How to proceed

[Johnson1]

20 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

It sounds like she wants her freedom to play the field and explore single life. Especially dating local men.

You're right not to take this seriously since there are too many red flags and logistical problems from the  distance to her being a busy single working mother.

She never said she was dating anyone or remotely interested in anyone else. She tells me she's not a cheater, so I'm taking that as  a round about way that she's not interested in dating anyone else. She says she's a dedicated mom that hardly goes out. I edited, so you might have missed it, but she doesn't work. She's living off alimony and child support. She tells me she's got guys interested in her, but she's not interested in them. I know it's early, and a bit forward, but should I ask her if exclusivity is what she'd like to have? To be honest, I'm quite smitten with this lady and she said she feels the same way, although she used the word enthralled. Our apart-time isn't as close as I'd like it to be, but I'm trying not to read into it.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[glows]

39 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

She didn't just file. She's officially divorced as of today. There are unanswered questions. I do enjoy her company very much. That's just it. I'd like to feel as close when we're apart as we are when we're together. She mentioned about maybe talking on the phone today. I'd always rather do that. Texting is cold and impersonal. She said she's not big on talking on the phone, but when we spoke on the phone before our last date we had an awesome conversation. The thing is I like to talk to her more but I feel uneasy calling her because I don't know if she's busy with her kids and it makes me feel like I'd be intruding on her personal time with them. She doesn't work. As I said previously, she's living off alimony and child support.

Calling versus texting may be personal preference. I'm a calling person so will not usually respond to texts. This reads as disinterest but I always respond if I'm dating someone or interested. I won't hold conversations over text though and am known to ask the person to call me instead if they're free or I'll take the chance and call them myself if I know they're available. She may not be as available to talk as you'd like because she has kids. 

Give her the benefit of the doubt if you sense the attraction or interest is mutual. Step away from the social media browsing. It's just too much worry and stress over someone you're just getting to know. You're trying to know everything in a short amount of time. Have some patience and distance yourself a little. You're way up in her business about her marriage and past issues. If there's anything that seems strange or doesn't add up, just move on and stop seeing her. 

 

 

[poppyfields]

56 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

She never said she was dating anyone or remotely interested in anyone else.  She tells me she's not a cheater, so I'm taking that as  a round about way that she's not interested in dating anyone else.

But yet on socials she flirts with other men and gives them the impression she isn't dating anyone (your previous post).

I dunno OP, this sounds iffy.  I would scale down expectations big time.  I would also not assume she isn't dating else anyone based off her comment she's not a cheater.   You have had TWO dates, this is not an exclusive relationship wherein anything she does with other men would be considered "cheating."

JMO but it doesn't sound like you're on the same page with respect to time accountability when apart or what you're both wanting from this.

Good luck though.

Edited February 1, 2022 by poppyfields

[Johnson1]

2 minutes ago, glows said:

Calling versus texting may be personal preference. I'm a calling person so will not usually respond to texts. This reads as disinterest but I always respond if I'm dating someone or interested. I won't hold conversations over text though and am known to ask the person to call me instead if they're free or I'll take the chance and call them myself if I know they're available. She may not be as available to talk as you'd like because she has kids. 

Give her the benefit of the doubt if you sense the attraction or interest is mutual. Step away from the social media browsing. It's just too much worry and stress over someone you're just getting to know. You're trying to know everything in a short amount of time. Have some patience and distance yourself a little. You're way up in her business about her marriage and past issues. If there's anything that seems strange or doesn't add up, just move on and stop seeing her. 

I know. I just don't want to interpret something as "strange" or "doesn't add up" if it's just me over-analysing and over-worrying. You know what I mean? We're great together. The only thing I'd like to be on the same page more is our contact when we're apart. I would like to know for sure that I can't call her because she's with her kids. I feel like I'm at her calling and texting mercy, although she said I could text her anytime. It just takes her a long time to get back to me or if it's after 8:00pm sometimes not at all. Assuming she's with her kids 24/7 makes it hard for to have a normal conversation. I know her divorce is finalized today. I don't know if she's got to go to the courthouse or what. I just texted her a little while ago and they asked her how her day was going. She was responsive right up until she went to bed last night. She asked me what I made for dinner and then said I'm going to bed. LOL. I told her what I was making, but I didn't know if she would see it since she said she was going to bed. LOL. I sent it anyway so I could give her a 'sweet dreams' back. 

She just texted back and said she drove to the nearest city, which is about an hour from her one way to buy shoes, and she was hurrying back to make the school line. I won't to ask her why she traveled 2 hours to buy new shoes, but okay. lol

 

[Wiseman2]

57 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

To be honest, I'm quite smitten with this lady and she said she feels the same way, although she used the word enthralled.

That's ok. It's good you are feeling a connection. Just from the outside looking in, guard your heart because she is in a state of flux with the divorce.

[Johnson1]

5 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

But yet on socials she flirts with other men and gives them the impression she isn't dating anyone (your previous post).

I dunno OP, this sounds iffy.  I would scale down expectations big time.

JMO but it doesn't sound like you're on the same page with respect to time accountability or what you're both wanting from this.

Good luck though.

I know. I just get bits and pieces with little detail. Like now for example. She said she drove and hour and a half round trip to go buy shoes, and is racing to get back to meet her kids at school. I can't to ask her why she needs shoes and such a hurry. She has lots of them. Again, it's just a 'why?' thing. 

[Johnson1]

2 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

That's ok. It's good you are feeling a connection. Just from the outside looking in, guard your heart because she is in a state of flux with the divorce.

I know bro. That's what I've been saying and why I have concerns about how much we communicate since she has so much time in her hands with and without the kids. I dated someone else and we were really into each other and she said she loved me, but then she went back with her husband. I don't think she's ever going back to her husband, but as much as she likes me I'm not sure how serious she wants to be, especially given the distance. I hate to lose her to somebody else because I really like her a lot. She's so open, loving, and down to earth. I really don't think she's being dishonest about anything, she's just not big on communicating and giving detail. She mentioned about talking today. She just text a little while ago from getting shoes and told me she's on her way to get the kids at school, but I don't know if I should text her back and ask her if and when she'd have time to talk today.

[poppyfields]

12 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

I know. I just get bits and pieces with little detail. Like now for example. She said she drove and hour and a half round trip to go buy shoes, and is racing to get back to meet her kids at school. I can't to ask her why she needs shoes and such a hurry. She has lots of them. Again, it's just a 'why?' thing. 

I'm curious why this would matter to you?  Why she needs to buy shoes in such a hurry?  

Please don't take offense but you sound controlling and quite intense (sorry).  After only two dates, there is no reason why you should need to know why she's buying shoes.   I am truly baffled by that.

Or what she does when you're apart or why she takes X amount of time to respond to a text message.

Again, it's been two dates, try and keep things in perspective and allow things to progress slowly, naturally and organically.

Otherwise, you're gonna blow this thing right out of the water.

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by poppyfields

[Johnson1]

16 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

I'm curious why this would matter to you?  Why she needs to buy shoes in such a hurry?  

Please don't take offense but you sound controlling and quite intense (sorry).  After only two dates, there is no reason why you should need to know why she's buying shoes.   I am truly baffled by that.

Or what she does when you're apart or why she takes X amount of time to respond to a text message.

Again, it's been two dates, try and keep things in perspective and allow things to progress naturally and organically.

Otherwise, you're gonna blow this thing right out of the water.

 

Only because it's possible she bought them for a night out, whether it be for tonight, tomorrow, or for this weekend when we get together. It wouldn't make much sense to travel that far to buy shoes to wear around the house or to just pick up kids at school. She asked me how my day was going and I told her then I asked if she would be available tonight to talk since she had mentioned about doing that. I'm just waiting for her response.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[poppyfields]

11 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

Only because it's possible she bought them for a night out, whether it be for tonight, tomorrow, or for this weekend when we get together. It wouldn't make much sense to travel that far to buy shoes to wear around the house or to just pick up kids at school.

Well, imo it shouldn't matter to you whether she bought them for a night out or for some other reason, again you have only had two dates.

That said, your line of thinking - jumping to the worst case scenario that she bought them for a night out with another man is called "catastrophizing."

>>Catastrophizing is an irrational thought pattern where someone habitually assumes the worst possible outcome will take place in any given situation and/ or takes one small thing their partner does and turns it into something significant.

It comes from your anxiety and inability to relax and remain detached from the outcome until you've spent more time together to determine if she's even the right fit for you.  And you her.

This takes time, certainly more than two dates.

I am not quite sure what the rush is for you, but if you continue along this path, you will either drive yourself crazy or her, or both of you.

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by poppyfields

[Wiseman2]

12 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

It wouldn't make much sense to travel that far to buy shoes to wear around the house or to just pick up kids at school. 

Don't apply logic to shoe shopping. Even though you are excited about her, just breathe, go with the flow and try not to overanalyze.

[Johnson1]

36 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Well, imo it shouldn't matter to you whether she bought them for a night out or for some other reason, again you have only had two dates.

That said, your line of thinking - jumping to the worst case scenario that she bought them for a night out with another man is called "catastrophizing."

>>Catastrophizing is an irrational thought pattern where someone habitually assumes the worst possible outcome will take place in any given situation and/ or takes one small thing their partner does and turns it into something significant.

It comes from your anxiety and inability to relax and remain detached from the outcome until you've spent more time together to determine if she's even the right fit for you.  And you her.

This takes time, certainly more than two dates.

I am not quite sure what the rush is for you, but if you continue along this path, you will either drive yourself crazy or her, or both of you.

 

I can just be aloof too.

 

32 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Don't apply logic to shoe shopping. Even though you are excited about her, just breathe, go with the flow and try not to overanalyze.

LMAO. I know. I can always be aloof too. I can easily go out tonight and hang out with friends and not be concerned about what she does. The only thing is it seems every time I go out singing somewhere I end up meeting someone and I'd have to turn them away if she tells me she's at home with the kids, otherwise I'd feel like a sh**heel. Besides, it's not like I would want to anyway. From what I can tell she is one of the best women I've had the pleasure of meeting and I don't want to lose her if she catches down wind that I'm going out with someone else, especially since we have a lot of mutual friends in my area. It just stinks that she's so far away and we can't do simple things like going out to dinner during the week like I would with other people I've dated locally. I've dated others recently, but no one like her. Normally I have a 'whatever' attitude, but with her it's different. She comes close to being that 'unicorn' for me from what I can tell just being on two dates. Trust me, I can see the difference, or at least I feel like I do. I'm not going to ask her a bunch of questions and make her think that I have doubts just because I don't get to talk to her as much when we're not together. All I could do is take her at her word because when we're together she gives me no reason to think otherwise.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[Johnson1]

58 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Well, imo it shouldn't matter to you whether she bought them for a night out or for some other reason, again you have only had two dates.

That said, your line of thinking - jumping to the worst case scenario that she bought them for a night out with another man is called "catastrophizing."

>>Catastrophizing is an irrational thought pattern where someone habitually assumes the worst possible outcome will take place in any given situation and/ or takes one small thing their partner does and turns it into something significant.

It comes from your anxiety and inability to relax and remain detached from the outcome until you've spent more time together to determine if she's even the right fit for you.  And you her.

This takes time, certainly more than two dates.

I am not quite sure what the rush is for you, but if you continue along this path, you will either drive yourself crazy or her, or both of you.

 

I'm probably driving you guys crazy more than her. Lol. I'm big on scenarios. It's only because I've seen the worst and always kept giving the benefit of the doubt when I should've walked away. There's a very slight bit of doubt on my part, but not nearly enough at this point to end something that could be great. I've just never taken it slow before. I'm not sure exactly what that means. Only drop a text here and there every two or three days? I could do that, but it would just make me feel like it would put a lot of distance between us, especially in long distance getting-to-know each other. Out of sight, out of mind can either make the heart grow fonder, or drive people apart.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[poppyfields]

@Johnson1I can't tell you how to go slow, it's different for everyone.  

You just seem overly anxious to me, that's all.  Anxious to get to the finish line versus enjoying the journey getting there.  If that has worked for you in the past, in your other long term relationships, then carry on.  You should do what you want, what you think is best.

Just be sure you're doing it for the right reasons, and not due to anxiety or insecurity because anything done for those reasons is a recipe for disaster.

Reading this thread, this woman does not sound like she wants to move at your fast pace.  She is on socials flirting with other men, leading them to believe she's not dating anyone and has options open.

That is neither good or bad, it's only been two dates, problem is it appears you're in a rush to lock her down and I don't sense she feels the same.  

IF she were on board with your fast pace, texting often, responding immediately to your texts, chatting 24/7 (exaggeration), making future plans, being accountable for her time while apart, then I'd say go for it!

But she's not, so that's a problem.  You're on different wavelenghs.

So my advice is to lower your expectations, slow your roll, and try to relax with it.  Embrace that bit of uncertainty versus fighting with it, trying to cast it out.

I realize when we really like someone, we have a tendency to overthink and become anxious but most of us are aware enough to recognize that these are our own anxieties and issues to deal with, and we learn ways to manage in a healthy way.

The best relationships in my experience have been slow and steady.  Messaging once a day or once every other day, or even two days.   Seeing each other once a week (weekend) at first (first month or so).  

I LOVE missing a man, I love wondering.  I love that feeling.  So when we finally connect, it's that much more exciting, fresh, fun and interesting.

But again you do YOU just make sure it's for the right reasons.

[Alpacalia]

Agree. 

I have a thread on here if you want to read about it ("Fast and furious or slow and steady?")

There was some good feedback you might find helpful. 

We sometimes feel more confident and in control when we overanalyze.  Keep an eye open for any red flags or concerns you may have in the relationship. The two of you are still trying to figure out if you're the right fit for each other.

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by Alpaca

[Johnson1]

35 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

@Johnson1I can't tell you how to go slow, it's different for everyone.  

You just seem overly anxious to me, that's all.  Anxious to get to the finish line versus enjoying the journey getting there.  If that has worked for you in the past, in your other long term relationships, then carry on.  You should do what you want, what you think is best.

Just be sure you're doing it for the right reasons, and not due to anxiety or insecurity because anything done for those reasons is a recipe for disaster.

Reading this thread, this woman does not sound like she wants to move at your fast pace.  She is on socials flirting with other men, leading them to believe she's not dating anyone and has options open.

That is neither good or bad, it's only been two dates, problem is it appears you're in a rush to lock her down and I don't sense she feels the same.  

IF she were on board with your fast pace, texting often, responding immediately to your texts, chatting 24/7 (exaggeration), making future plans, being accountable for her time while apart, then I'd say go for it!

But she's not, so that's a problem.  You're on different wavelenghs.

So my advice is to lower your expectations, slow your roll, and try to relax with it.  Embrace that bit of uncertainty versus fighting with it, trying to cast it out.

I realize when we really like someone, we have a tendency to overthink and become anxious but most of us are aware enough to recognize that these are our own anxieties and issues to deal with, and we learn ways to manage in a healthy way.

The best relationships in my experience have been slow and steady.  Messaging once a day or once every other day, or even two days.   Seeing each other once a week (weekend) at first (first month or so).  

I LOVE missing a man, I love wondering.  I love that feeling.  So when we finally connect, it's that much more exciting, fresh, fun and interesting.

But again you do YOU just make sure it's for the right reasons.

Very true on everything. We'll see. I hate doing what's good for the goose is good for the gander, but it seems these days you have to. Maybe I should just grab my own attention on social media, flirt and see what comes of it. She responded back to some yocal who was flirting with her on her post, but didn't bother to respond to my text asking her if she wanted to talk tonight, which was HER idea last night. I only sent her two texts today. The first one was asking how our day was going, then she responded back about shoes and getting her kids, then I responded back what I was doing and asked if she wanted to talk tonight. That was almost 3 hours ago. Her initial reply was only 20 minutes. I'm just speaking from my own experience and what I would do. If I'm thinking about someone I really like, I don't leave them hanging in preference to responding back to some yoyo on a post. She probably saw my text and is debating whether or not to call because maybe she's got plans to use those shoes. I know, here I go thinking negative. I just put things in priority. If I had two great dates with someone and they're texting me, they're my priority, not social media.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[poppyfields]

Did you read my previous post wherein I said that the biggest lesson I ever learned (or one of the biggest lessons) was that not everyone is going to text, respond or generally behave as I do?

20 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

I'm just speaking from my own experience and what I would do. If I'm thinking about someone I really like, I don't leave them hanging in preference to responding back to some yoyo on a post. She probably saw my messages debating whether or not to call because maybe she's got plans to use those shoes. I know, here I go thinking negative. I just put things in priority. If I had two great dates with someone and they're texting me, they're my priority, not social media.

This has been said time and time again on this forum but she's not you.  And please do not take offense at this but expecting her to act as you do is a bit arrogant and I say this coming from someone who used to be quite self-centered and entitled and yes I DID expect people to act as I did.

Until my own mom pointed out how self-centered (and somewhat entitled) an attitude that was, we are all separate individuals and as such will have different styles and ways of interacting and it's important to respect and try to understand each other's styles and not make them "wrong" for not doing things exactly as you do.

So try to not read too much into her style of doing things, it doesn't necessarily mean she's less into you, she just has a different style, different from you, there is no right or wrong.

In fact, thinking positive she may be absolutely crazy about you but nervous, a bit scared and talking to other men is her way of distracting herself from you, slowing the pace to avoid burn out which happens more often than not.

OR she could simply not be as into you as you are into her.

You just won't know for awhile so continue dating her and if I were you, I would scale back the texting just a bit, see if she picks up the pace.

Edited February 1, 2022 by poppyfields

[poppyfields]

40 minutes ago, Alpaca said:

Agree. 

I have a thread on here if you want to read about it ("Fast and furious or slow and steady?")

There was some good feedback you might find helpful. 

That was a good thread!  I just browsed it again.   OP, I think you might benefit from reading it.  

[Johnson1]

16 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

In fact, thinking positive she may be absolutely crazy about you but nervous, a bit scared and talking to other men is her way of distracting herself from you, slowing the pace to avoid burn out which happens more often than not.

Thank you. You may be on the mark with this. I never looked at it that way. I know perfectly well how the old adage goes. If you really care set them free or at least back off and make them wonder. Chasing people is not good and I always seem to the one who gets roped into doing that and it's never worked out in the long run.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[Johnson1]

I have one quick question. If I don't talk to her tonight and she only gives me a late text about how she was hanging with her kids all night, then apologizes the next day, how should I respond? I always keep saying that's okay, I understand. I don't want to hold her to anything, but she's the one that suggested about chatting tonight. I just made plans to hang out with my bff gf. She asked me if I want to come over and hang out. She's living with some guy. I'm just going over some drinks and chill by the firepit. I don't know if she plans on calling or not. I don't want to put my life on hold either waiting. If she does call I don't know what to tell her. She probably won't be too happy asking her if she's going to call and then not taking the call because I'm hanging out with my bff.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[Johnson1]

36 minutes ago, Johnson1 said:

The fact is her kids could be the perfect cover. What do I know.

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by Johnson1

[Allupinnit]

This is a whole lot of thinking and overanalyzing for someone you've met twice.

It seems to me that she's enjoying her freedom as a newly single woman who likes going "out" a lot and enjoys the ego boost on social media (personally I never thought having orbiters on social was a good look).  

She is not going to want to be tied down by a man 2.5 hours away, I'm sorry to say.  I know you don't want to be hurt again but there are no guarantees when it comes to matters of the heart.  As it stands you're questioning every move she makes and that is concerning to me.  Whether she's home, why she's buying new shoes - dude you really need to chill.  She's doing what she wants to be doing and that is OK.  You're not her dad or even her boyfriend at this point, so it doesn't matter what or why, or even whom.

 

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by Allupinnit

[Allupinnit]

Also if I may add, the incredibly derogatory way you speak of your ex-fiance (whether rightly or wrongly) tells me that you are FAR from moving past it, and you're projecting all of that hurt onto this poor woman who seems like she's mostly interested in having fun.

[Johnson1]

4 hours ago, Allupinnit said:

This is a whole lot of thinking and overanalyzing for someone you've met twice.

It seems to me that she's enjoying her freedom as a newly single woman who likes going "out" a lot and enjoys the ego boost on social media (personally I never thought having orbiters on social was a good look).  

She is not going to want to be tied down by a man 2.5 hours away, I'm sorry to say.  I know you don't want to be hurt again but there are no guarantees when it comes to matters of the heart.  As it stands you're questioning every move she makes and that is concerning to me.  Whether she's home, why she's buying new shoes - dude you really need to chill.  She's doing what she wants to be doing and that is OK.  You're not her dad or even her boyfriend at this point, so it doesn't matter what or why, or even whom.

 

 

And that's fine. She has her life. I have mine, but what you don't know is how much she cares, even after two dates. Tonight she called, but I didn't answer. Why? Because I can't make it appear that I'm sitting by the phone waiting for her call. Tonight I hungout with my bff gf at her place. We chatted for a while, had some drinks, then I came home.

In the process of her 6 hour hesitation in replying, my bff gf asked if I wanted to come over to hangout, which I did. When she called, I didn't answer because she wouldn't understand my hanging out with a bff gf when she thought I was sitting around waiting for her call. She would've been upset because she hasn't had the opportunity of meeting my bff gf and I didn't want to give her the wrong idea. There's absolutely nothing ever between my bff gf, but she doesn't know that. This isn't game playing. It's a 'dance'. A dance between two people who are trying to care. I know she does and I do as well, but I can't let her know that because it's too soon.

[basil67]

8 hours ago, Johnson1 said:

If I'm thinking about someone I really like, I don't leave them hanging in preference to responding back to some yoyo on a post. She probably saw my text and is debating whether or not to call because maybe she's got plans to use those shoes. I know, here I go thinking negative. I just put things in priority. If I had two great dates with someone and they're texting me, they're my priority, not social media.

Actually, you just posted about deliberately leaving her hanging while you hang out with your bff gf, with the knowledge that she wouldn't understand.  Why do you expect this woman to give you priority after two great dates when you won't do the same for her?

If you keep up this game playing and hypocritical behaviour you're going to crash and burn.