillii

[Lotsgoingon]

Chill. Texting needs nothing--literally almost zero--when dating, especially for young people. 

People will text for hours and hours and have no interest in meeting the person or going for another date. You don't learn much from texting.

So set up the second date and cut all the conversations in between. Say hi ... ask her a superficial question about her week ... and then set up the date. Don't start serious conversations over texts. Daily texting is very iffy when you're starting. Those conversations are for in person. 

And drop trying to stage the dates. Take your to a favorite park or cemetery if you like, but drop the photography. You don't know her well enough for that. And she can't "read" you yet.  That's jumping ahead too much. Think of an activity you would like, a place you would like to go ... and ask her there. Keep things simple Focus on your interests. If the relationship is going to work, then your interests matter. Trying to figure out what she wants is a waste of time. You will learn what she likes over time as you spend real live time (not texting) with her.

Now a question: you describe her response. But did YOU really like her, despite her restraint? I didn't hear your feelings. You more described her reactions to you. 

 

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

No. Just no. Take nature pics on your own time. Maybe it seems like a good date, but it could be misconstrued as creepy to go off in the woods (not bringing food and foraging) then on top of it taking pictures.  A cemetery? Now that is seriously creepy. Ask her what she would like to do. 

Was also my thought. There is no way that I would agree to spend an evening alone with a man that I do not know in a cemetery. No offence OP, if you knew each other better it would be a really interesting thing to do. But for a woman, this raises all kind of alarm bells with respect to personal safety. 

[Scotty Riggs]

6 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

No. Just no. Take nature pics on your own time. Maybe it seems like a good date, but it could be misconstrued as creepy to go off in the woods (not bringing food and foraging) then on top of it taking pictures.  A cemetery? Now that is seriously creepy. Ask her what she would like to do. 

Foraging and photography are two separate ideas, but better for a later time. The cemetery isn't creepy, secluded or unsafe. It's essentially a city park, in the middle of town, that people review on Google as a fun place to visit. Plus, she and I both enjoy those themes (we collect bones, etc). But I totally get not suggesting a photo session style date so early, hence my apprehension. Thank you.

 

[Stret]

7 hours ago, Scotty Riggs said:

She seems more low-key and restrained in expressing herself than any girl I've dated before that was interested in me. I don't see anything wrong with that, but I do feel like she has more of a "protective layer" and more smoldering charisma than most girls I've dated. Maybe it's easier to see in person than to be explained in words.

Then let her have her protective layer for God's sake, you've met her once. You sound a bit over the top to me and should really take a step back and let her be herself, respect her boundaries and if she feels some day she can let her guard down, she will. If not, the more you insist, the more you'll push her away. 

[Scotty Riggs]

3 hours ago, Lotsgoingon said:

And drop trying to stage the dates. Take your to a favorite park or cemetery if you like, but drop the photography. You don't know her well enough for that. And she can't "read" you yet.  That's jumping ahead too much. Think of an activity you would like, a place you would like to go ... and ask her there. Keep things simple Focus on your interests. If the relationship is going to work, then your interests matter. Trying to figure out what she wants is a waste of time. You will learn what she likes over time as you spend real live time (not texting) with her.

Now a question: you describe her response. But did YOU really like her, despite her restraint? I didn't hear your feelings. You more described her reactions to you. 

Thank you. That's very helpful advice. As to how I feel, I wasn't head over heels after the first date, but I genuinely like, relate to, and want to get to know her better. Most dates I've had in recent years, the women have wanted another date, while I haven't. So it's a big relief to finally find some mutual interest. This would be the first second date I've had in many years.

In my early dating years, I treated it like progressing to the next level in a video game. I'm a perfectionist, and even if I wasn't that into a girl, it felt like an investment. So I'd sometimes get silent rejection by someone I didn't even particularly like. It's hard to fully shake that mentality and approach, but I'm much better now at dropping second date prospects if I'm genuinely not feeling it. But clearly I also need to ease back on ambitious date ideas so early on and to not overthink it.

Edited April 18, 2022 by Scotty Riggs

[Scotty Riggs]

6 minutes ago, Stret said:

Then let her have her protective layer for God's sake, you've met her once. You sound a bit over the top to me and should really take a step back and let her be herself, respect her boundaries and if she feels some day she can let her guard down, she will. If not, the more you insist, the more you'll push her away. 

I haven't been pushy. She just feels kind of enigmatic, and sometimes I start overanalyzing. In that way, I frustrate myself. So I hear you, and I agree. Thank you.

[glows]

She is interested if she’s responding to you and agreeing to meet with you. You can both decide on the date ideas and run it by her if you have suggestions and vice versa. You need to find out from her and not speculate.

 

Edited April 19, 2022 by glows

[Wiseman2]

18 hours ago, Scotty Riggs said:

. Something that encourages use of skills and improvisation alongside conversation. Foraging would allow us to explore and talk, and swap our knowledge of edible plants. 

Try not to make the date seem like a test.  This seems like a high school biology test. In fact a lot of it seems more like a chore or test than a fun date.

Ok you're trying for "unique", but it's a little over the top for someone you don't know and assume is "dark".

 

 

[Scotty Riggs]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

Try not to make the date seem like a test.  This seems like a high school biology test. In fact a lot of it seems more like a chore or test than a fun date.

Ok you're trying for "unique", but it's a little over the top for someone you don't know and assume is "dark".

There's a variety of date ideas out there that involve those themes, like a cooking class or sports/recreation. She and I share some "dark" interests (macabre art, collecting bones, etc.), but I realize the word "dark" is vague and open to interpretation. We also both like foraging, and it's spring. So I don't think any of my ideas are bad or over the top in general. However, I agree that they aren't ideal suggestions this early on, and that plans for early dates should be conservative. If we're seeing each other a month from now, they could be worthy suggestions.

Edited April 19, 2022 by Scotty Riggs

[CollinW]

I'll put this as blunt and frank as possible because I would want someone to do the same to me in this situation. 

You need to calm your ass down. 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, Scotty Riggs said:

. We also both like foraging, and it's spring. So I don't think any of my ideas are bad or over the top 

Ok, it's all part of the get-to-know-you process. If you're both into these things that's good. However it's still just one date so far, and you're right, be more conservative until you establish more rapport and trust.

[smackie9]

She's not being hard to read, she's being quite normal with dating a stranger/new person. It's normal to be a little reserved. You are sounding a bit thirsty. You are already trying to strategize to increase interest when all you have to do is slow your roll and let things unfold organically with simple conversation over a slice of pizza.