Am I in the wrong for wanting exclusivity in my LDR while we work on our stuff?

[livinglongdistance]

Hi everyone,

I've only just signed up but have been snooping the long distance relationship forms for advice for a while ever since I started a long distance relationship of my own. Let me give you some background.

I (32M) am in a LDR with my partner (25F). I live in Europe and she lives in North America. We met online and never expected to develop feelings for each other, but ultimately we did. We have known each other about 6 years and have been in a relationship for approximately 3/4. We have met in person quite regularly, and last summer she came to stay for most of the summer at my place. It was great, we really clicked and living together for that time was better than either of us could've expected and we talked a lot about how we'd like it in the future. Unfortunately work family committments means that it's not possible for either of us to relocate right now but we have both said that we would be willing to move to be with the other one if it worked out that way.

Going back to the start a little, we had some rough patches around the start of our relationship where both of us were unfaithful and we both massively regretted it (this was before we met for the first time). After meeting for the first time we became more serious and have remained faithful to each other completely (I mean, I certainly have, and I am 10% confident that she has as well), but as you will see this is complicated by the below a little bit.

Before we met she had never really had relationships and certainly not anything long term (she suffered a lot with anxiety and depression when younger so never really got to know people). I got married very young and subsequently got divorced so I had experience of long term relationships. I was aware that she felt almost as though she had "missed out" on things like dating and meeting people because her first serious relationship was long distance and I understood this completely. She previously (2-3 years ago) discussed the idea of her maybe seeing other people, not necessarily for anything more than dating, and not for a relationship, just for her to experience that sort of stuff. I struggled with the idea a little, but I genuinely do love this woman and want the best for her and want her happy. Plus I am not the jealous sort and I was confident in our relationship. I was also happy that she talked to me about this as to me it showed that she was being open with me.

So we agreed that she could "date" a little and just see how it went, but that nothing would be "hidden", everything would be open and honest and we would discuss everything as it happened to check we were both still happy etc. (Btw this was after we had met the first few times but before she had stayed with me for a full summer).

This is where it started going a little off the rails. After we had agreed that she could meet other people, she seemed to go off the idea completely. She would talk to people for a little bit then just stop, and it would be on and off quite a lot. She would go through phases of talking to people, and then she'd just stop again. I started to ask her more about exactly what she was looking for and she kept telling me that she didn't really know. When I asked her to think about it so we could talk about it she said I was making it all "too serious" so it was stressing her out. 

I will point out at this stage that she still suffers from severe anxiety and panic attacks, these are diagnosed and do come on when she is feeling stressed or worked up about something, so talking about serious issues is hard. We usually need to break these down into little conversations we have over a period to make sure she doesn't struggle. I have had partners in the past who have also suffered and I understand this and am fine communicating in this way.

However every time I brought it up as a subject she would get annoyed and say that she didn't know what she wanted. I would ask if she wanted to just meet people, or if she wanted to date, or if she wanted sex, and she'd always say that she didn't really know. She would say that she'd never really had it so didn't know what she wanted, and how could she know until she'd had it etc etc. But then it would all go silent on the topic for months until I brought it up again and asked what was going on, at which point she would again say that she still didn't know what she wanted exactly.

I worked very hard to get to a place where I was going to be ok with whatever she wanted, I understand that long distance relationships are difficult, I understand what it can be like to feel like you've missed out on your "youth" and the experiences that go with it, I also understood at the time that there was a chance our relationship might not work out and it wouldn't be right for me to restrict her from having these things in her life for a man on the other side of the world.

So I went through it all with her, told her what I'd be ok with and what I would need in return for me to feel confident about our relationship while this was happening. These were things like making sure we had time for us still, making sure that we kept lines of communication open all the time, making sure that nothing was hidden or kept secret that we were totally honest at all times and making sure that if either of us ever became uncomfortable with the situation or were not ok with it anymore it would stop to let us have chance to talk about it more. We agreed all of this, but then ultimately nothing happened, she didn't meet anyone for nearly 2 years, and every time I would ask about it, she would say that she still felt like she needed to "at some point." After a while I started saying that I couldn't wait around forever with the knowledge that she might still want to see other people "at some point".

It's important to say at this point, at the start of our relationship, both long distance, and when we met in person, it was very sexual, and we both loved it. We had a great time, we explored new things, it was intense. Now I am never one to think that couples can maintain the level of sexual intimacy from the start of their relationship forever, there will always be some up and down and things won't always be as "steamy" as they were at the beginning. But after the first couple of years things really fell off a cliff, and this was around the same time that she first suggested that she might want to see other people. We went from doing something "sexual", be that phone sex or video calls or stuff like that, 2 or 3 times a week, to it being once a month, at the most. Ultimately this then decreased to basically never. I know that her anxiety medication has caused a significant drop off on her sex drive, and I completely understand. We talked about it and she has said that she will try to find more time for that and work on more of that side of the relationship for us, because I made no secret of the fact that I found it hard without that.

Then last summer comes around. We hadn't talked about her seeing other people for a long while before she came to stay with me for the summer and ultimately the whole time was amazing, it felt so natural and we were so close, it just felt totally right. We talked about how amazing it was to actually have an extended amount of time together and how it felt like we were living together for real and that it felt natural. There were a few issues with regards to sex during that time, she didn't seem particularly "interested" in it most of the time, but when we did have sex it was amazing and we both loved it. She explained after that her medication means that it's just much harder for her to feel "in the mood", but once she is then she's fine. It comes across as her not wanting intimacy, and that's because she doesn't have those urges as much, but once she is in the mood everything is fine. Ultimately I don't have any problem with this whatsoever, we had amazing sex when we were able to and everything else was so perfect, I couldn't have asked for a better summer.

After summer was over it went back to us not having any intimate stuff whatsoever, it's much hard to get in the mood when you are on opposite sides of the planet I guess. But we didn't talk about her wanting to perhaps see other people again, when I brought it up she said she wasn't feeling like that any more and that she didn't think she wanted it anymore. 

So time went by, I struggled a lot without having any intimacy at all and we tried to work on that a little bit, but ultimately it was a non starter. But the rest of our relationship was great, we made time for each other and it really was brilliant, the summer together had brought us even closer and I made plans to visit her over Christmas/New Year just gone. When I did we had the same issues with regards to intimacy but this time they were more "worse". During the 15 days I was there we had sex twice and on both of those occasions it felt as though she was only doing it because she thought she should. Despite me checking with her multiple times that it was actually what she wanted it ultimately felt like she didn't enjoy herself and as a result neither did I. She actively avoided any sort of intimate touching or talk, but was still affectionate and cuddly and all of that, provided there was no sexual connotation to it whatsoever.

The rest of the time was once again amazing, when we spend time together it's perfect, even just mundane things like going food shopping or walking the dog, just stupid little things like that it feels amazing, it feels like we're still getting the butterflies of a new relationship, even after all this time, it's what I've always dreamed of a relationship being. But as soon as there was any possibility of sex or intimacy, she shut down. I know that anxiety meds can do this, and we have talked about it in the past, but this didn't seem like she just wasn't in the mood, it seemed more like she just didn't want to be in the mood at all and would go out of her way to avoid any situation where intimacy could develop.

In any event, all talk of her meeting other people was shelved long ago, we hadn't talked about it at all for over a year and when it was mentioned then it was seemingly decided that she didn't want that anymore.

Apparently that has now changed. She has brought this up again and said that she would like to meet people. She said that she felt like she never really got the chance to have "crushes" and to flirt with people and that she feels like she needs to experience that and have that.

She has been suffering with her anxiety quite a lot recently and one of the things that helps her is when she can feel "grounded" and when she feels like she is in control of how she acts and how she is. I think it's sort of a power thing, she likes the idea of freedom and it being a bit of a "game" I guess.

I have tried to dig into her reasons a bit more and she says that she thinks it will help our relationship because it will lead to her feeling more like her again, because she will be "free" and she'll be able to be more like how it was when we first met. After even more digging I have basically got it out of her that she wants an open relationship, or as I have described it "she wants the life of being single, with the benefits of being in a relationship".

And I am struggling.

I have always been open to the idea of meeting other people and having other partners but I am also of the view that this only ever works when the primary relationship is entirely healthy and happy. I don't think we are at the moment. I think we have a lot f stuff missing.

And I struggle with the idea of her having intimacy with someone else when she says she can't have it with me. She has countered this by saying that she thinks it will help our relationship because she will feel more like herself again and it will help with her anxiety which has been the main cause of us not having that stuff.

Am I being selfish in wanting our problems worked on before we go down the route of her seeing other people? Am I wrong to be thinking that she's had years of chances of me being open to these things that it's not ok to bring it up again when we've just spent an amazing few months together and have been talking about living together when we can?

Am I in the wrong if I say that she has to choose between having the life of a single person without me, or having me and giving up on those things?

Am I in the wrong if I make her make that choice in the knowledge that she might be right and it might help her and us?

Sorry for the incredibly long post and thank you for anyone who takes the time to read all of this, I know it's a bit of an essay. But I just had to get it all out there.

Thank you in advance

[livinglongdistance]

Only realised how long this was after I sent it..... really sorry.

Well done to anyone who reads it all and thank you.

[BrinnM]

11 hours ago, livinglongdistance said:

Am I in the wrong if I say that she has to choose between having the life of a single person without me, or having me and giving up on those things?

 

No, you are not wrong, especially because you have already been very patient with her. She's been constantly whining about what she has been missing out on, because she's 25 and has never really dated. So what? She is now in a relationship with you, and it's absolutely incredible how you have accommodated her numerous whims over the years. First she wants to "see other people" (men to have sex or a side-relationship with), then she can't find any that she likes, then she wants to stop seeing other people, now she wants an open relationship. What else? It never ends.

I understand you're not the " jealous type", but she's so inconsistent that I don't even think she is sure she wants the relationship. Sure, it's nice to have a boyfriend on the backburner in another country as a safety net, while you venture out and date other men, and I guess we can agree that it's "nice" of her to at least be honest about it.
However, reading trough your OP (and yes, you're right, it's very long), and the way you describe your interactions, the relationship reminds me of a father-daughter-relationship, more than a romantic relationship. It's like you're guiding her through her first dating experiences that she didn't have before she met you, and now you're somehow co-responsible for that before she settles down with you. Every man I know would say no thanks to that. Guaranteed. 

Tell her yes, sure, but I am starting to sleep around as well, and I am signing up on Tinder as we speak.

[Wiseman2]

Set each other free. LDRs can be frustrating, confining and unsatisfying.

Unfortunately she (perhaps rightly so) wants to date local men. Consider dating local women you can build a real-time In-person relationship with.

[glows]

May I ask what is the point of this LDR if you’re never actually in the same locale? Are you both expecting this to go on for years and decades? 

What she’s telling you is she doesn’t want to be with you but is too attached to let go completely. 

You may be seeking go nowhere relationships like this that go through cycles or stress/strife because you haven’t recovered from your divorce. You may not like what I’m about to say but I think you’re running away from your personal issues and problems. The focus on her anxiety, her meds, her needs, her dating are smothering and completely out of balance. Attend to your own issues and deal with the fact that you are dating someone on another continent who wants different things from you. 

This isn’t working. 

[ExpatInItaly]

This relationship is toast, OP. 

I hate to say it, but you've been way too accommdaitng and making way too many excuses for her. This is limping along and what you have with her isn't great. Her dating other people is just going to be the final nail in the coffin. Open relationships don't work like this. She is bascially just shopping for your replacement and wants to place you on hold while she looks for him. And it's going to hurt like hell once she meets him and gives you your walking papers. I can nearly guarantee that is what is going to happen here. She isn't into you enough anymore. It isn't just her anxiety or medicaiton. 

The moment she told you she wanted to experience other guys was the moment you should have let her go. It's been dying a slow death ever since. Cut her loose so you can find someone who wants you and only you and doesn't come up with ridiculous schemes to cheat with your blessing. 

 

[chillii]

Well, didn't read all of it but got the gist and no your not wrong long distance or not . Why even consider such an arrangement and bs. lf she never got this or that and that bothers her then she shouldn't be attempting to have a relationship with you or anyone, she should be single.

l'm sorry you've had hope for this but honestly, this girl is not the person or of the character you'd even contemplate anything serious with. Not now or even ever actually. Plenty of women even much younger than her have committed to real and solid relationships and marriage and if you want to look at older people many of them are together since school or 15-16 , 50yrs. l know they don't makem like they use to but this one, forget it. She'd also never ride out the LD thing either anyway. Get out of this rubbish and find yourself something real.

Edited March 25, 2022 by chillii