poppyfields Posted October 13, 2021 Posted October 13, 2021 BB, just curious but what happened with your ex that made you so overly-cautious? Making such assumptions that he seeks a doormat? From as expat said a fairly innocuous conversation? I don't see it. If you didn't like him, his vibe, energy okay then next. But then why create this thread? Just next the guy, no need to be attaching negativity to his character, you never even met the guy. Your ex must have hurt you pretty badly, Im sorry about that. How long ago did you beak up?
Author babybrowns Posted October 13, 2021 Author Posted October 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, Versacehottie said: Sorry you are feeling down....you do realize that feeling this way is, in large part, your own doing though, right? Here's the thing: you are not going to be able to SEE and determine with much or total accuracy on the basis of a simple innocuous sentence on a dating profile what the outcome of a relationship or even a date will be. You can't really say with certainty that you dodged a bullet or his loss or even any of that other b.s. designed to make a person feel better about the avoidance tactics and self-sabotage they have. No one can make you be a doormat if you are not being one or are not one. That discussion is even down the line, like much further like at least date 3 haha. What you need to do is just go on a date or dates to find out what people are about. Would you want every part and parcel of your words and actions prior to meeting to be dissected to this length? It doesn't allow anyone a fair chance. You also are trying to make things so perfect with the "analysis" that you are making yourself completely powerless. Here's what I would suggest in the future: go on the first date and you can pull the plug at any time if the gathering of more real life and reality-based evidence tells you, indeed, that a person is looking for a doormat or not for you in general. Lastly i would say if you are going to analyze that your skills in that department are hyper-sensitive and poorly-tuned. From his statement, I take it much less that he's looking for a doormat but more so that he's not a fast mover in relationships or maybe shuts down emotionally or has trouble expressing himself with a girlfriend and doesn't want to be dinged for it, ie it probably says more about his past relationships and himself than anything. Is it self-aware and improving/willing to work on it or a red flag that he mentioned it? There is sooo not enough information at this time from one sentence that you do yourself a disservice in trying to figure it out beforehand with an elimination round!. Just go and gather info. It's that simple. It's not a master's thesis. Thanks for your post. Very useful. However the emboldened part is itself another dealbreaker for me in dating since I’ve had my fair of emotionally unavailable men and such a relationship is not a fun place to be. I’m in my early 30s now so I have become very selective with whom I will/ won’t let in. I also tend to get attached to people early after meeting them in person if we get on, especially romantically, even if I know something is off. I have thus started scanning men earlier than the first date to save me time, emotions and energy.
Versacehottie Posted October 13, 2021 Posted October 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, babybrowns said: . However the emboldened part is itself another dealbreaker for me in dating since I’ve had my fair of emotionally unavailable men and such a relationship is not a fun place to be. I’m in my early 30s now so I have become very selective with whom I will/ won’t let in. I also tend to get attached to people early after meeting them in person if we get on, especially romantically, even if I know something is off. I have thus started scanning men earlier than the first date to save me time, emotions and energy. you're doing it again..... While I feel like my assessment is probably more likely correct than your doormat theory, the whole big point of my post is that you don't know/I don't know. You are using this hypersensitive (and inaccurate possibly) fear-centered side of your mind. It's emotion-based and the way it's going is designed to NEVER get you out onto date number one. It's also simply your perception. People are much more complex than a sentence on a dating app (in good ways too--since I don't want you to tell me "yeah in all the bad ways" the you are not willing to deal with). You're selective picker is way off. Miscalibrated and not-functioning, like in a bad input loop. Your mind thinks it's in protective mode but your are actually chopping your goals off at the knees. If you keep this up, I doubt you will get onto a date. Don't forget, letting this mentality become a part of you, is also unattractive to others and hurts your future chances with people so it's not just a helpful protection mechanism. 5 1
Ami1uwant Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 4 hours ago, babybrowns said: It may well be the case. But it did feel to me that to be told so early on, something along the lines of “I am setting the expectation here and now that you’ll grin and bear my bad days no matter how nasty I get”- sent alarm bells ringing. I do think that if this were not a big part of his day to day personality, he wouldn’t have brought it up as his top 3 requirements in dating- especially so early on. When in his own words he was worried about “scaring me off” when he made these confessions, and yet still chose to make them. Those who are thinking I might be projecting past experiences onto this, yes this might partly be it. The last guy I dated also had ‘confessions’ to get off his chest on our first date, which although he trivialised at the time, ended up being a *very* big part of his life, and eventually ripped us apart when they started taking hold of his life. I do feel that when a man chooses to bring something up to a potential love interest so early on, he needs that thing to be accepted just as he needs to be accepted by her as a whole. It’s a big part of who he is and he needs to know she’ll stand for it. I’m not going to stand to be someone’s doormat. You still don’t get the test you failed…..
basil67 Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 6 hours ago, glows said: Yeah, definitely not. Grumpy? Who says that. I think you should listen to your instincts. Onwards. I do. There are so many good words to describe the nuances of our feelings. 1
poppyfields Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 3 minutes ago, basil67 said: I do. There are so many good words to describe the nuances of our feelings. Amen sista. 1
ExpatInItaly Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 6 hours ago, babybrowns said: Well I was the one who started on the “I don’t think I’m the one for you!” Which made him go away as he called me judgmental. I do not want to be someone’s doormat and I’m glad I did have the sense to see the red flag when it came. Fair enough, if that is your assessment and you stand by it. But then, why did you start this thread?
Alpacalia Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) I'd just read his statements as a deep chord struck for you in the past that hasn't yet been resolved. He is welcome to his opinion in the same way that you are welcome to yours. He was merely expressing his. I think that sometimes we jump to conclusions, assume intentions, and assign our own meaning to words. If you can overcome the urge to pass judgment and wait until the discourse is finished before making a decision, you may discover that there is no hidden meaning to be found by the time you reach the conclusion. Edited October 14, 2021 by Alpaca 3
Author babybrowns Posted October 14, 2021 Author Posted October 14, 2021 Thank you all for your help, your posts are all very helpful and helped me to reflect. I guess I have been single so long and have had my fair share of experiences with men who didn’t treat me in the right way sometimes. This has made me be extra careful and proceed with caution. But I definitely agree that the best time to form any kind of judgement is at least after meeting properly in person. I really don’t want to shoot myself in the foot in the way I did here. Will try my best not to repeat this mistake in the future. Thank you all 1 1
dramafreezone Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) On 10/12/2021 at 11:06 PM, babybrowns said: Hi all, I recently matched with someone online. We had only been chatting for a couple of days, had a date lined up for later in the week. The chat and all was going well. At one point, we asked each other what our top 3 values are from someone we are dating. When we told each other, we did share some common values, he also listed ‘patience’ as one of his. I asked him if he meant patient about anything in particular to which he gave a quick reply “nope! ” I nevertheless wanted to dig a little deeper as to what’s behind this to which he said ‘When you’re stressed or having a bad day you need someone patient’. This being in the top 3 things he looks for in a date, I did want to dig a little deeper. I asked him if he tends to get moodswings to which he said he can do when stressed. He then just gave a generic ‘Patience is important in any relationship, moodswings or not! ’ This didn’t sit well with me since it made me feel like he was virtually saying he is looking for someone who can put up with moodswings. More discussion on it however made him quickly end our association and wish me all the best, calling me ‘judgemental’. I might well have prodded too much into this, or I might have dodged a bullet. Would be interested to see what members on here think? Seems like a lot of digging before you've even met in person. I think patience is a very good value to look for in someone else. I would be perfectly ok with saying this to someone I'm dating, and I am less prone to mood swings than most. Patience can be useful for a number of reasons, and not just for someone who has mood swings. Patience is essential for dealing with the fine details of planning a life together, when parenting, etc. When I say patience, part of that means I want someone that knows how to manage expectations. That said I don't know why he just ended communication abruptly like that. It seems like you questioning put him on the defensive, I don't think he handled it that well. Edited October 14, 2021 by dramafreezone 3
Author babybrowns Posted October 14, 2021 Author Posted October 14, 2021 56 minutes ago, dramafreezone said: Seems like a lot of digging before you've even met in person. I think patience is a very good value to look for in someone else. I would be perfectly ok with saying this to someone I'm dating, and I am less prone to mood swings than most. Patience can be useful for a number of reasons, and not just for someone who has mood swings. Patience is essential for dealing with the fine details of planning a life together, when parenting, etc. When I say patience, part of that means I want someone that knows how to manage expectations. That said I don't know why he just ended communication abruptly like that. It seems like you questioning put him on the defensive, I don't think he handled it that well. Thank you and this, what I have emboldened, is what made me want to dig deeper. To see whether it was something as harmless as that or whether it was something I had to be cautious about. His response and bringing in his grumpiness gave me a red flag and reluctance to pursue. So in a way I am glad that I did prod a bit more than I ‘ought to have’, it helped me avoid getting to the ‘I meet him, I like him, so what if he’s a little grumpy’ stage 2
dramafreezone Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, babybrowns said: Thank you and this, what I have emboldened, is what made me want to dig deeper. To see whether it was something as harmless as that or whether it was something I had to be cautious about. His response and bringing in his grumpiness gave me a red flag and reluctance to pursue. So in a way I am glad that I did prod a bit more than I ‘ought to have’, it helped me avoid getting to the ‘I meet him, I like him, so what if he’s a little grumpy’ stage Even if he is prone to mood swings (which we don't know), I would want someone that has some self awareness about the issue. It speaks to a person's willingness to identify their faults (again assuming that your assumption was correct), which is not common. Also, it could be that he dealt previously with a GF that had zero patience. I do agree with others that it was too early to dig deeper. Everyone has red flags. You already had your guard up so I don't see it as likely that you'd just forget about it. Just something to keep in the back of your mind next time as you get to know the guy. Edited October 14, 2021 by dramafreezone
glows Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 14 hours ago, babybrowns said: Thank you all for your help, your posts are all very helpful and helped me to reflect. I guess I have been single so long and have had my fair share of experiences with men who didn’t treat me in the right way sometimes. This has made me be extra careful and proceed with caution. But I definitely agree that the best time to form any kind of judgement is at least after meeting properly in person. I really don’t want to shoot myself in the foot in the way I did here. Will try my best not to repeat this mistake in the future. Thank you all I don't think you have to go so far overboard with cautiousness. Someone might rub you the wrong way or say something that's inappropriate to you and it's still your call. You lack confidence most of all. It's best to balance dating with other interactions and make sure you still have meaningful relationships with your friends and family. 1
Foxhall Posted October 14, 2021 Posted October 14, 2021 On 10/13/2021 at 7:06 AM, babybrowns said: When you’re stressed or having a bad day you need someone patient’. He opened a can of worms here unnecessarily for himself, (easily done I suppose from a male perspective!) Its ok you should not feel bad for probing on this, he then failed to give you the reassurance you needed, so yeah chances are the two of you would not have clicked in-person either. 1 1
BaileyB Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 On 10/13/2021 at 1:06 AM, babybrowns said: ‘Patience is important in any relationship, moodswings or not! He’s right. One can not maintain a happy long term relationship without patience and the ability to let things go/don’t sweat the small stuff. He sounds like a wise man. Reminds me of a quote I heard that was said by RBG - “In a marriage, it helps to be a little bit deaf sometimes.” So true - the point being that you need to be patient, forgiving, kind to your partner… if you want to find happiness in relationships.
BaileyB Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 5 hours ago, dramafreezone said: it could be that he dealt previously with a GF that had zero patience. Maybe he had a girlfriend previously who was prone to mods swings and he has learned that having a harmonious relationship requires patience and emotional control - for both partners. 2
BaileyB Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 (edited) On 10/13/2021 at 1:14 PM, babybrowns said: he even used the words “I hope I don’t scare you off but yea I do get grumpy sometimes”. Don’t we all? On 10/13/2021 at 3:02 PM, babybrowns said: But it did feel to me that to be told so early on, something along the lines of “I am setting the expectation here and now that you’ll grin and bear my bad days no matter how nasty I get” You got this from the first date? From a simple comment that he thought patience was important in a relationship and a disclosure that he can get a little “grumpy” sometimes? Gosh, I was grumpy yesterday when I got home because I had a hard day at work. My partner was grumpy today because I got stuck at work and I was a few minutes late for a meeting we had to attend. Thankfully, we are both patient people so we both took a deep breath, gave the other some space, and life goes on… Quote Which made him go away as he called me judgmental. He’s not wrong. You jumped to conclusions and passed judgment on him without actually taking the time to get to know the man. If you are a doormat, the problem isn’t the other person - the problem is with the boundaries that you set for yourself in relationships. If you don’t trust yourself, you are going to do exactly what you did here and look for problems before you actually know the man. Edited October 15, 2021 by BaileyB 1 1
ExpatInItaly Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 9 hours ago, babybrowns said: it helped me avoid getting to the ‘I meet him, I like him, so what if he’s a little grumpy’ stage I mean, are you never in a bad mood or something? Are you always consistently chipper and happy? You are treating a one-off comment about occasional grumpiness as if he'd told you he sometimes enjoys kicking puppies. Mountains of molehilles. 3
introverted1 Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 On 10/13/2021 at 5:34 PM, babybrowns said: However the emboldened part is itself another dealbreaker for me in dating since I’ve had my fair of emotionally unavailable men and such a relationship is not a fun place to be. He said nothing to suggest that he is emotionally unavailable. Just the opposite: it is you who appears to be unavailable as you attempt to calculate future compatibility off a phone call with someone you've never met! p.s. If you want to meet emotionally available men, you would do better not to select men who live 3 hours away. Regardless of his emotional availability, it will be difficult to build an emotionally intimate r/s with this sort of limitation on time together. Plus, can you honestly say you would not be analysing each text message, each phone call call, each time communication takes longer than you think it should, etc.? 2
Versacehottie Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 (edited) 18 hours ago, babybrowns said: Thank you and this, what I have emboldened, is what made me want to dig deeper. To see whether it was something as harmless as that or whether it was something I had to be cautious about. His response and bringing in his grumpiness gave me a red flag and reluctance to pursue. So in a way I am glad that I did prod a bit more than I ‘ought to have’, it helped me avoid getting to the ‘I meet him, I like him, so what if he’s a little grumpy’ stage This thinking is pretty backwards though. Everything you are doing is to AVOID rather than experience. You are picking things apart--even inaccurately when the very thing you are picking apart could be a good trait...or simply an explanation of himself that is so beyond common, I would have a hard time saying that most guys aren't this to an extent. Why are you SO afraid that you can't control your own impulses that if you "meet him and like him and will then ignore ACTUAL red flags at that point? This is what you should work on personally rather than trying to extract answers which you seem to be getting wrong AND turning guys off in the process. On your same theory that your prodding was justified. I think his seeing your tactics to probe as unappealing was a huge red flag to him that you wouldn't be a good person to be in a relationship with --- and would argue that many if not most people would see it that way as well. I think you should control your side of the road a lot more and worry about the impression you give. And know you can control yourself at each step of the way and drop out of a progressing relationship at any time. You should work on being light, happy and fun in these initial conversations--because that is what life should primarily be about in something that is supposed to bring good into your life--instead you're bringing drama right off the bat...so who was actually exhibiting grumpy or annoying behavior from the get-go?? It was you, not him. You can't let your protective mode override good judgment and good social behavior. Edited October 15, 2021 by Versacehottie 1
Versacehottie Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 BTW, I don't think the guy was in the wrong whatsoever to drop out of the conversation. He's trying to feel attracted to someone and is being put on trial for a sentence. It's so unappealing--I would definitely drop out if someone did this to me. Here's an extreme example of what you did in essence: "It says on your profile that you love your dog, does that mean you hate cats? Does it mean that you have enough love to give to other people, things?" Yeah, not good, my friend. 2
dramafreezone Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 18 hours ago, Foxhall said: He opened a can of worms here unnecessarily for himself, (easily done I suppose from a male perspective!) Its ok you should not feel bad for probing on this, he then failed to give you the reassurance you needed, so yeah chances are the two of you would not have clicked in-person either. If this is an isolated case of her being concerned about a possible red flag, then ok. If this is something she's doing with every guy, then maybe she needs to consider if she's sabatoging her own dating life. 1
poppyfields Posted October 15, 2021 Posted October 15, 2021 1 hour ago, dramafreezone said: If this is an isolated case of her being concerned about a possible red flag, then ok. If this is something she's doing with every guy, then maybe she needs to consider if she's sabatoging her own dating life. I suggest you read BB's history. It's pretty much become a pattern. BB, my personal opinion is that you are conflicted. You seek connection and a relationship but your fears perpetuate an avoidance mindset which results in you quickly finding fault and dismissing. I would explore this if I were you, on your own and with the help of a qualified professional. I wish you the best. 2
BaileyB Posted October 16, 2021 Posted October 16, 2021 13 hours ago, introverted1 said: He said nothing to suggest that he is emotionally unavailable. Just the opposite: it is you who appears to be unavailable This. In your attempt to “avoid red flags” that you have missed in the past, you were very guarded and your over reacted to what were rather vague statements made by a man that you didn’t know… You ended it before you even got to know the man - shutting it down at the first sign of any perceived trouble - as an act of self preservation. Emotionally healthy and available people don’t do this, people who are afraid to trust, afraid of being hurt, do. Something to talk about with your counsellor. You have swung from one extreme to another, in an attempt to place a healthy boundary for yourself. 2
Nothanks Posted October 16, 2021 Posted October 16, 2021 You read a lot into his responses that wasn’t there. If someone told me they valued patience, I would not jump to “well they must be moody” red flag! I value patience because it is a difficult virtue to have. Nothing he said could be seen as evidence of mood swings. Everyone gets grumpy at times. That fact keeps the coffee industry in business. If you are always looking for red flags, you will always be able to find one. Try having a more positive outlook until you at least meet someone in person. 2
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