Relationship Heart and Head Conflict

March 23, 2022

8 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

Do I accept that this relationship will never grow into a partnership where we can build a life together, and just be glad for a good man (my ex husband was abusive) Or do I end it with someone who I love and loves me back - for practical reasons? I ask because all this makes me seem / feel shallow and money-oriented. But I wish for a partner to build up a live with in addition to all the rest like love etc.

What works in a passionate love relationship doesn't necessarily work in a long-term partnership. There are skills/attributes that are required in one and not required in the other. We think that love and partnership should overlap perfectly but they do not.

Finances are a core prerequisite to a strong long-term partnership. That doesn't mean that the other person has to be rich but they should at least be self-sufficient.

I think you should move forward with the idea that his finances will likely not improve much, and make the best decision for yourself with that information.

If you do decide to end it, please do it with empathy and kindness. Just because he can't manage his finances doesn't mean he's a bad person.

Edited March 23, 2022 by dramafreezone

March 23, 2022

Wiseman is correct.

There is such a thing as Financial Abuse. This is exactly what you’re experiencing right now.

What’s getting my goat big time (about what you’ve told us) is his sense of “entitlement”. The “I’m above taking on work that I don’t want to do” and “everyone else should support me” attitude.

His attitude stinks. Not only is it very unattractive, he has the mentality and self entitlement of an 8 year old.

Get rid. He’s not as good a man as you think he is.

March 23, 2022

10 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

Currently he doesn't have his own place and stays with friends, family and myself respectively.

I missed this sentence the first time I read it.

How can you have a grown up relationship with a man who can’t afford to live - a man who relies on family, friends, you, whoever is kind enough to offer a sofa and a hot shower. If this isn’t a huge red flag, I don’t know what is -

You want a partner, not a dependent.

Edited March 23, 2022 by BaileyB

March 23, 2022

10 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

For the last two years I didn't even get a birthday gift (even though I gifted him with thoughtful gifts) and had to pay for myself on my birthday dine-out (even when on his birthday, I paid the whole bill)

Wow, just wow. This is bad. You say that he is a good guy but it seems like he doesn't care about you at all. He couldn't give you a box of unexpansive chocolate or flowers or some cheap trinket? How about just writing how he feels about you on a piece of paper? He could at least have done that and given that to you. A gift doesn't have to be expensive or elaborate, giving anything is better than giving nothing. And he claims to love you I presume. I don't care how poor he is, this alone should be a deal breaker for you. If a man doesn't give you anything for your B-day, it's because he truly honestly doesn't gives a damn about you. So, you took him for a restaurant for your own b-day dinner and paid for it all, now nice for him. Darling, he is using you. Please don't worry about being too nice to him. Dump him, pronto. I can almost guarantee that when you end this he is going to find another gullible female to sponge off from (and there are plenty of those around to pick and choose from).

March 23, 2022

11 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

I have a young child from a previous marriage to take care of first and foremost.

Focus on this and only this. In fact, if you state this as the reason for the breakup, that's fine too.

Google "Homeless Joe". Gigolos exit. However your BF is more parasitic.

March 23, 2022

Yeah l mean he could well be. The difference with the guy l know , even though it was all ending up that way and looked that way , she'd also lent him a large amounts to along the way to, 30k or so. Within a few mths of her breaking it of though, he got new work doing 12hr shifts often 7 days and really turned himself around over the next 12mths.

Not saying this guys gonna do that , just saying. You do need to break it of though op and if he does want to turn himself around then , he can.

Edited March 23, 2022 by chillii

March 24, 2022

I think the challenging thing is since we've been living apart, he's been super loving. He tells me he loves me every day and says the most beautiful, encouraging and praising words toward me most days. So on top of my conflict - there's also guilt on my side.

March 24, 2022

Thank you so much for everyone's responses - they are all very valuable insights and I will be using it to help me make some decisions!

March 24, 2022

2 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

He tells me he loves me every day and says the most beautiful, encouraging and praising words toward me most days.

Words are easy, though. They require no effort.

What do his actions tell you about his real desire to move things forward?

March 24, 2022

3 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

I think the challenging thing is since we've been living apart, he's been super loving. He tells me he loves me every day and says the most beautiful, encouraging and praising words toward me most days. So on top of my conflict - there's also guilt on my side.

So you're willing to put up with all of this for some sweet words that anyone can say? Why do you feel guilty, you've already done too much for him.

March 24, 2022

1 hour ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Words are easy, though. They require no effort.

What do his actions tell you about his real desire to move things forward?

Exactly what I was going to say.

A man can hit his wife, and then hold her and tell her that he loves her and that he’s very sorry… what should you believe, his words? Or his actions?

March 24, 2022

Agreeing not to date a homeless man should be the bare minimum requirement. That's what he is - a homeless couch-surfing leech. Is he there when your kid's around?

March 24, 2022

On 3/23/2022 at 4:09 AM, Cornelia83 said:

Do I accept that this relationship will never grow into a partnership where we can build a life together, and just be glad for a good man (my ex husband was abusive)

Maybe an abusive man made this man look great, but (sorry to say) he doesn't seem to be a great catch, either.

On 3/23/2022 at 4:09 AM, Cornelia83 said:

Or do I end it with someone who I love and loves me back - for practical reasons? I ask because all this makes me seem / feel shallow and money-oriented. But I wish for a partner to build up a live with in addition to all the rest like love etc.

You're not shallow and money-oriented. You support yourself and your child. There is nothing wrong with expecting this GROWN man to support himself. Can you imagine spending the rest of your life taking care of his financial needs? Because that is what you are proposing, if you stay with him.

March 24, 2022

11 hours ago, Cornelia83 said:

I think the challenging thing is since we've been living apart, he's been super loving. He tells me he loves me every day and says the most beautiful, encouraging and praising words toward me most days. So on top of my conflict - there's also guilt on my side.

Guilt is a perfectly normal emotion to feel when you have a strong emotional attachment to someone and you feel the need to do something that will hurt them, so allow yourself to have that feeling. It's really easy for us to tell you to break up with him but we're not the ones that have to do it and deal with the fallout. Breakups are frequently painful for both sides.

He can mean everything he says, and sincerely be a loving, thoughtful guy. But it doesn't mean that someone has the capability of getting their lives in order with regard to finances. Again, it's two completely different skillsets that tap into two different parts of the brain.

I have loved ones that are simply not good with finances. They are not bad people in nature or predatory, they are simply lacking certain skills and foresight, planning. In their minds, they live in the now. They are eternal optimists with their future prospects, they always think their next idea is going to work out perfectly. If I have a good read on this guy, I'm sure that's something that at one point attracted you to him.

We all have our shortcomings, and you know his. It's not realistic to expect him to be something he's not. If he was being deceptive or lying, that'd be one thing but I haven't read that to be the case here.

Edited March 24, 2022 by dramafreezone

March 30, 2022

On 3/24/2022 at 9:48 PM, dramafreezone said:

Guilt is a perfectly normal emotion to feel when you have a strong emotional attachment to someone and you feel the need to do something that will hurt them, so allow yourself to have that feeling. It's really easy for us to tell you to break up with him but we're not the ones that have to do it and deal with the fallout. Breakups are frequently painful for both sides.

He can mean everything he says, and sincerely be a loving, thoughtful guy. But it doesn't mean that someone has the capability of getting their lives in order with regard to finances. Again, it's two completely different skillsets that tap into two different parts of the brain.

I have loved ones that are simply not good with finances. They are not bad people in nature or predatory, they are simply lacking certain skills and foresight, planning. In their minds, they live in the now. They are eternal optimists with their future prospects, they always think their next idea is going to work out perfectly. If I have a good read on this guy, I'm sure that's something that at one point attracted you to him.

We all have our shortcomings, and you know his. It's not realistic to expect him to be something he's not. If he was being deceptive or lying, that'd be one thing but I haven't read that to be the case here.

Thank you. Indeed it's very tough to consider deeply hurting someone you love and who isn't intentionally doing anything to hurt you (like say cheating). If it weren't for this one factor, this relationship would be near-perfect.

There are other things, but they can be dealt with as he is very open to communication (which I'm not so good with) and eager to grow the relationship (I just haven't addressed it as this one thing is overshadowing everything else).

Everyone needs different things from a relationship. But an important aspect to me is building a life together. I've already had everything fall apart once and just want to have a life and home with an equal partner, I'm nearing my 40's and not that I necessarily want another marriage or another baby, soon those things will be off the table for me either way. I'm sure he wants that too. But after 2.5 years I have seen zero improvement in the financial / career area from his side. I'm getting hopeless that this might change. I wrote him a supportive message a few days back telling him how he is simply too educated, skilled and talented to be struggling like this in life. It's actually unexpected.

Thank you for your and everyone's feedback.

March 30, 2022

On 3/24/2022 at 1:31 AM, Cornelia83 said:

I think the challenging thing is since we've been living apart, he's been super loving. He tells me he loves me every day and says the most beautiful, encouraging and praising words toward me most days. So on top of my conflict - there's also guilt on my side.

This is obviously him trying to manipulate you to feel guilty/bad/obligated. This is what freeloaders do to get what they want. Don't answer or read the messages.

March 30, 2022

On 3/23/2022 at 1:15 PM, Trail Blazer said:

But it's not about his financial struggles that is the real problem. Yes, of course it is a problem, but as problems go, it's not necessarily the problem which is the real deal-breaker.

This guy doesn't seem to acknowledge that it is a problem that he's woefully lacking of funds and is leeching off you. Clearly it's an issue, yet when you raised it, what did you get? You didn't get compassion or understanding, you got abuse.

The real issue is his underlying attitude towards addressing issues which concern you. He won't see past his own insecurities and is instead shifting blame on to you. The fact that you can't even see what he is doing is very concerning.

To be fair, he probably doesn't know what he's doing, either. He doesn't sound like he goes out of his way to upset you, but at the same time he certainly doesn't stretch himself to understand you, either.

If you don't leave him you will be faced with a very frustrating and unfulfilling relationship where you'll experience swelling resentment towards him and any future attempt to address how you're feeling will result in an escalation of outbursts from his end as he continues to bury his head in the sand and not take responsibility.

This is not a man you build a future around. This is a man you leave when you find out that he has very little going for him. He needs you a lot more than you need him. You just need to realize that first, and then you'll see that you're being exploited for having diminished boundaries owing to your abusive past relationships.

Please, think long and hard about what value this man truly brings to your life. You only have one life and to waste it with someone who sucks the joy and energy from you and provides little in return would be a travesty.

I just wanted to thank you for this great input - this is thought provoking.

March 30, 2022

18 minutes ago, Cornelia83 said:

I just wanted to thank you for this great input - this is thought provoking.

You're welcome. I hope my perspective on your situation has helped you in some way.

March 30, 2022

1 hour ago, Cornelia83 said:

I'm nearing my 40's and not that I necessarily want another marriage or another baby, soon those things will be off the table for me either way. I'm sure he wants that too. But after 2.5 years I have seen zero improvement in the financial / career area from his side. I'm getting hopeless that this might change. I wrote him a supportive message a few days back telling him how he is simply too educated, skilled and talented to be struggling like this in life. It's actually unexpected.

My father is to a lesser extent like your BF. I end up sending him money so that he can stay afloat. He has never been responsible with money, and he always has a new idea that going to take off and he's going to pay my money back (he says) but that never happens. He never plans for the worst or if things don't go exactly perfectly.

I don't think he's manipulative in a predatory sense, but maybe situationally manipulative. He has some glaring holes in how to manage his life. We are creatures of survival, so right now his instincts are to just keep food on the table and he has to do that the best way he knows how. It's kinda like drowning, you can't learn how to swim when you're in the water and the water is already above your head.

I think that there are actual con-men and sociopaths that do nothing but leech off of others, they are professional leechers. Maybe he is that, but if so he's extremely bad at it. What his specific diagnosis would be is ultimately irrelevant as it relates to what you need to do. He is not your responsibility to fix or wait to fix himself, that's probably not going to happen at this stage in his life. Good luck.

Edited March 30, 2022 by dramafreezone

March 30, 2022

1 hour ago, Cornelia83 said:

But an important aspect to me is building a life together. But after 2.5 years I have seen zero improvement in the financial / career area from his side.

Unfortunately you're the only one doing the building. Focus on your and your child's future. Start putting money away for your retirement and your child's education, etc.

March 31, 2022

Cornelia, your boyfriend could take on other jobs so that you do have to bear the financial burden. He isn't doing so. He is showing you what life will be like with him - is that what you want?

I have been in your situation before and it did not change. His priorities were just different from mine. I was not money-orientated but I do think it is fair that both partners take the financial strain and make the effort. If you get sick, will he be getting a job to support you? If he can't treat you, then he ought to be doing something so that he can treat you.

Please do not accept that this is the best relationship you could have. OK, you love him and vice versa, but he will never have your back as regards finance and you will have to bear all the burden and feel cheated. It is not just a question of money; it is about whether he will look after you as you would (and have) looked after him. It does not sound like he will.

March 31, 2022

Just catching up with this thread.

Cornelia I sense that you are not breaking up with this man anytime soon. That’s a Shame because you sound like a nice lady, and you deserve so much better.

Your problem is that your view is skewed by your emotions but there’s no much i or any other poster can do about that. You need to be the one who decides when you’ve had enough. My sense is that you’re not there yet.

My only hope now is that he does he does the right thing and set you free. Doubtful, as you give him too much (for free) so he won’t want to lose that …

Anyway, as I was reading what you said about how supportive he is a thought popped into my head;

why don’t you tell him that you’re worried about the sky rocketing price of petrol, food and energy bills? That you’re worried about how you will afford the bills for you and your child, and that you’d really appreciate his “support” by his offers of contributions?

I’d love to know what his reaction would be. I wonder how well he’d support you with that conundrum?

April 6, 2022

On 3/31/2022 at 9:33 PM, Calmandfocused said:

Just catching up with this thread.

Cornelia I sense that you are not breaking up with this man anytime soon. That’s a Shame because you sound like a nice lady, and you deserve so much better.

Your problem is that your view is skewed by your emotions but there’s no much i or any other poster can do about that. You need to be the one who decides when you’ve had enough. My sense is that you’re not there yet.

My only hope now is that he does he does the right thing and set you free. Doubtful, as you give him too much (for free) so he won’t want to lose that …

Anyway, as I was reading what you said about how supportive he is a thought popped into my head;

why don’t you tell him that you’re worried about the sky rocketing price of petrol, food and energy bills? That you’re worried about how you will afford the bills for you and your child, and that you’d really appreciate his “support” by his offers of contributions?

I’d love to know what his reaction would be. I wonder how well he’d support you with that conundrum?

Edited April 6, 2022 by Cornelia83
Accidentally pressed send

April 6, 2022

Just now, Cornelia83 said:

Deep down I know what I need to do. But I really fear regret. I also fear his reaction: he's a sensitive person and this might really hurt him. So I'm procrastinating. I'm extremely conflicted hence me coming on here...

Thank you so much for your input!

I think I'm waiting for the right moment? Perhaps when we're not in a window of time where we're very close? I actually thought we'd drift apart when I moved out... but it seemed to strengthen things instead.

April 6, 2022

There’s no “right” time to break up with someone. It’s always going to be tough, and it usually always hurts.

My sense is that you aren’t ready for it yet. When you get there, you’ll bite the bullet.

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