Should I end my relationship because of a psycho ex?

[ironpony]

2 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately, this story she's telling you has so many twists and turns that it seems they want to get back together.

She seems to tell you whatever she can make up.  First he's over there with his keys at night.  Then she claims she called the police.

Then stories about restraining orders which she also doesn't seem to want to get, since now you claim they're chitchatting about money.

Then stories about needing closure. And now stories about she wants to give him money?

Obviously they are talking and seeing each other. Otherwise where would she come up with this story about money?

Step back from all this. Stop telling her what to do. She seems to be telling you one tall tale after the next.

 

but if she wants to get back together with him, why doesn't she just be honest about it instead of putting on this traumatized PTSD performance that she is doing, if that's what she's doing?

I also don't understand how to sign that she wants to get back together with him just because the situation is complicated with twists and turns? how does a situation being complicated mean it's a sign of wanting to get back together?

Edited January 7, 2022 by ironpony

[ironpony]

I also don't understand what gives the stories the impression that they are made up.  A guy coming into a woman's place twice with a key, I believe that.  Her not being able to get a restraining order, because a court officer tells her she is not in iminment danger, seems plausible that he may say that.  What parts sound made up or implausible?

[ASG]

6 hours ago, ironpony said:

I also don't understand what gives the stories the impression that they are made up.  A guy coming into a woman's place twice with a key, I believe that.  Her not being able to get a restraining order, because a court officer tells her she is not in iminment danger, seems plausible that he may say that.  What parts sound made up or implausible?

Why hasn't she changed the locks? That's something she can do regardless. 

As for the restraining order being refused, yeah, I think it's completely plausible that the courts don't feel she's in any present danger. 

But if he won't give up his key, she needs to change the locks. She should have done that straight away when they broke up. 

[ironpony]

1 hour ago, ASG said:

Why hasn't she changed the locks? That's something she can do regardless. 

As for the restraining order being refused, yeah, I think it's completely plausible that the courts don't feel she's in any present danger. 

But if he won't give up his key, she needs to change the locks. She should have done that straight away when they broke up. 

She did already long ago.

[ASG]

14 minutes ago, ironpony said:

She did already long ago.

Long ago?! How long ago are we talking about??? I mean, you used that as evidence he was stalking her... And as the basis for a restraining order... I figured that had happened recently. 

If that was that long ago, what exactly is happening with the ex? What is going on that is RECENT that has brought this on?

[ironpony]

It was a few weeks ago, that he came into her place twice with a key and I told her to get a restraining order then but she didn't want to thinking that it will just make things worse, because then he will retialate more.  Now weeks later he has come back and is demanding 5500 hundred USD from her now.  So I advised her to get the restraining order again, because of this and she tried but didn't work so far.

[basil67]

He's asked for money this time, but has he threatened her?   Restraining orders are for when someone is deemed at risk.  If he's just being annoying and wanting money, they aren't going to give a restraining order. 

[ironpony]

5 minutes ago, basil67 said:

He's asked for money this time, but has he threatened her?   Restraining orders are for when someone is deemed at risk.  If he's just being annoying and wanting money, they aren't going to give a restraining order. 

 

5 minutes ago, basil67 said:

 

I was hoping that plus all the threats from before like entering with the key would be enough, but I guess not.  She is at risk though, even if he is not threatening her now and just demanding.  But this guy is still unstable and is a threat still from my perception of it.  I mean if he goes into her place with a key, then she calls the cops on him, the cops go and interview him, leave, and then he retaliates by going into her place again, then I think he is unstable.  A visit from the police doesn't even phase him and if he is not afraid of the law much and just uses it as an excuse for further retaliation, then I feel he's unstable.

But if she gives him the money to try to get him to back off, I am going to be hugely turned off by it because I had a long term ex before that was hugely unreliable with money, and I cannot have that in a gf again.

Edited January 8, 2022 by ironpony

[Wiseman2]

10 minutes ago, ironpony said:

It was a few weeks ago, that he came into her place twice with a key and I told her to get a restraining order. 

It seems like you want him out of the picture but she doesn't.

[ironpony]

3 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

It seems like you want him out of the picture but she doesn't.

I don't want her throwing her money away.  I don't want her to be used like that.  I mean is it so bad of me to not want someone I care about to be used and taken advantage of money wise now?

But if she doesn't want him out of the picture, why is she putting on this traumatized PTSD show about how she feels he will kill her if he doesn't do what she says, and about how him raping her before in the relationship, has made her more scared of him then ever?  If she doesn't want him out of the picture, then why is she putting on this act with me, if that's the case?

If it's an act, and she wants him back in the picture, should I just confront her about it politely, and tell her she's putting on an act?

Edited January 8, 2022 by ironpony

[Wiseman2]

8 minutes ago, ironpony said:

I don't want her throwing 

I don't want her to 

This is the main problem. You're too controlling.

[ironpony]

I fear for her safety though.  If she wants to go back to a guy who is going to harm her and possibly rape her again, should I just not care and emotionally pull away and say, go back to your rapist, what do I care?  How do I not care what she does, without being controlling?

Edited January 8, 2022 by ironpony

[ironpony]

23 minutes ago, ironpony said:

I fear for her safety though.  If she wants to go back to a guy who is going to harm her and possibly rape her again, should I just not care and emotionally pull away and say, go back to your rapist, what do I care?  How do I not care what she does, without being controlling?

I just feel I cannot watch her dig her own hole with this guy and it's too straining on this relationship with me and feel i have to set boundaries if she wants to be in a relationship with me.  But how do I set boundaries without being controlling?

Edited January 8, 2022 by ironpony

[basil67]

4 hours ago, ironpony said:

I fear for her safety though.  If she wants to go back to a guy who is going to harm her and possibly rape her again, should I just not care and emotionally pull away and say, go back to your rapist, what do I care?  How do I not care what she does, without being controlling?

The difference between caring and controlling is that caring involves love and emotion, but controlling is when you remove someone's choice.  Or telling them how they must behave or the decisions they should make.  

4 hours ago, ironpony said:

I just feel I cannot watch her dig her own hole with this guy and it's too straining on this relationship with me and feel i have to set boundaries if she wants to be in a relationship with me.  But how do I set boundaries without being controlling?

It's quite simple.  Boundaries are about what you accept.  Whereas being controlling is about making someone do things against their wishes.  If you say to her "I love you, but I can't stay with you because your choices aren't sitting well with me", this is a boundary.   If you insist she does something which she does not want to do, this is controlling.

Thing is, when we're in the early stages of a relationship, it's the time for observing and seeing if they are a good match for us.  You can make suggestions sparingly, but telling them what to do is never OK.

Edited January 8, 2022 by basil67

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

The difference between caring and controlling is that caring involves love and emotion, but controlling is when you remove someone's choice.  Or telling them how they must behave or the decisions they should make.  

This is an excellent definition. The best thing you can do is listen and observe. She can do whatever she feels is needed. 

Are you allowed to stay at her place overnight? Does she have roommates?

[Cali Lisa]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

The difference between caring and controlling is that caring involves love and emotion, but controlling is when you remove someone's choice.  Or telling them how they must behave or the decisions they should make.  

It's quite simple.  Boundaries are about what you accept.  Whereas being controlling is about making someone do things against their wishes.  If you say to her "I love you, but I can't stay with you because your choices aren't sitting well with me", this is a boundary.   If you insist she does something which she does not want to do, this is controlling.

So, a parent cannot be caring and controlling at the same time? Controlling has to exclude love and emotion?

How is the definition of controlling removing someone's choice? Who came up with that?

"If you insist she does something which she does not want to do, this is controlling." -- So, you suggest we never insist on anything that the other person wants to do? He should just express his feelings and terms, and if she won't accept them, he should simply say goodbye and leave, right? On which planet does that work that way? 

"If you say to her "I love you, but I can't stay with you because your choices aren't sitting well with me", this is a boundary." ~ No, this is a goodbye. Or at best, it is a blackmail. 

The most manipulative people NEVER EVER let you figure out that you did something because of them. They keep you dry through the river. Don't ever think that the most controlling people are the ones who are loud or aggressive or demand that we behave a certain way. Those are babies. Manipulation is done in a tiger's way: surreptitiously, silently and from behind. Master manipulators work you up from the inside. Their passive language and body demeanor is premeditated many steps in advance, branched out into different options and combinations of what-ifs. They wait for months for you to enter their traps. Some of them you won't fall into. They have no moral restraints in twisting minds to achieve their goals. 

OP, I think as two mature adults, you should discuss this and come up with a mutually agreed upon solution. Is that so difficult? Who cares if we all say you are right, but she thinks you're wrong? Or if she admits you are right, but she does nothing about it? We are not getting a clear picture of what exactly is bothering you. She came with this ex and time will tell what will happen. But for some reason, you don't want to wait and see, you want us to tell you. Why is it so urgent that you make up your mind right now about leaving her? Is there some other girl on the horizon?

[ironpony]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

The difference between caring and controlling is that caring involves love and emotion, but controlling is when you remove someone's choice.  Or telling them how they must behave or the decisions they should make.  

It's quite simple.  Boundaries are about what you accept.  Whereas being controlling is about making someone do things against their wishes.  If you say to her "I love you, but I can't stay with you because your choices aren't sitting well with me", this is a boundary.   If you insist she does something which she does not want to do, this is controlling.

Thing is, when we're in the early stages of a relationship, it's the time for observing and seeing if they are a good match for us.  You can make suggestions sparingly, but telling them what to do is never OK.

oh okay. Well I told her if she gives him the money it's not going to work out between us because I need a partner that can be reliable long-term and not given to exes like that, but is that controlling or setting a boundary?

[ExpatInItaly]

17 minutes ago, ironpony said:

oh okay. Well I told her if she gives him the money it's not going to work out between us because I need a partner that can be reliable long-term and not given to exes like that, but is that controlling or setting a boundary?

It's setting a boundary. 

But it doesn't matter what you call it, really. At the end of the day, she isn't making wise choices for herself and you can't change that. Her response to his behaviour suggests a lot of unfinished emotional business to me, not only on his end but very much also hers. 

[ironpony]

Oh okay.  I also thought she is making unwise decisions and I just want to help her make wiser decisions because I care, but I am not sure how to do this if it's not my place.  But at the same time, I don't want to her to keep digging herself into a trap either and just let it get worse.

[basil67]

9 hours ago, Cali Lisa said:

So, a parent cannot be caring and controlling at the same time? Controlling has to exclude love and emotion?

 

As you well know, I was speaking within the context of a romantic relationship.  

[basil67]

7 hours ago, ironpony said:

Oh okay.  I also thought she is making unwise decisions and I just want to help her make wiser decisions because I care, but I am not sure how to do this if it's not my place.  But at the same time, I don't want to her to keep digging herself into a trap either and just let it get worse.

You're correct that it is not your place to help her make wiser decisions.  She is not a child and you're not a parent.  As an adult, she has the absolute right to make her own choices.   

Further, you mentioned making a boundary about her spending.  On second thought, this is not something you can make a boundary about because it's her money.  There is no joint bank account and she can use her money as she chooses.    Again, rethinking this - warning her that you'll break up if she does pay him is not OK.  @Cali Lisa is right - it's blackmail. 

All you can do on this matter is watch her choices and see if she's the right girl for you.

[balletomane]

OP, a good rule to help you to distinguish between having boundaries and being controlling is to ask yourself this: does the matter concern your life or hers?

For example, telling someone that they can't smoke in your house is fine. Telling them they need to stop smoking full stop is not fine, even if that would be a healthy thing for them to do. We all have a right to our own decisions, even unwise ones. You can refuse to be in a relationship with someone who is bankrolling their ex - heck, you can refuse to be in a relationship with someone just because you don't like their socks - but what you don't get to do is dictate how they use their money, or insist they buy new socks.

[basil67]

@ironpony you know how you get bothered about your parents being overly interfering with your choices and financial matters?  You're doing the same thing to your GF

[ironpony]

8 hours ago, basil67 said:

You're correct that it is not your place to help her make wiser decisions.  She is not a child and you're not a parent.  As an adult, she has the absolute right to make her own choices.   

Further, you mentioned making a boundary about her spending.  On second thought, this is not something you can make a boundary about because it's her money.  There is no joint bank account and she can use her money as she chooses.    Again, rethinking this - warning her that you'll break up if she does pay him is not OK.  @Cali Lisa is right - it's blackmail. 

All you can do on this matter is watch her choices and see if she's the right girl for you.

Oh okay thanks, I see what you mean. How do I set the boundary clearly, without it being blackmail though?

[ironpony]

7 hours ago, basil67 said:

@ironpony you know how you get bothered about your parents being overly interfering with your choices and financial matters?  You're doing the same thing to your GF

Well I think there is a huge distinction here, is that if she were to do it, she would be giving into a psycho and it would make matters worse likely, where as I would be doing it for something that I want compared to giving into a psycho.